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  1. #1
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    Baptist Minister to apologize to those routinely condemned by Christans

    Gwinnett minister to apologize to those condemned by Christians
    Gays, women seeking abortions, couples not married will be included

    By REBECCA McCARTHY
    The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
    Published on: 03/28/08
    Just as the Christian church has done many wonderful things throughout history, says the Rev. Richard Mark Lee, it also has done many terrible things, such as targeting, judging and condemning various individuals and groups.
    On Sunday, Lee plans to apologize for these past wrongs in a sermon at his church, Sugar Hill Baptist, known as The Family Church. Some of the groups Lee said he'll apologize to include gays, women seeking abortions and couples who live together outside of marriage.

    http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/met...ge_tab_newstab

    What a terrific idea for a sermon! I'll be interested to see how it is received, but it's considered different enough to make the news. I applaud him.

  2. #2
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    I do agree that some Christians go about spreading the gospel
    the wrong way but on the other hand murder is murder weather
    it be inside or ouside the womb.

  3. #3
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    I see this as grandstanding. If he wants to do it, then do it. Don't call the media outlets and tell them you are going to do it.

    While we're all apologizing, where's mine for being castigated as a hater because I happen to be a Christian?

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Taximom View Post
    I see this as grandstanding. If he wants to do it, then do it. Don't call the media outlets and tell them you are going to do it.

    While we're all apologizing, where's mine for being castigated as a hater because I happen to be a Christian?
    That'll be right before or right after, Jamiel Shaw's murder is called a hate crime.

    Or maybe when people realize that one reason we see so much of what we are seeing with young children being abused is because life lost it's value 30 something years ago with the complete legalization of abortion. If life is not precious in the womb, it's not precious outside either.

    /rant

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by southcitymom View Post
    Gwinnett minister to apologize to those condemned by Christians
    Gays, women seeking abortions, couples not married will be included

    By REBECCA McCARTHY
    The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
    Published on: 03/28/08
    Just as the Christian church has done many wonderful things throughout history, says the Rev. Richard Mark Lee, it also has done many terrible things, such as targeting, judging and condemning various individuals and groups.
    On Sunday, Lee plans to apologize for these past wrongs in a sermon at his church, Sugar Hill Baptist, known as The Family Church. Some of the groups Lee said he'll apologize to include gays, women seeking abortions and couples who live together outside of marriage.

    http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/met...ge_tab_newstab

    What a terrific idea for a sermon! I'll be interested to see how it is received, but it's considered different enough to make the news. I applaud him.

    I agree, SCM. Good!

  6. #6
    IrishMist's Avatar
    IrishMist is offline You can't control the wind - but you can adjust your sails
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    Quote Originally Posted by justche View Post
    That'll be right before or right after, Jamiel Shaw's murder is called a hate crime.

    Or maybe when people realize that one reason we see so much of what we are seeing with young children being abused is because life lost it's value 30 something years ago with the complete legalization of abortion. If life is not precious in the womb, it's not precious outside either.

    /rant
    Child abuse goes back far beyond "30 something years ago"!

    On topic now-- I also applaud this. It'd be nice to hear about it from more than one church, but it's a good start!

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by IrishMist View Post
    Child abuse goes back far beyond "30 something years ago"!

    On topic now-- I also applaud this. It'd be nice to hear about it from more than one church, but it's a good start!
    Of course it goes back farther than 30 years - thank you captain obvious! But there has never been a time that so many horrible things happened to little ones, that we are seeing now.

  8. #8
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    Being one of those people who is constantly called a sinner, murderer and basically everything but a white woman, I'm always heartened when I see a religious leader who thinks it's terrible to be so full of venom. Unless and until you've walked a mile in someone else's shoes, you have no right, granted by God or anybody, to be so downright nasty to your fellow man. Unfortunately that falls on deaf ears and blind eyes.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by justche View Post
    Of course it goes back farther than 30 years - thank you captain obvious! But there has never been a time that so many horrible things happened to little ones, that we are seeing now.
    You think? I believe child rights and protection and the awareness of child abuse has come so far in the last 50 years that it blows my mind (in a good way)! The world is only getting better - in part, because we are caring better for our children!

  10. #10
    IrishMist's Avatar
    IrishMist is offline You can't control the wind - but you can adjust your sails
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    Quote Originally Posted by justche View Post
    Of course it goes back farther than 30 years - thank you captain obvious! But there has never been a time that so many horrible things happened to little ones, that we are seeing now.
    You're the one that made the silly comment... if it makes you feel better to call me names, that's fine.

    Yes, there has been a time. 1800's and 1900's weren't all that great of a time for children. Not to mention, the first child abuse case prosecuted was done under the current animal abuse laws. They didn't even HAVE child abuse laws at the time.

    It may be convenient to blame child abuse on abortion... but it doesn't make it true.


  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eire View Post
    .... I'm always heartened when I see a religious leader who thinks it's terrible to be so full of venom.......
    I agree, Eire. I am Christian, but too often I feel Christians give Christianity a bad name! I especially loved this quote from Rev. Lee:

    "Why is the gospel of love dividing America? The unchurched world views us as judgmental and homophobic," says Lee. "I don't think God is going to ask what label we wore. He's going to ask what did we do for Jesus."

    And it's really good for me to have this view come from a Baptist leader because that is a denomination that forces me to look at my own personal prejudices against Christians who don't think like I do.

    I also agree with Rev. Lee that so much religion has become politicized into a "bumpersticker" mentality. Blech! I don't care who you voted for, who you sleep with or whether you'er pro or anti choice - let's just come together in the unity of a loving God and figure it out for ourselves under that umbrella of grace and acceptance!

    It will be lovely to see if he can make it through the sermon without any BUTs. Equally lovely if the leaders of his Christian community don't chastise him for having the guts to say - "I'm sorry - we've been guilty of behaving like a bunch of arrogant, self-righteous dunderheads! No wonder you don't want to worship with us!"

  12. #12
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    I think that it's nice that he's trying to gain attention for his church, but this is NOT the way to do it. What is he really apologizing for? The Bible's teachings that these things are wrong? Sorry, but that book is the very essence and totality of what we as Christians are to believe and do. If he's willing to apologize for it then he needs to step down as pastor, resign from his church, and seek God's forgiveness for his weakness. JMHO. I may be a hater, a holy-roller, or whatever -- but he is deceiving his people and trying to conform our faith into whatever the people will put money into the coffers for.

    While saying this, I must also say that I personally have NEVER condemned anyone for whatever they choose to do lifestyle-wise. If you ask me, I'll tell you it's wrong based on my religious beliefs. But what you choose to do is between you, your closests, and God. It's NOT my right to tell you that you MUST do something (unless you're going to get hurt -- like you're standing in front of a train). I can only tell you what I think and then you live your life.

    PS... sorry to sound so scathing, but this is what I really believe. I know that our religious zealots have done some horrible things, many of then against our Biblical teachings as well. If he wants to apologize for that, then fine. But the main issue referenced is expressly wrong in our teachings and for that he should not apologize, but teach how to compassionately minister to it and not angrily accost those who don't believe as we do.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by IrishMist View Post
    You're the one that made the silly comment... if it makes you feel better to call me names, that's fine.

    Yes, there has been a time. 1800's and 1900's weren't all that great of a time for children. Not to mention, the first child abuse case prosecuted was done under the current animal abuse laws. They didn't even HAVE child abuse laws at the time.

    It may be convenient to blame child abuse on abortion... but it doesn't make it true.
    LOL! I'm going to begin every future PM to you as Dear Captain Obvious! Allright, I will start behaving now....

    And, on topic, that second paragraph is one of the things that I was thinking about when I say it is getting better, IMHO. We have more awareness today, better laws, children have more rights - it's just all so much better than it used to be. (ir - not to say we don't have a LONG way to go, mind you)

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by southcitymom View Post
    I am Christian, but too often I feel Christians give Christianity a bad name!

    I also agree with Rev. Lee that so much religion has become politicized into a "bumpersticker" mentality.

    I couldnt agree with you more south! I think that is the reason that we hear so many people today say that they are "spiritual" rather than religous.
    The world is full of magical things patiently waiting for our wits to grow sharper.
    Bertrand Russell

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by IrishMist View Post
    You're the one that made the silly comment... if it makes you feel better to call me names, that's fine.

    Yes, there has been a time. 1800's and 1900's weren't all that great of a time for children. Not to mention, the first child abuse case prosecuted was done under the current animal abuse laws. They didn't even HAVE child abuse laws at the time.

    It may be convenient to blame child abuse on abortion... but it doesn't make it true.
    This is something that I see pretty often - it's ok to make a put down in a smiley or a comment - but when I in like manner say captain obvious - suddenly it's me being rude.

    I didn't blame child abuse on abortion - I think it factors in to how casually life is looked at.

    The heart of child abuse is evil - not caring for something that is a precious gift. But - then again so is abortion - comparing not blaming.

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