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  1. #61
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    113
    A couple of the men in the group started asking each other "if you wanted to make someone disappear forever, what would you do?" The overwhelming response was "I'd throw him in with the hogs".
    This actually happened in a rather famous, or maybe I should say infamous, case here in Michigan.

    http://www.angelfire.com/mi3/mpccn/ognjan.html

    http://www.freep.com/news/mich/bros30_20031030.htm


  2. #62
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Posts
    129
    Wow Shellbee and Emma, your links make me wonder even more if it happens more frequently than city dwellers might realize.

    Pretty scary.

    My husband, having grown up in the country, thinks that rural law enforcement probably isn't smart enough to think of hog farms when people come up missing. I'm hoping he's wrong.


  3. #63
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Anchorage, AK
    Posts
    1,394
    Quote Originally Posted by emma l
    Interestingly though I read that the police based the idea of the photo not being Tara on one simple fact- the girl in the photo has shaved legs, why would a kidnapper shave or allow an abducted girl to shave her legs?

    I personally think its pretty self-explanatory.........You def would let the person shave their legs/wash/do their hair etc if you were keeping them for certain reasons........ I don't think i need to go into details...................
    Apparently the girl in the photos was seen by witnesses on a beach shortly beore the photo was found. She was apparently surrounded by males and was being ordered around......but the police suspected it might have been staged...........Who knows? Its a pretty elaborate hoax.
    I had read about the men ordering the young lady around, and considered it might have been a consensual relationship that she had with the men, but hadn't heard all of the other similarities you mention.

    Yes, if you kidnap someone for sexual reasons, you might want them to shave their legs.

    It makes me more scared to consider how long Tara might have lived like this than it would to think that someone took and killed her quickly. IIRC, this photo was found MONTHS after Tara was kidnapped.

    And who the hell is that little boy?


  4. #64
    BethInak,

    I think about the boy in the photos a lot. Its weird that nobody came forward and said it was their child- apart from Micheal Henleys parents.....and as he was said to have died from exposure..................... Although I did notice in the article that Taras parents say that they "even have their doubts about that".....................

    I was saying in the Zack Bernhardt thread that although it obviously couldn't be Zack in the photos with Tara, it is weird that the boy in that photo and the boy in the photo found bound and gagged around the time Zack dissapeared are both similar in looks- blonde haired, similar colouring etc. And that photo was also found outside a convience store as well- something about this is really bugging me.............

    I also noticed that Tara disappeared in September 1988 and the first photo of her and the boy was taken on film not available until May 1989, the 2nd in June 1989 and the third in FEBRUARY 1990.

    This would suggest that the photographer deliberately chose film that would tell people the time it was taken.......Why would anyone bother to do this if not to give some kind of clue or message that Tara was still alive months after she vanished?

    Poor Tara, and that poor little boy. It must be devastating for her family, knowing she might have been alive for months after she disappeared- that she might even be somewhere right now. I think the pain of not knowing, of trying to keep some kind of hope alive would crush me. I don't know how people cope.


  5. #65
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    2,384
    Quote Originally Posted by emma l
    BethInak,

    I think about the boy in the photos a lot. Its weird that nobody came forward and said it was their child- apart from Micheal Henleys parents.....and as he was said to have died from exposure..................... Although I did notice in the article that Taras parents say that they "even have their doubts about that".....................

    I was saying in the Zack Bernhardt thread that although it obviously couldn't be Zack in the photos with Tara, it is weird that the boy in that photo and the boy in the photo found bound and gagged around the time Zack dissapeared are both similar in looks- blonde haired, similar colouring etc. And that photo was also found outside a convience store as well- something about this is really bugging me.............

    I also noticed that Tara disappeared in September 1988 and the first photo of her and the boy was taken on film not available until May 1989, the 2nd in June 1989 and the third in FEBRUARY 1990.

    This would suggest that the photographer deliberately chose film that would tell people the time it was taken.......Why would anyone bother to do this if not to give some kind of clue or message that Tara was still alive months after she vanished?

    Poor Tara, and that poor little boy. It must be devastating for her family, knowing she might have been alive for months after she disappeared- that she might even be somewhere right now. I think the pain of not knowing, of trying to keep some kind of hope alive would crush me. I don't know how people cope.


    Emma,
    I too have been thinking about these cases (I guess we're sharing brainwaves! )and in my opinion they are related as the m/os are just too similar.
    Think about it.........how many people(children) are abducted and held for longer than 24-48 hours? I dont have a statisic handy but if my memory serves me don't they say that if an abducted child is usually murdered within 2-3 hours after being kidnapped? And if/when they are held is it more than two days? Very rarely(yes theres Elizabeth Smart & Steven Stayer but their cases are anomilies are they not?) and in addition,how often do the abductors take photographs? I know sometimes a memento of sorts is kept(a piece of jewelry or clothing etc) but to my knowledge concrete evidence,i.e photos is again quite rare as is leaving said photos in a public place (those photos were left on purpose to be found imo).

    I belive you're correct Emma in regards to the boys similarities and I belive that was deliberate too.


    Very chilling!!!!!!!!!
    The saints are the sinners who keep trying...


  6. #66
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Anchorage, AK
    Posts
    1,394
    Quote Originally Posted by emma l
    BethInak,

    I was saying in the Zack Bernhardt thread that although it obviously couldn't be Zack in the photos with Tara, it is weird that the boy in that photo and the boy in the photo found bound and gagged around the time Zack dissapeared are both similar in looks- blonde haired, similar colouring etc. And that photo was also found outside a convience store as well- something about this is really bugging me.............

    I also noticed that Tara disappeared in September 1988 and the first photo of her and the boy was taken on film not available until May 1989, the 2nd in June 1989 and the third in FEBRUARY 1990.

    This would suggest that the photographer deliberately chose film that would tell people the time it was taken.......Why would anyone bother to do this if not to give some kind of clue or message that Tara was still alive months after she vanished?

    Poor Tara, and that poor little boy. It must be devastating for her family, knowing she might have been alive for months after she disappeared- that she might even be somewhere right now. I think the pain of not knowing, of trying to keep some kind of hope alive would crush me. I don't know how people cope.
    Emma!
    Tell me about the second and third photos. In all my searches on Tara, I never heard of them.


  7. #67
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    GREAT STATE OF TEXAS
    Posts
    202

    There is actually a PRODUCT they are working on that is embedded in the skin and works with a GPS system. NOT ready yet however. The ASIAN are working with "manipulating" skin with computer chips.

    However scary this sounds with reference to "Revelations" in the BIBLE, I would rather put something in my kids skin than to wish I had NOT.


    I am in agreement with you on that. Just think how easy it would be to find these kids and return them home to mom, instead of mom spending the rest of her life wondering what happened to her child. It will be the best protection for our children.


  8. #68
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    2,969

    cold cases

    Case that haunt me are:
    http://www.doenetwork.us/cases/1ufny.html, the boy in the box. How could a child reamin unidentified for so long. Someone knows something and aunt, brother, sister, grandparent. Even a family aquantance.
    http://www.doenetwork.us/cases/1ufny.html Caledonia, NY Jane Doe. I think her case can be solved. She is probably a runaway who had a falling out with her family and is estranged then met up with the wrong person/people (maybe organized crime?) Her family maybe hasn't looked for her yet and don't even realize she has died. There probably wasn't a missing persons report filed or it was lost.
    http://www.doenetwork.us/cases/34dfca.html Gayle Marks. I wonder if Wesley Shermantine has any information on her. He was convicted of killing 2 girls in Stockton, CA or the surrounding area in the 80's. The remains were never found but they had enough evidence to convict. Her mother has a nice website set up for Gayle at http://www.angelfire.com/ca2/GayleMarks/
    http://www.doenetwork.us/cases/374dfme.html Kimberly Moreau. I really have no thoughts about her. Maybe someone else out there does.


  9. #69
    QUOTE=BethInAK]Emma!
    Tell me about the second and third photos. In all my searches on Tara, I never heard of them.[/QUOTE]

    Hey 2 sisters. Unfortunatley I've never seen the other photos,but they're mentioned in several articles.....

    Theres this quote from the old MPCNN site and a news article

    http://www.abqtrib.com/archives/news...ews_tara.shtml
    "Two other similar photographs have surfaced over the years. One Polaroid, made on film that was unavailable until June 1989, was found near a residential construction site in Montecito, California and depicted a girl's face with her mouth covered by duct tape. The image is blurry, but Calico's mother says she thinks the girl in the photo is her daughter. She has a cowlick on her right temple like Calico, and also a lazy eye like Calico has. The blue-striped fabric the girl is lying on is similar to the pillow in the first photo.
    The third Polaroid photograph was shot on film not available until February of 1990 shows a woman who is loosely bound in gauze and has her eyes covered with gauze and large black-framed glasses. There is a man sitting next to her on the passenger seat of an Amtrak train. Calico's mother is not sure whether the girl is daughter;or if its a cruel joke. Still, the man's face is included with two other suspect composites"
    snip................................

    I can't find a picture of the suspect composites anywhere which is annoying. Even if the 3rd photo is a fake, that still leaves the one taken in 1989. Thats a year after Tara was taken. Very spooky.............

    Messiecake- we are indeed sharing brainwaves...........I believe that they are either related or are made to look like they are.....too similar otherwise. I wonder if its ever been looked into?


  10. #70
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    15

    Jennifer Bryan Judd

    Don't know why this case sticks in my mind. She was only 20 years old. She had only been married 10 days. I think it happened in 1992 and it has never been solved. She's from Kansas. Have you ever heard of this case?

    Taffy


  11. #71
    Hey Taffy,

    This was the only link I could find to a Jennifer Judd- is this her?

    http://www.unsolvedcrimes.com/juddj.html

    I hadn't heard of this case before and I can't find any other links- sometimes unsolved murder cases get almost no publicity- which is terrible. Do you have nay more info on her?


  12. #72
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    4

    here is one that haunts me

    I been looking at this for a long time now and have lost 23MB of info stored also an old posting on websleuths disappeared as well.
    http://fbi.edgesuite.net/mostwant/seekinfo/zywicki.htm


  13. #73
    Hey Fotoaus- how did you manage to lose so much info?!! You know you can usually take PC's into a store and they can recover even deleted information.

    My boyfriends computer died and in it was a full album of songs that his band had written and they have had interest from Sony Records so he was distraught!!
    But they recovered it fine- he was sooooooooo worried. Anyway it might be worth a try. You might not even have to pay if it is a hardware or software problem that caused you to lose it and it is still under guarantee.

    Anyway here's all Tammy's google links http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&i...=Google+Search

    And here's an interesting article http://web.grinnell.edu/sandb/archiv...s/zywicki.html


  14. #74
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    604
    Quote Originally Posted by Azlaw
    You're right. Ken and Si were responsible for the deaths of these girls. They rode at Si's brother's barn and witnessed Ken's brother planting a bomb on Si's brother's car. (Si eventually succeeded in killing his brother years later). An assistant trainer, a young woman named Cherie, was asked to bring the car around to the front. The car exploded and she was killed. The three girls were witnesses, so Si had Ken kill them. Ken used his boat (which matched the description given by eyewitnesses) and then burned it. (he also collected insurance for the 'accident' to his boat).

    The real mystery is where did Si's nephew, Frank Jayne Jr., put the body of Brach candy heiress Helen Brach. There have been books and movies about Helen Brach, but no one has ever found her body. Jayne's accomplice, Richard Bailey is in prison for life for his involvement in her murder.
    Has this been proven, about Ken and Silas killing the 3 girls?
    Free online muder mystery game!http://www.murdermysteryinvestigations.com


    In memory of Laci and Conner and my wonderful grandparents Joan and Les - I love you guys


  15. #75
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    3
    Quote Originally Posted by KATKAT19691
    I am sure this will get many of you up in arms, but one way to make sure we can always find our babies is tracking device, much like they use for people on house arrest. if we can use those leg brac. to keep track of them we could use them to track our kids if they come missing. also they have a device in cell phones that can be tracked i wish they could somehow put one in jewerly or something so we could track them if needed. tell me what you think. the worst thing i can think of is not knowing where or what happened to my son.

    kat
    I doubt this would work as undoubtably kidnappers would take off the item. Anything in the skin would probably get ripped out (ouch!).

    kitap


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