648 users online (100 members and 548 guests)  


Websleuths News


Results 1 to 9 of 9
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Posts
    29

    Spiral staircase

    Didnt PR state that she always used the spiral staircase to go up to the other floors? if so then would she not have gone up those same stairs that night when she supposedly went to bed?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    US
    Posts
    1,599
    Hi Terralee, Probably so....why do you ask?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Oregon
    Posts
    514
    Quote Originally Posted by terralee
    Didnt PR state that she always used the spiral staircase to go up to the other floors? if so then would she not have gone up those same stairs that night when she supposedly went to bed?
    More importantly - it is those same stairs she came DOWN in the morning.
    The note author somehow magically KNEW this and chose THAT place - of all the places in the 6,500 sq. ft. house to place the note.

    Patsy has stated that she often "placed items" on the bottom steps to be noticed and taken upstairs. Yet another circumstance of evidence pointing in Patsy's direction. HER pen. HER pad of paper. Both pad and pen put BACK after being used to write the note. HER handwriting. HER linguistics. HER path (stairs) she used in the morning.

    When Patsy, in her panic, wrote that bogus note to deflect attention away from what really happened that night to JonBenet, - she subconsciously fell into her routines and patterns in the process thereby bringing the suspicion full circle back to HER involvement. It often happens with perps who try and stage a crime scene. In their endeavor to make it LOOK like something it is not - the "is not" becomes obvious.

    Her clothing fibers from her outfit that night discovered entwined in the knot around the cord on her daughter's neck and in the paint tote where the paintbrush was broken that night - simply further bolster the other evidence pointing to her involvement in the cover-up.
    Facts do not lie.
    This post is my opinion.

  4. #4
    Exactly Angel.

    One does forget some of their "habits" when attempting to stage a crime. People are creatures of habit.

    Does anyone know where the writing pads were located before John handed them over to the police?

    The reason I ask is because of this discussion during Patsy's interrogation...

    The photo John Ramsey had taken of the wet bar area, also showed a table near it. On it, were two white lined legal pads. One of them had been used to write the ransom note. It was the same pad that contained Patsy's doodles, other writings and the so-called practice ransom note.

    TH: ...Like I say, this was on your roll of film and it's not exactly the same photograph that was taken by the police.

    PR: Uh huh.

    TH: And this legal pad that you -

    PR: Right.

    TH: - identified -

    PR: Right.

    TH: - do you know when that would have been in that position?

    PR: No. So this, this was taken before...?

    TH: Before the police photos...do you recognize that pad...?
    ...We have said to ourselves, look, there is never going to be a victory in this, there is no victory...John Ramsey: 6/24/98

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Oregon
    Posts
    514
    Quote Originally Posted by Toltec
    Exactly Angel.

    One does forget some of their "habits" when attempting to stage a crime. People are creatures of habit.

    Does anyone know where the writing pads were located before John handed them over to the police?

    The reason I ask is because of this discussion during Patsy's interrogation...

    The photo John Ramsey had taken of the wet bar area, also showed a table near it. On it, were two white lined legal pads. One of them had been used to write the ransom note. It was the same pad that contained Patsy's doodles, other writings and the so-called practice ransom note.

    TH: ...Like I say, this was on your roll of film and it's not exactly the same photograph that was taken by the police.

    PR: Uh huh.

    TH: And this legal pad that you -

    PR: Right.

    TH: - identified -

    PR: Right.

    TH: - do you know when that would have been in that position?

    PR: No. So this, this was taken before...?

    TH: Before the police photos...do you recognize that pad...?
    Toltec - I think the pad was found on that same table. Not certain about that, but that is what I recall.
    I've always felt that John's lack of hesitation in handing the pad over (well I'm ASSUMING he felt or showed no hesitation!), is a circumstance in his favor that perhaps he really didn't know until later what had happened the night before.
    Or maybe he was just trying to "appear" to be cooperative and didn't think there would or could be any "evidence" left in the pad tying it to the note.
    This post is my opinion.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Posts
    29
    Quote Originally Posted by Nehemiah
    Hi Terralee, Probably so....why do you ask?
    I could be in a memory lapse here so if Im incorrect please forgive me, didnt Patsy say that she always used the spriral staircase to access the upstairs? if that is true then she would have gone up that staircase that night after returning from the Whites and yet in the morning when she first saw the note she said she thought (pg11 DOI)"whats this? I wonder. I turn to look at 3 pieces of paper on a step near the bottom. I bend over. Must be a note from the cleaning lady, Linda, I think. Probably reminding me she needs to borrow twenty five hundred dollars. I must leave a check on the kitchen counter before we leave" Now if Pasty used that staircase the night before to get upstairs when did she think Linda would have left a note? it wasnt there when she went upstairs?

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    US
    Posts
    1,599
    Quote Originally Posted by terralee
    I could be in a memory lapse here so if Im incorrect please forgive me, didnt Patsy say that she always used the spriral staircase to access the upstairs? if that is true then she would have gone up that staircase that night after returning from the Whites and yet in the morning when she first saw the note she said she thought (pg11 DOI)"whats this? I wonder. I turn to look at 3 pieces of paper on a step near the bottom. I bend over. Must be a note from the cleaning lady, Linda, I think. Probably reminding me she needs to borrow twenty five hundred dollars. I must leave a check on the kitchen counter before we leave" Now if Pasty used that staircase the night before to get upstairs when did she think Linda would have left a note? it wasnt there when she went upstairs?
    Yes, you are correct to think that Patsy used that staircase. That's a very good catch, Terralee, about the note not being there the night before. I've never thought about it like that, but you make an excellent point!

    IMO

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Oregon
    Posts
    514
    This is a very important question for all the IDI theorists.

    Just WHEN did the 'intruder' place that note on the stairs?
    Before, during or after he killed JonBenet??

    Now think about the logic of it. It is very important.

    Think about how Patsy described finding the pages. Where they were placed.

    How did this 'intruder' manage to carry JonBenet AND lay the pages down?
    Did he set her down, and then lay them across the stairs before picking her back up again and heading to the basement with her?

    Did he lay them down BEFORE he went upstairs to get JonBenet out of her bed? No, I guess not because he would have stepped on the pages wouldn't he?

    Did he go BACK upstairs after abusing and killing JonBenet just to lay down a fake 'ransom' note that was now worthless as he had no victim to bargain with? And where had he kept these 3 pages all along?

    The answer to all 3 is of COURSE NOT. Too ridiculous to even consider.

    Another thing to think about is that the stairs were not the only option an intruder would have had to place the note. MANY other locations would have sufficed. He then would not have had the dilemma of having to step over them on his way downstairs, the awkwardness and impossibility of carrying the note AND JonBenet down the stairs on his way to the basement and having to "set her down" to lay the note pages down, and the completely unbelievable option of having just abused and killed the homeowner's daughter (who apparently may have let out a blood-curdling scream in the midst of it) and then RISKING his life to go BACK upstairs where the parents very likely were up wandering around just to lay a now useless 'ransom note' -which he NEVER followed through with.

    So just WHEN do you IDI theorists think the 'intruder' placed that note on the stairs?

    So just WHEN
    This post is my opinion.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    The Wild West
    Posts
    1,911
    Quote Originally Posted by K777angel
    So just WHEN do you IDI theorists think the 'intruder' placed that note on the stairs?
    Great question, K777angel. Here, let me help. We know the intruder didn't exit through the basement window because of the chair blocking the door to that room. So, even if he managed to enter the house that way, without disturbing the spider web nor the window sill, and then found the chair and used it to block that room (uh, why would he do this, by the way?), the chair's final position proves he didn't exit using that route. (See the Smit/John Ramsey discussion in the NE Police Files book, pages 313-314.)

    Therefore, he had to have exited through a door on the main floor, let's say that back door by the spiral stairs. Which begs the question: WHY after abandoning his collateral did he bother leaving a fake "ransom" note with a three-page handwriting sample? If he'd left the note before the crime and the "kidnapping" went badly, why not pick up the note on his way out?

    Terralee - excellent catch.
    The intruder is innocent! JMO