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Thread: NY - Mark Seelman, 16, & Douglas Goodwin, 18, Rome, 7 June 1990

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    NY - Mark Seelman, 16, & Douglas Goodwin, 18, Rome, 7 June 1990

    I am going to work on getting Douglas a link in the NMEC database. Douglas was in the company of another missing boy, Mark W. Seelman, when both disappeared after leaving DJ's Bar on June 7, 1990 Martin St, Rome NY. Mark was likely intoxicated, there is little information about Douglas from that evening.

    The boys left the bar in a green vehicle possibly being driven by Douglas. The boys may have been headed to Utica, but were never seen again.

    What makes Douglas' case especially sad is that LE informed me that his family was unwilling to file a missing persons report. The motivation for that is unclear-perhaps they knew where he was or perhaps they did not care. There is no information on what Douglas was last wearing, but here is the information we do know:

    DOB: 01/30/1972
    5'10", Brown hair, brown eyes, no known pictures of him in the file.
    Bio Parents:
    father: James Goodwin
    mother: Terry Goodwin

    last known address: 9598 Main St, Remesen NY
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    I would love it if you people search folks could spend a few minutes on Douglas-strangely enough I located a few people with his name and birthdate in various states, particularly the West Coast. If he is alive, then perhaps he knows where Mark Seelman is.

    Peace!
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    Extensive news article

    http://www.uticaod.com/news/x5930439...ssing-19-years

    20 Sept 09

    Questions are all Jacob Knapp has about his father, Douglas Goodwin, who went missing as a young adult, 19 years ago, in the months before Knapp was born.

    "What was he like?" the 18-year-old asks while sitting on the edge of a bare bed in his room at a West Utica boarding house. "Am I like him?"

    It was mid-August, and Knapp was speaking about life without his father, who disappeared at age 18 along with Remsen teen Mark Seelman. The pair was last seen June 7, 1990, at a bar called DJ's on Martin Street in Rome.

    In June, the O-D spoke with Seelman's family and police for a story published on the anniversary of the day the two males went missing. Subsequently, Goodwin's former girlfriend, who is Knapp's mother, emerged and began to tell the story of raising the missing man's son.

    All these years, Knapp has never seen a photo of his father.

    pics at link

    very, very extensive article at link; interesting comments too
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    NY - Mark Seelman, 16, Remsen, June 1990

    http://www.uticaod.com/news/x5930439...ssing-19-years

    20 Sept 09

    For police, there have been many leads and many dead ends in the cold case of Mark Seelman and Douglas Goodwin, who both went missing June 7, 1990, in Rome.


    They were last seen at a bar called DJ’s, located then on Martin Street in Rome.


    Neither Seelman, then 16, nor Goodwin, then 18, have ever been seen again.


    Because he was a minor, Seelman’s case was treated as that of a missing child, and the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children has helped keep interest in the case alive.


    The most recent lead came in response to an Observer-Dispatch story published in June about the anniversary of the disappearance that focused on the impact of the loss on Seelman’s family.


    Mike Hulihan senior investigator for state police in Marcy, said someone called after reading the story and said they remembered seeing suspicious clothing in a wooded area in Steuben.


    much, much more at link, incl pics, videos and comments...very interesting and unfortunate
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    What a heart tugging story this young man has to tell about his Father.

    Prayers that he is found soon.
    "Three things in human life are important: The first is to be kind; the second is to be kind; and the third is to be kind." ~ Henry James

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    NY - Mark Seelman, 16, & Douglas Goodwin, 18, Rome, 1990

    Hey folks, I've seen this case briefly mentioned here on WS, but it has been somewhat vague. Recently, however, it has been established that both of these individuals disappeared together on the same night at the same bar on June 7, 1990. There is a great article about the case that has been posted recently from a local newspaper, with video as well, that I recommend taking a look at. I'll post that along with their missing persons profiles from the Charley Project. Interested in some of your thoughts.

    http://www.uticaod.com/news/x5930439...ssing-19-years

    http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/...n_douglas.html

    http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/s/seelman_mark.html

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    What about a vehicle. I didn't read any mention about any vehicle they might have been driving that night. What is the story. Did a vehicle "disappear" with them?

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    Were they walking?
    It is 11.2 miles from Rome to Utica, NY.
    It was June.

    Or did they have a car?

    Does anyone know if a search of any kind was done?
    Results?

    The 16 yr old, Mark Seelman, is listed as a runaway on NY missing children's list.
    http://criminaljustice.state.ny.us/missing/alpha4.htm
    Last edited by dreamweaver; 09-27-2009 at 10:49 PM. Reason: add sentence
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    Quote Originally Posted by dreamweaver View Post
    Were they walking?
    It is 11.2 miles from Rome to Utica, NY.
    It was June.

    Or did they have a car?

    Does anyone know if a search of any kind was done?
    Results?

    The 16 yr old, Mark Seelman, is listed as a runaway on NY missing children's list.
    http://criminaljustice.state.ny.us/missing/alpha4.htm
    From what I've read on the story, it seems that the 18 yr. old, Douglas Goodwin, was somewhat of a transient who didn't appear to own a car. The two may have hitched a ride somewhere (the bar mentioned in the case file?). Mark Seelman is listed as a runaway on the NY database, but if you read the story above (see link) from the Utica newspaper the investigator working the case currently does not believe either one of the missing voluntarily. Both Seelman and Goodwin did work together at a farm, which probably explains how they knew each other.

    Before some of this new info on the case has come out and both Goodwin and Seelman apparently disappeared together, it was mentioned on many sites (Charley Project & Doe Network, to name some) that Seelman was seen leaving the bar with a black male in a green car. I wonder if this was ever followed up on?

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    First of all, thank you so much, kevmob77, for the informative article with all the new info. In the interview with Mark's adoptive mom, she says that on the Friday before he was last seen (So this must've been Friday June 1st) He'd said he was going "shopping" and might not be home until the next day. But then she never saw him again. She waited form him Monday, June 4th at the bus stop and when he didn't get off she KNEW something was wrong. However, supposedly he was last seen at DJ's bar the FOLLOWING Thursday June 7th. So where was he this whole week? Partying???? If so then it makes the idea of a runaway a lot more plausible BUT that relies on the assumption that he truly was alive and well on the 7th. How reliable was the sighting at DJ's? I mean, was the witness someone who actually knew Mark/Doug or was it just somebody who thought it looked like them?

    My thoughts: I would not be surprised one bit if Doug ran off never to return from the way the story makes it sound (I.e., his parents wanted nothing to do with him, and he didn't even know that his girlfriend of 1 month was pregnant, and she'd kicked him out anyway.) What reason would he have for staying in the local area? Maybe that Friday, June 1st (when Mark said he was going shopping) was a payday for Mark (and probably Doug too if they worked at the same farm.) So maybe they took the money and just partied for a week winding up at DJs and, if it is true that the two were out partying for nearly a week without contacting home, and were actually at the seedy bar on the 7th, then you never know where they may have gone to continue their fun....
    BUT if that wasn't them at DJs and if they were paid on the 1st and went out with a pocket full of cash and never were seen again, then the most likely thing is they met with foul play.

    Anyway, I hope the former is true and they are found alive and well someday and tell us about their crazy adventures.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PI_Baker View Post
    First of all, thank you so much, kevmob77, for the informative article with all the new info. In the interview with Mark's adoptive mom, she says that on the Friday before he was last seen (So this must've been Friday June 1st) He'd said he was going "shopping" and might not be home until the next day. But then she never saw him again. She waited form him Monday, June 4th at the bus stop and when he didn't get off she KNEW something was wrong. However, supposedly he was last seen at DJ's bar the FOLLOWING Thursday June 7th. So where was he this whole week? Partying???? If so then it makes the idea of a runaway a lot more plausible BUT that relies on the assumption that he truly was alive and well on the 7th. How reliable was the sighting at DJ's? I mean, was the witness someone who actually knew Mark/Doug or was it just somebody who thought it looked like them?

    My thoughts: I would not be surprised one bit if Doug ran off never to return from the way the story makes it sound (I.e., his parents wanted nothing to do with him, and he didn't even know that his girlfriend of 1 month was pregnant, and she'd kicked him out anyway.) What reason would he have for staying in the local area? Maybe that Friday, June 1st (when Mark said he was going shopping) was a payday for Mark (and probably Doug too if they worked at the same farm.) So maybe they took the money and just partied for a week winding up at DJs and, if it is true that the two were out partying for nearly a week without contacting home, and were actually at the seedy bar on the 7th, then you never know where they may have gone to continue their fun....
    BUT if that wasn't them at DJs and if they were paid on the 1st and went out with a pocket full of cash and never were seen again, then the most likely thing is they met with foul play.

    Anyway, I hope the former is true and they are found alive and well someday and tell us about their crazy adventures.
    The problem that I have regarding Douglas Goodwin taking off on his own accord theory is that he was only 18 years old. He hasn't been seen by anyone since 1990. Although it happens, 18 year olds just aren't that sophisticated enough to completely disappear without reappearing at some point, being seen by someone at some point in 19 years, no Social # used, and the fact that Mark Seelman disappeared the same day w/out ever being seen again makes me believe foul play is very likely.

    It was mentioned in some missing persons' websites that Seelman was very intoxicated at the bar. If Goodwin was with him, and also intoxicated, it is very plausible that something happened at the bar. Maybe they were looking to score some drugs possibly and literally got taken for a ride? If they were intoxicated, maybe one or both of them got loud with someone at the bar. It was mentioned in the Utica article that the bar was a seedy place.

    The one thing that I didn't quite understand about that Utica article was that the investigator working the case said there hasn't been any new info in years. Yet, he also said that there were rumors for years, without going into any detail as to what those rumors were? Maybe disclosing those rumors will open up some new leads and get some people to talk that may know what happened. It has been 19 years, and I can't really think of a situation on how that would hinder the investigation at this point.

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    I'm afraid you're right, Kevmob77, the prospects don't look very good for them and the signs of a bad ending are stacked pretty high.

    I was thinking about what might have happened at the bar as well and thinking about the drug-deal-gone-bad scenario, but that missing week before this supposed bar sighting bugs me. I'd like to know if Mark had ever done that before (gone for a week or more without contacting anyone.) Doug's girlfriend seems pretty vague about when she last saw him the weekend of their argument.) Was it that same Friday, June 1st that Mark was last seen or afterwards?

    Everything seems to hinge on that bar sighting on the 7th but we don't know how valid that sighting was. The police and investigator seem to be putting a lot of stock in it but to me it is like those rumors. WHO exactly saw them at that bar on the 7th--someone reliable? And did they for sure see Mark AND Doug together? It had been reported previously about Mark leaving in a green car with a black male, so was there ever even a green car? Because of all these sketchy details about the bar sighting I'm skeptical about it. I'm even suspicious about who said they saw Mark (or Mark and Doug) there in the first place since Mark's family never saw or heard from him again after the 1st. Wouldn't he have at least gone home to grab some cash and those cigarettes?

    Because if someone said they saw them on the 7th, knowing that something had happened to him/them around the 1st, that person might have been trying to throw everyone off by saying they saw them alive and well on the 7th.

    But it is possible that the 'witness' that night is just like those rumors, something that the police are keeping quiet about, though that info might help shed new light on this case.

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    Another Mark Seelman?

    You don't suppose Mark could have run off to Rochester to become Assistant Controller of Micro Instrumental Corp. do you? Ha
    http://www.rochesterworks.org/employ...udy_micro.aspx

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    mark seelman

    The way I see it, there are only really three scenarios regarding his disappearance and both of them lead me to believe that he is no longer alive.

    1. Mark and his companion left the bar intoxicated and the car ran into a lake or river. It will most likely be found under water, similar to the way Eli Vanderpool's body was found in Frankfurt NY. Everyone was thinking he had been abducted, he had died the same night he disappeared and this is the most likely scenario here.

    2. Louis Lent was busy killing kids all over upstate NY and liked young men. Remember when he confessed he said he had other bodies that he did not want found. Both of these men were very vulnerable; they may have met their doom with him. Not as probable as scenario #1

    3. Drug related homicide; both may have been involved in dealing or selling or owed someone money.

    I do not think he ran away; he had a family he loved and the other boy had a child on the way; never unlikely they ran away

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