Crystal S., Haleigh's mother #4

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Tom'sGirl

Tom'sGirl

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This thread is to discuss Crystal, stay on topic!

Please continue here, and keep in mind a few things that are OFF LIMITS!​
  • posting of random MySpace pages
  • posting Rumors
  • bashing or name calling of case 'players'
 
texasmommy39 said:
Crystal admits doing cocaine while pregnant, this is not a try during pregnancy kind of drug it is a habitual habit at this point and is sometimes in need of intervention. Jr. was 6mo. when Ron took Jr. and Haleigh. What do you really think the reason was Ron took the children? My knowledge leads me to believe those that don't want to quite doing drugs while pregnant are in need of someone else caring for the child after delivery. In Florida the Laws could suggest his motive for his actions the day he picked up the children and there after. I also have to wonder how aware was MG to Crystals use and was she living in her home at the time? do we know why Ron left her? do we know when? I find this not to hard to understand. I didn't say agree with. But /B]. Saying that I find no fault under the possible circumstances.
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These statements indicate to me along with obvious actions of Ron is that Misty was not afraid to tell Ron of her concerns as a babysitter (inside knowledge) of the care given to his son by this mother. His actions of not seeking paternity tells me he is not spiteful and do we not need to speculate the mothers motives for not pursuing child support to establish said paternity. Misty's ability to show concern for this child that is his probably gave him a little piece of mind to consider her to babysit the children that were in his custody. If we had the opportunity to meet these three women with out all of our informed opinions what would your first impressions be? Looks, mannerisms, tone of voice, would be good indicators of personality. I will leave this there. FOOD FOR THOUGHT.
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:banghead:

(bold mine, from previous Crystal #3) Hi txmommy :wave: ...and we were doing so well yesterday... lolol!

1. "Crystal admits doing cocaine while pregnant, this is not a try during pregnancy kind of drug it is a habitual habit at this point and is sometimes in need of intervention."

What Crystal admits to is STOPPING use of cocaine as soon as she learned she was pregnant--unlike dad, who continued using drugs in the home they shared.

2. "Those who don't want to quit drugs while pregnant are in need of someone else caring for the child after delivery."

Those who don't want to quit drugs while PARENTING are in need of someone else to care for their child/ren!

3. "I firmly feel that Ron has demonstrated repeatedly his ability to address ASAP his concerns in regards to the children."

Ron is the one who did not want Crystal to learn to drive; and insisted instead he would be responsible for arranging alternate transportation by his mother to and from Haleigh's doctor appts. during the time they were living together and beyond, yet failed to follow through. Crystal is not the one in whose care Haleigh was when the 22 absences from school occurred during her first few months in school. And Crystal is also not the one who, w/out warning failed to return and kidnapped their two children in violation of the court ordered schedule. It would seem when dad takes the children--nevermind whether there was just cause, whether court sanctioned nor even if legally entitled--he has only altruistic motives... Yet when Mom, in response to now grave and justifiable concern is in a position to seek LEGAL remedies, to rightfully pursue due parental recourse in the prescribed manner, her motives are selfish, sinister and suspect...?

4. "...we (do) not need to speculate the mothers motives for not pursuing child support to establish said paternity."

While attributing the worst most selfish possible motives to mom, for me to say there is a ton of speculating and assigning of benevolent motives re dad going on in your own post would be a gross understatement. And plez, don't even get me started on this doing comparisons of these three women's characters on the basis of looks, mannerisms or vocal tone, I will have cardiac arrest or a stroke... lol. This will have to do for now as it needs to be addressed further in Ron Thread, but w/e we saw eye to eye yesterday, well it was nice while it lasted LOL!!

:parrot:
 
kiki the parrot said:
:banghead:

(bold mine, from previous Crystal #3) Hi txmommy :wave: ...and we were doing so well yesterday... lolol!

1. "Crystal admits doing cocaine while pregnant, this is not a try during pregnancy kind of drug it is a habitual habit at this point and is sometimes in need of intervention."

What Crystal admits to is STOPPING use of cocaine as soon as she learned she was pregnant--unlike dad, who continued using drugs in the home they shared.

2. "Those who don't want to quit drugs while pregnant are in need of someone else caring for the child after delivery."

Those who don't want to quit drugs while PARENTING are in need of someone else to care for their child/ren!

3. "I firmly feel that Ron has demonstrated repeatedly his ability to address ASAP his concerns in regards to the children."

Ron is the one who did not want Crystal to learn to drive; and insisted instead he would be responsible for arranging alternate transportation by his mother to and from Haleigh's doctor appts. during the time they were living together and beyond, yet failed to follow through. Crystal is not the one in whose care Haleigh was when the 22 absences from school occurred during her first few months in school. And Crystal is also not the one who, w/out warning failed to return and kidnapped their two children in violation of the court ordered schedule. It would seem when dad takes the children--nevermind whether there was just cause, whether court sanctioned nor even if legally entitled--he has only altruistic motives... Yet when Mom, in response to now grave and justifiable concern is in a position to seek LEGAL remedies, to rightfully pursue due parental recourse in the prescribed manner, her motives are selfish, sinister and suspect...?

4. "...we (do) not need to speculate the mothers motives for not pursuing child support to establish said paternity."

While attributing the worst most selfish possible motives to mom, for me to say there is a ton of speculating and assigning of benevolent motives re dad going on in your own post would be a gross understatement. And plez, don't even get me started on this doing comparisons of these three women's characters on the basis of looks, mannerisms or vocal tone, I will have cardiac arrest or a stroke... lol. This will have to do for now as it needs to be addressed further in Ron Thread, but w/e we saw eye to eye yesterday, well it was nice while it lasted LOL!!

:parrot:
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Ok, just got because I hate to see such rampant misinformation being put out there as fact, here we go again...

1. Crystal admitted in the custody docs posted previously (and frequently) to using cocaine while pregnant with RJ.

2. The same can be said by both sides, so...

3. Crystal's not having a license is on her first off, does Every single thing have to be blamed on somebody else. Secondly, Ron did provide the transportation thru his grandmother, and Crystal once again admitted in the custody docs posted, to the judge, that maybe she didn't feel like getting out of bed to take Haleigh to the Drs. (12x in less than a year mind you). She even precluded that admission with how she was going to stop blaming other people. But yet other people continue to blame other people for Crystal's faults and neglects, when she herself already took responsibility for this.
Ron did not kidnap the children. Even Crystal has not made that allegation. Probably because she knew there was no court ordered schedule that you speak of! People can post after post about how he kidnapped the children, but obviously both the judge (2 of them) and LE disagree with you. Repeatedly stating something as fact does not make it fact and it only adds to the confusion, of which there is enough of.
 
Shelby77 said:
Ok, just got because I hate to see such rampant misinformation being put out there as fact, here we go again...

1. Crystal admitted in the custody docs posted previously (and frequently) to using cocaine while pregnant with RJ.

2. The same can be said by both sides, so...

3. Crystal's not having a license is on her first off, does Every single thing have to be blamed on somebody else. Secondly, Ron did provide the transportation thru his grandmother, and Crystal once again admitted in the custody docs posted, to the judge, that maybe she didn't feel like getting out of bed to take Haleigh to the Drs. (12x in less than a year mind you). She even precluded that admission with how she was going to stop blaming other people. But yet other people continue to blame other people for Crystal's faults and neglects, when she herself already took responsibility for this.
Ron did not kidnap the children. Even Crystal has not made that allegation. Probably because she knew there was no court ordered schedule that you speak of! People can post after post about how he kidnapped the children, but obviously both the judge (2 of them) and LE disagree with you. Repeatedly stating something as fact does not make it fact and it only adds to the confusion, of which there is enough of.
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what they did then and how they act now are what counts imho .. they have both made mistakes .what has led up to this we dont know but i dont think crystal has anything to do with her daughter disappearing ..it has to be someone they both knew or someone who knows misty .. and i think misty is the key i get the feeling its someone who has had or has a beef with ronald .. or they wouldve taken crystals newborn not haleigh why would they hurt ron too ? ((if this is all about crystal being her fault) its gotta be something to do with misty and ron and who they know ..its someone angry with them or just a phedo that lives by them for all we know it could be someone from the school or an employee at a store that sees haleigh all of the time .
 
zadari said:
what they did then and how they act now are what counts imho .. they have both made mistakes .what has led up to this we dont know but i dont think crystal has anything to do with her daughter disappearing ..it has to be someone they both knew or someone who knows misty .. and i think misty is the key i get the feeling its someone who has had or has a beef with ronald .. or they wouldve taken crystals newborn not haleigh why would they hurt ron too ? ((if this is all about crystal being her fault) its gotta be something to do with misty and ron and who they know ..its someone angry with them or just a phedo that lives by them for all we know it could be someone from the school or an employee at a store that sees haleigh all of the time .
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I agree with you, Zadari, that their current behaviors are more important than past. I also agree that it could be someone who knew Ron or Misty, or a pedo. I haven't really come to a conclusion yet on what has happened to Haleigh, and I am certainly open to all logical theories.

I do disagree with information being put out there that is not true. It just creates more drama and confusion, of which there is plenty already with this cast of characters. So when I see somebody post something that is simply not true, and already proven to be, I can't help but feel the need to point that out.

If it were mis-truths being put out about Crystal, I'd point that out too, it's just that I don't see posters stating falsehoods as facts when it comes to Crystal. That seems to work mostly one way, and on the same facts :banghead:
 
Shelby77 said:
I agree with you, Zadari, that their current behaviors are more important than past. I also agree that it could be someone who knew Ron or Misty, or a pedo. I haven't really come to a conclusion yet on what has happened to Haleigh, and I am certainly open to all logical theories.

I do disagree with information being put out there that is not true. It just creates more drama and confusion, of which there is plenty already with this cast of characters. So when I see somebody post something that is simply not true, and already proven to be, I can't help but feel the need to point that out.

If it were mis-truths being put out about Crystal, I'd point that out too, it's just that I don't see posters stating falsehoods as facts when it comes to Crystal. That seems to work mostly one way, and on the same facts :banghead:
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i understand totally .. i think everyone is just afraid for haleigh and documents have to read carefully and sometimes are not always .i admit i miss things then read them again and find stuff i didnt see before ..
 
So does anyone know why Crystal has/had a suspended Driver's License?
 
Scathing references to "rampant misinformation" and blistering accusations of lies aside, I can only defer and pay homage to our fellow member boytwnmom--whom we've all been privileged to have on these boards--and who "couldn't help but feel the need herself to patiently point out a few of the mistruths about Crystal" earlier on this thread. Shelby I assure you, you are not the only one waxing patient in disagreement w info being repeatedly put out here as "fact" yet merely adding to the confusion. Yes here we go again, but I will spare her the trouble of having to repeat herself:

boytwnmom said:
"I did an analysis of the custody hearing the other day. I'm an attorney, although a corporate not a domestic relations one, but I do know rules of evidence and standards of proof and so I feel confident in saying that the hearing was handled in an appalling and unfair manner and presents numerous grounds for appeal.

Some of what I said the other day:

"Especially as I went back and read the custody rehearing where he made sure every statement he made was spun to make himself look good and Crystal look bad. Anything that had gone wrong was Crystal's fault. Even when asked about day care he said he wanted to get Haleigh in but he left some papers in Crystals car and she didn't give them back so he couldn't get her in day care.

I see a consistent pattern of deflecting any personal responsibility for anything that happens which to me ties in with his every ready response that "I was at work". I also highly doubt he has been truthful about things like his invovlement with drugs unlike Crystal who was, if anything, too truthful about everything. By that I mean she seemed completely unprepared in that custody hearing and Ron was clearly loaded for bear knowing exactly how to spin everything.

He was a great provider even though he had only just gotten a job and was living with his mother. He didn't bring Haleigh back to Crystal after the Mexican vacation but it was Crystal's fault because she had "problems" and a cocaine habit and she never really asked him to. I also saw that Crystal testified that Ron wanted her to quit her job as he didn't want his children left with a babysitter-kind of ironic and also devious as he knew then that would make her look less eligible at the custody hearing. Crystal sure isn't any brain surgeon and I don't know if she is just simple and trusting or beaten down and sort of afraid of Ron or still in love with him or what. I didn't see any evidence of her being less than truthful or else she would have dissembled about obvious negatives the way Ron did.

I noticed that Ron said he passed a drug test but the results were not there or available and the Magistrate simply took his word for it and it wasn't like he later checked because he made the decision immediately. When Ron's criminal history came up Ron immediately changed the subject to Crystals mother's criminal history and his was never discussed or put in the record but the Magistrate did take Crystals mothers records that Ron convieniently brought. This hearing is a textbook example of why someone needs a lawyer as the Magistrate did not follow normal rules of evidence nor apply his rules equally to both sides nor ensure that he had a complete record prior to making his decision."

So, I have to disagree with your comments. I also don't think you should accuse her of cocaine use while pregnant unless you lhave a firm basis to do so. At least she was honest concerning her past transgressions. Given Ron's criminal record I would be more concerned with his history. It is simply not credible that anyone with the number of drug related charges he has has never been invovled in anyw ay with drugs. He is simply not truthful about it.

In any fair hearing the fact that he absconded with the children and refused to return them would have been an extremely important factor but it was completely ignored. HIs representations regarding his living with his mother and her caring for the children soon become him living in a felonious relationship with a minor from whose presence the child was stolen and who can't tell a consistent story as to the timeline leading up to the disappearance of the child.

I am just glad that Crystal has attorney now to protect herself and her children and she seems to have escaped from Ron's influecne and control.

And I have never seen any evidence of her filing false charges. I really don't think you should be throwing accusations around that are completely unsubstantiated as accusing people of a crime without any basis can get one in trouble."
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http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3475523#post3475523

boytwnmom said:
"On page 45 of the transcript the Magistrate clearly says that he does not have the arrest records of the parties before him. The only records that were produced were those of Crystals mother and these were brought by RC.

Yes, it is highly unusual to not have records prior to making a decision like this. That was kind of my point. This hearing was a travesty.

Ron also admits he did not return the children when he came back. He had not been awarded custody and he did not return them as agreed. Just because Crystal didn't know how to properly articulate that doesn't mean it's not the truth. On page 5 Ron says he just kept them with him. On page 18 Crystal talks about going to court and attempting to get an injunction. She is terrible at communicating but the gist of it seems to be that Ron kept the kids, stopped answering his phone or comunicating with her and wouldn't let her see or talk to them. Once she tried to get an injunction he would only let her see and talk to them if she dropped the injunction which she says she did so he would let here see the kids. This obviously makes little sense from a legal perspective but I don't get the sense she has a very keen awareness of domestic relations law. So, I'm not sure whether she is seriously misinformed about the law or just was cowed by Ron or whatever but he clearly took advantage of the situaiton and was awarded custody when, apparently, she did not receive notice of the first hearing. On page 19 she also says she asked him to bring the children back but that she couldn't make him do it.

I still do not see where Crystal admitted to doing cocaine while pregnant as you say she did so perhaps you can point that out.

Although you say all your claims are backed up by proof you do not point to any sources to substantiate that Crystal has made false reports to LE. Again, that is a serious matter and I think when referenced the source should be linked to.

As far as what Crystals attorney alleges I have no idea about that. I was only speaking for myself and do not feel responsible for the allegations of another person who I clearly don't know and have never spoken to. I was referring to allegations you have made here, on this site which are not linked to sources. You say your info can be verified and so I would like to review that verification as so far I have found Crystals statemments and behavior both at the custody hearing and in regard to this situation to be consistent and truthful. If that is not the case I would like to know that so I can revise my opinion accordingly.

In general I look at these things with a bias towards facts. Facts can be inconvienient things but also tend to be a useful tool for getting at the truth, which is the only thing most of us are interested in so that Haleigh can be found. The truth seems to be one things sorely lacking in this investigation and ferreting it out seems to be the key."
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http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3476185#post3476185

Yes it IS frustrating to have facts presented in earlier posts both ignored and distorted. Altho I've worked for two attorneys (and consider myself fairly articulate) I, no doubt like Crystal, am w/out question not nearly as equipped to assess nor to argue the legal ramifications as succinctly and clearly as boytwnmom--who, like myself, has no dog in this race. I'm just grateful that a disinterested person in this field has taken time out to do an analysis in order to shed light on this for the rest of us--of which any of us who are not attorneys might do well to heed and take note. And thankful that Crystal has an advocate of her own now. You are not the only poster who's grown weary of hearing what they feel is a mischaracterization. As you said, repeatedly misstating something does not make it true. So it's all "one way," and we "don't see posters stating falsehoods when it comes to Crystal?" Perhaps there is more than "one way" to interpret the alleged "facts" but boytwnmom is certain to enjoy a raucous laugh over that one... Props BTM for your posts. JMO

:parrot:
 
I just can NOT believe that with all of those drug charges Ron had he was not convicted, not once ! I have never seen anything like it in my life !
 
http://www.cbs47.com/media/news/e/4/.../cummings1.pdf

Page 5 - Ron says he kept the kids because he heard she was using cocaine

Missed hearing - page 21 - Crystal states lived in Glen St Marys for 3 months, therefore when she was served papers October 3rd, and answered them October 18th she would of been living at the same residence at the time of the hearing in December. If she did move between October and December by chance it would of been her responsibility to inform the court - she was full well of the proceedings as she had answered the original petition.

Cocaine use - page 23 - she admits not using cocaine for a year - RJ is 9 months old at time of hearing - therefore she used while preg with RJ.

Criminal records - page 39 Marie brings records up - later Ron brings Maries records up

False police report - cannot link direct but go here http://www.bakercountyfl.org/clerk/
hit search criminal dockets type in sheffield and scroll thru - they are not in order some of her charges are up top some at bottom you will find filing false police report (which was also addressed on NG today.

Hope this helps.

ETA - also if you scroll to the end of the documents the judge says he will review the violence file and dcf file and if he finds anything in there to change his ruling he will do so. I do not have page number because already closed out and takes forever to load.
 
Busylady said:
http://www.cbs47.com/media/news/e/4/.../cummings1.pdf

Page 5 - Ron says he kept the kids because he heard she was using cocaine

Missed hearing - page 21 - Crystal states lived in Glen St Marys for 3 months, therefore when she was served papers October 3rd, and answered them October 18th she would of been living at the same residence at the time of the hearing in December. If she did move between October and December by chance it would of been her responsibility to inform the court - she was full well of the proceedings as she had answered the original petition.

Cocaine use - page 23 - she admits not using cocaine for a year - RJ is 9 months old at time of hearing - therefore she used while preg with RJ.

Criminal records - page 39 Marie brings records up - later Ron brings Maries records up

False police report - cannot link direct but go here http://www.bakercountyfl.org/clerk/
hit search criminal dockets type in sheffield and scroll thru - they are not in order some of her charges are up top some at bottom you will find filing false police report (which was also addressed on NG today.

Hope this helps.

ETA - also if you scroll to the end of the documents the judge says he will review the violence file and dcf file and if he finds anything in there to change his ruling he will do so. I do not have page number because already closed out and takes forever to load.
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the link doesnt work . the first one

I just am at the point where if its from the media i dont know if id beleive it .. it couldve been retyped changed ect ect and reposted ..because it sure isnt up right now .. i just dont think i trust what the media says too much anymore .. and really this is turning into im right your wrong type of thing imho .. again this is turning into a fiasco about them(the parents) just like with the anthonys .Crystal as far as we know was 100 miles away yea i heard it took her time to get down there however she wasnt there when this happened that we know of and why would she take haleigh and hurt her now ? after 5 years ? id think she wouldve years ago
misty was the one with those kids its got something to with her imho . on nancy grace she said something about rj saying there was a man in black and bouncing couch then why dont they have a professional ask the little boy what and if he saw anything .. i would think a professional child psychologist would know if rj indeed saw anything . and im just using your post in general not knocking it in any way so please dont take it that way .
 
It is just a copy of the custody documents, link worked fine for me just took a bit of time to load. You can also go to any other source and get the documents and the page numbers will match. But I understand where you are coming from. Clarification was asked so I just copied a post that I did a few weeks ago, giving the page numbers so people could look for themselves to find the information. I myself am done with the custody discussion and have been for sometime now.


zadari said:
the link doesnt work . the first one

I just am at the point where if its from the media i dont know if id beleive it .. it couldve been retyped changed ect ect and reposted ..because it sure isnt up right now .. i just dont think i trust what the media says too much anymore .. and really this is turning into im right your wrong type of thing imho .. again this is turning into a fiasco about them(the parents) just like with the anthonys .Crystal as far as we know was 100 miles away yea i heard it took her time to get down there however she wasnt there when this happened that we know of and why would she take haleigh and hurt her now ? after 5 years ? id think she wouldve years ago
misty was the one with those kids its got something to with her imho . on nancy grace she said something about rj saying there was a man in black and bouncing couch then why dont they have a professional ask the little boy what and if he saw anything .. i would think a professional child psychologist would know if rj indeed saw anything . and im just using your post in general not knocking it in any way so please dont take it that way .
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Did you by any chance copy a shortened link from a quoted post here? I've already managed to mess up quite a few links that way.
 
Busylady said:
It is just a copy of the custody documents, link worked fine for me just took a bit of time to load. You can also go to any other source and get the documents and the page numbers will match. But I understand where you are coming from. Clarification was asked so I just copied a post that I did a few weeks ago, giving the page numbers so people could look for themselves to find the information. I myself am done with the custody discussion and have been for sometime now.
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im there too hun i just wanna see haliegh found and i hope to god alive like you do .. :praying:
 
kiki the parrot said:
Scathing references to "rampant misinformation" and blistering accusations of lies aside, I can only defer and pay homage to our fellow member boytwnmom--whom we've all been privileged to have on these boards--and who "couldn't help but feel the need herself to patiently point out a few of the mistruths about Crystal" earlier on this thread. Shelby I assure you, you are not the only one waxing patient in disagreement w info being repeatedly put out here as "fact" yet merely adding to the confusion. Yes here we go again, but I will spare her the trouble of having to repeat herself:



http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3475523#post3475523

kiki, thanks for bringing boytwnmom's post back for reference. It is the most amazingly concise posting of the custody info yet. Just the facts mam.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3476185#post3476185

Yes it IS frustrating to have facts presented in earlier posts both ignored and distorted. Altho I've worked for two attorneys (and consider myself fairly articulate) I, no doubt like Crystal, am w/out question not nearly as equipped to assess nor to argue the legal ramifications as succinctly and clearly as boytwnmom--who, like myself, has no dog in this race. I'm just grateful that a disinterested person in this field has taken time out to do an analysis in order to shed light on this for the rest of us--of which any of us who are not attorneys might do well to heed and take note. And thankful that Crystal has an advocate of her own now. You are not the only poster who's grown weary of hearing what they feel is a mischaracterization. As you said, repeatedly misstating something does not make it true. So it's all "one way," and we "don't see posters stating falsehoods when it comes to Crystal?" Perhaps there is more than "one way" to interpret the alleged "facts" but boytwnmom is certain to enjoy a raucous laugh over that one... Props BTM for your posts. JMO

:parrot:
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Thanks!!!
 
Shelby77 said:
Ok, just got because I hate to see such rampant misinformation being put out there as fact, here we go again...

1. Crystal admitted in the custody docs posted previously (and frequently) to using cocaine while pregnant with RJ.

2. The same can be said by both sides, so...

3. Crystal's not having a license is on her first off, does Every single thing have to be blamed on somebody else. Secondly, Ron did provide the transportation thru his grandmother, and Crystal once again admitted in the custody docs posted, to the judge, that maybe she didn't feel like getting out of bed to take Haleigh to the Drs. (12x in less than a year mind you). She even precluded that admission with how she was going to stop blaming other people. But yet other people continue to blame other people for Crystal's faults and neglects, when she herself already took responsibility for this.
Ron did not kidnap the children. Even Crystal has not made that allegation. Probably because she knew there was no court ordered schedule that you speak of! People can post after post about how he kidnapped the children, but obviously both the judge (2 of them) and LE disagree with you. Repeatedly stating something as fact does not make it fact and it only adds to the confusion, of which there is enough of.
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sufficiently to make the legal argument that Ron had kidnapped her children does not change the FACT that the argument could, and should, and would have been made had she been represented by a competent attorney.

In Florida, as in every other state that I know of, an unmarried mother of children is their natural and legal guardian and sole legal custodian. A putative father has NO, ZERO, NADA, rights in regard to those children unless and until paternity is established by a court of competent jurisdiciton.

Here are a few snippets in PLAIN ENGLISH from various FL domestic attorney websites:


"Fort Lauderdale, Florida, Paternity Laws Lawyer

When parents are not married to each other, a paternity action may be required to establish a father's identity and the rights and responsibilities of the father, mother and child, such as the following:
• The right of the mother to receive child support if she is the custodial parent
• Parental rights of the father which may include child custody and visitation rights
• Inheritance rights of the child with regard to the father's estate "

"How Do Parents Benefit from
Establishing Paternity?

Establishing paternity gives the father and mother legal
rights. You can:

• Seek an order for support.
• Seek a court order for custody or visitation.
• Have a say in some legal decisions about the child."

"Fathers' Rights in Paternity Cases
If you are listed on your child's birth certificate as the father, it doesn't mean you have legal custody or visitation rights. Only a court can give custody and visitation rights to an unmarried father."

"October 7, 2008
The Importance of Establishing Paternity for Children Born Out of Wedlock in Florida
Florida law dictates that the mother of a child born out of wedlock is automatically considered to be the legal parent who is required to provide support for her child. However, if a child’s parents are not married to each other when that child is born, Florida courts will not automatically presume a man is the biological father and thus recognize the father’s duties and financial obligations to the child unless paternity is legally established. "

I hope the above makes it clear that RC had no legal right to withold the children from their mother at the time he refused to return them. This is the truth regardless of CS's failure to argue this in court or the magistrate's failure to take judicial notice of this fact. RC's dissembling on these circumstances does not change the fact that the only legal recourse he had if he truly suspected drug abuse was to report same to DCF or LE for action. He had no right to self help and to unilaterally remove the children from their mother. Of course, he had no such concerns as he asked for no restrictions on visitation despite his unsupported accusations. I don't think we need to rehash his lenghty criminal drug record again here so let's just go with pot, kettle.

It also worth noting that CS did not try to establish paternity in order to try and get support from RC as he subsequently did to her. Again, I find his actions indicative of the type of person he is. He was just as unemployed as she was until he got a job just before he asked for the hearing and he was living on his mother's largesse in a mobile home she paid for. He made it clear to CS that she couldn't work because he didn't want his kids with a sitter and then of course used her lack of employment against her. He controlled her further by not wanting her to drive and then used that against her. He also used his Mommy & Grammy as his stable childcare support in court then promptly moved in his underage sex partner as an apparently appropriate "sitter". He & his mother used the legal system to set CS up. They relied upon her passivity and were not disappointed. I'm glad to see she has progressed form there. Too bad she didn't progress sooner as then perhaps this tragedy could have been averted.

I think it is fairly clear to anyone schooled in domestic abuse the type of control RC excerted over CS. She displays a passivity in a face to face with her abuser that is fairly typical in women who were subejcted to psychological abuse and assertions of control over their actions. It's clear she needs to be represented by counsel in any and all actions invovling RC and his clan as that is the only way there is any possibility of justice being done.
 
RE: the photos Ron has of his daughter's marks on her body.Okay So his daughter falls at school and gets bruises---I just thought it was odd that if it were an accident,why did he keep taking photos of her face AFTER it happened? Anyone else think that's odd? Why would you take pictures of boo boo's if they were were an accident?
 
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