12-11-2008, 12:19 AM #1
A fresh look at all test results
I had typed up the test results included in the investigative report for my own reference, but thought I'd post them here too.
It will save us all having to go back and forth between the pdf's.
So here they are....
Items from vehicle - florida tag # *******
Q1 Debris from front edge of trunk (item Q-1)
Q2 Debris from interior trunk floor (item Q-2)
Q3 Debris from right side interior fender well (item Q-3)
Q4 Debris from spare tire cover (item Q-4)
Q5 Debris from spare tire cover (item Q-5)
Q6 Debris from right side of trunk liner (item Q-6)
Q7 Debris from middle of the trunk liner (item Q-7)
Q8 Debris from left side of trunk liner (item Q-8)
Q9 Debris from left side of trunk liner (item Q-9)
Q10 Debris from left side of trunk liner (item Q-10)
Q11 Debris from left directional wire (item Q-11)
Q12 Debris from left side of trunk liner (item Q-12)
Q12.1 Hair from specimen Q12 debris from left side of trunk liner
Items listed as belonging to victim caylee marie anthony...
Q15 Hairbrush (item K-3)
Q16 Comb (item K-4)
K2 Head hair sample from casey A (items K-8 and K-9)
HAIR-(performed by fbi- karen korsberg lowe TEU)
P2504- RESULTS OF EXAMINATIONS-
A caucasian head hair found in specimen Q12 exhibits characteristics of apparent decomposition at the proximal (root)end. This hair is microscopically similar to the caucasian head hair recovered from the Q15 hairbrush,however a more meaningful conclusion cannot be reached as this is not a suitable known hair sample.The proximal(root) portion of the hair which exhibits the apparent decomposition has been preserved on a glass microscope slide. the remainder of the hair, designated Q12.1 has been submitted for mitochondrial DNA analysis. No other hairs exhibiting characteristics of apparent decomposition were found in specimens Q1 through Q7 and Q10 through Q12. No hairs were found in specimens Q8 and Q9. Due to the circumstances of the case, no other trace evidence examinations were conducted.
*This report contains the opinions/interpretations of the examiner(s) who issued the report.
P2406 Items from vehicle -
Q22 Piece of spare tire cover (OCSO item # 22, Q-18)
Q23 Spare tire cover (OCSO item # Q21)
Q24 Left side of trunk liner (OCSO item # 25, Q-20)
Q25 Right side of trunk liner (OCSO item # 24, Q-19)
Q26 Debris from trunk (OCSO item #1 , Q-14)
Q27 Debris from inside trunk (OCSO item # 3, Q-15)
Q28 Debris from trunk interior and fender well interior (OCSO item # 6, Q-17)
P2507 (Karen Korsberg Lowe TEU)
Results of examinations:
Specimens Q22 through Q25 and debis collected from specimens Q26 through Q28 were examined for the presence of hairs exhibiting characteristics of apparent decomposition; however none were found.
Hairs and fibers collected from specimens Q23 through Q28 have been preserved on glass microscope slides and in vacuum canisters for possible future comparisons. The specimens were examined visually using stereo-microscopy and comparison microscopy.
*This report contains the opinions/interpretations of the examiner(s) who issued the report.
P2508- Examination/report by Catherine Theisen PHD DNA analysis unit 2.(Dated 8/8/08)
Results from Q12.1 hair from specimen Q12 debris from left side of trunk liner.
K1 Buccal sample from Casey anthony (k6 & k7)
Mitochondrial DNA sequences were obtained from the Q12.1 from the Q12 debris from the left trunk liner and the K1 buccal sample sample identified as coming from Casey Anthony, identified as the mother of Caylee anthony.The mtDNA sequences obtained from items from items Q12.1 and K1 are the same. Therefore, neither Casey anthony nor Caylee marie anthony can be excluded as the source of the Q12.1 hair.
*This report contains the opinions/interpretations of the examiner(s) who issued the report.
Last edited by butwhatif?; 12-11-2008 at 05:39 AM.
12-11-2008, 12:22 AM #2
AIR analysis results- P2511
By Michael sigman, PHD, ass dir physical evidence. University of central Fl.
Analysis conducted for OCSO 29th july, report dated 30th July.
(Samples collected and analyses performed) The following samples were obtained from the trunk of the white pontiac, held in the forensics unit at the Orange Country Sheriffs Office.
Sample 1: Approximately 1 liter (L) of air removed by a gas-tight syringe and pllaced into a Tedlar Polymer bag through a rubber septum.
Sample 2: Approximately 300 milililters (mL) of air removed by a gas-tight syringe and placed into a Tedlar polymer bag through a teflon-lined septum.
Sample 3: A single solid phase micro-extraction (SPME) fiber coated with a 65um thick dimethylsiloxane/carboxen adsorbent layer was placed in the trunk for a period of aproximately 40 minutes.
Sample 4: One 1cm (cm) x 0.5cm activated carbon strip, exposed for approximately 40 minutes.
Sample 5a -Sample 5d: Four SPME fibers coated with a 65 micron thick dimethylsiloxane/carboxen adsorbent layer were placed in the trunk for a period of approximately 7.5 hours.
Sample 6: Two 1cm x 0.5cm activated carbon strips, exposed for approximately 7.5 hours.
Samples 1 and 2 were collected from the rear of the automobile with the trunk open approximately 2 inches. Samples 3-6 were collected from within the closed trunk. The trunk lid was opened a minimal amount to allow the collection devices to be placed in the center of the trunk, so that air was sampled from throughout the trunk. All samples were collected by sigman and Clark. Samples 2,3,4,5a,5b and 6 were analyzed by gas chromotography-mass spectrometry (GC-MS). Samples 2,3,4,5a and 5b were analyzed by Sigman and clark. Sample 6 was analyzed by Williams.
Sample 1 was not analyzed at NCFS. Samples 2-4 provided evidence for low concentrations of volatile organic chemicals in the trunk of the automobile.Samples 5a and 5b provided evidence for the presence of gasoline vapors in the trunk, as determined by comparison of the GC-MS data to data of the same type in an ignitable liquids ...
continues pg 2512...
database maintains by the National centre for forensic science. In addition to the gasoline components, samples 5a and 5b also contained dimethyl disulfide,tetrachlorothene and chloroform. samples 5c and 5d were not alalyzed by NCFS. Analysis of sample 6 also provided evidence for the presence of gasoline vapor in the automobile trunk.
Interpretation of findings:
Dimethyl disulfide, tetrachloroethene and chloroform are known to be liberated from decomposition of human remains. these three compounds were not found in a representative gasoline sample in the NCFS dadtabase. dimethyl disulphide also occurs naturally in cabbage and onion.tetrachloroethene is used in dry cleaning and may be used in spot removers. Chloroform may be used as a degreaser and may be formed through the reaction of chlorine bleach with some organic chemicals.
Based on these results, it is my opinion that the presence of dimethyl disulfide,tetrachloroethene and chloroform does not conclusively demonstrate that human decomposition was previously present in the automobiles trunk due to other possible sources of these materials.
Last edited by butwhatif?; 12-11-2008 at 05:27 AM. Reason: Add
12-11-2008, 12:26 AM #3
DR vass prelim report #1
P2513-DR Arpad Vass oakridge national lab.
Odor analysis of trunk carpet sample.(august 6th 08)
On July 24th 2008 investigator mike vincent of the county sheriffs dept sent me a carpet sample from the trunk of a 1998 pontiac sunfire to determine if the odor present on the sample and in the trunk of the vehicle was indicative of a decompositional event.These samples were sent to me in reference to research we have been performing since 2002 in an attempt to identify the chemical composition of human decomposition odor. This research has resulted in the development of a decompositional odor analysis database.
The carpet sample was enclosed in a sealed metal can. A prelimary analysis was performed by colecting a small (0.8ml) sample of air from the can and injecting the air into a gas chromatograph/mass spectrometer. Several compounds were observed in this sample; however, it was deemed necesary to concentrate the sample in order to improve the sensitivity for the lower abundance compounds.
The sample was removed from the metal can and placed in a tedlar bag for several days at 35 degrees C and allowed to off-gas into the tedlar bag. The analytes from several ml of gas from the tedlar bag were concentrated by cryo-focusing them with liguid nitrogen at the headf of a gas chromatograph/mass spectometer.Preliminary results of this analysis are summarized in the attatched table. compounds in the sample were tentatively identified by mass spectral library match.
Standards of the tentatively identified compounds have not been run. It is important to note that gasoline was found in the vehicle trunk which presented a significant chromotographic signal and overlapped with many chemicals typically observed in decompositional events. Additionally, a decomposing pizza was also found in the trunk. It is not known what impact this had on the results of the preliminary study. Finally it is unknown what compounds, if any, the spraying of a luminol-type product (blustar) in the trunk might have had on the detected compounds.
Of the 54 chemicals identified (many gasoline components are not listed in the table), 43 (79%) are consistent with decompositional events. Only 19 of these overlap with gasoline constituents.Common fluorinated compound usaully associated with human decomposition were not detected. It is possible, although this has NOT been ....
.....studied, that a 3 yr old child may not have had sufficient time (many years) to ingest enough fluorinated compounds for them to be incorporated into tissue and then to appear in the decompositional breakdown of soft tissue and bone.
Additionally, several of the identified compounds are typically associated with anaerobic decomposition.While the actual significance of this is not known, it indicates that any type of decompositional event that might have been asociated with the odor in the trunk of the car occurred under deprived oxygen conditions(the pizza was not wrapped and most likely was decomposing aerobically).
While these are very preliminary results, the results at this point appear to be consistant with a decompositional event having occured in the vehicle. This does not rule out the possibility that an animal carcass (had to be wrapped to produce anaerobic compounds), rotting meat, paint , varnish, cleaners, degreasers or garbage were transported in the trunk at some time that may have contributed to the observed chemical compounds.
It is recommended that additional samples be analyzed including air samples of the vehicle interior, a clean control sample, a control sample sprayed with blustar and if possible a sample of air that was found in the vechile trunk.
Last edited by butwhatif?; 12-11-2008 at 03:57 AM.
12-11-2008, 12:30 AM #4
Dr vass prelim report # 2
P2518- Findings as of 24th september
Preliminary forensics report #2 by Arpad Vass
On July 24th, 2008 Investigator Mike Vincent of the orange county sheriffs dept sent us a carpet sample from the trunk of a 1998 Pontiac sunfire (FL license num G63-XV) to determine if the odor present on the sample and in the trunk of the vehicle was indicative of a decompositional event. additional air samples , collected by Investigator Vincent on triple sorbent traps(TSTs), where sent to us on Sept 3, 2008 and included air samples from the vehicle interior and composite air samples from all the items identified in the trunkk compartment. these samples were sent to us in reference to research we have been performing since 2002 in an attempt to identify the chemical composition of human decomposition odor. This research has resulted in the development of a decompositional odor analysis database.
The initial carpet sample was enclosed in a sealed metal can.A preliminary analysis was performed by collecting a small (0.8ml) sample of air from the can and injecting the air into a gas chromatograph/mass spectrometer. several compounds were observed in this sample (primarily chloroform); however, it was deemed necessary to concentrate the sample in order to improve the sensitivity for the lower abundance compounds.
The sample was removed from the metal can and placed in a tedlar bag for several days at 35 degrees c and allowed to off-gas into the tedlar bag. The analytes from several ml of gas from the tedlar bag were concentrated by cryo-focusing them with liquid nitrogen at the head of the gas chromatograph/mass spectrometer . Preliminary results of this analysis are summarized in table 1. compounds in the sample were tentatively identified by mass spectral library match.Standards of the tentatively ientified commpounds have not been run. It is important to note that gasoline was found in the vehicle trunk which presented a significant chromatographic signal and overlapped with aproximately 41 % of the chemicals typically observed in decompositional events....
Previous reports of a decomposing pizza found in the vehicle trunk were not true and this was incorrectly stated in the previous report. An MSDS sheet, listing the ingredients of Blustar, was obtained and evaluated by a chemist (Dr. Michael Burnett, oak ridge national lab). His conclusion was that components of the product could not have contributed to the chemical signature obtained in these analyses. Additional samples which have been analyzed and are being summarized in this report include:
1) control trunk carpet sections obtained from three pontiac sunfire vehicles (two from 1998 and one from 1996-the carpet samples were all a similar color and type as the florida vehicle) located in a junkyard in Knoxville TN and placed in a tedlar bag at 35 degrees C for two days (collected by Dr david Glasgow, ORNL);
2)a piece of pizza (mushroom and pepperoni) in the original pizza box which was allowed to decompose for several days at the universityy of tenessee's decay research facility and then placed in a tedlar bag at 35 degrees C (included as a control even though no pizza was actually found in the florida vehicle). It is interesting to note that no maggots were found on the pizza;
3) composite air samples from all of the items found in the trunk of the florida vehicle collected on triple sorbent traps (TST's)
4) air samples from the florida vehicle interior compartment collected on TST's
5)laser induced breakdown spectroscopy (LIBS) results from the florida trunk sample.
6)air sample from the lab at ORNL where the florida trunk carpet sample was prepared and stored (control)
7)TST florida trip blank (control)
8)TST air sample from garage where florida vehicle is stored.(control)
9)Volatile fatty acid analysis (not yet complete) which will also be used to assist in the determination of a decompositional event and is the best means of obtaining a post mortem interval (PMI) in this instance in lieu of entomological evidence.
Of the 51 chemicals identified from the florida trunk sample, (many gasoline components detected are not listed in the table), 41 (80%) are consistant with decompositional events. Only 17 of those overlap with known or possible gasoline consituents leaving 24 compounds (59%) found in the decompositional odor analysis database potentially unaccounted for. It is important to note that this sample was removed from the trunk and eventually isolated in a tedlar bag so the compounds which were detected in this analysis were off-gassing from the carpet sample and did not include vapors that may have been in the air of the trunk.
Nine compounds identified in the control samples from the junkyard were also detected in the florida trunk sample carpet samples. These were all in trace amounts. Only 4 of these compounds could not be attributed to possible gasoline vapor components-one of these compounds was chloroform, but was only detected in trace amounts in the control carpet sample.
Only 6 compounds identified in the pizza, which were also deteted in the florida trunk sample, could not be attributed to gasoline vapor components. Of these 6 compounds, four were detected in the control carpet samples from the junkyard.
Laboratory air where the sample was stored and processed was sapled to determine if the room contained any chemical components which might have contributed to the odor detected in the florida trunk carpet sample. None were detected.
The TST trip blank contained a number of additional compounds unrelated to what was found in the florida car trunk. In order to keep table 1 as simple as possible not all compounds are listed, but somme of the additional compounds detected in this sample included: butane 2-butane, 2methyl butane, 1-pentene, 1-hexene, pentanal, 1-heptene, heptene,1-octene,heptanal, and substituted benzenes.
The florida forensic unit garage TST air sample was composed of primarily gasoline vapors (not all components liste din table 1) freons and degreasers (tetrachloroethene), all commonly found in garages. No chloroform or sulfur containing compounds were detected in spite of the fact that TST's could potentially concentrate more material than would direct sampling of the headspace of the carpet sample in a tedlar bag(10mls were injected) The TST pump was calibrated to collect 500ml/minute and 77 minutes were collected so the spectrum would have represented aproximately 39L of air.
Freons detected included trichlorotrifluoroethane dichlorofluoroethane and trichlorotrifluoroethane. some of the additional compounds detected in this sample included : 2-methyl butane,2-methyl butene , 2, 3 dimethyl butane, 2-methyl pentane,cyclohexane, methyl cyclopentane,3-methylhexane, cyclopentane, heptane, 3-methyl 2-hexane, methylcyclohexane, 1, 2 dimethyl benzene(xylenes) and styrene.
The TST air sampling from the florida vehicle interior showed common hydrocarbons and significant amounts of xylenes present(69minutes collection time(35.4L of air).
NOt all compounds are listed in table 1. Some additional compounds detected in this sample included: substituted benzenes, pentanes, heptanes, heptenes and 2-propanol.
The composite air sampling of the trash bag contents (72 minutes collection time - 36L of air) showed that compounds were present which represented primarily ubiquitous hydrocarbons, many of which are also found in gasoline.(not all listed in table 1)
Dichlorofluoroethane and tetrachloroethene (also seen in gharage air sample) were detected in low concentrations. Some of the additional compounds detected inn this sample include: cyclopropane, dimethyl pentane, substituted hexanes, substituted naphthalenes, cyclopentane, 2-heptene, cyclohexane and heptanal.
Air sampling summary.....(2520)
Out of 24 compounds detected in the florida trunk sample which did not overlap with known or possible gasoline constituents, 16 (67 %) known to be associated with human decompositional events were detected in the odor signature from the florida trunk carpet sample whose source could not be potentially linked to any of the controls which were analyzed. these included 2-methyl furan, acetic acid methyl ester, butanoic acid methyl ester, carbon disulfide, carbon tetrachloride, cloroethane, chloroform, chloromethane, decanal, dichloroethane, dichloromethane, dimethyltrisulfide, dimethyl disulfide,hexanol, methanethiol, and trichloroethane. Of these 16 compounds, seven were significant human decomposition chemicals listed in the database. only 5 of these.....
....seven compounds are being used to draw conclusions about the possibility of a decompositional event.Decanal and trichloroethene were dropped from this list because they were only detected in trace amounts. these five compounds are:
~ appears very early in human decomposition (<100 ADD's)
~ appears in both aerobic and anaerobic decomposition.
~ appears very early in human decommposition (<100ADD's)
~ appears in both aerobic and anaerobic decomposition.
~ potentially a human specific marker(not seen in animal remains)
~ appears very early inn human decomposition (<100ADD's)
~ primarily detected in deprived oxygen(anaerobic) decompositions
~ appears very early in human decomposition.(<100ADD's)
~ appears inn both aerobic and anaerobic decomposition.
~ appears very early in human decomposition(<100ADD's)
~appears in both aerobic and anaerobic decomposition.
Note: ADD+ accumulated degree day (an accumulation of average daily temperatures)
This assumes that all the control samples contributed equally to the odor signature in the trunk (which is unlikely) and does not take into account that numerous compounds in the controls were detected in trace amounts and that some were potentially highly concentrated by the TST collection procedure.( for example, fluorinated compounds were detcted in the forensics unit garage, but were not detected in the florida vehicle trunk sample potentially indicating very little if any contribution of the garage air to the trunk signature).
TST's collected from the florida trunk were analyzed even though the trunk liner had been removed and the odor woulld not have been representative of what was originally present at the time of vehicle discovery. Even with the liner removed sulfur containing compounds such as carbon disufide ,carbon tetrachloride chloroform and dimethyl disulfide were still detctable in trace amounts. The trunk was the only location where all these types of compounds were detected.
Common fluorinated compounds usually associated with human decomposition were not dtected in the florida trunk sample. It is possible, although this has not been studied, that a three yr old may not have had sufficient time (many years) to ingest enough fluorinated compounds for them to be incorporated into tissue and then to appear in the decompositional breakdown of soft tissue and bone.
Additionally several of the identified compounds ar typically associated with anaerobic decomposition.while the actual significance of this is not known, it indicates that any type of decompositional event that might have been associated with the odor in the trunk of the car could have occurred under deprived oxygen conditions.
Last edited by butwhatif?; 12-11-2008 at 04:02 AM.
12-11-2008, 12:37 AM #5
LIBS PMI & conclusions
Cont page 2522.....
LASER BREAKDOWN SPECTROSCOPY (LIBS) FOR ELEMENTAL ANALYSIS.
LIBS analysis was also performed on the both the florida trunk carpet sample and the control samples. as decomposition progresses, various inorganic elements found in human tissue, such as magnesium(MG) , calcium (CA) iron(FE) and sodium (NA) are found in increasing concentrations(over time) in drainage from decompositional events. This technique was utilized to determine if known inorganic components of decompositional events were elevated over the controls and also to determine if the concentration ratios of these elements could be used to determine arough post mortem interval.
Introduction to LIBS:
LIBS provides rapid muti-elemental microanalysis of bulk samples(solid, liquid, gas, aerosol) in the parts per million(PPM) range with little or no sample preparation which has been widely demonstrated. IN this technique, a laser vaporizes a small volume of sample material with sufficient energy for optical excitation and optical excitation of the elementalspecies in the resultant sample plume. The vaporized species then undergo de-excitation and optical emission on a microsecond time scale, and time-dependent utraviolet-visable spectroscopy fingerprints the elements associated with the spectral peaks. LIBS is typically a surface analytical technique, with each laser pulse vaporizing microgram or submicrogram sample masses. However the rapidity of sampling (typically 10 hZ laser repetition rate) and the ability to scan a sample surface, provides sufficient statistics for bulk sampling.
The greatest advantage of LIBS is its cabability for remote chemical analysis of samples with minimal handling and little or no sample preparation, which minimizes generation of waste of the microgram per pulse of ablated material. The instrumentation and operation of a LIBS system is simpler than some of the more sensitive techniques, and analysis times on the order of minutes, make it more amendable for real-time analysis of chemical processes. Although calibration standards are required for quantative analysis, the generation of a single calibration curve will suffice for analysis of samples in a similar matrix.
In the analysis of the carpet samples that were obtained , care was taken to scan the sample consistantly. A laser beam of 532nm wavelength was focused onto the surface of the florida trunk carpet sample and control carpet samples collecting the excited light using collection optics that were delivered to a spectometer which detected specific band wavelengths. these wavelengths correspond to between 260nm to 300nm for Mg, between 390 to 420nm for Ca, between 570 to 610 for Na, and between 240- 280nm for Fe. The data were collected in multiples of five and compared to each other. All spectral information was very consistent within the mutiples of spectra that were captured an analyzed.
It is interesting to note that every element known to be associated with a decompositional event (that could be detected using this technique) was elevated over control values.(non- metals such as potassium, chloride etc, have a greater ionization potential than metallic and semi metalilic elements and could not be detected using the current laser system.)
Post-mortem interval determinations in this instance are best carried out using volatile fatty acids (VFAs), but can be done in a crude fashion using inorganic elements. the 5:1 ratio of calcium:magnesium typically occurs at 90 acumulated degree days (ADD's). An ADD is simply the accumulation of average daily temperatures (in celcius) over time.
The exact temperatures inside the vehicle trunk are not known. If one assumes it would be quite warm-florida in the summer (~95degrees F or 35 degrees celsius) this equates to aproximately 2.6 days of decomposition. At 2.6 days, the level of sodium should be much higher than what was detected using LIBS. This points to a PMI of less than 2.6days, but the error estimation for sodium is quite high as one approaches the beginning of decomposition. The low concentration of sodium also indicates almost no contribution to the blustar product. Low amounts of carbon (C) also indicate recent PMI.
While these are still preliminary results(specific retention times must be confirmed with standards, specific compounds should be quatified and VFA analyses need to be completed), both odor analysis and LIBS results appear to be quite consitent with a decompositional event having occurred in the trunk of the vehicle. Of particular interest is the large concentration of chloroform(not a common ingredient in commercial products) and the presence of sulfur containing compounds in the florida trunk carpet sample which are particularly chacteristic of decompositional events.
Finally we wish to discuss the possiblity that these chemical signatures are of human origin. The decomposition odor products of animal remains (dog, deer, pig-primarily bone) have been studied since these are the most commonly encountered in outdoor environments. these animals can be ditinguished from human remains by the percentages of certain classes of chemicals (keytones, amides, aldehydes and alcohols).
While the direct correlation of animal bone to early human decomposition may not be exact, the results are interesting and potentially point to a human origin as the source of the scent. Table 2 shows which compounds were detected in the Florida trunk sample and compares them to what is known about animal decomposition.
While not conclusive these data indicate that:
1) Nearly all the compounds present in early human decomposition were detected in the trunk samples if their concentrations were hight enough to detect. Carbon tetrachloride was also detected and is a human specific marker with these animal sets.
2)Compounds that have been detected in these select animal remains and not in humans were not detected in the florida trunk carpet sample(1-heptanol, acetamide, N, N-dimethyl). This is also suggestive of a human decompositional event.
3)Compounds associated with anaerobic decomposition are seen supporting a possible deprived oxygen type of decompositional event.
4)Compounds with a late ADD were not detected supporting an early stage decompositional event.
The correlation between all the techniques, the comparison to what is known about the decomposition of human and animal remains, indications of early decomposition products and the presence of the five key major compounds associated with human decomposition(primarily sulfur containing compounds) indicates that a portion of the total odor signature identified in the florida vehicle trunk is consistent with a decompositional event that could be of human origin. Additional components that made up a potion of the total odor signature included gasoline constituents and an unusually large concentration of chloroform- far greater than what is typically seen in human decomposition.
These results do not rule out the remote possibility that an unusual variety of products (not present in the trunk at the time of discovery) may have had some contribution to the overall chemical signature.
Arpad VASS Ph.D(research scientist)
Marc Wise Ph.D (analytical chemist)
Madhavi Martin Ph.D (physicist)
Last edited by butwhatif?; 12-11-2008 at 04:07 AM.
12-11-2008, 12:48 AM #6
WOW! You typed this? Way to go.
Reading this again really convinces me that Caylee was deceased in the trunk of that car. The hair is either Casey or Caylee, it's so obvious. I have no idea what the defense could be to this science. I get more and more angry at the A's for playing this sick game. When will they accept the facts.
Thanks so much for doing this. I hope the mods make it a sticky.
12-11-2008, 02:31 AM #7
Thank you soooo much for your time and effort taken to post this information.It is deeply appreciated by posters who cannot open pdf files.Nore.
12-11-2008, 02:55 AM #8=butwhatif?;3041026]Snip:
DR Arpad Vass oakridge national lab.
Additionally, a decomposing pizza was also found in the trunk. It is not known what impact this had on the results of the preliminary study. Finally it is unknown what compounds, if any, the spraying of a luminol-type product (blustar) in the trunk might have had on the detected compounds.
12-11-2008, 02:59 AM #9JMO. Unless there's a link, I can't prove it.
12-11-2008, 03:02 AM #10
12-11-2008, 03:17 AM #11
Now if they had said there was a dead pig in the trunk, they might have gotten away with it. Course, how do you explain a dead pig in your car trunk?JMO. Unless there's a link, I can't prove it.
12-11-2008, 03:20 AM #12
Dr Vass' tables....
(Sorry, I need to reinstall some programs and this is the best I could do .You might have to zoom to see them properly, or at all LOL )
12-11-2008, 03:34 AM #13
ETA: I didnt spell check so there might be more than a few mistakes.
On a seperate note, remember KC's use of the word 'potentially' in the jail visit vids? Theres a few in these reports including this one...
While the direct correlation of animal bone to early human decomposition may not be exact, the results are interesting and potentially point to a human origin as the source of the scent.
Everytime I read it now, I think of KC and that is never a good thing
Last edited by butwhatif?; 12-11-2008 at 03:49 AM. Reason: add
12-11-2008, 04:18 AM #14Former Member
- Join Date
- Aug 2008
- In a bubble.
So, a compound which is present in animal decomp is NOT present in the trunk and a compound SPECIFIC to human decomp IS present in the trunk. That is all they need to say.
Oh, and that there was no pizza in the bag or the trunk.
And no one ever accused KC of hoarding cabbages and onions in her car trunk. Oops! It was cole slaw! She was delivering for Meals on Wheels and some of the food spilled in her trunk!
12-11-2008, 04:19 AM #15
That's it? One partial hair sample, split. The rest is Air Tests. (new science - not yet used in court like DNA.)
They have only one partial hair sample (Q12) that was divided for two tests ???!!!
Wow. I wondered how much DNA evidence they had, given LE's reluctance to talk about the nature & strength of the DNA evidence. We kept hearing LE hedging, back in Sept/Oct that "The forensic evidence considered, not by a hair sample alone, but in its entirety suggests that ..." We kept hearing about a hair with a "death band". Then, LE statements became much more confident. I felt sure they'd have more significant DNA samples to work with. At least a little something from the carpet? But nothing? Just odor from the carpet? Are they holding back carpet fluid evidence? Do we know if this is the entire range of DNA evidence they have? (Pauses for deep breath...)
(I understand that they need 16-20 hair samples for a test to be significant & considered accurate. See this link for more on DNA samples from the FBI: http://www.fbi.gov/hq/lab/fsc/backis...tandards02.htm )
Well, I haven't posted in eons, as I'm a fact-hound, and less interested in speculating. However, ... these forensics ... concern me greatly – quite frankly, I feel a bit underwhelmed with the scientific evidence – clearly enough to post my worries.
(Thank goodness for the dogs. How I love the dogs. We still have the dogs!)
Perhaps THIS is the reason they can't seek DP? They have weak science ... hole-poking will not be difficult ... Perhaps Kobi has been skeptical of the forensics for good reason - these test results are like swiss cheese. Yup old Miss Emma is very concerned. Will it be a highly circumstantial case? They must be saving the best circumstantial evidence for last ...
I would also like to thank our OP, butwhatif? for her organizational research. I hadn't had time to do this, and have been wanting to. I certainly would not have found the time around the holidays. TYVM!
Somebody with experience,feel free make me feel better! In the meantime, I'll "be-moaning" the missing forensics over in chat.
JMHO, as always, my sleuthing friends…
By CW in forum Caylee Anthony 2 years oldReplies: 1Last Post: 08-11-2008, 07:29 PM
By RainbowsAndGumdrops in forum Janet Christiansen AbaroaReplies: 9Last Post: 07-22-2008, 02:28 PM
By ihadcabinfever in forum Up to the MinuteReplies: 0Last Post: 05-22-2007, 01:13 AM