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  1. #1
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    FLDS - The Children

    The following is a very interesting article on the guidelines given to foster care workers, with a few things that I haven't seen included in other articles.

    Polygamist sect children present a cultural challenge for foster-care facilities

    The two guides were crafted this week to help foster care workers at 16 different residential facilities, including those in the Houston area, who will interact with children from the reclusive breakaway Mormon sect.


    "Help them with self-esteem, guilty feelings, shame, confusion about mainstream culture, and learning basic decision making skills," stated the "Model for Care For Children From the Yearning For Zion Fundamentalist Latter Day Saints Sect," released to the Houston Chronicle by CPS.


    The second guide, the "Cultural Awareness Guide for Children From Eldorado," offered child care staffers a laundry list of the children's dietary and clothing needs.


    Further in the article it addresses the women who were separated from their children.


    An FLDS Web site set up to accept donations for the legal custody battle said that 40 mothers who decided to go to battered women's shelters in San Antonio and San Angelo did so because CPS workers told them they would have a better chance of seeing the children.


    Azar (CPS spokesperson) called those allegations "blatantly untrue" and said CPS will work to ensure that all mothers can visit their children in foster care.

    http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/...o/5731553.html



    One of the things I noted was that the guide covered discipline, and cautioned foster care workers to be aware of potentially harsh practices the children may have experienced.

    In regards to the women who returned to the YFZ ranch or went to a battered women's shelter, it's evident that the FLDS doesn't want to acknowledge that some of the women may be seeking to leave the FLDS. Only 7 women returned to the ranch, while 40 went to a shelter.




  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leila View Post
    The following is a very interesting article on the guidelines given to foster care workers, with a few things that I haven't seen included in other articles.
    Polygamist sect children present a cultural challenge for foster-care facilities
    The two guides were crafted this week to help foster care workers at 16 different residential facilities, including those in the Houston area, who will interact with children from the reclusive breakaway Mormon sect.
    "Help them with self-esteem, guilty feelings, shame, confusion about mainstream culture, and learning basic decision making skills," stated the "Model for Care For Children From the Yearning For Zion Fundamentalist Latter Day Saints Sect," released to the Houston Chronicle by CPS.
    The second guide, the "Cultural Awareness Guide for Children From Eldorado," offered child care staffers a laundry list of the children's dietary and clothing needs.
    Further in the article it addresses the women who were separated from their children.
    An FLDS Web site set up to accept donations for the legal custody battle said that 40 mothers who decided to go to battered women's shelters in San Antonio and San Angelo did so because CPS workers told them they would have a better chance of seeing the children.
    Azar (CPS spokesperson) called those allegations "blatantly untrue" and said CPS will work to ensure that all mothers can visit their children in foster care. http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/headline/metro/5731553.html
    One of the things I noted was that the guide covered discipline, and cautioned foster care workers to be aware of potentially harsh practices the children may have experienced.

    In regards to the women who returned to the YFZ ranch or went to a battered women's shelter, it's evident that the FLDS doesn't want to acknowledge that some of the women may be seeking to leave the FLDS. Only 7 women returned to the ranch, while 40 went to a shelter.
    Except that LATER when the FLDS got all lawyered up, those 40 women went right back to the ranch and/or their husbands. Some of the women NOT at the ranch are elsewhere in Texas WITH the FLDS "leaders". They did NOT leave and IMO, will NOT leave - the FLDS has told them if they leave, they will NOT get legal help to get the children back and since they have no jobs and no income, they will LOSE the kids to Daddy or another FLDS relative picked by the FLDS. They have trapped those women neatly and it will take WAY WAY more than the usual kinds of assistance to get those mothers out of the FLDS - if it's even possible.

    Of course the mothers will LIE and say and do whatever CPS says they need to do get custody of their kids, but unless CPS does very strict and frequent follow-up, those kids will go right back into the FLDS with their mothers. These mothers DON'T WANT TO ESCAPE THE FLDS - they believe in it and they don't know any other life. They'd be useless without their husband and leaders and can't begin to deal with the real world and MOST IMPORTANT they have no desire to change or get away. It will take YEARS of intense deprogramming to get even a FEW of these mothers to even THINK about leaving the FLDS....I think they will give up their kids 1st in most cases - they are THAT BRAINWASHED!

    WE cannot understand, but to these women they way they live is the ONLY RIGHT WAY and they have been taught this since BIRTH. They think WE are the wrong ones. You don't change a lifestyle and a belief that strong by taking their children - in fact, you may only make them MORE determined to get back to "normal" - even if that means they sacrifice their children. A human being will ALWAYS reach for the familiar and the KNOWN when stressed and these women are no different - that drive to get something back to "normal" while the chaos goes on means they will fight to get their own lives back, even at the expense of their children.

    We cannot rescue those who do not WANT to be saved. Trying only means we risk allowing them to drag us down with them. WE MIGHT be able to save the children and we should focus on them.

    My Opinion

  3. #3
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    An FLDS Child's Life

    Warning, this may make you sick....

    Life in the FLDS is tightly controlled, and always has been. Anything that might facilitate contact with the outside world is forbidden. No television, radio, newspapers or magazines are allowed. Reading matter is restricted to the Bible, the Book of Mormon and a couple of other Mormon religious manuals and FLDS tracts. No movies are allowed, no secular music, and the internet is restricted to a chosen few.
    Also banned is having a dog, swimming, celebrating worldly holidays, wearing short-sleeved shirts or blouses, women wearing pants or skirts above the ankle, talking with people outside the FLDS faith, being outside after dark, and any romantic contact between boys and girls; no flirting, no hanging out, no holding hands and no kissing.
    The list of banned items and activities goes on and on, is subject to change at any time; interpretation is at the discretion of the Prophet and not subject to appeal. All members watch each other at all times, are expected to report any infraction, and punishment is meted out again at the Prophet’s whim.

    Education for most members is highly restricted, and everything taught is through a religious filter
    . Prophet Jeffs ordered all FLDS to be homeschooled, following a church-approved curriculum with no history or biology, teaching that the moon landing was faked and the creationist version of science; schooling ends for most with the eighth grade.
    While girls are expected to learn and practice only homemaking skills, boys begin working in construction or the fields at age 8 and by 14 are operating heavy equipment. All wages, if they are paid at all, go to the communal United Effort Plan that owns the whole town and all FLDS businesses. The boys get nothing for their labor but room and board. There have been multiple incidents of child laborers being seriously injured, but no state complaints have ever been filed.
    All children are taught to fear outsiders, especially blacks who are portrayed as tools of Satan bearing the Mark of Cain, cursed by god and planning on torturing and killing any white children they can capture. Along with the usual Mormon doctrine of male domination, FLDS children are taught that if they leave the faith or are expelled they will forever lose their soul and dwell in eternal darkness.

    The level of physical abuse is utterly appalling. Babies as soon as they begin to crawl are routinely brutalized by beatings and having their faces held under open taps or forced into sinks full of water until they are no longer able to struggle, and this is repeated at random intervals throughout early childhood with no warning and for no stated reason. It isn’t punishment, but domination; the process is called “Breaking” and is meant to instill unreasoning, unquestioning fear and obedience.
    Women and children are routinely “reassigned” from one man to another, to intimidate and keep in line both the men and the women. Once placed with a new man, the children are required to view him as their real father and shun the father they have always known. Women who persist or repeat their defiance can have their children taken away and given to other women; the children are taught that their original mother is evil, and that the new woman is their real mother. This can happen again and again during a child’s life; no wonder that the children in Texas could not identify their true parents.
    http://www.correntewire.com/flds_ste...ing_texas_laws

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlowerChild View Post
    Except that LATER when the FLDS got all lawyered up, those 40 women went right back to the ranch and/or their husbands. Some of the women NOT at the ranch are elsewhere in Texas WITH the FLDS "leaders". They did NOT leave and IMO, will NOT leave - the FLDS has told them if they leave, they will NOT get legal help to get the children back and since they have no jobs and no income, they will LOSE the kids to Daddy or another FLDS relative picked by the FLDS. They have trapped those women neatly and it will take WAY WAY more than the usual kinds of assistance to get those mothers out of the FLDS - if it's even possible.

    Of course the mothers will LIE and say and do whatever CPS says they need to do get custody of their kids, but unless CPS does very strict and frequent follow-up, those kids will go right back into the FLDS with their mothers. These mothers DON'T WANT TO ESCAPE THE FLDS - they believe in it and they don't know any other life. They'd be useless without their husband and leaders and can't begin to deal with the real world and MOST IMPORTANT they have no desire to change or get away. It will take YEARS of intense deprogramming to get even a FEW of these mothers to even THINK about leaving the FLDS....I think they will give up their kids 1st in most cases - they are THAT BRAINWASHED!

    WE cannot understand, but to these women they way they live is the ONLY RIGHT WAY and they have been taught this since BIRTH. They think WE are the wrong ones. You don't change a lifestyle and a belief that strong by taking their children - in fact, you may only make them MORE determined to get back to "normal" - even if that means they sacrifice their children. A human being will ALWAYS reach for the familiar and the KNOWN when stressed and these women are no different - that drive to get something back to "normal" while the chaos goes on means they will fight to get their own lives back, even at the expense of their children.

    We cannot rescue those who do not WANT to be saved. Trying only means we risk allowing them to drag us down with them. WE MIGHT be able to save the children and we should focus on them.

    My Opinion
    The indoctrination is not only from birth, but is multi-generational. But, I keep hoping, and perhaps it's wishful hoping, that at least a few will emerge from this and be counted among those who've escaped.

    I'm still hopeful that the underage teenagers, who are either now pregnant or have already given birth, will make the decision to leave. As the victims, CPS will not allow them to be returned to the FLDS, but when they turn 18, there's nothing to prevent their return if that's their decision. With a 15 or 16 year-old, two or three years outside the cult may provide them with options.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leila View Post
    The indoctrination is not only from birth, but is multi-generational. But, I keep hoping, and perhaps it's wishful hoping, that at least a few will emerge from this and be counted among those who've escaped.

    I'm still hopeful that the underage teenagers, who are either now pregnant or have already given birth, will make the decision to leave. As the victims, CPS will not allow them to be returned to the FLDS, but when they turn 18, there's nothing to prevent their return if that's their decision. With a 15 or 16 year-old, two or three years outside the cult may provide them with options.
    All this is why I feel the children should see the outside world now. Sheltering them from reality will not enable them, especially those near 18, to make an intelligent decision about returning to a life they've always known or living a life in the real world.

    I think the facilities are great for the children, but it's interesting that there is a religious book and a wall poster of Jesus at Kidz Harbor, Liverpool. I wonder how this plays with the sect.

    http://www.chron.com/channel/houston...ECTS_KIDS.html

  6. #6
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    I watched a little of Nancy Grace last night. I'm falling away from that show because all she does is repeat herself and the same pictures and videos are shown over and over and over. I am still a fan of hers. I guess she doesn't have much to report on so she has to fill the hour.

    Anyway, this whole situation makes me sick. I hope and pray that anyone who has been held hostage to this lifestyle can overcome it and live a normal life.

  7. #7
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    What the deal with not owning dogs?

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Linda7NJ View Post
    What the deal with not owning dogs?
    Probably because they give fun and pleasure to their owners and cause their owners to laugh and smile.

    now about FLDS members not being allowed to swim: no chance of them being able to save their own lives should they fall into deep water, huh?

    accidentally or no . . .

  9. #9
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    Warren Jeffs on animals

    http://blog.beliefnet.com/news/2008/...at-puberty.php

    When Carolyn J. made her escape at one point she met with Utah's attorney general, Mark Shurtleff
    and told him of the abuse and extremism that had taken hold of FLDS, because of Warren Jeffs. She described how women were arbitarily taken from husbands and given to other men.

    How Warren had terrorized young children by having animals tortured to death in front of them. She told them about the day all the dogs were destroyed and how Warren taught that a society
    that treated animals humanely was corrupt and had turned away from God.

  10. #10
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    IMO Warren is a psychopath who seized control and had his own personal playground for several years in which he practiced his cruelty to both humans and animals. There is no punishment great enough in my view that could be meted out to this ...thing that would bring justice to those he abused.


  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trino View Post
    All this is why I feel the children should see the outside world now. Sheltering them from reality will not enable them, especially those near 18, to make an intelligent decision about returning to a life they've always known or living a life in the real world.

    I think the facilities are great for the children, but it's interesting that there is a religious book and a wall poster of Jesus at Kidz Harbor, Liverpool. I wonder how this plays with the sect.

    http://www.chron.com/channel/houston...ECTS_KIDS.html
    At this point CPS only has temporary custody of the children. There is still the possibility of sending them back dependent on what the investigation reveals about abuse and of course on the court's decision. To expose them to more right now, could make it more difficult on them if they should be returned. So until things are more permanent, then it is probably best for the kids if exposure is limited.

    Now if the court allows them to be taken for longer term, I think that they will receive more exposure. From what I have read, CPS can only hold them in the shelters for 90 days- unless the judge extends that. If they end up in foster homes, then there will be more exposure. They will be attending school, they will have exposure to other foster kids, there will be TV's, sports and a whole lot of other things.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trino View Post
    All this is why I feel the children should see the outside world now. Sheltering them from reality will not enable them, especially those near 18, to make an intelligent decision about returning to a life they've always known or living a life in the real world.

    I think the facilities are great for the children, but it's interesting that there is a religious book and a wall poster of Jesus at Kidz Harbor, Liverpool. I wonder how this plays with the sect.

    http://www.chron.com/channel/houston...ECTS_KIDS.html
    Kidz Harbor appears to be the perfect setting to place these children. I'm hopeful the court decisions will allow the children to remain apart from the FLDS and gradually be introduced to the outside world.

    One thing that wasn't addressed that I wonder about is how the foster care workers and social workers will answer children's questions. Certainly the older children, the pre-teen and teens will have questions about what is happening to them, why they were taken from their homes.

    I hope that with the teens that are pregnant or have already given birth, there will be a more intensive learning about the real world. These teens don't have parents to claim them, as they're considered a "wife" to one of the FLDS men.

  13. #13
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    Q: State District Judge Barbara Walther ruled on April 18 that the children remain in CPS custody. What is the next legal step for the children?

    A: CPS must adhere to a strict set of court deadlines. An initial hearing is held first, within 24 hours after the child is taken from the home. At that hearing and every subsequent one, CPS workers must state why the child was taken and whether conditions exist that would prevent the child from returning home. A 14-day hearing is held to determine if the child should remain in state custody. Walther ruled that the FLDS children should remain until the 60-day status hearings, which will begin by June 5.

    Q: And after the status hearing?

    A: CPS meets with the judge at the six-month, 10-month and year marks after a child is taken into custody. At the final hearing, parents have to show how they've made their home safe so the children can be returned. If they can't prove that, their parental rights are terminated and the child is put up for adoption.
    http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/...n/5737874.html

  14. #14
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    I hope these kids realize what the real God and real people are like instead of living with demons. Hopefully, after getting to watch some tv, play, not be raped and beaten, dress and fix their hair like real people do they won't ever want to live around a bunch of freaks again. They'll even have some black men and women caring for them I'm sure. They'll see that they care more about them than their so called families and false prophet.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by mysteriew View Post
    Q: State District Judge Barbara Walther ruled on April 18 that the children remain in CPS custody. What is the next legal step for the children?

    A: CPS must adhere to a strict set of court deadlines. An initial hearing is held first, within 24 hours after the child is taken from the home. At that hearing and every subsequent one, CPS workers must state why the child was taken and whether conditions exist that would prevent the child from returning home. A 14-day hearing is held to determine if the child should remain in state custody. Walther ruled that the FLDS children should remain until the 60-day status hearings, which will begin by June 5.

    Q: And after the status hearing?

    A: CPS meets with the judge at the six-month, 10-month and year marks after a child is taken into custody. At the final hearing, parents have to show how they've made their home safe so the children can be returned. If they can't prove that, their parental rights are terminated and the child is put up for adoption.
    http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/...n/5737874.html
    Thanks Mysteriew! With this protocol, I can't see many, if any, of the children returning to the FLDS parents. I think it will be dependent on what the state presents in court as evidence of abuse when the status hearings begin on June 5th. Certainly, none of the underage girls that are pregnant or have already given birth will be allowed to return to the YFZ ranch. Their status at the YFZ ranch was a wife, not a child.

    In addition to the civil proceedings, there's the likelihood of criminal charges.

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