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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
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    77

    CA - Dana Point, WhtFem 23UFCA, 18-23, cliff jump, Sep'87 - Holly Glynn

    I found this case on the Doe Network: Case File 23UFCA
    Unidentified White Female, 18-23 years old
    Killed herself by jumping off a cliff in Dana Point, California on September 20, 1987
    http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/23ufca.html

    I think she may be a match to Marie Louise Andrus: http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/a/andrus_marie.html

    What is a match
    The heights and weights are nearly identical (both 5'4" and around 130 lbs)
    Marie disappeared on August 20, the unidentified woman was found a month later, September 20.
    The locations are close. Marie disappeared from Siskiyou County, on the California/Oregon border. It's believed, from a map found in Jane Doe's possession, that she hitch-hiked through San Bernardino, Riverside, and Los Angeles counties to reach Dana Point. Marie's route down through the state would lead her through those areas.

    What is not a match
    Marie had a chip in her upper front tooth that is not noted on Jane Doe's file. She had brown hair (very light from the picture) and blue eyes; Jane Doe had strawberry blonde hair and brown eyes.
    Jane Doe is estimated to be 18-23 years old; Marie is 27.

    The photo of Marie isn't a very good one; she seems to be squinting. So it's hard to judge if her face is a match to Jane's or not, but the height/weight, dates, and location matches are very interesting to me. I wish I could find more information on these cases!

    I've never done this before, so I'd be very grateful to hear any suggestions. Do you guys think this is close enough to notify authorities?
    Last edited by CarlK90245; 11-12-2012 at 11:39 AM. Reason: updated link

  2. #2
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    http://dojapp.doj.ca.gov/missing/ima...5010644mp1.jpg

    This is the original unaltered photograph of Marie, if that helps any.

  3. #3
    Join Date
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    Well the timing is uncanny, just a month later... but the eye colour, thats a big mismatch.

    I don't think there is any harm in calling/or writing in about it, imagine if you were right? and if not, thats okay - worth checking out.

    It's great that people like you are out there trying to make connections and put names to victims.

  4. #4
    Every time I look for a match and the only thing different is the eye color... I wonder. What effects do death have on eye color? If a person has been dead and in the elements a long time... would you even be able to tell what the original eye color was?

    I tried to find some info on this... no luck.

  5. #5
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    you would have to talk to a eye doctor who maybe could shed some light on the issue im sure a doctor would be willing to talk to you about it

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
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    Thank you all for your advice. I wrote an email to Doe Network asking them to take a look at the cases and contact law enforcement.

    Regarding eye color, in this case it's kind of hard to tell, because you can't tell the color of Marie's eyes from her photo. Not saying anything against Charley Project or Doe Network, but there's always the possibility her eye color could have been recorded wrong in her original police report or something, and no one is the wiser. I think meggily posted a story elsewhere on the board that there was a case where a Jane Doe's eyes changed color after death, but I'm not sure how common that is.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
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    info

    I contacted a freind of the missing person by email and she reponded about this match. The friend does not think it is the same person because of the shoe size being too small on the possible match. I replied by email providing a link to this website and this thread with an invitation to post any info that friend thinks will be helpful.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
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    3,330
    I wonder if they were not her shoes. Afterall, the report said her belongings were stacked, not worn. Since the purse was not hers, could be the shoes weren't either.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
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    The doenetwork has listed Marie as being 37 not 27 years old... hrmm.

    Marie Louise Andrus
    Missing since August 20, 1987 from Siskiyou County, California.
    Classification: Endangered Missing

    Vital Statistics
    Date Of Birth: April 29, 1950
    Age at Time of Disappearance: 37 years old
    Height and Weight at Time of Disappearance: 5'4; 130 lbs
    Distinguishing Characteristics: White female. Brown hair; blue eyes.
    Dentals: Available. Chip in upper front tooth.

    Circumstances of Disappearance
    Andrus was last seen August 20, 1987 in Siskiyou County, CA. Foul play is suspected.

  10. #10
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    Sep 2004
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    California Girl...

    I have seen the sketch of the Dana Point girl on several previous occasions. I get the impression that she was from the Southern California beach area, rather than a recent arrival. The story about her purse, which was somebody elses ten years before, and the fact that she was wearing men's underwear, leads me to believe that she had been living on the beach and was not particularly fasion concious. Her face is so familiar, and yet she is an unknown.


  11. #11
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    About the chipped tooth...sometimes LE doesn't put every single detail of a UID in the case file (so there's some identifying factors left if anyone would ever confess to killing someone or to help a family identify someone). So don't let the tooth thing defer you.


    Happiness...consists in giving, and in serving others.
    - Henry Drummond

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    77
    Sorry for the delay-- I emailed Doe Network about Marie and Jane Doe and they said "California has a program that has the dentals of all unidentified and missing persons in it and they run a possible match often to see if there are any matches so I am sure these have been checked out." So that's that. Back to the drawing board.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by SadieJane
    Sorry for the delay-- I emailed Doe Network about Marie and Jane Doe and they said "California has a program that has the dentals of all unidentified and missing persons in it and they run a possible match often to see if there are any matches so I am sure these have been checked out." So that's that. Back to the drawing board.
    Sadie girl... all you can do is try. I'm proud of you.

  14. #14
    iNTERESTEDWOMAN's Avatar
    iNTERESTEDWOMAN is offline I'll trade you a bushel of corn for a barrel of oil.
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    You think a 17 year old could grow a few inches in 3 years? Or possibly the height an estimate?

    This girl is a good match IMO
    http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/81dfok.html

    Jane Does suicide would have happened 3 years to possibly the day Sandy went missing.

    Both smokers, freckles, weight, height, age all very close.

    Sandys new thread:
    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=63486

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
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    United States
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    CA - UID Female 23UFCA, Dana Point, 1987 to: Linda Grimm, Perris, 1986


    Died: September 20, 1987 - Dana Point, California
    Doe Network: 23UFCA
    http://www.ocsd.org/8704457/
    http://www.unsolved.com/ajaxfiles/une_jane_doe.htm

    I believe she is a possible match with Linda Rose Grimm.

    Missing Since: March 31, 1986 - Perris, California
    Doe Network: 881DFCA
    Charley Project

    The following is an admittedly badly put together kinda creepy overlay. I'm sure someone could do better with this.



    The eyes, nose, and mouth seem to match up very well. The jaw line does seem to match equally well, just not at the perspective of the original image. I have lined it up successfully with a couple images of Grimm.

    There are a few problems with this potential ID though.

    Grimm's mother claims to have heard from her in October 1987, by which point the Jane Doe was already dead. I wonder about the accuracy of her mother's statement though, as the dates in Grimm's case seem to be largely guesswork. The Charley Project page indicates that some sources can't even agree in which month or even year that Grimm disappeared. If her mother's account was off by even a few weeks, problem solved.

    Grimm has a cesarean section scar that is not listed as appearing on the Jane Doe. It seems possible that the scar could have been missed due to the resulting injuries from the Jane Doe's fall off the cliff. The Jane Doe did have signs of a prior pregnancy.

    Thoughts?

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