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  1. #1
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    Sep 2007
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    The Farce

    It has been said by others that ‘we know nothing.’ I beg to differ.


    We may not know the exact fate of Madeleine McCann, but the Policia Judiciaria compiled a dossier of evidence implicating the McCann’s in her disappearance which was submitted by the prosecutor to a judge. A root and branch review of the case by Paulo Rebelo has not changed the course of the investigation and Kate and Gerry are still the prime suspects. The PJ are not looking for a living child, but a corpse. Although many of the facts remain secret due to Portuguese legal procedure, there is plenty of circumstantial evidence which is in the public domain and most of it was revealed by the suspects themselves.


    We know that these infants were left alone every night, a crime which the social services chose to overlook, despite the risk to the twins. In the immediate aftermath of their child’s disappearance, the parents did not join a search party, but went jogging/hairdressers/tennis, which is incomprehensible in the circumstances. Gerry had the presence of mind to write a daily blog on trivial matters. Alex Woolfall said initially they thought Madeleine had wandered off, but Kate and Gerry contradicted this by claiming they knew “straight away, she was taken” within a minuscule window of opportunity, by a predatory paedophile. “Cluck-whoosh!”


    Kate admitted that after the twins were born Madeleine would “scream for attention” and she had a “sense of danger” but she was so “funny and engaging” that her mother believed she would give the creepy predator “her tuppence worth.” Kate washed all traces of her missing daughter from her favourite toy, Cuddle Cat. The child was heard crying “daddy” for hours by a neighbour. We know very little else about Madeleine, because her parents seldom mention her, preferring to discuss the antics of the twins.


    We know Russell O’Brien was absent from the group for half an hour and according to waiters, Jane Tanner never left the Tapas Bar. Her description of the abductor she could not have seen has changed several times, resulting in innocent people being persecuted by the McCann’s henchman, a government spin doctor. The McCann’s compromised the local priest whom they later snubbed and the distressed Father Pacheco has since distanced himself from this ignoble couple.


    They initiated a media circus and raised over a million pounds which has been squandered on a farce. Gerry was disappointed he could not use the fund to pay their legal fees. None of this money has been used to assist others with missing children. However, they paid their mortgage with these generous donations two months after Madeleine vanished. Two fund directors have resigned and been replaced by Jon Corner, Kate’s lifelong friend and Ed Smethurst. Brian Kennedy, is paying his fees and for Metodo 3’s fruitless search. They all have a ‘Common Purpose.’


    Alleged sightings have not amounted to a hill of beans, but proposed book/film/TV deals amount to a substantial sum. Clarence Mitchell’s main role appears to be negotiating lucrative contracts to raise cash to find a child that the police are certain is dead. Two suspected child killers are now the hottest property on the chat-show circuit. Who says crime doesn’t pay?


    Against police advice Gerry was willing to endanger his daughter’s safety by publicising her eye defect, because it was “a good marketing ploy.” Therefore, money making was always the priority over protecting his child. They enlisted instant support from Knights of the Empire and “called in favours.” Brown and Milliband have taken a personal interest in the case and the Home Secretary is impeding progress in the investigation by delaying crucial police interviews.


    The most outlandish theories have been proposed by Team McCann and their agents. Madeleine is with drug dealers in the Rif Mountains, she was at a museum in Chile, she is a rich Saudi’s trophy, or she is with the Russian Mafia. When the focus returns to the Arguido’s, another absurd theory is suggested and confirmed by Brits who work in the health service or with close ties to the McCann’s. The suspects and witnesses held a clandestine meeting at a hotel room.


    Gerry named his website after a book which deals with cold cases where the victim’s bodies remain undiscovered. This is already being described as a ‘cold case’ by the media, when the investigation is ongoing and far from complete. Statistically it is more likely Madeleine was killed by her parents than kidnapped, as Gerry confessed, this would be a hundred million to one chance, whereas the majority of untimely child deaths occur at the hands of a family member. We do not know what happened to Madeleine, but the Portuguese authorities are convinced she died at the Ocean Club and the cadaver dog’s reaction and DNA obtained from the scene are indicative of that.

    There is nothing which is hidden that will not be revealed.

    By Creepin (aka "Velma")

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    567
    Nice post.You have posted most that has had me .

    There is nothing which is hidden that will not be revealed.
    I really hope so in this case.I am so afraid that we will never know what happened to this sweet baby girl.

    I hope where ever she is,she is at peace and happy.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    UK
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    130
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Creepin View Post
    It has been said by others that ‘we know nothing.’ I beg to differ.


    We may not know the exact fate of Madeleine McCann, but the Policia Judiciaria compiled a dossier of evidence implicating the McCann’s in her disappearance which was submitted by the prosecutor to a judge. A root and branch review of the case by Paulo Rebelo has not changed the course of the investigation and Kate and Gerry are still the prime suspects. The PJ are not looking for a living child, but a corpse. Although many of the facts remain secret due to Portuguese legal procedure, there is plenty of circumstantial evidence which is in the public domain and most of it was revealed by the suspects themselves.


    We know that these infants were left alone every night, a crime which the social services chose to overlook, despite the risk to the twins. In the immediate aftermath of their child’s disappearance, the parents did not join a search party, but went jogging/hairdressers/tennis, which is incomprehensible in the circumstances. Gerry had the presence of mind to write a daily blog on trivial matters. Alex Woolfall said initially they thought Madeleine had wandered off, but Kate and Gerry contradicted this by claiming they knew “straight away, she was taken” within a minuscule window of opportunity, by a predatory paedophile. “Cluck-whoosh!”


    Kate admitted that after the twins were born Madeleine would “scream for attention” and she had a “sense of danger” but she was so “funny and engaging” that her mother believed she would give the creepy predator “her tuppence worth.” Kate washed all traces of her missing daughter from her favourite toy, Cuddle Cat. The child was heard crying “daddy” for hours by a neighbour. We know very little else about Madeleine, because her parents seldom mention her, preferring to discuss the antics of the twins.


    We know Russell O’Brien was absent from the group for half an hour and according to waiters, Jane Tanner never left the Tapas Bar. Her description of the abductor she could not have seen has changed several times, resulting in innocent people being persecuted by the McCann’s henchman, a government spin doctor. The McCann’s compromised the local priest whom they later snubbed and the distressed Father Pacheco has since distanced himself from this ignoble couple.


    They initiated a media circus and raised over a million pounds which has been squandered on a farce. Gerry was disappointed he could not use the fund to pay their legal fees. None of this money has been used to assist others with missing children. However, they paid their mortgage with these generous donations two months after Madeleine vanished. Two fund directors have resigned and been replaced by Jon Corner, Kate’s lifelong friend and Ed Smethurst. Brian Kennedy, is paying his fees and for Metodo 3’s fruitless search. They all have a ‘Common Purpose.’


    Alleged sightings have not amounted to a hill of beans, but proposed book/film/TV deals amount to a substantial sum. Clarence Mitchell’s main role appears to be negotiating lucrative contracts to raise cash to find a child that the police are certain is dead. Two suspected child killers are now the hottest property on the chat-show circuit. Who says crime doesn’t pay?


    Against police advice Gerry was willing to endanger his daughter’s safety by publicising her eye defect, because it was “a good marketing ploy.” Therefore, money making was always the priority over protecting his child. They enlisted instant support from Knights of the Empire and “called in favours.” Brown and Milliband have taken a personal interest in the case and the Home Secretary is impeding progress in the investigation by delaying crucial police interviews.


    The most outlandish theories have been proposed by Team McCann and their agents. Madeleine is with drug dealers in the Rif Mountains, she was at a museum in Chile, she is a rich Saudi’s trophy, or she is with the Russian Mafia. When the focus returns to the Arguido’s, another absurd theory is suggested and confirmed by Brits who work in the health service or with close ties to the McCann’s. The suspects and witnesses held a clandestine meeting at a hotel room.


    Gerry named his website after a book which deals with cold cases where the victim’s bodies remain undiscovered. This is already being described as a ‘cold case’ by the media, when the investigation is ongoing and far from complete. Statistically it is more likely Madeleine was killed by her parents than kidnapped, as Gerry confessed, this would be a hundred million to one chance, whereas the majority of untimely child deaths occur at the hands of a family member. We do not know what happened to Madeleine, but the Portuguese authorities are convinced she died at the Ocean Club and the cadaver dog’s reaction and DNA obtained from the scene are indicative of that.

    There is nothing which is hidden that will not be revealed.

    By Creepin (aka "Velma")
    Excellent post ! You speak for many....

    I have always felt that the Policia Judiciaria know much more than they are letting on and just because they have made no arrests doesn't mean that they know nothing! ( being accused of bungling and so on) They are biding their time, making sure that they have all the facts before they act.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
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    Lone Star State
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    6,293
    Excellent summation of the conflicting stories and concerns.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
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    14,189
    What a good post Creepin. I didn't know that Kate had washed Cuddle Cat or that the website was named after a cold case book. Makes me suspect those two even more.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    London
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    765
    i think the post is what is the worst of this case - it is full of half truths , innuendos , and just down right repetition of blog/tabloid rumour with no basis - little comments that if were to be put under any sort of scrutiny would crumble -

    It is to me just posted from a position of such bias on what is still an open case - a case that has not anyhere near being solved

    Yes I know everyone is entitled to an opinion - well this mine

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    29,161

    A Second Look

    Dr. Creepin - I have taken some liberties with your post. I hope you don't mind. If you do, please let me know.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Creepin View Post
    It has been said by others that ‘we know nothing.’ I beg to differ.


    We may not know the exact fate of Madeleine McCann, but the Policia Judiciaria compiled a dossier of evidence implicating the McCann’s in her disappearance which was submitted by the prosecutor to a judge. A root and branch review of the case by Paulo Rebelo has not changed the course of the investigation and Kate and Gerry are still the prime suspects. The PJ are not looking for a living child, but a corpse. (We know this from various media sources and I don't believe it is disputed anywhere. K&G remain prime suspects, Paulo Rebelo is now in charge of the investigation.) Although many of the facts remain secret due to Portuguese legal procedure, there is plenty of circumstantial evidence which is in the public domain and most of it was revealed by the suspects themselves.


    We know that these infants were left alone every night (we know this because the parents have admitted it and witnesses have confirmed it, Gerry admits it in a video - although he says they took the children to dinner the first night, but not any night following), a crime which the social services chose to overlook, despite the risk to the twins. In the immediate aftermath of their child’s disappearance, the parents did not join a search party, but went jogging/hairdressers/tennis (again, we know this because the parents tell us so - Gerry blogged about the jogging and tennis and the pictures reveal the trip to the hairdresser), which is incomprehensible in the circumstances. Gerry had the presence of mind to write a daily blog on trivial matters. Alex Woolfall said initially they thought Madeleine had wandered off, but Kate and Gerry contradicted this by claiming they knew “straight away, she was taken” (we know this again, because the parents say it in a video interview) within a minuscule window of opportunity, by a predatory paedophile. “Cluck-whoosh!”


    Kate admitted that after the twins were born Madeleine would “scream for attention” and she had a “sense of danger” but she was so “funny and engaging” that her mother believed she would give the creepy predator “her tuppence worth.” (Again a paraphrasing of Kate's words on video or media interviews) Kate washed all traces of her missing daughter from her favourite toy, Cuddle Cat (Again, Kate has admitted this - she claimed the toy smelled like suntan lotion). The child was heard crying “daddy” for hours by a neighbour (there is a witness to this that has been quoted and misquoted in the papers. My opinion is that this may be one of the only witnessess that is NOT looking for their 15 minutes of fame). We know very little else about Madeleine, because her parents seldom mention her, preferring to discuss the antics of the twins (We know this because we have read Gerry's blog. There was hardly any mention at all of Maddie until the parents started feeling the heat from the public about the lack of pictures and comments).


    We know Russell O’Brien was absent from the group for half an hour and according to waiters, Jane Tanner never left the Tapas Bar. Her description of the abductor she could not have seen has changed several times, resulting in innocent people being persecuted by the McCann’s henchman, a government spin doctor. (We know there is discrepancy here, anyway you slice the cake) The McCann’s compromised the local priest whom they later snubbed and the distressed Father Pacheco has since distanced himself from this ignoble couple.


    They initiated a media circus and raised over a million pounds which has been squandered on a farce. (We know this because we see it everyday.) Gerry was disappointed he could not use the fund to pay their legal fees. None of this money has been used to assist others with missing children. However, they paid their mortgage with these generous donations two months after Madeleine vanished. Two fund directors have resigned and been replaced by Jon Corner, Kate’s lifelong friend and Ed Smethurst. Brian Kennedy, is paying his fees and for Metodo 3’s fruitless search. They all have a ‘Common Purpose.’


    Alleged sightings have not amounted to a hill of beans (we know this because Maddie is still missing), but proposed book/film/TV deals amount to a substantial sum. Clarence Mitchell’s main role appears to be negotiating lucrative contracts to raise cash to find a child that the police are certain is dead. Two suspected child killers are now the hottest property on the chat-show circuit. Who says crime doesn’t pay?


    Against police advice Gerry was willing to endanger his daughter’s safety by publicising her eye defect, because it was “a good marketing ploy.” (We know this because Gerry tells us so) Therefore, money making was always the priority over protecting his child. They enlisted instant support from Knights of the Empire and “called in favours.” Brown and Milliband have taken a personal interest in the case and the Home Secretary is impeding progress in the investigation by delaying crucial police interviews.


    The most outlandish theories have been proposed by Team McCann and their agents. Madeleine is with drug dealers in the Rif Mountains, she was at a museum in Chile, she is a rich Saudi’s trophy, or she is with the Russian Mafia. When the focus returns to the Arguido’s, another absurd theory is suggested and confirmed by Brits who work in the health service or with close ties to the McCann’s. The suspects and witnesses held a clandestine meeting at a hotel room. (We know this because they have admitted to the meeting calling it a "reunion.")


    Gerry named his website after a book which deals with cold cases where the victim’s bodies remain undiscovered. (Anyone of us could verify this by doing a quick google search) This is already being described as a ‘cold case’ by the media, when the investigation is ongoing and far from complete. Statistically it is more likely Madeleine was killed by her parents than kidnapped, as Gerry confessed, this would be a hundred million to one chance, whereas the majority of untimely child deaths occur at the hands of a family member. We do not know what happened to Madeleine, but the Portuguese authorities are convinced she died at the Ocean Club and the cadaver dog’s reaction and DNA obtained from the scene are indicative of that. (We know this because again, K&G are still suspects)

    There is nothing which is hidden that will not be revealed.

    By Creepin (aka "Velma")
    We are always talking about what to believe and what sources are trustworthy. I have highligted (in blue) passages in Dr. Creepin's post above, which I consider are undisputed facts in this case and then I have followed the highlighted passage with a reason (in red) why that particular fact might be considered "indisputable."

    I would love to hear from others as to their take on these "facts" and why they might or might not believe them.

    Salem

    PS - Dr. Creepin - hope you don't mind my using your post.

  8. #8
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    Aug 2003
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    East Tennessee
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    Quote Originally Posted by gord View Post
    i think the post is what is the worst of this case - it is full of half truths , innuendos , and just down right repetition of blog/tabloid rumour with no basis - little comments that if were to be put under any sort of scrutiny would crumble -

    It is to me just posted from a position of such bias on what is still an open case - a case that has not anyhere near being solved

    Yes I know everyone is entitled to an opinion - well this mine
    Yeah, well . . . most of the cases here are still unsolved and "open." That is not a reason to stop discussing them, although you say that alot Gord.

    Dr. Creepin is just stating an opinion as valid as your own, and many of the things written there are verified by the McCann's own statements.

    As long as they keep talking, people will keep paying attention because they are still suspects. All suspects all over the world should watch what they say, because sometimes they incriminate themselves.

  9. #9
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    Sep 2007
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    76
    Salem, thanks for verifying these facts, it saved me the trouble.

    Brown discussed the case with Socrates - fact!
    Cuddle Cat was washed - fact!
    No Stone Unturned is a book about cold cases - fact!
    Kate's uncle said they called in favours - fact!
    They paid thei mortgage -fact!
    Innocents are being harrassed -fact!
    The PJ beleive Maddy is dead - fact!
    Jon Corner is a new fund director - fact!

    I could go on, because most of what I wrote were quotes from the horse's mouth - Kate and Gerry, during their many interviews, but I can't be bothered countering Gord's nit-picking.

    quote: 'a case that has not anyhere near being solved'

    And I stated at the end, this investigation is far from complete.

  10. #10
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    Oct 2007
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    UK
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    Quote Originally Posted by gord View Post
    i think the post is what is the worst of this case - it is full of half truths , innuendos , and just down right repetition of blog/tabloid rumour with no basis - little comments that if were to be put under any sort of scrutiny would crumble -

    It is to me just posted from a position of such bias on what is still an open case - a case that has not anyhere near being solved

    Yes I know everyone is entitled to an opinion - well this mine
    Keep your hair on Gord , you are right, that is your opinion, but with respect, you have to understand that many of us on this forum have ours also. Creeping's post is just voicing her opinion which I have to say that I agree with whole-heartedly!


  11. #11
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    Sep 2007
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    334

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by gord View Post
    i think the post is what is the worst of this case - it is full of half truths , innuendos , and just down right repetition of blog/tabloid rumour with no basis - little comments that if were to be put under any sort of scrutiny would crumble -

    It is to me just posted from a position of such bias on what is still an open case - a case that has not anyhere near being solved

    Yes I know everyone is entitled to an opinion - well this mine
    Totally agree gord

  12. #12
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    Sep 2007
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    1,148
    Wonderful post Dr. Creepin, you summed it all up very nicely!

  13. #13
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    Feb 2007
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    Gord and Daffodil - With respect and sincerity - I ask you, why you do not believe the things in Dr. Creepin's post. I am not asking for the sake of argument, but because I believe many of the things Dr. Creepin has said are "indisputable." However, it is obvious that you don't share this opinion and I wonder why? I am really asking why you dispute those facts or what those facts mean to you. I would like to know what you see that I might be missing.

    I have tried to approach this discussion several different ways and have gotten no where. I understand that you do not believe all you see and read and I have no issue with that, I don't believe everything either. But I feel as though all the rebuttals to the arguments are based solely on "unreliable media" and we never discuss the real meaning of the, in my opinion, indisputable facts.

    So this is my last effort at having a real discussion, based on something other than "unreliable media." I do respect your opinions and I am not trying to change them, I would just like to understand them better.

    Thank you,

    Salem

  14. #14
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    Feb 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Creepin View Post
    Salem, thanks for verifying these facts, it saved me the trouble.

    Brown discussed the case with Socrates - fact!
    Cuddle Cat was washed - fact!
    No Stone Unturned is a book about cold cases - fact!
    Kate's uncle said they called in favours - fact!
    They paid thei mortgage -fact!
    Innocents are being harrassed -fact!
    The PJ beleive Maddy is dead - fact!
    Jon Corner is a new fund director - fact!

    I could go on, because most of what I wrote were quotes from the horse's mouth - Kate and Gerry, during their many interviews, but I can't be bothered countering Gord's nit-picking.

    quote: 'a case that has not anyhere near being solved'

    And I stated at the end, this investigation is far from complete.
    Thank you Dr. Creepin for the additional clarification. I did not have time to look everything up, so I went with what I was sure of, thinking (and hoping) it would be a good place to start some dialog about the differences of opinion. I would really like to hear what the other side of the fence has to say about why they don't believe these facts.

    Salem

  15. #15
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    Jun 2007
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    I wish I had the time to go back and re-read all the posts BUT, I don't.

    Is it just me or do the rest of you see some of us laying out detail which substantiates our position and some of us only rebutting those details with insults? I am not saying this happens all the time, just a lot of the time.

    I know I have asked before for posters to present clear, concise, detailed arguments to back up their beliefs. Like Salem did above, it would be great to see someone use Velma's post to offer something, anything, that calls into question the points she has raised. And I mean something more substantial than, "that's printed in a tabloid and I have never believed anything printed in that rag".

    Is there anyone out there who could present a "list" like Velma's with an opposing viewpoint? Anyone?
    Last edited by colomom; 02-01-2008 at 03:25 PM. Reason: clarification

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