View Poll Results: Have you donated to the Find Madeleine Fund

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  • NO- Never have, and never will

    115 90.55%
  • Yes- I gave at the beginning, but will not give again

    2 1.57%
  • Yes- I gave, and will continue to give until she is found

    4 3.15%
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Thread: Have you donated to "The Fund"

  1. #26
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    Thanks, Texana and Interested Woman.

    Yes, the McCanns immediately called everyone they knew - whom they must have had on speed dial - and told them they were "disappointed in the police." So immediately, the police became the problem and the parents victims, and even though the police made some mistakes, the idea that Maddie was abducted did not come from the cops, but clearly from the parents and straight to the British Media. So I think you can definitely make a case that it was the McCanns who alerted the media to an "abduction."

    Whether it really was an abduction is still unsolved.

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThoughtFox View Post
    Thanks, Texana and Interested Woman.

    Yes, the McCanns immediately called everyone they knew - whom they must have had on speed dial - and told them they were "disappointed in the police." So immediately, the police became the problem and the parents victims, and even though the police made some mistakes, the idea that Maddie was abducted did not come from the cops, but clearly from the parents and straight to the British Media. So I think you can definitely make a case that it was the McCanns who alerted the media to an "abduction."

    Whether it really was an abduction is still unsolved.
    Exactly!

    Nicely summarized.

  3. #28
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    Thought Fox--great posts! Thanks for all the research you put into this.

    Those horrible McCanns...their baby's body isn't even cold yet, and they are on the phone getting the spin out to all their media chums. Horrid, horrid people!

  4. #29
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    There's nothing wrong with them calling their friends and family for support, but while they were doing that they were not out looking. And that just seems illogical to me, because why was getting the message out their priority? Had they checked the all the swimming pools in the area? Had they checked all the streets? Why didn't they just think that Maddie had gotten lost? All those apartments look similar - couldn't she just have gotten disoriented and wandered through another unlocked door? It's possibly what happened.

    I don't know what happened, but we know now what they actually did all night that night. I don't think either of them actually went back out until the next morning, which is hard to believe.

  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThoughtFox View Post
    There's nothing wrong with them calling their friends and family for support, but while they were doing that they were not out looking. And that just seems illogical to me, because why was getting the message out their priority? Had they checked the all the swimming pools in the area? Had they checked all the streets? Why didn't they just think that Maddie had gotten lost? All those apartments look similar - couldn't she just have gotten disoriented and wandered through another unlocked door? It's possibly what happened.

    I don't know what happened, but we know now what they actually did all night that night. I don't think either of them actually went back out until the next morning, which is hard to believe.

    The official line from them would be of course that the condition of the shutters said she had been abducted--as well as Cuddlecat's position. But even so--(and we still have never had the shutter condition actually verified, there was a lot of discrepancy in that originally they were broken from the inside, which didn't make sense at all--why take the time to break or open the shutters once inside?)

    They would not know if their child had been perhaps abandoned on some street somewhere--or worse but still quite possible, had been abused and then killed/dumped.

    The immediate was abandoned in favor of alerting the world to a particular story, when the immediate was available to them. They had translators available, both Murat (no matter what his role truly was, he offered to translate) and they had officials from the Consulate--high level officials who could get translators as well--at the ready--so they could do whatever they wanted that night--

    And what they wanted to do, apparently, was notify British citizens that a British child had been abducted.

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Texana View Post

    The immediate was abandoned in favor of alerting the world to a particular story, when the immediate was available to them. They had translators available, both Murat (no matter what his role truly was, he offered to translate) and they had officials from the Consulate--high level officials who could get translators as well--at the ready--so they could do whatever they wanted that night--

    And what they wanted to do, apparently, was notify British citizens that a British child had been abducted.

    Something I read a while ago was that Robert was a translator for the local Police while living in Norfolk. Maybe that's why he offered his services that night .
    I beleive he also sat in as translator during the Tapas interviews ( as such, he will have known most of what was going on at that time regarding the questioning etc). I think that is why most likely his status of 'arguido' hasn't been lifted as yet, it will help protect him. I really don't think that he is involved, just someone who wanted to help, bit of excitement and fame thrown in.


    http://www.mccannfiles.com/id20.html


    But he also earned 150 a time as a translator for Norfolk police, using his language skills to help their inquiries among the large Portuguese community in the county.

    Mr Murat had a reputation, not only in the car trade but in Hockering, as something of a Good Samaritan.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThoughtFox View Post


    So supposedly, according to Ian Woods, those interviews by Renwick were the "first time" that Sky News heard about Maddie. However they apparently didn't check Google News . . .

    A blogger named "Joana Morais" noticed that a newspaper article appeared overnight in the British Press - the Telegraph - talking about Madeleine. Who called them with specific information? No one knows for sure, but the Telegraph story was supposedly in the paper by 12 a.m., just two hours after Maddie disappeared.

    Blog

    Check the time and date:
    Three year-old feared abducted in Portugal
    By staff and agencies
    Last Updated: 12:01am BST 04/05/2007
    A three-year-old British girl has gone missing while on a family holiday in Portugal, the Foreign Office said today.

    Portuguese police are investigating the disappearance from a holiday complex in Praia da Luz in the western Algarve.

    A Foreign Office spokesman said that he understood the girl's parents had gone to have dinner once their children were asleep last night, but returned to check on them only to find the girl had gone missing.
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/global/ma...ortugal104.xml

    So that report comes from the Foreign Office just two hours after Maddie went missing - that's not alot of time for a report to get out.

    The blogger made the point of noticing that Portugal and Britain are in the same time zone, and I think that's significant.
    Can I ask a stupid question? You are saying this report was 2 hours after Madeline was reported missing, but it is dated 12:01 AM on May 5. That isn't 2 hours later, right? It's 26 hours later. She disappeared on the night of May 3, right? Or am I losing it?

  8. #33
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    Angelmom - the date 4/5/2007 is read 4th of May, 2007 unlike in the States where we would read it April 5, 2007.

    Salem

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThoughtFox View Post
    No, Gordon, it is not just a rumor, but a report that goes back to the first week Maddie went missing. And I'm actually glad you asked me this, because I didn't want to answer your question without some research, and I saved every link to what I found so that no one will ever think it is "just a rumor" again.

    First of all, it is true that many months after the disappearance, Sky News reporter Ian Woods denied that the McCanns called them directly on the night of the disappearance.
    http://video.aol.com/video-detail/ia...first/68346603

    But what Ian Woods does say is that a "friend" of the McCanns called GMTV to set up an interview for the next morning by 8 a.m. That "friend" was Jill Renwick, and what she said to GMTV is in this article:
    http://www.mccannfiles.com/id31.html



    Notice that even though the search for Maddie had barely begun, the McCanns were already feeling "let down" by the police, as if it was the fault of the police that their daughter was missing. So they had Jill Renwick ranting to both GMTV and the BBC by 7:45 the next morning that the police weren't doing enough. I find that odd in the extreme.

    So supposedly, according to Ian Woods, those interviews by Renwick were the "first time" that Sky News heard about Maddie. However they apparently didn't check Google News . . .

    A blogger named "Joana Morais" noticed that a newspaper article appeared overnight in the British Press - the Telegraph - talking about Madeleine. Who called them with specific information? No one knows for sure, but the Telegraph story was supposedly in the paper by 12 a.m., just two hours after Maddie disappeared.

    Blog

    Check the time and date:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/global/ma...ortugal104.xml



    So that report comes from the Foreign Office just two hours after Maddie went missing - that's not alot of time for a report to get out.

    The blogger made the point of noticing that Portugal and Britain are in the same time zone, and I think that's significant.

    Okay - another point:

    We have three different articles from that first week that mention John Corner, the godfather of the Twins. Kate called him immediately on the night Maddie went missing, and he has been highly involved in everything. He owns a Media company. He is quoted in three early articles saying that he talked to Kate immediately after Madeleine disappeared:
    http://www.mccannfiles.com/id31.html



    River Media Company

    Products and Services
    TV and Film - Production and Post Production

    Now - he may not be a famous newsman, and he may not be a journalist, but he is a Media Specialist who deals with "TV and Film," and he is probably the person who alerted some of the media. So we don't have to be Sherlock Holmes to think that Kate might have known good and well that this man might give their story to the media right away.

    John Corner also shot a video diary of the McCanns for a Panorama Special about the "predator" who stole Maddie:
    http://www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/...4375-20125768/

    He is not an objective journalist at all, but someone involved with the spin due to his connection with the family from the very first night.

    The McCanns seemed to be on the phone all night long to many, many people. None of us here can know for sure that they didn't call some media. We know they called a Corner. We know that Jill Renwick had an interview by the next morning. So what is the difference? The story was out really fast, and Kate was already spinning it her own way, with broken shutters and abductors and police who weren't doing anything. And that's why I don't trust what she said that night.
    Thanks for all the links

    I have read them all , but nowhere above can I see anything that tells me that Gerry or Kate called the media BEFORE they called the police as yoiu stated earlier. It is generally accepted that the Police were called by about 10.40 pm that night on the 3rd May So I am looking for something that shows this to be true - Some quote from Sky news or the Telegraph that says They received a call from Gerry or Kate befiore that time . ie soon after 10.00pm

    This is quite important to me - I have no doubt that Kate and Gerry made calls to the UK that evening - but if I thought that they had called Sky News before they called the police it would be highly suspicious - so the time is quite important.

    Sky News have been quoted has saying that they picked the story up from GMTV in the morning news . Where GMTV got the story is from a number of sources , including Jill Renwick , the Godfather or even the news wires

    Also if at this stage Gerry and kate were acting out the plan - ie they had just hidden / killed Maddy - why on earth would they do something like that call the media before the police - Remember they would be playing the role of anguished parents - it would have been planned to a certain extent -

    The Telegraph story is interesting . They say that they got a report from the Foreign office - though I cant quite see how the FO would have released a staement to be printed on line all within two hours - From what I know of how consular people work this seems very unlikely - Almost impossible. They would be based in Lisbon and would not have relaease anything to the press until it was all checked - If you read further into the story it is mused that the timing on the page was an error . You cant view that page on any archive material on the Telegraph web site - it has gone .

    If you have any other material that shows clearly that Geryy or Kate called the media BEFORE the police , I would be gratefull .

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salem View Post
    Angelmom - the date 4/5/2007 is read 4th of May, 2007 unlike in the States where we would read it April 5, 2007.

    Salem
    Duh. Of course. Thank you. I am losing it!

    I knew ThoughtFox wouldn't make an obvious mistake like that but I just couldn't see it. Just goes to show how ingrained certain things are in our brains, even after we've discussed that in previous threads.

    Sorry!

    ETA: The fact that this hit the news in 2 hours is nothing short of amazing. How could they rule out "wandering off" in that time? They couldn't.

  11. #36
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    Can this discussion go under "General." We are supposed to be discussing the fund and donating to it.

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThoughtFox View Post
    No, Gordon, it is not just a rumor, but a report that goes back to the first week Maddie went missing And I'm actually glad you asked me this, because I didn't want to answer your question without some research, and I saved every link to what I found so that no one will ever think it is "just a rumor" again.....
    .
    Fantastic job ThoughtFox, thank you

  13. #38
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    Gord: I knew that no matter how much stuff I found, you would say it wasn't enough.

    My conclusion: They told someone else to go call the police, as I recall - they never called the police themselves. So that is a moot point.

    Then they let other people go out and look for their missing daughter, while they sat in their room and made phone calls all night to everyone they had ever known.

    No one knows who they called and when they called them. They could have simultaneously been calling media as someone else called the cops.

    But yes - back to the topic of this thread.

    Some of those people had media connections. One of those people appeared on TV the next morning accusing the police of not doing enough, though it had been only hours since Maddie disappeared.

    I'm so done with this - I proved to myself what I wanted to discover, and I'm glad some of you saw it for what it was.

  14. #39
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    Iam sorry you feel, that way

    Yoiu know all i wont to do in this case is to try and boil down and get some accurate discussions , some accurate points without letting personal bias or feelings get in the way - almost like an impartial juror or invesigator would .

    You state quite clearly that they called the media befiore the police and I am sorry but you have shown me nothing that backs that up .

    Sure someone talked to the media at sometime that eveening early morning - but how do you or I know it was the Mccaans .

    It is just like your point that the Mccaans sat in their room all night calling everyone they ever knew - letting everyone else search .

    Every report I have seen said they were out searching till six in the morning - after the police had called it a day - sure they made calls to family and friends - they had mobile phones -

    I get frustrated as much as you do I suppose - I am not being deliberatlley obtuse - but I am certainly not going to back down from stating my point just becaus it doesnt agree with yours

  15. #40
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by gord View Post
    Iam sorry you feel, that way

    Yoiu know all i wont to do in this case is to try and boil down and get some accurate discussions , some accurate points without letting personal bias or feelings get in the way - almost like an impartial juror or invesigator would .

    You state quite clearly that they called the media befiore the police and I am sorry but you have shown me nothing that backs that up .

    Sure someone talked to the media at sometime that eveening early morning - but how do you or I know it was the Mccaans .

    It is just like your point that the Mccaans sat in their room all night calling everyone they ever knew - letting everyone else search .

    Every report I have seen said they were out searching till six in the morning - after the police had called it a day - sure they made calls to family and friends - they had mobile phones -

    I get frustrated as much as you do I suppose - I am not being deliberatlley obtuse - but I am certainly not going to back down from stating my point just becaus it doesnt agree with yours

    Excellent post gord and my feelings exactly

  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by gord View Post
    Iam sorry you feel, that way

    Yoiu know all i wont to do in this case is to try and boil down and get some accurate discussions , some accurate points without letting personal bias or feelings get in the way - almost like an impartial juror or invesigator would .

    . . . I get frustrated as much as you do I suppose - I am not being deliberatlley obtuse - but I am certainly not going to back down from stating my point just becaus it doesnt agree with yours
    That is fine, although I don't think anyone here is actually impartial, and we don't have to be because we are stating our opinions.

    It's unfortunate that we keep quibbling over something no one can prove. Even if they didn't call the media before the cops, by the next morning their personal friends were smearing the police to the British press, and saying how unhappy Kate was with the investigation. That is the only point I needed to know, and that is a fact.

  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThoughtFox View Post
    That is fine, although I don't think anyone here is actually impartial, and we don't have to be because we are stating our opinions.

    It's unfortunate that we keep quibbling over something no one can prove. Even if they didn't call the media before the cops, by the next morning their personal friends were smearing the police to the British press, and saying how unhappy Kate was with the investigation. That is the only point I needed to know, and that is a fact.
    hey Its just debate and animated discussion !

    The thing about the friends talking to the press / GMTV the next day . If you can for a minute ( I know you dont believe it ) but for a minute imagine that Maddy was abducted - nothing to do with the parents ( humour me )

    I would say that Kate and Gerry would be in an absolute right to do anything possible that they thought was the correct thing or maybe help . If that meant getting as much publicity as possible go for it . Remember the police went home at 3.30 am - maybe they thoiught there wasnt enough being done - they were desperate - in a total panic and grasping at any straw that came along

    Everybody who knows anything about abductions says that the first 24 -48 hours are crucial - it is the one time you have when everything is fresh peopel might remember something - Maddy could have been alive and in the vicinity -

    I freely admit that the otherside of the coin could be the big conspiracy theory - they had a plan in place to use the media to confuse the issue - to battle with the PJ .

    anyway as of today 8 months later we are all still in the dark

  18. #43
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    Yes, it's useless to discuss this because the media coverage has been worldwide and it hasn't done any good at all, whether she was abducted or not. So the McCanns miscalculated on that one.

    However, if my child had been missing, for whatever unknown reason, I would not be sitting in a hotel room making phone calls. I can promise you that. I think it would have been more logical for the parents to go look for their daughter.

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by colomom View Post
    Money is the root of all evil.

    I would look for a missing child, a campaign is not necessary.

    Maddie's face was broadcast all over the world. I can think of other ways of making sure people don't forget about her without taking people's money to pay my mortgage.

    Never have....never will.
    LOVE of money is the root of all evil.

  20. #45
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    I would give to a registered Charity. I'm surprised that they didn't divert the money to one. I am staggered that they used it for their mortgage. I am concerned they used it for Metodo 3 - and kept on doing so even when they made ridiculous claims. I am suspicious about what exactly it is paying for now.

  21. #46
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    I think at this point, the intent is to drain the fund as much as possible so that expenditures are not so widely publicized. Once that is done, and the initial, most controversial monies are spent, they can continue to sell posters, bracelets and t-shirts, collect the money and spend it as they wish.

    Charging for the posters - now that is a novel idea. I wonder how many they have sold?

    Salem

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salem View Post
    I think at this point, the intent is to drain the fund as much as possible so that expenditures are not so widely publicized. Once that is done, and the initial, most controversial monies are spent, they can continue to sell posters, bracelets and t-shirts, collect the money and spend it as they wish.

    Charging for the posters - now that is a novel idea. I wonder how many they have sold?

    Salem
    Why would they want to 'drain the fund' - are you hinting that some of this money is being recycled i.e. laundered?

  23. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salem View Post
    I think at this point, the intent is to drain the fund as much as possible so that expenditures are not so widely publicized. Once that is done, and the initial, most controversial monies are spent, they can continue to sell posters, bracelets and t-shirts, collect the money and spend it as they wish.

    Charging for the posters - now that is a novel idea. I wonder how many they have sold?

    Salem
    I think you are exactly right. A big, very public expenditure of funds, well publicized not just with the acts that are paid for, but publicizing the decision to spend the money, the plan to spend the money, etc.--to deflect criticism.

  24. #49
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    The Fund and M3

    I am confused about who exactly is paying M3. In some places I read that the fund is and then elsewhere that Brian Kennedy, a millionaire friend of the McCanns is paying them. But today I read on another forum that the fund is paying some money to Brian Kennedy who then tops it up if necessary and then pays M3. It all seems a little odd. If I had given to the fund then I would be writing to ask for assurances that the money is being used solely for the search for Madeleine even though it can be legitimately used for family expenses of course.

    Anyone got any accurate info on all this?

  25. #50
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    I found the source its a direct quote of Clarence Mitchell in the Portuguese news paper 24 Horas.

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