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  1. #16
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    Moon phases, days, months, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by SharetheLight View Post
    One of the resident astrologers suggested when trying to come up with a common denominator for crimes, it is not so much the phase of the moon that may affect a perp, but how the planets, or which planets are rising and falling in relation to other things. She said the moon is the fastest moving target in our charts so it is telling, but the phase of the moon probably has very little to do with it. (I hope I haven't screwed up that explanation too horribly.)
    So we can continue to look at moon phases, but maybe we should just concentrate on Tuesdays here???

    Any other opinions about moon phases??
    Nice work on finding the moon phases posted. I tend to agree somewhat with your astrologer friend. Moon phase COULD be a stressor or trigger, but possibly only a minor factor in crime.

    It would probably be different for each individual person. That is, affecting some, but not others. Other factors such as weather, day of week, certain times of year etc probably play a bigger part with more people.

    The Unibomber was definitely affected by the moon phase as well as the seasons of fall and spring - specifically the planting and harvest times. When he deviated (which he did) from his pattern, he tended to screw up and leave clues and evidence, such as his Summer time bombing in Colorado where the one and only sighting of him took place. (Remember the composite drawing of the guy in the shades and hooded sweatshirt?)

    Someone who was truly "into" astrology would tend to allow himself be affected more by all the various astrological movements and horoscopes. But it could affect others significantly, even though they have no interest in or understanding of such factors.

  2. #17
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    Richard...........

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    Nice work on finding the moon phases posted. I tend to agree somewhat with your astrologer friend. Moon phase COULD be a stressor or trigger, but possibly only a minor factor in crime.

    It would probably be different for each individual person. That is, affecting some, but not others. Other factors such as weather, day of week, certain times of year etc probably play a bigger part with more people.

    The Unibomber was definitely affected by the moon phase as well as the seasons of fall and spring - specifically the planting and harvest times. When he deviated (which he did) from his pattern, he tended to screw up and leave clues and evidence, such as his Summer time bombing in Colorado where the one and only sighting of him took place. (Remember the composite drawing of the guy in the shades and hooded sweatshirt?)

    Someone who was truly "into" astrology would tend to allow himself be affected more by all the various astrological movements and horoscopes. But it could affect others significantly, even though they have no interest in or understanding of such factors.
    I thought that you were encouraging us to look into moon phases, because on the time of year thread you said
    quote from Richard,snipped by me-
    It would seem far more likely that the more immediate variables such as warm weather, time of day, and situation of school being out and a lot of kids at the mall played a direct part in this specific crime. Also, such factors as moon phase, day of the week, etc could affect the abductor in some way. When all factors have been analyzed, possible patterns might be seen when comparing this crime with others (solved and unsolved).

    Did I misunderstand you?

  3. #18
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    Moon Phase

    Quote Originally Posted by Motherof5 View Post
    I thought that you were encouraging us to look into moon phases, because on the time of year thread you said
    quote from Richard,snipped by me-
    It would seem far more likely that the more immediate variables such as warm weather, time of day, and situation of school being out and a lot of kids at the mall played a direct part in this specific crime. Also, such factors as moon phase, day of the week, etc could affect the abductor in some way. When all factors have been analyzed, possible patterns might be seen when comparing this crime with others (solved and unsolved).

    Did I misunderstand you?
    I did suggest checking into various factors, including moon phase, as possible clues. What I was trying to explain is that there is not a specific set of rules that would be useful in all situations and for all suspects. Each person is different and may be affected differently by each different factor.

    What you have to look for is Patterns that include moon phase or other factors such as day of the week, weather, type of victim, etc. to compare cases and try to determine who or what type of person was the perpetrator.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    I did suggest checking into various factors, including moon phase, as possible clues. What I was trying to explain is that there is not a specific set of rules that would be useful in all situations and for all suspects. Each person is different and may be affected differently by each different factor.

    What you have to look for is Patterns that include moon phase or other factors such as day of the week, weather, type of victim, etc. to compare cases and try to determine who or what type of person was the perpetrator.
    We are all creatures of habit, so I'd think whoever committed this crime also committed others. If they didn't, then looking at patterns is useless.
    Only if this person was a serial molester/killer/abductor will looking at patterns be useful. If this crime was committed as some type of retribution, then it's possible the perp didn't commit anymore crimes.

    Operating under the theory that this person did commit other crimes we have the benefit of time to compare this crime to other like crimes. If we are creatures of habit, then a pattern should emerge somewhere. Unless of course the habit is randomness
    I think it's good to look at all commonalities, no matter how insignificant, in other crimes because you don't know where the common denominator will be. With virtually nothing to go on, we must look at any and all common denominators.

    Add to that the fact that humans are also imperfect, and there will be crimes that were committed that don't follow a pattern, that this perp most likely committed also. Here's hoping we find the common thread to lead us to whoever committed this atrocity.
    Children don't stop dancing

  5. #20
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    As I have been thinking about the common denominator for crimes this person may have commited before and after the lyon girls.
    Maybe the common denominator is something specific to our perp. For example, the perp hates all of his uncles, so he chooses to abduct/kill on the dates of birth of his uncles. Uncle #1 born 5/25/33, Uncle #2 born 10/4/40, Unlce #3 born 1/5/38 etc. So the perp will abduct/kill on 5/25, 10/4, 1/5 etc.
    Or maybe the perp is a fan of Elvis and his kill dates are the dates Elvis's singles went #1 on the charts.
    These are lame examples, I know, but I am just thinking that the common denominator might be so specific to the perp that it is near impossible to determine what that denominator may be.
    Or maybe the common denominator is opportunity specific to our perp. Say the perp is on a sports team that travels, he abducts when his team is away in various cities. Or our perp is an actor or singer, he abducts when his band has gigs in various cities. Or our perp is a business man, he abducts when he is called out of town on business.
    If we had a list of people of interest this type of thing would be easier to determine, but with no real list of people of interest, this is an impossible task. If indeed, the perp who took the lyon sisters has some sort of pattern that is very specific to his life/his opportunities.
    Just kind of thinking out loud here in frustration.
    Children don't stop dancing

  6. #21
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    An interesting Historical date coincidence...

    Many of you have probably heard of a website called "The Charley Project". It is named after a little 4-year-old boy named Charley Brewster Ross who was kidnapped in Philadelphia on 1 July 1874. A series of letters demanding ransom of $20,000 were sent by the kidnappers to Charley's father. It was the first known time in US history that a kidnapping of a child for ransom occurred.

    The outcry from the public was tremendous. This became front page news in all of the cities in the US for several months. Police agencies searched high and low for any sign of the kidnappers and the boy.

    Then on 14 December 1874, two men were shot while burglarizing a house in New York. One confessed before dying that they were the kidnappers of little Charley, but that only the other man knew his whereabouts. Unfortunately, the other burglar had already died. Later evidence identified both men positively as the abductors of Charley, but no one had a clue as to where Charley was.

    Laws regarding kidnapping at the time were actually very limited and weak. Kidnapping was a misdemeanor punishable by fines only as high as a thousand dollars and confinement for a year or two. In an effort to make stronger sentences against kidnapping, the Pennsylvania legislature passed a bill in February of 1875 which made the crime a felony punishable by imprisonment of 25 years and fines up to ten thousand dollars. Included in the bill were provisions for prosecuting not only the actual kidnappers, but also anyone who aided and abetted the act.

    Because little Charley had still not been returned to his family, the legislature, as an incentive to whomever held him, put a 30 day delay clause in the bill so that anyone holding the boy could turn him over to authorities within 30 days of passage and NOT face the full penalties of the new law. After that time, this law would become the most severe in the entire country for the crime of kidnapping.

    The Pennsylvania Governor signed the bill into law on 24 February 1875 and the 30 day grace period ended on 25 March 1875.

    Exactly 100 years later, to the day, the Lyon sisters disappeared.

    Today the Lyon sisters , like little Charley Ross, are still missing.

  7. #22
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    Factors and Patterns...

    In studying any unsolved case, one needs to be on the watch for all possible variables and how those individual factors could have played into a crime. Those varying factors COULD be seen as part of a pattern when compared with other similar crimes.

    Such factors as the day of the week (Tuesday), time of day (around 3PM?), location (busy shopping mall, parking lot, or residential street, etc), day-month-year (25 March 1975), season (Spring/Easter) and weather that day (warm and sunny) - all could have played a part in the disappearance/abduction of the Lyon sisters.

    The girls were seen at a number of different points inside and outside the mall by reliable witnesses. At one point, they were seen talking to an older man with a tape recorder, who mysteriously disappeared at the same time they did.

    Victimology (that is factors pertaining to the victims) also enters into the mix: TWO young girls (ages 11 and 13), Race (White), description (small, blonde, blue eyes), clothing worn (seasonal, nice clothes, of known colors), How they walked, interacted with eachother and with others, what their interests were, etc. Any and all of these factors may have gone into the perpetrator's thought process and selection of the girls as victims.

    Knowing about the girls' family, their school friends, their habits, their likes and dislikes, etc, also helps to form a picture of them. It could explain why a certain individual or individuals might have been attracted to them.

    What you have with all the known factors can then be compared with known factors in other similar crimes against children. What are the similarities? Can patterns be determined? Are they truly connected or just coincidentally similar? What factors are pertinant and which factors do not matter? What is the geographical area, and distance between possibly connected cases? What is the time frame between possibly connected cases?

    The Lyon Sisters went missing Tuesday, 25 March 1975, around mid afternoon, probably while walking together enroute from Wheaton Plaza Shopping Center to their home in Kensington. The weather was warm and sunny. The vernal equinox had just passed and schools were closed for spring break.

    Several events were only days away: both girls' birthdays, the full moon, Easter weekend, and the resumption of the school schedule.
    Last edited by Richard; 04-29-2011 at 10:37 AM. Reason: Spelling and additional info...

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post

    What you have with all the known factors can then be compared with known factors in other similar crimes against children. What are the similarities? Can patterns be determined? Are they truly connected or just coincidentally similar? What factors are pertinant and which factors do not matter?
    I think much of the interest that men, and local men in particular, have in these sorts of cases can be ascribed to this phenomenon. When stuff like what people think happened to the Lyon sisters happens to girls and they return alive, it's not as though they are going to be as confident in their affections as they otherwise would have been. And so, when one has had a feeling some girl one really likes naturally likes one back, and that at least in some reality it could have been very beautiful, but it just didn't work out, one is likely to have a long-lingering feeling that something like what people think happened (forcible sodomy/rape) to the Lyon sisters happened to her. And no matter if she was strong- and clean-natured, smart, and basically the last person one would have expected a molester to go after. For look at the pictures of the Lyon sisters that lived a half-dozen or so miles away from me. Sheila looks so smart. And Kate looks like should could out trick anybody. But men mostly don't talk about these suspicions, maybe they aren't even clear that such inner suspicions have something to do with why they are interested in these sorts of crimes; certainly they should be hesitant to start rumors. Besides, people would think the guy crazy presumptuous to think the girl naturally would have been comfortable with him except for that something bizarre had happened to her, because if he really loves her, he will care about her privacy and, more importantly, his evidence for his explanation of her behavior is likely based on such a myriad of individually only weakly convincing impressions and trains of thinking that it can't be communicated convincingly.

    There is another reason that girls and to a lesser extent women can be interested in this manner of crime. On the one hand, they and their daughters are potential victims of the same or similar villains. On the other, when girls wonder whether they are in love, it is a comfort to them by way of knowing for sure their emotions haven't been warped by defiling addiction to know that they still readily take interest and delight in justice and seeing the villains they fear punished. Nancy Drew can feel more comfortable with her affections for Ned Nickerson while she is enjoying having punished the evil villains: whatsoever the cause of her affections for Ned, they obviously can't be from his having warped her into being unable to effectively hate villainy; similarly with girls reading Nancy Drew while thinking about their affection for males. Being able to feel hate simultaneously with being able to love (someone else) can make in the girl the love sweeter from being more certain (notwithstanding the hate busies brain faculties that otherwise could be used for directly constructive thinking, e.g., about love). So that's partly why I can imagine a scenario in which the Lyon girls would try to punish a would-be child molester right before encouraging a man to run away with them: doing so would make them feel more comfortable and certain in their affections (girls that young of course are naturally very scared of sex). But it is not the only reason. A would-be child molester hoodwinked by such girls probably would become hellbent on making up for it by going after other girls who like to test their capacity for hate when feeling love. And since a molester is stubborn, he'd probably try to commit the crime similarly, by posing as a rescuer if that's what he tried at first (sort of like computer viruses very often are posed as antivirus programs).

    If a guy has long loved someone whose relationship with him was indeed thwarted by some villain, and if the villain performed some other act of villainy, then by assuming the villain is one and the same, the guy probably can have amazingly wondrous insights into that other act of villainy. A large part of the guy's past poetical profound experiences and of his longest train of careful reasoning will be wrapped up with overcoming the villain. Of course, though the guy can also have developed general insights into that sort of villainy, if the villain is not the same, then to the extent he has assumed otherwise, his insights are likely to be not only ridiculously presumptuous looking, but ridiculously wrong.

    As to something else, I don't know if I would say it was warm and sunny on March 25, 1975, in Kensington. According to weather underground (the only site I could find with historical weather data—I guess it isn't bogus despite its ominous name), the high at BWI was 64, but by 3pm there were 20mph sustained winds. Warm for March, yes, but with that wind it probably wouldn't have felt warm. And at 2pm skies apparently changed from scattered clouds to mostly cloudy.

  9. #24
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    Here are two very useful links which will allow you to calculate the day of the week and the moon phase for any date in history:

    Moon Phase Calendar Link:

    http://www.moonconnection.com/moon_p...calendar.phtml

    Day of the Week Calendar Link:

    http://www.searchforancestors.com/ut...dayofweek.html

  10. #25
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    The unsolved murder case of Kathy Lynn Beatty has some possible connections to the disappearance of Sheila and Katherine Lyon (25 March 1975).

    The abduction/attack upon Kathy occurred on 24 July 1975 almost exactly four months after the Lyon sisters went missing, and only four miles away. The day of the week was Thursday and the moon phase was just one day past full moon.


  11. #26
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    The moon phases and day of week is so interesting............I bumped this for those that do not know this thread exists.
    I saw many post about full moon and JDW ................
    Kyron, HALEIGH, ADJI & Gabriel NEEDS PRAYERS NOW TO FIND THEM!. Zahra & Jonathan in heaven
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    No Justice for Caylee Marie..........

  12. #27
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    It would be hard to determine if moon phase actually had anything to do with the Lyon case, when considered in isolation, but it is a factor which Could have influenced the perpetrator. When comparing the Lyon case with other cases (solved or unsolved) moon phase - along with other factors mentioned previously - could provide clues toward possible links.

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