SF cop versus skateboarder

This is quite the topic of conversation in the Bay Area- personally I think the cop was over the top in this situation - I'd be interested to hear everyone else's thoughts.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/crime/detail?entry_id=48696

I'm surprised officer schwab threatened to break his arm.. and wondering why he didn't threaten to tase him. I thought those tasers cops are toting are the new in thing.

As for him being arrested, for not carrying id? that BS. It is not the law to have your drivers license or something like that on you 24/7. I think the real reason chris was arrested was because the cop had a stick up his *advertiser censored*.

I totally agree buffet. The power seems to have gone to the cop's head. Supposedly he's been reassigned to "desk duty" while they "investigate" the incident. But everyone sure seems to wonder when it became law that we had to carry ID 24/7. That's about all anyone can agree on in this case though!

cinsbythesea said:

This is quite the topic of conversation in the Bay Area- personally I think the cop was over the top in this situation - I'd be interested to hear everyone else's thoughts.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/crime/detail?entry_id=48696

Click to expand...

Is it really against the law to skateboard in the city and county? That's crazy!

It is obvious to me that this officer reacted to the kid's mouthing off---which is a troubling sign to me. If skateboarding is illegal and the cop saw them skateboarding, then the law is on the cop's side--but it appears as if the cop was just going to warn the kids until ZS "disrespected" him. The kid is entitled to his opinion, and although what he said was disrespectful, he was sitting down and not being threatening in any way. The officer is clearly punishing the kid for name-calling, because he initially isn't arresting anyone but Zack.

Even MORE troubling to me is that the officer threatened the kid with breaking his arm. Are cops supposed to threaten people with excessive physical violence? That action on the part of the officer is very clearly over-board, IMO.

Then, just when I thought it couldn't get any worse, suddenly EVERYBODY is being arrested because a concerned citizen tells the cop he shouldn't have "kicked the kid in the ear." (There's gotta be a better way to overcome passive resistance!) It appears he is willing to arrest a guy that says "I'm just walking through the neighborhood, I didn't do anything!"

This cop is, IMO, going to really, really hurt somebody one day. If this is how he reacts to a mouthy teenager, what will he do the NEXT time he doesn't like what he is hearing?

It hasn't been verified yet but there's a commenter in the comment section that insists the cop already has a brutality lawsuit against him. Wouldn't surprise me in the least. Really- I think the cop started all this - the kid was sitting there complying and the cop asks if anyone has excedrin etc and it just goes downhill from there- but it was the cop that really started the war of words. As far as skateboarding in SF - who knows?! There's so may crazy rules there these days that I wouldn't be at all surprised!

cinsbythesea said:

the kid was sitting there complying and the cop asks if anyone has excedrin etc and it just goes downhill from there- but it was the cop that really started the war of words. As far as skateboarding in SF - who knows?! There's so may crazy rules there these days that I wouldn't be at all surprised!

Click to expand...

I thought I heard him mention "pulling up vents". Is that what they call manhole covers there? If they were doing that, and (illegally) skateboarding, then that's pretty dangerous. The kid deserved what he got. It's one thing if he was just walking down the street, and the cop says "give me your id", but he had already been caught doing something , maybe 2 things, illegal. He should have kept his mouth shut. Too many people getting an attitude when they KNOW they're the ones doing something wrong...:banghead:

He didn't appear to be arresting the kid until the kid called him a name- prior to that I think he was going to cite him. Once the kid called him a name - he decided it was now an arrestable event. But yeah- I did read that they had pulled up one of the manhole covers - dumb, dumb, dumb.

From what I gather from watching the video, it's against city ordinance to ride a skate board within the city limits. The kids were also lifting man hole covers or whatever. The police were summoned by a person in the neighborhood.

I don't care what the law is; but if you break it, you should be prepared to pay the consequences. When the officer first came up, he appeared to just be doing the normal procedure, checking and verifying everyone's id. I think that the kids got a little bold because they knew they were video taping and were TRYING to incite something.

I think the guy deserved to be arrested. It's never a good idea, especially when you're in the wrong, or ever, to call an officer a *advertiser censored***** D***. It appears the officer was just going to warn the group, until the name calling started.

Sure the officer shouldn't have threatened to break his arm. However, the kid was being argumentative and the officer was also confronting not just one person. It's incidents like this, that can start off innocently and calmly at first, that can turn into a deadly situation. Plus, the passers-by that stuck their nose in the situation, deserve no pass from me. If they ended up in trouble too, that's too bad.

I've seen other videos of officer involved situations and the policeman acted inappropriately. This isn't one of those times. He was justified and I hope he gets exonerated after the investigation and is allowed to resume his normal duties.

Good grief! If this is all it takes to get a policeman fired or whatever, we'll never be able to retain proper legal assistance when we need it. I can't imagine calling a neighbor to the scene of a hold-up to take care of a perp with a gun.

When a policeman is hired and trained, he's there to do whatever is necessary, within the law, to protect the citizens who give him his paycheck. It's really time we started treating our police officers with some respect.

As for the comments after the article. This is San Francisco, right? :angel:


JMHO
fran

Punk *advertiser censored* kids who don't show any respect don't really deserve any. I can't figure how we expect cops to be above human and never get impatient.

The were gonna cut the kids a break until punk *advertiser censored* mouthed off. That's what he's used to gettting away with and I'm glad the officer arrested him.

The people who pay the property taxes in that community have every right to some peaceful enjoyment of their property and if the city has decided skate boarders are annoying and dangerous, then those little entitled Yoots should respect the laws and the people in the neighborhood.

I am so over disrespectful selfish people. Guess that cop was too. :0

ziggy said:

Punk *advertiser censored* kids who don't show any respect don't really deserve any. I can't figure how we expect cops to be above human and never get impatient.

The were gonna cut the kids a break until punk *advertiser censored* mouthed off. That's what he's used to gettting away with and I'm glad the officer arrested him.

The people who pay the property taxes in that community have every right to some peaceful enjoyment of their property and if the city has decided skate boarders are annoying and dangerous, then those little entitled Yoots should respect the laws and the people in the neighborhood.

I am so over disrespectful selfish people. Guess that cop was too. :0

Click to expand...

I don't expect cops to be above human and to never get impatient. I do expect them to behave PROFESSIONALLY at all times. Kicking a mouthy teen in the ear and threatening to snap his arm like a twig isn't professional behavior, IMO. I think a cop who cannot keep his cool when facing the public is a huge potential danger.

As I said before, the laws seem to be quite definitely on the side of the cop---if it is illegal to skate in the city and county, then the teens were subject to arrest for doing so. It's not the arrest that bothers me; it is the unprofessional behavior of the police officer.

I'm sorry but we expect robot behavior and not human behavior of cops. I get what you mean that they should be professional, but expecting that 100% of the time is just asking for the impossible, in my opinion - I don't know how they do it as well as they do. The amount of disrespect cops have to put up with, the daily decent into human ugliness, their lives in danger literally every second on the job. Hey, it's pretty easy to sit back and expect so much. I couldn't do it. I guess I cut them some slack because of that. Was it really that bad? Did he hurt that nice young man's feelings? That kid gets hurt worse from skateboarding mishaps.

ziggy said:

I'm sorry but we expect robot behavior and not human behavior of cops. I get what you mean that they should be professional, but expecting that 100% of the time is just asking for the impossible, in my opinion - I don't know how they do it as well as they do. The amount of disrespect cops have to put up with, the daily decent into human ugliness, their lives in danger literally every second on the job. Hey, it's pretty easy to sit back and expect so much. I couldn't do it. I guess I cut them some slack because of that. Was it really that bad? Did he hurt that nice young man's feelings? That kid gets hurt worse from skateboarding mishaps.

Click to expand...

I don't know if he hurt the kid's feelings, Ziggy. I do know his behavior attracted the attention of passers-by who were concerned enough about him kicking the kid in the ear to ask the officer to identify himself. Was it that bad to kick a kid in the ear? I think so. The kid probably does get hurt skateboarding, I know my kids all took spills. But hurting oneself is not the same as being hurt by someone else, is it?

Cops are not robots, true. Their lives are in danger, true. But when a cop threatens to snap someone's arm and then becomes physically violent, there is a problem far more serious than a mouthy, unarmed, passively resisting teenager. Cops CAN have human reactions to disrespect, etc. They can say they'll taze you if you don't cooperate, they can say they'll arrest you if you don't cooperate---But they should NEVER react with threats and violence. If he can't handle himself without making threats and kicking people around, law enforcement is probably not the job for him.

it's the police officer's job to not get pissed off when he gets called names, because people ARE going to call you names in this line of work. he gave the skaters EXACTLY what they wanted and now he's the one who looks like a jerk. i have been around skaters my whole life and they and the police both revel in the push-push back. i've seen skaters totally antagonize cops and i've seen cops totally antagonize skaters. "i'll break your arm like a twig"? really? that's just ridiculous. it's exactly why i would never be able to be a police officer, because lowly citizen me would say some crap like that. i have great respect for police, but not for little boys who can't get over schoolyard crap-talk without showing who's the AUTHORI-TIE! as cartman would say. he didn't arrest him for breaking the skateboarding laws (because he didn't arrest anyone else), he arrested him because he called him a name and that's wrong. If a Harvard Prof. can do it, so can this young man. doesn't make it nice, but it doesn't warrant a trip to the pokey and a waste of taxpayer money to just have the charges dropped immediately in the morning. IMO

i did love the part where the citizen said "yeah, that's what i used to tell my mom when i kicked my little brother", that was pretty funny.

There must be a law someplace that says that when a kid gets a skateboard he automatically becomes a mouthy, profane arrogant little punk.No offense intended as I am sure there are many skateboarders who don't fit that sterotype but most of the ones that live in my area do.
Having said that I think this cop overreacted. In his place I don't know what I'd have done; that's why I never wanted to be a cop.

If the kid was skateboarding and pulling up city property and, as the cop said the original complaint was, vandalizing cars, he should have been punished. It sounds like the cop was citing them and the kid called him a name, which pushed the cop's buttons, so he arrested the kid. If skateboarding is illegal, and I'm certainly sure pulling up vents and vandalizing cars is illegal, then the kid was a *advertiser censored*** d****, not the cop.

In a city the size of SF, surely there are safe, legal places to go to skateboard. I think the kid was in the wrong.

Would any of this have happened if the boy would have been respectful toward the officer? When the officer arrived, the kids could have easily stood up, respectfully faced the officer and listened to what he had to say, scooped up their skateboards and walked away and could have even said, "Thank you, officer sir."

I can promise that if any of my guys call an officer "dude" and the other vulgar name, that this boy did, I would back the officer 100%. The bystander who said "you've got a gun" to the officer, I would like to ask, "WTH is he supposed to have? An Etch-a-Sketch?" :banghead:

I think they were both in the wrong. The boy, should have been taught better respect and manners, and if i were his mother, i would be extremely dissappointed and ashamed by his attitude toward the police officer. On the other hand, if it was my son, and the officer threatened him with bodily harm and then kicked him, I would be extremely angry and concerned for not only the safety of my son, but also that of the community. The officer should be able to let the sarcastic smartmouth comments of the boy roll off without getting so worked up about it. That has nothing to do with being an officer, it has to do with 1) being the adult and 2) being the bigger person and maintaining. If he is so easily upset by the passive comments of this teenage boy then how would he react to the resistant comments of a drunken or drugged person? The issue of the illegality of the skating could and should have been dealt with by issuing a citation or arrest being made without the threat of violence ever coming into it. MOO

Snick1946 said:

There must be a law someplace that says that when a kid gets a skateboard he automatically becomes a mouthy, profane arrogant little punk.No offense intended as I am sure there are many skateboarders who don't fit that sterotype but most of the ones that live in my area do.
Having said that I think this cop overreacted. In his place I don't know what I'd have done; that's why I never wanted to be a cop.

Click to expand...

LOL, it is hard to tell! Most teenagers go through that mouthy spell, don't they? Most of them are respectful enough of the authorities in their lives to never call a police officer vulgar names! I do think that skaters have a certain mind-set of "them against us." They love to skate, and cities are cracking down with tough laws disallowing them to do so. So the kids start really feeling unfairly persecuted and anti-establishment. It's a culture, just like emo and prep and every other direction teens can take.

magnolia mom said:

I think they were both in the wrong. The boy, should have been taught better respect and manners, and if i were his mother, i would be extremely dissappointed and ashamed by his attitude toward the police officer. On the other hand, if it was my son, and the officer threatened him with bodily harm and then kicked him, I would be extremely angry and concerned for not only the safety of my son, but also that of the community. The officer should be able to let the sarcastic smartmouth comments of the boy roll off without getting so worked up about it. That has nothing to do with being an officer, it has to do with 1) being the adult and 2) being the bigger person and maintaining. If he is so easily upset by the passive comments of this teenage boy then how would he react to the resistant comments of a drunken or drugged person? The issue of the illegality of the skating could and should have been dealt with by issuing a citation or arrest being made without the threat of violence ever coming into it. MOO

Click to expand...

You are so right about both of them being wrong. It does appear that the city and county have indeed outlawed skateboarding, so the teens were wrong to be doing that----and vandalism is NEVER ok. The officer is guilty of making threats of bodily harm and even inflicting bodily harm by kicking the kid.

I especially agree that this situation would have been better dealt with if the officer had cited or arrested the teens without resorting to threats and violence.

ziggy said:

Punk *advertiser censored* kids who don't show any respect don't really deserve any. I can't figure how we expect cops to be above human and never get impatient.

The were gonna cut the kids a break until punk *advertiser censored* mouthed off. That's what he's used to gettting away with and I'm glad the officer arrested him.

The people who pay the property taxes in that community have every right to some peaceful enjoyment of their property and if the city has decided skate boarders are annoying and dangerous, then those little entitled Yoots should respect the laws and the people in the neighborhood.

I am so over disrespectful selfish people. Guess that cop was too. :0

Click to expand...

THANK YOU. Cops are human beings, and what they have to "turn the other cheek" on is beyond most everyone's ability. I'm glad he took the punk to task and SAYING he's gonna break his arm and actually breaking it are worlds apart.

I agree with Ziggy, too. I would rather the cop take the kid to jail than have a bunch of law-breaking youth running around my neighborhood. His threat to break the boy's arm was a threat. Maybe it was said to make sure the boy understood that fighting/resisting was not the wisest option. The "kick" was not shown on video. But the person who accused him of kicking the boy also seemed to think the cop was threatening people with a gun, so she wasn't the most reliable witness. I say, kudos to the cop for taking that kid off the street and teaching him a lesson.