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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by MissJames View Post
    You are so right,Mystic.A parents reaction to an unexpected death is to get help and "My child will be okay.My child CAN"T be dead".From my own experience,even after the dr told us ,I kept asking him to keep trying.It just was not possible our son was dead.Now we know our son had did before my daughter found him and all the CPR was useless,but a parent would try. I just can't imagine anyone finding their child lifeless and going for the duct tape instead of 911.
    I've talked to a lot of parents since and it's a universal reaction to an unexpected death IMO.
    I'm so sorry that you have had to go through the unbearable loss of your son. I think most parents, most adults, know there is no worse pain than the loss of a child. Thank you so much for sharing with us what you learned from this experience. I know in my heart, if I were in the position of finding a child lifeless there is nothing I wouldn't try to "fix" the problem. No matter how irreversible it seemed.

    How KC was able to wrap duct tape over her baby's face (it makes me feel ill just writing the statement) I will never as long as I live be able to understand. How she could do this to another human being, her very own precious baby, I cannot fathom.

    I hope she never knows another day of freedom, I hope she never again has a chance to enjoy "the beautiful life". I hope she never has the opportunity to cause another human being harm, never experiences the joy of holding a new born baby. Never knows the pleasure of being in love, playing with puppies or even seeing a rainbow. I hope all the things she has deprived Caylee of are tenfold for KC.

    I don't really care if she lives or dies. Once she is found guilty, once the prison door slides shut behind her. I hope I never again hear her name or read anything about her. I hope she falls into anonymity. Never to be spoken of again. Knowing KC's personality, that is probably a fate worse than death.



    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Thank you my WS family for everything you do, everyday. You are loved and appreciated.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~



    ~Emma Leigh Barker~
    09/02/07~03/18/09
    ~R.I.P.~


    Justice For Emma
    Stacey Barker - Guilty - Murder 1 - 5/24/11
    25 to LiFE - Sentenced 6/17/11


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  3. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by missmybaby View Post
    I'm so sorry that you have had to go through the unbearable loss of your son. I think most parents, most adults, know there is no worse pain than the loss of a child. Thank you so much for sharing with us what you learned from this experience. I know in my heart, if I were in the position of finding a child lifeless there is nothing I wouldn't try to "fix" the problem. No matter how irreversible it seemed.

    How KC was able to wrap duct tape over her baby's face (it makes me feel ill just writing the statement) I will never as long as I live be able to understand. How she could do this to another human being, her very own precious baby, I cannot fathom.

    I hope she never knows another day of freedom, I hope she never again has a chance to enjoy "the beautiful life". I hope she never has the opportunity to cause another human being harm, never experiences the joy of holding a new born baby. Never knows the pleasure of being in love, playing with puppies or even seeing a rainbow. I hope all the things she has deprived Caylee of are tenfold for KC.

    I don't really care if she lives or dies. Once she is found guilty, once the prison door slides shut behind her. I hope I never again hear her name or read anything about her. I hope she falls into anonymity. Never to be spoken of again. Knowing KC's personality, that is probably a fate worse than death.

    I agree. The only thing is.... if KC is found guilty we will still hear plenty about her. Rest assured the As will launch the Save Casey Anthony (or some similar iteration) campaign and website ala Jackie and Lee Peterson. Their current foundation will be a dim memory. I don't think it will be over, if ever, for a very long time.
    Last edited by Patty G; 07-17-2009 at 08:54 AM. Reason: Fixed broken quote ...


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  5. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by RR0004 View Post
    I agree totally...so then is the defense going to go for there's NO PROOF that Ms. Anthony was the one who killed her? Personally it would be the lesser of two evils...a) it was an accident and I put the duct tape on AFTER Caylee died...or b) it wasn't me who did it. If I were them, I would stay clear of anything that has to do with the duct tape.
    I think they'll just try to pick at the forensics, and call it a day. They don't have anything else.

    LOVE it is they put Dr. Lee up against Dr. G! Fun!
    Age. Fac ut gaudeam


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  7. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Princess Rose View Post
    I am convinced the duct tape was almost certainly placed after Caylee died.
    And, before decomp!

    So, KC had a MAX of 10 minutes to:

    1) Think about what to do.
    2) Go find the duct tape and garbage bags (unless she had stocked the car with them, beforehand)
    3) And then wrap the baby's lifeless head in three layers of duct tape.

    Now, Dr. G. has ruled out accident.

    But, if it WAS an accident, most parents would either:

    1) Frantically call 911 while also trying to resuscitate, or,
    2) Sit paralyzed with shock, holding the baby, rocking and moaning that it couldn't be happening.

    Not KC! She intrepidly swung RIGHT into action!
    Age. Fac ut gaudeam


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  9. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by marspiter View Post
    For what cause? A dead child is not going to scream. If it was to stop fluid leakage, well the tape was placed before decomp. Also fluid leakage from the mouth would be the least of Casey's worries. There are other areas where the body fluids leak from that would draw more attention then the mouth.

    When a person dies any leakage from the mouth and nose would be minimal at best given when the autopsy says it was applied. That and duct tape doesn't actually stick well to wet surfaces especially wet skin.

    So what exactly would be the reason be to place the duct tape on Caylee?
    Within moments of dying a person's mouth gapes open. It's very disturbing and shocking to see someone like this. The duct tape was put on strongly enough to hold Caylee's mandible in place even after decomposition which indicates to me that holding the mandible in place may be the actual reason for the duct tape. I think that the heart shaped sticker actually indicates that Casey was trying to fix this problem. I don't think Casey had ever been around someone who died (all of her grandparents are aparently alive) and I suspect she would be unaware that normally the mandible is closed after death with a headband that goes under the chin and around the top of the head.

    The other part of this is twofold:

    1. The duct tape was put on the front of Caylee's face only - not wrapped around the back of her head.
    That indicates to me that Caylee was probably on her back when the duct tape was applied.
    2. The duct tape was put on in several strips that were layered.
    If Caylee were alive and thrashing about because she couldn't breathe, it would be very difficult to layer the duct tape with additional pieces and place the heart shaped sticker.

    For all these reasons, I believe it was put on immediately following Caylee's death.


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  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Princess Rose View Post
    Within moments of dying a person's mouth gapes open. It's very disturbing and shocking to see someone like this. The duct tape was put on strongly enough to hold Caylee's mandible in place even after decomposition which indicates to me that holding the mandible in place may be the actual reason for the duct tape. I think that the heart shaped sticker actually indicates that Casey was trying to fix this problem. I don't think Casey had ever been around someone who died (all of her grandparents are aparently alive) and I suspect she would be unaware that normally the mandible is closed after death with a headband that goes under the chin and around the top of the head.

    The other part of this is twofold:

    1. The duct tape was put on the front of Caylee's face only - not wrapped around the back of her head.
    That indicates to me that Caylee was probably on her back when the duct tape was applied.
    2. The duct tape was put on in several strips that were layered.
    If Caylee were alive and thrashing about because she couldn't breathe, it would be very difficult to layer the duct tape with additional pieces and place the heart shaped sticker.

    For all these reasons, I believe it was put on immediately following Caylee's death.
    Tell it to the FL Supreme Court.

    1) Killers do not tend to be concerned about the open mouth that distresses loving friends and relatives.
    2) If KC was concerned about the open mouth, she would have wrapped the tape vertically, not horizontally.
    3) The tape WAS put on over her face and into her hair, IIRC. Which may have helped hold the tape in place. Which indicates to me she was sitting up on KC's lap, while KC held her with her left arm, and wrapped the tape with her right hand.
    4) All KC would have to get on was one strip. Caylee would not have been able to pull it off. I have a hard time pulling off duct tape, and I am an adult. Then, she could take her time wrapping the other two pieces.

    However, if Caylee WAS on her back
    1) KC was likely sitting on her, holding her face with her left hand, and wrapping with her right.

    Piece of cake!

    One question is, did she put the tape and the bags in the car in preparation for the kill?
    Age. Fac ut gaudeam


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  13. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Princess Rose View Post
    Within moments of dying a person's mouth gapes open. It's very disturbing and shocking to see someone like this. The duct tape was put on strongly enough to hold Caylee's mandible in place even after decomposition which indicates to me that holding the mandible in place may be the actual reason for the duct tape. I think that the heart shaped sticker actually indicates that Casey was trying to fix this problem. I don't think Casey had ever been around someone who died (all of her grandparents are aparently alive) and I suspect she would be unaware that normally the mandible is closed after death with a headband that goes under the chin and around the top of the head.

    The other part of this is twofold:

    1. The duct tape was put on the front of Caylee's face only - not wrapped around the back of her head.
    That indicates to me that Caylee was probably on her back when the duct tape was applied.
    2. The duct tape was put on in several strips that were layered.
    If Caylee were alive and thrashing about because she couldn't breathe, it would be very difficult to layer the duct tape with additional pieces and place the heart shaped sticker.

    For all these reasons, I believe it was put on immediately following Caylee's death.
    You have got to be kiddin me/us---I didn't even know what a mandible was til I joined W/S. Yet, KC is smart nuff to know what it is and what it does and let's keep mandible safe with her skull? Thats as bad as the flys.

    1. "The duct tape was put on the front of Caylee's face only - not wrapped around the back of her head."

    If Caylee was sittin in the car seat---KC could have taken a piece of tape and holding it with both hand slap that tape over the mouth (hard with force)---baby starts movin around (maybe KC slaps her right her---maybe hard enough to knock her silly) then she reaches for another piece of tape and slaps that one on (maybe at this point KC has wrapped baby in her blanket---bound her and she couldn't move around). Then (as we know there were several---so at least 3---I did hear a romor today that it was 5 pieces---but fersur it was 3) KC slaps that 3rd piece of tape.
    This could also be the way it could have happened if the child was laying on her back with the blanket binding her down.

    I think the tape was placed while she was still breathing and then she breathed no more. I don't think KC would have worried about fixin anythang except when she killed Caylee---then it "fixed" her freedom---well, for awhile anyway. She is still free from having to watch a snot nosed kid.
    GA: "...I mean Im not a stupid guy...
    Det. Hussey: I think youre, I think youre a guy that knows a lot about a lot of things, George.
    (LE interview 8-4-08)


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  15. #38
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    I saw a loved one shortly after death with the slack-jaw, open mouth. It isn't the way I choose to remember him but it is certainly much, much more desirable than with his mouth triple-layered with duct tape!!

    To me, this doesn't sound reasonable. moo
    The heart of the pure can see, but my eyes have never seen the unicorn . . .


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  17. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brini View Post
    Tell it to the FL Supreme Court.

    1) Killers do not tend to be concerned about the open mouth that distresses loving friends and relatives.
    2) If KC was concerned about the open mouth, she would have wrapped the tape vertically, not horizontally.
    3) The tape WAS put on over her face and into her hair, IIRC. Which may have helped hold the tape in place. Which indicates to me she was sitting up on KC's lap, while KC held her with her left arm, and wrapped the tape with her right hand.
    4) All KC would have to get on was one strip. Caylee would not have been able to pull it off. I have a hard time pulling off duct tape, and I am an adult. Then, she could take her time wrapping the other two pieces.

    However, if Caylee WAS on her back
    1) KC was likely sitting on her, holding her face with her left hand, and wrapping with her right.

    Piece of cake!

    One question is, did she put the tape and the bags in the car in preparation for the kill?

    Have you ever tried to put pieces of duct tape on something very tightly with one hand? It's impossible - you have to use both hands - one to hold the first end of the duct tape and the other to wrap and smooth. If you don't believe me, try applying duct tape with one hand to a small pillow and wrap it tightly. Not only that, there is no way to line the duct tape pieces up using one hand. Remember this duct tape was wrapped so tightly that it was still holding the mandible in place after the body was skeletonized. That is super tight. If Caylee were alive when the duct tape was being put on, she would be struggling -also making it impossible for Casey to line the pieces of tape up and get them on tightly.


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  19. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by RR0004 View Post
    I agree totally...so then is the defense going to go for there's NO PROOF that Ms. Anthony was the one who killed her? Personally it would be the lesser of two evils...a) it was an accident and I put the duct tape on AFTER Caylee died...or b) it wasn't me who did it. If I were them, I would stay clear of anything that has to do with the duct tape.
    I don't think they can go for "no proof" that KC killed Caylee.

    The jury would do a floor laugh.

    She's have to start by explaining who took Caylee away from her, and then explain all the OTHER stuff we've cited: 31 days, lies, decomp in car, partying....
    Age. Fac ut gaudeam


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  21. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Princess Rose View Post
    Have you ever tried to put pieces of duct tape on something very tightly with one hand? It's impossible - you have to use both hands - one to hold the first end of the duct tape and the other to wrap and smooth. If you don't believe me, try applying duct tape with one hand to a small pillow and wrap it tightly. Not only that, there is no way to line the duct tape pieces up using one hand. Remember this duct tape was wrapped so tightly that it was still holding the mandible in place after the body was skeletonized. That is super tight. If Caylee were alive when the duct tape was being put on, she would be struggling -also making it impossible for Casey to line the pieces of tape up and get them on tightly.
    Unless Caylee were somehow incapacitated (e.g., drugged) prior to the duct tape being applied.


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  23. #42
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    Wouldn't be such a task to tape a baby's face. I could do it and use both hands. Am sure KC is probably as coordinated as I am. I had to hold one of my kids down to give his meds. Yup---never spilled one drop.

    You lay the child down on the floor (well, I did)---put lil arms to their sides and put a knee on each side---holding arms close to body---then reach for the tape---rip---with index fanger and thumb of each hand, grab ends of tape---hold baby's sweet lil face with the 6 fangers you have free, grab sides of her face (probably about the hair line on the sides)---put tape on mouth and grab the ends of tape with rest of fangers cuz right now you can control and hold her head still and push very hard---making the tape tight.

    Yup---thats the way I see it. Wouldn't be hard at all.
    GA: "...I mean Im not a stupid guy...
    Det. Hussey: I think youre, I think youre a guy that knows a lot about a lot of things, George.
    (LE interview 8-4-08)


    "THE MAN OF THE HOUR"
    4/2/09 Jose B.
    "I'm Sorry??? What Law School did you go to Kathy???"


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  25. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patty G View Post
    Please continue here.

    Guilty 1st Degree Murder - Totally Premeditated

    Guilty 2nd Degree Murder

    Guilty Manslaughter - Not premeditated but during a Rage attack or a snapped moment

    Not Guilty - Complete Accident

    Completely Innocent
    This thread is about is "Casey is guilty" for the above reasons. PLEASE stay on the topic.

    TRY and get in your comments Casey is Guilty of etc., because ......
    :Banane59: Pekingese "Best Of Show" 2012


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  27. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by AZlawyer View Post
    Unless Caylee were somehow incapacitated (e.g., drugged) prior to the duct tape being applied.
    Yes, I agree, that is a possibility. If she were drugged first and then taped that would imply premeditation, IMO.


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  29. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Princess Rose View Post
    Within moments of dying a person's mouth gapes open. It's very disturbing and shocking to see someone like this. The duct tape was put on strongly enough to hold Caylee's mandible in place even after decomposition which indicates to me that holding the mandible in place may be the actual reason for the duct tape. I think that the heart shaped sticker actually indicates that Casey was trying to fix this problem. I don't think Casey had ever been around someone who died (all of her grandparents are aparently alive) and I suspect she would be unaware that normally the mandible is closed after death with a headband that goes under the chin and around the top of the head.

    The other part of this is twofold:

    1. The duct tape was put on the front of Caylee's face only - not wrapped around the back of her head. I agree. If you were going to tape over a mouth and nose that would be the natural way to position the child.
    That indicates to me that Caylee was probably on her back when the duct tape was applied. I think Caylee was on her back, too.
    2. The duct tape was put on in several strips that were layered.
    If Caylee were alive and thrashing about because she couldn't breathe, it would be very difficult to layer the duct tape with additional pieces and place the heart shaped sticker. It wouldn't be hard if KC were sitting on her with an arm under each leg. Read Mama's Bear's post. One of the nurses who posts on WS Caylee threads posted about using the very same technique at her work.

    For all these reasons, I believe it was put on immediately following Caylee's death.
    My responses are in red.

    Lots of young mothers have claimed to have hidden a dead child due to a horrific surprise accident they were afraid to tell anyone about. But, to my knowledge, no parent has ever duct taped up his or her dead child's nose and mouth to close an open mouth or stop fluid leakage.

    Duct tape is pretty commonly used to prevent screams and/or breathing. If taping up open mouths was a natural response to the sight of a dead baby it would be a common defense. Not the case.

    1st degree. KC used more than one strip of tape.


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