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  1. #1
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    Exclamation Thomas and Hunter Speak

    The Thomas factor

    Hunter has probably had no stronger critic through his tenure on the case than former Boulder police Detective Steve Thomas.

    Thomas, who resigned from the department in summer 1998, has left law enforcement and is building houses with a friend in Australia.

    When Thomas resigned, he did so with a blistering eight-page letter in which he put the lack of charges in the case squarely on Hunter's doorstep, accusing the prosecutor and his staff of impeding justice.

    Several newspaper editorials echoed Thomas's critique, Hunter recalled, and "cut me below the bellybutton, and side to side."

    Thomas wrote a book, published in 2000, in which he underscored his contempt for Hunter's approach to the case and the judicial system.

    Hunter, who remembers the Thomas broadsides as "one of the bumps for me in the case," is restrained in talking about them now.

    "I think he did what he thought he should do," he said. "He thought he should write a book. I don't think he should have written a book with case file information. I don't think that's something he should have done . . . because these are case-confidential files, and they, to disclose them, can prejudice a case."

    Thomas, in an e-mail sent this weekend from Australia, said he doesn't regret writing a book "after it became painfully evident that there was never going to be a filing in this case." He called Hunter's criticism "disingenuous."

    The former detective said that Hunter "hosted the Globe tabloid in his office on a fairly regular basis, for example, talking about the case file information to which he refers."

    Hunter insists that he never discussed anything of evidentiary value with a tabloid reporter.

    Thomas added that he has no doubt Hunter wished for "a proper resolution to this case."

    "These cases don't solve themselves, and we just had different ideologies about how hard to push the agenda and pursue the matter properly," he said. "It is unfortunate that his legacy will reflect an absence of duty in this case."

    The trouble with statistics

    Thomas' book made clear his belief that Patsy Ramsey was responsible for the murder, and attributes that belief to others in his department, up to and including Boulder Police Chief Mark Beckner, when Beckner was the detective bureau commander.

    Hunter chooses his words carefully in discussing the Ramseys.

    "I never saw anything in this investigation that indicated to me they were bad people," he said. "There was no history of abuse, nothing to support (that) this wasn't a loved child, in the evidence that I saw."

    Hunter has high praise for former Boulder police chief Tom Koby, but believes that some in Koby's department were overly influenced by FBI profilers, who stressed the likelihood of a family member's involvement in JonBenet's death.

    Hunter feels much of the same frustration as others who have watched the case unfold, then unravel, yielding only enduring questions without answers.

    Still, he said, "It was a good ride. A good play. I have zero anger at anybody involved in it - even Thomas. And, I'm grateful for that, too, because I think anger can eat us to death.

    "And that's sort of where it is."

    http://www.rockymountainnews.com/dr...5237612,00.html

  2. #2
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    I have more confidence in the FBI than in Hunter.

  3. #3
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    Hunter is a liar...never discussed anything of evidentiary value with a tab reporter....bullcrap.

    "I never saw anything in this investigation that indicated to me they were bad people," he said. "There was no history of abuse, nothing to support (that) this wasn't a loved child, in the evidence that I saw."

    But did you find any evidence indicating one of the Rs killed their daughter unintentionally and covered it all up?

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nuisanceposter
    Hunter is a liar...never discussed anything of evidentiary value with a tab reporter....bullcrap.

    "I never saw anything in this investigation that indicated to me they were bad people," he said. "There was no history of abuse, nothing to support (that) this wasn't a loved child, in the evidence that I saw."

    But did you find any evidence indicating one of the Rs killed their daughter unintentionally and covered it all up?
    Exactly and don't tell me there was no history of abuse with the bathroom yelling sessions. At least by todays standards those screaming sessions if true would clearly be labled abuse. If he saw no history then he was not speaking to the right people regarding the Mega JonBenet thing either. Hunter I think is at the place where he has know Boulder and Colorado and indeed the nation is not pleased with the handling of the JonBenet case. He has to know that.

  5. #5
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    Hunter chooses his words carefully in discussing the Ramseys.

    "I never saw anything in this investigation that indicated to me they were bad people," he said. "There was no history of abuse, nothing to support (that) this wasn't a loved child, in the evidence that I saw."


    Ohhhhhhhhh Okayyyyy.....John and Patsy made a good first impression on alex hunter and HE has decided for this alone................ta dah!...makes John and Patsy NOT guilty.

    Hey...lots of people said Susan Smith was a VERY GOOD MOTHER WHO LOVED HER CHILDREN!

    Hunter was sooooo confident he didn't go after the PHONE records until too late when one of the cell phone records went missing! Ramsey lawyers claimed it was a matter of Privacy.

    Let's see....kidnappers are to PHONE you and you can't release your phone records 'cause of privacy invasion! Might compromise your Privacy and heck there is surely no evidence in the phone calls so why let the police have the records? Surely no hang up calls or soliciting phone calls will turn out to be a monitoring kidnapping pedophiliac foreign faction that brutally murdered your beloved daughter???

    No wonder Thomas wrote the book and this is only one tiny little bitty bit of what Hunter did to cover his butt and not to run into conflict with a former business buddy lawyer who represented the Ramseys.
    -
    My opinion and nothing but my opinion.

    Tor:Con Index link below. Will show you the probability of a tornado happening in your area.
    http://www.weather.com/news/tornado-torcon-index

    FEMA's link for Emergency Supplies list below or what you need to survive for three days in case help is not immediately available to you.
    http://www.ready.gov/document/family-supply-list

    You can also purchase a weather radio which will inform you of severe weather even if your electricity goes out. Runs on batteries of course.

  6. #6
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    Thumbs down

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverRat

    Several newspaper editorials echoed Thomas's critique, Hunter recalled, and "cut me below the bellybutton, and side to side."
    What an A**! He's only worried about how the criticism hurt HIM!
    Quote Originally Posted by RiverRat
    "I never saw anything in this investigation that indicated to me they were bad people," he said. "There was no history of abuse, nothing to support (that) this wasn't a loved child, in the evidence that I saw."
    Excuse me! NO evidence of abuse. I call the pageantry child abuse. I call dying a 6-year-olds hair abuse. I call making her wear red lipstick at age 6 abuse! Posing like a grown woman with suggestive moves and costumes is abuse! And just because he didn't witness any abuse, does NOT mean there was no abuse going on in the Ramsey household, or that there couldn't be a first time.
    Quote Originally Posted by RiverRat
    Hunter has high praise for former Boulder police chief Tom Koby, but believes that some in Koby's department were overly influenced by FBI profilers, who stressed the likelihood of a family member's involvement in JonBenet's death.
    That's their job. BPD was not overly influenced- he was underinfluenced, and overly influenced by the Ramseys!
    Quote Originally Posted by RiverRat
    Still, he said, "It was a good ride. A good play.
    That's all little JonBenet meant to him- a good ride, a good play, not a little girl who couldn't get justice for herself and needed LE to do it for her!
    This is the year to locate Mark Dribin http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...ht=Mark+Dribin NamUs MP#876 and Ilene Misheloff http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...lene+Misheloff NamUs MP#6410 and bring them home to their families!

    Parents watch your children. Free-range parenting leads to more child victims.

    Cruelty to humans begins with cruelty to animals.

    I believe in closure, not forgiveness. I'm also unapologetically judgemental.

    JeSuisJuif
    JeSuisCharlie


  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by coloradokares
    Exactly and don't tell me there was no history of abuse with the bathroom yelling sessions. At least by todays standards those screaming sessions if true would clearly be labled abuse. If he saw no history then he was not speaking to the right people regarding the Mega JonBenet thing either. Hunter I think is at the place where he has know Boulder and Colorado and indeed the nation is not pleased with the handling of the JonBenet case. He has to know that.
    "Screaming sessions" - Do you state this on what LHP said? If so, can someone provide a link to this? I don't recall her labeling them as yelling sessions or screaming sessions, but I could be wrong. IIRC, she stated that there were times that Patsy had yelled at JonBenet while in the bathroom. Link???

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by LinasK
    I call the pageantry child abuse. I call dying a 6-year-olds hair abuse. I call making her wear red lipstick at age 6 abuse! Posing like a grown woman with suggestive moves and costumes is abuse!
    That is simply your opnion, though....and I DO agree that the whole pageant world leaves a nasty taste in my mouth, and I would never parade my daughter around like that, and I think that the only reason little girls are made to participate is because the parent (usually the Mom) has serious acceptance issues and self esteem problems.....BUT....

    It's not abuse. Is it wrong? Yes. Does it teach little girls that they only have worth that is based on their looks? Yes. It's not abuse, and clearly cannot be used as evidence of abuse in this case, as wrong and sick as it is.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by julianne
    "Screaming sessions" - Do you state this on what LHP said? If so, can someone provide a link to this? I don't recall her labeling them as yelling sessions or screaming sessions, but I could be wrong. IIRC, she stated that there were times that Patsy had yelled at JonBenet while in the bathroom. Link???
    I'll go you one better. Go read how LHP sued the Ramseys. Yelling Screaming ...call it what you wish. acandyrose.com Don't forget I LIVE where people talk about this murder and Patsy etc. as well JMHO I guess abuse isn't always having broken bones like Jason Midyette. Those bathroom sessions were a concern to LHP. If I heard it personally it'd be a flag up the pole for me. Nothing should ever have to be spoken to a child that can't be in a tone fit for hearing. Why resort to yelling?

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by coloradokares
    I'll go you one better. Go read how LHP sued the Ramseys. Yelling Screaming ...call it what you wish. acandyrose.com Don't forget I LIVE where people talk about this murder and Patsy etc. as well JMHO I guess abuse isn't always having broken bones like Jason Midyette. Those bathroom sessions were a concern to LHP. If I heard it personally it'd be a flag up the pole for me. Nothing should ever have to be spoken to a child that can't be in a tone fit for hearing. Why resort to yelling?

    Agreed.I would have offered to take over and help out the frazzled mom for both their benefit,of course we don't know that she didn't at least offer to.
    something to ponder:

    When the corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and the mortal have put on immortality, then shall we be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

    O death, where [is] thy sting? O grave, where [is] thy victory?

    The sting of death [is] sin; and the strength of sin [is] the law.
    But thanks [be] to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
    1 Corinthians 15:54-57


  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by JMO8778
    Agreed.I would have offered to take over and help out the frazzled mom for both their benefit,of course we don't know that she didn't at least offer to.
    I am sure from the kind of person that LHP came across as being that she did try. That is my opinion. I don't have information that could most definitely substantiate it. Patsy had a very high opinion of LHP which was apparent not only by the way she hired her away from Merry Maids. But that she was willing to help LHP out financially etc. LHP seemed totally shocked that she was named by them as a suspect. Like she just couldn't even fathom it.

  12. #12
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    Wellllll Hunter was influenced by the Ramsey's lawyer.....the one Hunter was in business with!

    Is this a conflict? I think so.
    -
    My opinion and nothing but my opinion.

    Tor:Con Index link below. Will show you the probability of a tornado happening in your area.
    http://www.weather.com/news/tornado-torcon-index

    FEMA's link for Emergency Supplies list below or what you need to survive for three days in case help is not immediately available to you.
    http://www.ready.gov/document/family-supply-list

    You can also purchase a weather radio which will inform you of severe weather even if your electricity goes out. Runs on batteries of course.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by coloradokares
    I'll go you one better. Go read how LHP sued the Ramseys. Yelling Screaming ...call it what you wish. acandyrose.com Don't forget I LIVE where people talk about this murder and Patsy etc. as well JMHO I guess abuse isn't always having broken bones like Jason Midyette. Those bathroom sessions were a concern to LHP. If I heard it personally it'd be a flag up the pole for me. Nothing should ever have to be spoken to a child that can't be in a tone fit for hearing. Why resort to yelling?
    Well, see that's where I get mixed up, because to me, there is a huge difference between LHP reportedly stating that there were times Patsy yelled or raised her voice to JonBenet while they were in the bathroom, and LHP reportedly stating that Patsy had regular "screaming sessions" in the bathroom with JonBenet.

    People talk about this case all over the world---sure, people talk about it in Colorado because it happened there, but it doesn't necessarily mean that what is said is any more true than what it said on forums or elsewhere. At this point in time, separating fact from fiction is difficult at best.

    I'd go one further to say that IF indeed, those "bathroom sessions" as you call it (because I've never heard LHP refer to it as that) was indeed as concerned as some state, then why didn't she report it? If she was so concerned and convinced that something dark and terrible was going on, WHY DIDN'T SHE REPORT IT????

    I agree that parents should never yell at their kids, and that it accomplishes nothing. But if a parent is going to tarred and feathered for yelling at their kid, you might as well lock up 95%, probably more, of the parents today---well, the parents who have kids over a certain age. If any parent in the world can say they raised their children for 18 years without ever once yelling at their kid, then they deserve a gold medal!!! I wish I could say the same, but as a parent of teenagers, I have yelled. If depends on the frequency of yelling, and more importantly, WHAT is being said. I think that for someone to say that yelling is the same as abuse is either an angel in disguise or simply has no children of their own to base reality on. I'd love to say I have never yelled at my teenager when he comes home an hour late from curfew, or when he is caught in a lie about doing his homework, but if I said that I would be a liar.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by coloradokares
    I am sure from the kind of person that LHP came across as being that she did try. That is my opinion. I don't have information that could most definitely substantiate it. Patsy had a very high opinion of LHP which was apparent not only by the way she hired her away from Merry Maids. But that she was willing to help LHP out financially etc. LHP seemed totally shocked that she was named by them as a suspect. Like she just couldn't even fathom it.
    yes,I thought she didn't pay her enough though,IMO.If I were wealthy and had a good housekeeper I could count on,I would have been more generous.I think she got a $200 Christmas bonus,when JR's was $118,000?(more than most ppl make in a yr).And she paid her $72/day, 3 days a week(I think I recall it was that).If I had good hired help,I think I'd pay them at least $40,000-$50,000 /yr,with a substantial C-mas bonus at the end of the yr.But maybe that's just me.
    Although I digress,it wasn't as bad as the Smarts paying Elizabeth's future kidnapper $5 for working on a roof for a few hrs.Talk about cheap labor...I think that's taking advantage of the homeless.I've often wondered if he felt they 'owed' him more and that's why he took Elizabeth.(NOT that it's right,of course !)
    something to ponder:

    When the corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and the mortal have put on immortality, then shall we be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

    O death, where [is] thy sting? O grave, where [is] thy victory?

    The sting of death [is] sin; and the strength of sin [is] the law.
    But thanks [be] to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
    1 Corinthians 15:54-57

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by julianne
    Well, see that's where I get mixed up, because to me, there is a huge difference between LHP reportedly stating that there were times Patsy yelled or raised her voice to JonBenet while they were in the bathroom, and LHP reportedly stating that Patsy had regular "screaming sessions" in the bathroom with JonBenet.

    People talk about this case all over the world---sure, people talk about it in Colorado because it happened there, but it doesn't necessarily mean that what is said is any more true than what it said on forums or elsewhere. At this point in time, separating fact from fiction is difficult at best.

    I'd go one further to say that IF indeed, those "bathroom sessions" as you call it (because I've never heard LHP refer to it as that) was indeed as concerned as some state, then why didn't she report it? If she was so concerned and convinced that something dark and terrible was going on, WHY DIDN'T SHE REPORT IT????

    I agree that parents should never yell at their kids, and that it accomplishes nothing. But if a parent is going to tarred and feathered for yelling at their kid, you might as well lock up 95%, probably more, of the parents today---well, the parents who have kids over a certain age. If any parent in the world can say they raised their children for 18 years without ever once yelling at their kid, then they deserve a gold medal!!! I wish I could say the same, but as a parent of teenagers, I have yelled. If depends on the frequency of yelling, and more importantly, WHAT is being said. I think that for someone to say that yelling is the same as abuse is either an angel in disguise or simply has no children of their own to base reality on. I'd love to say I have never yelled at my teenager when he comes home an hour late from curfew, or when he is caught in a lie about doing his homework, but if I said that I would be a liar.
    First off LHP did express concern on the bathroom sessions. Why didn't she report it prior. Who but LHP could give you the answer to that question. As for yelling at kids.....JonBenet was not a teenager. She was only 6 years old. For the most part John and Patsy did not reprimand Burke or JonBenet. I have that information from written accounts in newsarticles tabloids or from those who knew them. However regarding the bathroom conversations between Patsy and JonBenet disregard if you choose to . However that does not make it of less concern.

    I have spoken what I know to be the truth and from more than one source. You can believe it or discount it. It does not lessen the truth of it.

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