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12-14-2008, 05:26 PM #1
Casey & Family Psychological Profile #3
Discuss the family dynamics and psychological profiles of Casey and family in a constructive way, please do so here.
[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=70260"]Casey & Family Psychological Profile #1[/ame]
[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=69987"]Casey & Family Psychological Profile #2[/ame]
Last edited by BondJamesBond; 01-06-2011 at 11:32 PM.
12-14-2008, 08:47 PM #2Inactive
kaRN wrote: Clearly Casey is extremely mentally ill. She'll fit in perfectly with the other 99% of whatever prison population she's placed in. That being said. Legally she has to prove she didn't know what she was doing was wrong because of her as yet to be diagnosed mental defect.
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Second, the majority of incarcerated individuals are not diagnosed with an Axis I serious mental health disorder, such as Schizophrenia, Bipolar Disorder, Schizoaffective Disorder or Delusional Disorder, for example. I work for a major metropolitan felony probation department supervising offenders who have been diagnosed with a serious mental illness (SMI). We have approximately 4000 felony probationers on active supervision department-wide; of those, about 400 are supervised through the Mental Health Unit. Having a serious mental illness does not mean a person is more likely to be violent per se. Some individuals with a mental illness do experience homicidal, assaultive or aggressive behaviors, but this is by far not the norm. I can't agree with the assertion that 99% of all persons in prison have a mental illness.
Third, personality disorders -- such as Antisocial, Borderline, Narcissistic, etc -- fall onto the Axis II diagnostic spectrum, not the Axis I. It is possible to have both an Axis I and an Axis II diagnosis, or just one or the other. Having an Axis II diagnosis alone does not qualify as person as "mentally ill." It just means they have a significant character defecit.
Fourth, it is entirely possible to be mentally ill and actively experiencing psychotic, manic or otherwise debilitating symptoms of a mental illness at the time of the commission of a crime, and still not qualify as legally insane. Not Guilty by Reason of Insanity is a very specific finding -- it is rarely a successful defense, as you all probably know. Andrea Yates? Totally, unquestionably mentally ill -- Not Guilty/Insanity was a very appropriate verdict in that case, IMO.
From what I've personally read/reviewed/watched in this case, I would not be overly surprised if Casey Anthony is found to have an Axis II diagnosis. I have no information about an Axis I diagnosis, though, and haven't come across any information that indicates Casey has an established history of Axis I mental illness. If anyone has read otherwise, please let me know (link plz'nthx!)
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12-14-2008, 11:43 PM #3
You're not alone in your thoughts. There are several of us here who feel she has Axis II (one or more).
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12-15-2008, 01:56 AM #4
Also I am not personally attached to any particular psychological profile one might present of Casey. I am also not completely convinced Casey’s actions were premeditated. I do think she could probably be classed as a psychopath and I tend to refer to her as such within these forums. I would actually feel a sense of personal relief if I could see convincing signs pointing in another direction. Psychopathy is terrifying and the fewer psychopathic individuals, the better IMO!
We all offer our personal opinions, for the purpose of learning and understanding. When discussing psychology, we’re processing our subjective interpretations of observed behavior within the framework of objective diagnostic criteria and, sometimes, subjective personal experience. I think we’re all here because we like to read others’ opinions and share our own. We like to discuss and understand things and learn new things. I sense you took my reply as a personal jab and I wanted to clarify that it was not intended to be. If I wanted to pick fights and feel bad about myself, I'd just spend more time with my family I'm teasing, but I hope to convey I wasn't making passive jabs-- I was just interested in the discussion.
Personally, I think it’s really important to recognize the difference between the mentally ill and the pathologically personality disordered. I think someone with an Axis I mental illness could be analogized to a person with diabetes— the person is just a regular person but some of their inner machinery isn’t working like everyone else’s, so they need some medical treatment to normalize their functioning. We can observe and measure the imbalance and we can usually medically correct it.
To me, saying Casey Anthony seems to have killed her daughter because she has a serious mental illness doesn’t comport with all of her observable behaviors (and we have gotten to observe a lot), viewed in light of existing clinical research and guidelines.
Bringing back the diabetes analogy: It’s like if I kick you in the shins, take your cupcake, smile and shrug, saying “I needed sugar” and you say “poor girl must have diabetes.”
That’s just how I see it and it’s only my opinion, but I offer it in hopes that it might clarify why some of us get excited about drawing the line between mental illness and personality disorders.
Last edited by nancy botwin; 12-15-2008 at 01:59 AM. Reason: struggles
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12-15-2008, 02:00 AM #5
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12-17-2008, 07:38 AM #6
Scared Monkeys broadcast from 12-15 discusses Casey Anthony case.
Clint Van Zandt, retired FBI agent, and criminal profiler
Stacy Dittrich, police officer, author and investigator
Tim Miller of Texas Equusearch
Pat Brown, criminal profiler
Mark Williams, Orlando radio outlet News Director
Click here for media player or download options. (76 minute broadcast)
12-17-2008, 10:39 AM #7
ITA with everything you said, but i'd just like some clarification on one point.
The part that i bolded, are you saying that specifically in terms of the law?
Because those axis II diagnosis are condidered mental ilnesses in the mental health sector.
On another note , I'm suprised to see schizoaffective disorder as Axis 1. Thats really interesting.
thanks for the imput
12-17-2008, 11:14 AM #8Former Member
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I personally know a couple of people with bipolar disorder and they were first diagnosed in the early 20's.
12-17-2008, 11:29 AM #9
12-17-2008, 12:21 PM #10
Ya'll see how well I have been holding my tongue? It's getting tougher though, I gotta say.
seagull65- With any illness there are certain criteria one must meet in order to be diagnosed and like it or not Casey does not meet the criteria for a dissociative fugue. She does however meet criteria for one or more personality disorders.. "Psychopath" being one of those. People on this board are not the only ones who recognize and stand firm in their opinion of this. Every "expert" that has discussed this case (on TV or on their own websites, blogs and here on WS, for example the BRACE profile done by Russell) has agreed that Casey has some type of personality disorder. Many believe that she is indeed a "Psychopath".
They-and we (people who are themselves personality disordered or who have lived with, have children who are, were raised by or married to a personality disordered people) agree because we recognize the behaviors, symptoms, traits and diagnostic criteria for the disorders. And I'm sorry that you choose to feel insulted by the fact that we (the people here who "state over and over" that Casey is personality disordered) are quite sure of what we are seeing in Casey and are unable to be swayed by other ideas such a disassociation.
Egoslayer- no kidding! It's obvious they have never been exposed to Psychosis!
ButwhatIF- Axis II personality disorders are considered mental illnesses.. they are just not considered "Clinical illnesses" like Axis I disorders are, they are developmental/personality disorders. There are no medications approved to treat Axis II disorders though meds can be used to treat some of the issues that go along with the disorders such as depression or anxiety.
12-17-2008, 01:16 PM #11
Yep What one lost girl said
KC and several others indulged their disorders to the extreme by murdering but her lesser behaviors are experienced by many people .
When you see it up close and personal - you never forget and instantly
recognize it in others.
Amy H will never forget and will walk away from anyone else who
reminds her of KC .
Bi =polar is a chemical imbalance Treatable with medication
Cluster B's ( axis II ) are personality disorders -
These folks are truly tragedies - they are damaged and nothing
can fix them . They leave a long trail of destruction and wounded victims behind them . There is no way to re-construct an entire personality we cant inject empathy, or a moral compass . It is absent in all of them, in KC to the most extreme degree .
Their victims keep the therapists office busy and full.
12-17-2008, 01:47 PM #12
Can we please put to rest her psychological profile! No matter what her diagnosis of the day might be, nothing will stop her from being prosecuted. Any form of brain imaging that might accompany some of your personal diagnosis is not admissible in court. She isn't in psychosis and has proven she is aware of what is at stake so no insanity plea remember? My feeling is KC is a sociopath who crossed over into psychopathy land. I personaal only had one pt. like this in my career working in locked long term psych. unit.
12-17-2008, 01:54 PM #13
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12-17-2008, 01:58 PM #15
12-17-2008, 02:00 PM #16
12-17-2008, 02:03 PM #17Age. Fac ut gaudeam
12-17-2008, 02:05 PM #18
12-17-2008, 02:07 PM #19
12-17-2008, 02:08 PM #20
I know I have said this before but I'm going to say it again...thank you so much to Brini and One Lost Girl! Your posts make so much sense to me and I find them so logical. I plan on taking some Psychology classes when my daughter graduates from high school next year...Thank you agian for your well educated and thought out posts.
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12-17-2008, 02:15 PM #21Inactive
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My mother and daughter are bipolar - This is definately the AXIS I diagnosis - AXIS II diagnosis are normally personality disorders etc. As someone mentioned above - AXIS I diagnosis can normally be treated with medication - AXIS II diagnosis unfortunately are much harder to treat - the main problem is normally getting the patient to admit there is something wrong with them (instead of the problem is everyone else...) - this type of behaviour does remind me of KC - however, it does not excuse what she had done - and I doubt highly that you could win a mental insanity plea based on it.
Even if KC does have an AXIS I disorder it can still be difficult to prove that she was mentally insane - my daughter was diagnosed when she was 17 - now while it has certainly had an effect on her school and work life - she quite aware that her choices affect her life - and if she were to get in legal trouble it would be no different.
KC is nothing like Andrea Yates IMO - and therefore, I doubt that she can get off on an insanity plea.
Lastly, I realize KC more than likely grew up in a dysfunctional family - but so did the majority of the population (including myself) - but this is no excuse for what she has done.
12-17-2008, 02:51 PM #22Registered User
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12-17-2008, 08:13 PM #23
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12-17-2008, 08:47 PM #24
My guess is that in the highly unlikely event that he came on to KC, CA wouldn't "disbelieve" or "compete." She'd simply kick his cojones up to between his tonsils, put his stuff on the porch, and that would be that. Kind of like she did when he lost all that family money in the Nigerian scam.
And, KC would make VERY sure that CA found out! It's called "splitting.," and Axis IIs do it ALL the time.Age. Fac ut gaudeam
12-17-2008, 09:15 PM #25
From friends' descriptions of Casey and her mother saying that she suffered from past depression, I think she could have a form of bipolar. Bipolar can cause psychosis, and Casey seemed as if she could have had some of that going on at times. I believe that a psychopath can have some psychosis as well. There's no way that Casey's behavior with her friends and family was normal and healthy.There's no account of her being debilitated though, so it's no excuse for murder. I look forward to hearing about what is really wrong with her, but of course, the different experts will all be arguing and disagreeing with each other.
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