GUILTY CT - Zachary Cohn, 6, drowned in swimming pool, Greenwich, 26 July 2007

Sad story. People shouldn't have to go to their basements for the emergency shut off on the pool drain systems, especially on a pool built after 2005.
 
It's not clear in the news article if the child was being supervised while in the pool. I can understand the safety aspect as far as the builder being responsible, but was he being supervised. IMO 6 years old is too young to be swimming without an adult present. Either way it's a tragic loss for this family.
 
This seems like a civil matter to me.
 
It's not clear in the news article if the child was being supervised while in the pool. I can understand the safety aspect as far as the builder being responsible, but was he being supervised. IMO 6 years old is too young to be swimming without an adult present. Either way it's a tragic loss for this family.

I read some of the comments associated with the article and it seems that even if he had been supervised (which we don't know), they would have been unable to free him from the suction. One poster said that there was a similar situation where a girl's arm was stuck and six men pulling on her could not free her. She drowned. The only way to save the boy was to release the suction, and if it was not working properly there would be no way to save him. I'm not sure what kind of pool this was either. My neighbor has an above ground pool that I took care of last week. There was a power switch right next to the pool that had to be turned off in order to clean the basket that collected debris. I didn't realize the power had to be turned off first, and I was pulling and pulling on that basket until I realized the suction was holding it down. Once I turned it off the basket popped right out. Same concept as the boy. Evidently there was something wrong with the shutoff thingy.:confused:
 
The builder was negligence in the installation and construction of the pool.

This negligence "lead to the direct" death of a child.

A shut off safety valve is not a choice, not an option, not an "opps" it is mandatory, and if not installed properly or not at all, then it can and will lead to death.

So manslaughter and criminal negligence is a correct charge.

Manslaughter - his conduct was reckless,a wanton disregard for the known dangers of a particular situation.

I take it this man was not an average person who built and installed a pool, but a man who held himself out as capable and competent.

He cannot claim that he did not know that a missing or incorrectly installed safety value would not lead to a person death. He installs and build pools.

The pool construction did not meet safety codes for pool safety.

But I put money on the fact that this family trusted this man to install the pool correctly with the required safety device.

Unfortunately, when their child died, then they found out the builder did not install safety valve.

It would be similar to having a house built. You get a permit, you hire reputable contractors, who in the end decided to save themselves money by cutting corners.

The ceiling collapses, it kills your husband and child. Would that be a civil matter. The answer is no, it is criminal negligence. The builders knew or should have known that cutting corners will lead to the ceiling collapsing.

 
How is an improperly installed safety valve on a pool going to lead to the death of a 6 year old child if the child is being supervised? Even IF the child's hand was stuck in the vent the child would not have drowned if he/she was being supervised.

I find it ridiculous that a business owner is facing 10 years in prison for an allegedly improperly installed pool, which to my mind even if WAS improperly installed and even if he did KNOW FOR A FACT it was improperly installed it still cannot be considered the direct cause of death.

IMO the direct cause of death is the parents failing to supervise their child in their pool.
 
How is an improperly installed safety valve on a pool going to lead to the death of a 6 year old child if the child is being supervised? Even IF the child's hand was stuck in the vent the child would not have drowned if he/she was being supervised.

I find it ridiculous that a business owner is facing 10 years in prison for an allegedly improperly installed pool, which to my mind even if WAS improperly installed and even if he did KNOW FOR A FACT it was improperly installed it still cannot be considered the direct cause of death.

IMO the direct cause of death is the parents failing to supervise their child in their pool.


Even if his mom was in the pool with him supervising, he might have been underwater and become stuck to the suction and unable to come up for air. It just sounds so horrible. I can't imagine what a parent would do to try to get air to their drowning child stuck to suction under water. AFter reading Cyberlaw's post above, I think I agree. This is assuming that this safety feature is a mandatory requirement for pools, and not just something new. (I don't know much about how pools are set up). If the turn off switch was in the basement or somewhere difficult to get to quickly then it could have been too late before they got to it.
 
A similar event unfortunately happened in my city some years ago.

Again, the safety valve was either defective or missing.

A girls' hair got caught in the mechanism in a public pool. Despite the efforts of many people to get her out, they could not.

Not only was the pool supervised, lifeguards were on duty, kids taking swimming lessons, other people using the pool, parents, the child died.

The suction is beyond "just pulling out the child", you cannot just pull out the child with the force of the suction and the constant suction. You would literally have to "rip" the body part, or hair from the swimmer.

One of the reasons why when our oldest was taking swimming in school, the lifeguards "personally" ensured all girls wore swimming caps. All the girls lined up and were "checked" to ensure that their hair was under the caps.

This is negligence, pure and simple. BTW, a safety value is mandatory in the building code. If I remember correctly, the code was changed in 2004 and the pool was installed in 2005

How about this: You take your car in to the dealership to have the breaks repaired or changed. Well, you would assume since it is the dealership, they hire educated people, check the work to ensure it is safe.

But they cut corners, failed to check the work to ensure that is is safe, hired people at "cut rate" to save money.

Then you drive the car, you realize the breaks do not work. Your kids are injured, you are in a Coma, and your hubby is dead.

That is not a civil action it is criminal negligence.
 
If that happened I wouldn't sue the CEO of the auto company.

Where is the proof that the owner knew the safety value wasn't installed? Where is the proof he could have reasonably forseen that if he knew it wasn't installed, that it would lead to death? Where is the evidence that supports the idea that no lack of supervision contributed to the child's death?

Who inspects and approves new construction? Why not throw in a law suit for the State of Connecticut for failing to ensure the pool was up to code? What's the difference if you are looking to find someone else responsible? Maybe its a civil rights violation as well?

If they wanted to charge him with criminal negligence that might be one thing, but MANSLAUGHTER? It's ridiculous, and in fact its an affront to people whose family members are actual homicide victims.
 
If that happened I wouldn't sue the CEO of the auto company.

But the test is, recklessness. Would the owner of the auto company "foresee" that the lack of experienced workers, the lack of safety checks, the lack of skill, could "reasonably" been known by a reasonable person to lead to breaks that are not installed properly leading to death. That could be seen as "depraved" indifference to human life. Would a reasonable person know that this could lead to the death of your family. The answer to that is Yes.

Then when the person is found guilty, then you can sue. Which by the way could take years, in a civil trial.

Where is the proof that the owner knew the safety value wasn't installed?

If the people he hired to "build" the pool, were not trained, were not versed in pool safety, and were not versed in the building code for proper safety value instruction and the pool was not inspected by the company to ensure that it meet all safety requirements, then the owner of the company is responsible for his employees. There has to be a person who has experience, knowledge and training in the proper installation of pools to ensure the job was correctly done and meet all safety requirements.

Where is the proof he could have reasonably forseen that if he knew it wasn't installed, that it would lead to death?

Easy, he was the owner, he was responsible, it was his responsibility that "his product" was safe to use, his people were competent, that corners were not cut, that building code were in place and the pool was built to code. That means he or someone with knowledge and experience were required to ensure that the pool was built correctly and was safe.

There again, is a reason why it is included in the building code. Building codes ensure "minimum" standards in building and construction safety.

Where is the evidence that supports the idea that no lack of supervision contributed to the child's death?

Because in the instance of "suction" no amount of "human strength" could have pulled the child out. You would "literally" have to detach the limb from the suction to get the child out. No amount of supervision could have overcome a "defect" in construction and the lack of a "safety valve"
( it is called a safety valve for a reason)

Who inspects and approves new construction?

Sorry cannot comment on that one, as I do not live in this state.

But, I can tell you that the plans are approved by the building department. They would ensure all the plans meet building and safety requirements. They would approve the plans. The plans are "required" to be built as approved. But they "don't micro manage the installation, as that is the "hired" contractors job to do. There are only "certain" aspects of construction that may be checked. Again, I do not live in this state or even the USA. But am speaking from my knowledge of building permits

Why not throw in a law suit for the State of Connecticut for failing to ensure the pool was up to code?

Conn. did not build the pool, they approved the plans as submitted to them. Again, they do not go on site to "ensure" the builder follows the plans. The builder is required to build to code.


What's the difference if you are looking to find someone else responsible? Maybe its a civil rights violation as well?

Again, cannot comment on that, as I do not live in the states.

If they wanted to charge him with criminal negligence that might be one thing, but MANSLAUGHTER? It's ridiculous, and in fact its an affront to people whose family members are actual homicide victims.

Pardon me, a person dies. They both died at the "hands" and responsibility of another person. Be it they are directly killed by another person(murder) or dies as a result of another person actions. The end result is that they both died. Manslaughter is a legal term for the killing of a human in a manner considered by law as less culpable than murder.

 
Where is the proof that the owner knew the safety value wasn't installed? Where is the proof he could have reasonably forseen that if he knew it wasn't installed, that it would lead to death?

This type of accident due to suction has resulted in dozens of deaths over the last twenty years or more. The dangers are well known and established.

Where is the evidence that supports the idea that no lack of supervision contributed to the child's death?

No level of supervision can prevent these deaths.For example, there was a death in my former town about ten years ago in the wading pool--a small child sat down in the water and her butt was stuck to the drain by the suction. She didn't drown, her head was above water. The force involved essentially disembowelled her. Her mother was within arm's length of the child and frantically trying to release her from the suction to no avail.

Teenagers and adults have also drowned due to suction accidents.

Who inspects and approves new construction? Why not throw in a law suit for the State of Connecticut for failing to ensure the pool was up to code?

In my state, the building plans are approved by the building department. For most of the construction there is no inspection--the builder signs a statement saying that the project was completed as per the plans submitted. I don't know how the state of Connecticut handles site inspections.

What's the difference if you are looking to find someone else responsible? Maybe its a civil rights violation as well?

It might be if the plaintiffs are of colour or a certain religion and can prove that when this particular builder constructed similar pools for people outside that minority that they exercised due diligence for the other people but not in the case of this plaintiff.

If they wanted to charge him with criminal negligence that might be one thing, but MANSLAUGHTER? It's ridiculous, and in fact its an affront to people whose family members are actual homicide victims.

Is that child less dead because the person responsible wears a suit and tie?

I'm old enough to remember the outrage and backlash following the revelations that Ford Pinto cars were at particularly high risk for exploding gas tanks in rear end collisions because Ford didn't want to spend an extra $11/car for a strut that would reinforce the gas tank. Ford built thousands of those Pintos knowing that they had a design defect that they could explode in a rear end collision and that the doors were highly likely to jam closed in a rear end collision.

The real outrage came after a memo came to light which detailed the cost of the repair ($11/car) against what it would cost to settle the lawsuits by those who were actually harmed in such accidents. Knowing that Ford chose, in cold blood, to risk people's lives with a car that had a known defect because it was cheaper to pay off the injured and the grieving... well, people were very, very angry.

I think there is way less tolerance now for this sort of thing and I believe that is a good thing. To return to this case, the problem with excessive suction is a recognised and well known problem; there have been dozens of deaths (and a lucky few who escaped with hideous injuries--the child in my old home town was not the only victim disembowelled); there is no level of supervision which can prevent victims using the pool as intended from being killed or injured.

There is no possible excuse for not installing the legally mandated safety equipment.

I only wish that the vice presidents and president of Ford who decided that the lives of poor people (Pintos were aimed at the lowest end of the market) weren't worth $11/car had been arrested and tried for manslaughter as well.
 
I may be wrong but I don't think the CEO of Ford Motor Company or any other Ford executive was tried for MANSLAUGHTER, though I agree that it was a much more clear cut example of corporate malfeasance that this case is.

Sorry, I can't agree that suing corporate executives for the faulty work of their employees is any kind of justice or makes any legitimate legal sense without evidence this was done intentially as a policy.

If this man's company had installed multiple pools where multiple similar injuries had occured and he had flat out told his employees NOT to install the safety device, then I would say you have a case for manslaughter.

This case is a joke and among the worst examples of legal excess I have seen.

How is this guy POSSIBLY more responsible than say the Merck scientists who knew for a fact their drug was causing heart attacks? Why hasn'ts anyone from Merck been brought up on manslaughter charges?

Oh yeah, Merck is a billion dollar global behemoth that can afford dozens of lawyers and this poor slob is some guy who owns a pool installation company...he's an easy target.

Sorry, this case makes me sick. This is an example of super rich, whiny parents...the 'victim's father runs/ran one of the largest hedge funds on Wall Street which means they are worth tens of millions...who seek to place blame on someone else for this tragedy...no different than suing the parents who host a pool party and some kid drowns..and they are using their money to exact revenge as a way to salve their own guilty consciences.

Why the Greenwich police and prosecutor went along with it...I can only assume its Blue America at its absolute worst....there isn't much real crime in CT to begin with, none in Greenwich so they're inventing a new class of white collar manslaughter.
 
Excuse me, Medea.

Oh those whinny rich parents, their 6 year old child decided to go for a swim one day and died as a result of negligence of the pool installer. I guess when a pool is installed you should hire a pool inspector to make sure the job is done right. Oh I forgot, it is up to the company that built the pool to be sure it was done right. Silly me.........I just assumed that this company knew what they were doing, especially when a mistake or negligence could cost a person their life. This is not rocket science, it is a basic mandatory safety device.

Oh those whinny parents, why don't they chalk up their loses and call it a day after it was "no ones" fault that the child died, right.

Come on, please, I cannot believe the "attitude".

This happened in Canada, not only was their a coroners inquest, but "measures were put in place and recommendations were made so it does not happen again.

Because you ask, people die as a result of a defective or missing valve. They don't get a minor injury, they don't stub their toe, they don't get a bump on the head, they die a horrible death or have horrible life long serious injuries. The death is a direct result of the valve missing or defective. They get caught in the suction and die. If a safety value is installed and not defective, then they don't die.

If this man's company had installed multiple pools where multiple similar injuries had occurred and he had flat out told his employees NOT to install the safety device, then I would say you have a case for manslaughter.

Should 10 kids die, should maybe 50, before manslaughter charges are laid. How many is a good number for you. It does not matter what or if he told his employees anything. His product is defective, that defect lead to "unnecessary" death, he is responsible for every pool, every employee and any death. I put money that people who hired this company in the past, made sure their pool was inspected by another pool company so their child does not die one afternoon. I know I would.

How many "other" pools did this company install that may be ticking time bombs for the people who "contracted" with a reputable company, who paid them to build a pool to code and a safe pool(so you know, those whinny rich kids do not want to die when they want a dip in the pool)and this could happen again.

Sorry, I can't agree that suing corporate executives for the faulty work of their employees is any kind of justice or makes any legitimate legal sense without evidence this was done intentionally as a policy.

If you read the article, the person charged is the owner and operator of a swimming pool company. Not a head of any international car company or drug company.

He is responsible for his product, he is the owner, he is the "boss" he is responsible for the quality of the work, he is responsible for safety or the lack thereof. It does not matter that this was done intentionally or not, because it was reckless( Indifferent to or disregardful of consequences) of the fact that the pools was not up to code.

The code was changed a year before the pool was installed and the safety valve was "not installed".

Those who seek to place blame on someone else for this tragedy

Well let me see, the kids is not to blame, as he was swimming. But he died as a direct result of negligence. His dying is manslaughter. The parents did not install the pool, the parents did not build the pool, the parents did not install the safety device. Oh yeah, forgot, the person who is to blame is the person responsible for the death of this child.

...no different than suing the parents who host a pool party and some kid drowns

Sure, send you kid over to my place, I am in the kitchen, on the phone, or let me see having a "few glasses" of wine. I am reading a book or surfing the net, all the while your kid is outside unsupervised and he dies. But I promised you that I would be outside watching the child. But I changed my mind. Too bad so sad your child died. Not my fault he drowned. He should have had better swimming lessons, or a float device or called out to me upstairs when he was drowning. Not my fault, just a terrible "accident". Come on, please.

You bet, your bottom dollar if that happened that I would need to hire a criminal lawyer. No doubt. At all.

When our kids go over to another house to swim, you can put money on the fact that a "responsible" adult who only responsibility is to what our kids is there. Our kids are not going to die because of the recklessness and irresponsibility of "some other person". Not a chance. When kids come over here, parents do the same. I encourage it.

..and they are using their money to exact revenge as a way to salve their own guilty consciences.

Do they want revenge, or someone who is responsible, held responsible for the death of their child. Do people want the person who murdered their loved ones brought to trial and held responsible. Yes, no doubt. Little if any difference.

This company has been in business for 40 years. The code change was mandated because of serious injuries and death from a defective or missing device. Under pools safety on their website, for some odd reason they don't state "make sure our company installs your pool correctly because if we don't your child could die. Funny how that was not included.

The parents statement: Nothing will bring our son back but we hope this prosecution will help prevent another horrific incident like this from happening to someone else," the parents said in a statement released by their attorneys. "Those who knowingly violate pool safety codes designed to protect children should be held accountable for their actions."
 
I may be wrong but I don't think the CEO of Ford Motor Company or any other Ford executive was tried for MANSLAUGHTER, though I agree that it was a much more clear cut example of corporate malfeasance that this case is.

No, no Ford executive faced criminal charges. I am not alone in thinking that they should have.

In the memo, they even take into account that the settlements they'd have to pay would be less because the victims would be low income, therefore their lives would cost less. I am still not over the sheer hatefulness of that sort of thinking more than 30 years later.

Sorry, I can't agree that suing corporate executives for the faulty work of their employees is any kind of justice or makes any legitimate legal sense without evidence this was done intentially as a policy.

If he, as owner of the company, was not responsible for the results of the work done, why was he getting paid the most?

If this man's company had installed multiple pools where multiple similar injuries had occured and he had flat out told his employees NOT to install the safety device, then I would say you have a case for manslaughter.

One dead child isn't enough?

How is this guy POSSIBLY more responsible than say the Merck scientists who knew for a fact their drug was causing heart attacks? Why hasn'ts anyone from Merck been brought up on manslaughter charges?

The scientists for Merck developed a drug. That means they came up with a formula and ran experiments to test the performance of that drug. The results of those experiments were turned over to the management of the company, who made a decision on what results they should turn over to the FDA.

If the data had been as clearcut as you imply (which it was not), then the managers on up were responsible. The scientists do not make the final decision on which studies to release or which drugs to sell.

The studies look a lot more convincing in hindsight, when the data from thousands of users is known. At the time? Not so clear.

You are missing a point, though. The safety valve is not a speculative new technology. It is a tried, proven technology that prevents deaths when using the product as intended (for swimming). The danger was known, the remedy was known but not applied.

Sorry, this case makes me sick. This is an example of super rich, whiny parents...the 'victim's father runs/ran one of the largest hedge funds on Wall Street which means they are worth tens of millions...

Are you implying that these parents are in some way less bereaved from the loss of their child than parents who have factory jobs would be? That's just the flip side of the Ford reasoning: it's okay for the <x type> group to suffer because their lives aren't worth as much to us.

What difference does the father's source of income make? All his money cannot bring his child back.

who seek to place blame on someone else for this tragedy...no different than suing the parents who host a pool party and some kid drowns..and they are using their money to exact revenge as a way to salve their own guilty consciences.

Guilty for what?

They had a pool that was installed by a supposedly professional pool installer. Like me, these people probably wouldn't know a pool safety valve if it leapt up and bit them on the nose. So they did what any reasonable person would do--they hired a professional to do the job for them.

That professional failed to meet the legal standards and their child died due to that failure.

To me, that's criminal negligence.
 
Such a sad case. I feel for the parents. Poor little precious one loosing his life. {{hugs}}
 
From April 2011:

http://www.ctpost.com/local/article/CEO-pool-company-plead-guilty-in-Greenwich-boy-s-1336141.php

A pool company president expressed remorse Wednesday in state Superior Court as he pleaded guilty to a reduced charge of criminally negligent homicide stemming from the 2007 drowning death of a 6-year-old Greenwich boy.

David Lionetti, 55, also entered a guilty plea on behalf of his company, Stamford-based Shoreline Pools Inc., to the charge of second-degree manslaughter... Lionetti, who faced 10 years in prison, will serve a suspended one-year prison term followed by three years of probation...

Lionetti's company did not install a required vacuum-release system in the pool and failed to design an appropriate dual-drain system that would have decreased the suction force of the drain that trapped Zachary. The device would have also turned the system off after sensing the obstruction, according to authorities.
 

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