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  1. #1
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    Dead Folks and Decomp *WARNING: GRAPHIC PHOTOS IN OPENING POST*#2

    Warning, Pictures included! Not for the faint of heart!

    I wanted to start this thread because several people had asked me about it. My power has been off for 4 days, just got a generator, so if this needs to be moved? Mods feel free to do so. We can use this as a reference thread when discussing the case.

    Dead Folks and Decay



    Bodies do not always decompose uniformly or in the same way. A corpse might be partially skeletonized, partially mummified, and partially converted to adipocere. Adipocere looks like this:

    This photo is of two child victims in the famous Hoptoun Quarry Murders Case investigated by Sir Sydney Alfred Smith. Read the full story HERE.



    http://writersforensicsblog.wordpres...y/#comment-534
    Last edited by Kimster; 12-22-2009 at 04:07 PM. Reason: added graphic photo warning to title
    Media thread for Abby and Libby.


    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...5#post13163455

    WebSleuths Lingo thread.

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...bsleuths-Lingo

    Unless I provide a link, every one of my posts are to be considered rumor, Speculation, or simply MY OWN OPINION.

    We are the watchers. We are witnesses. We see what has gone before. We see what happens now, at this dangerous moment in human history. We see what's going to happen - what will surely happen - unless we come together: we - the Peoples of all Nations - to restore peace and harmony and balance to the Earth, our Mother.


    THE IGNORE BUTTON IS YOUR FRIEND!

  2. #2
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    You might want to add a warning to the thread title, I was not expecting that photo of the dead children.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by QB. View Post
    You might want to add a warning to the thread title, I was not expecting that photo of the dead children.
    Done and thank you.
    Media thread for Abby and Libby.


    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...5#post13163455

    WebSleuths Lingo thread.

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...bsleuths-Lingo

    Unless I provide a link, every one of my posts are to be considered rumor, Speculation, or simply MY OWN OPINION.

    We are the watchers. We are witnesses. We see what has gone before. We see what happens now, at this dangerous moment in human history. We see what's going to happen - what will surely happen - unless we come together: we - the Peoples of all Nations - to restore peace and harmony and balance to the Earth, our Mother.


    THE IGNORE BUTTON IS YOUR FRIEND!

  4. #4
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    I'm a tad squeemish, and its Christmas.
    But interesting post.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by QB. View Post
    I'm a tad squeemish, and its Christmas.
    But interesting post.
    Nauseated me when I first read it too.
    Media thread for Abby and Libby.


    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...5#post13163455

    WebSleuths Lingo thread.

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...bsleuths-Lingo

    Unless I provide a link, every one of my posts are to be considered rumor, Speculation, or simply MY OWN OPINION.

    We are the watchers. We are witnesses. We see what has gone before. We see what happens now, at this dangerous moment in human history. We see what's going to happen - what will surely happen - unless we come together: we - the Peoples of all Nations - to restore peace and harmony and balance to the Earth, our Mother.


    THE IGNORE BUTTON IS YOUR FRIEND!

  6. #6
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    Thank you Tulessa for this very interesting and informative information. It may be considered "gruesome" or even "over the top" to some people but when we are considering the ins and outs of murder it is part and parcel of the sleuthing process. I was not aware that a single body could degrade in 3 different methods. And to realize that a "skeletonized" body would not look like the typical skeleton from our school lab days was interesting. I think there is definitely a place for this kind of information in such a forum as Websleuths so long as there is sufficient "warnings" for those faint of heart.

  7. #7
    A question from the site: Could bacon grease wiped onto a napkin be mistaken for adipocere?

    Answer:
    D.P. Lyle, MD said, on October 3, 2009 at 6:07 am
    Visually they might appear similar but the lab would have no trouble distinguishing one from the other.

  8. #8
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    Smile

    Hi, J...thanks for info...didn't read the article, but it is EXACTLY true to differentiate the two....even if from grease wiped from a broiler pan from steaks, etc. When food is cooked, a variety of chemical reactions occur between the fat, protein and carbohydrates in the meat....won't bore you with details...but, a whole bunch of additional totally different chemicals would have been found on the paper towels. An example is IF, not that you'd WANT to do it, you chew on raw bacon or a steak or chicken, there's not too much flavor at all. All the flavors occur during cooking and a good amount leach out into the fat left over...basically why bacon fat from the pan is saved for GREAT flavor as opposed to using just plain lard.

    PS...many of these same rxns occur during toasting of bread...that's why toast tastes diff from just plain bread....and turns brown...sorry for O/T

    ETA : If you want to know about the molecules flying and chemical bonds breaking and forming and getting rid of H2O, etc....best to go see the resident Chemistry wiz, DogMom2JoeAndWillie...LOL
    Last edited by MyTinkieGirl; 12-22-2009 at 01:10 PM.

  9. #9
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    Even though this subject and the pictures are gruesome, I do want to know what stage Caylee's body was in say one day after her death, and then 3 days, 7 days, etc. I want to know how KC last saw her child. moo
    Rest in Peace Sweet Caylee

  10. #10
    Lexiintoronto's Avatar
    Lexiintoronto is online now Behind every successful man is a woman rolling her eyes.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tulessa View Post
    Warning, Pictures included! Not for the faint of heart!

    I wanted to start this thread because several people had asked me about it. My power has been off for 4 days, just got a generator, so if this needs to be moved? Mods feel free to do so. We can use this as a reference thread when discussing the case.

    Dead Folks and Decay

    [B]

    Bodies do not always decompose uniformly or in the same way. A corpse might be partially skeletonized, partially mummified, and partially converted to adipocere. Adipocere looks like this:
    <snipped> ...your power has been off for 4 days...you bring up the subject of the rate of body decomposition...

    WHAT EXACTLY IS IN YOUR FREEZER!!!




    (kidding...kidding)


  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lexiintoronto View Post
    <snipped> ...your power has been off for 4 days...you bring up the subject of the rate of body decomposition...

    WHAT EXACTLY IS IN YOUR FREEZER!!!




    (kidding...kidding)
    My freezer is fine lol. We have a Generator but only hooked it up to my pc today.
    Media thread for Abby and Libby.


    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...5#post13163455

    WebSleuths Lingo thread.

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...bsleuths-Lingo

    Unless I provide a link, every one of my posts are to be considered rumor, Speculation, or simply MY OWN OPINION.

    We are the watchers. We are witnesses. We see what has gone before. We see what happens now, at this dangerous moment in human history. We see what's going to happen - what will surely happen - unless we come together: we - the Peoples of all Nations - to restore peace and harmony and balance to the Earth, our Mother.


    THE IGNORE BUTTON IS YOUR FRIEND!

  12. #12
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    I noticed that some of the posters have no idea how fast a small child's body would decompose in the Florida heat. Some thinking KC carried Caylee around for 10 days or more. This is very important information when you have to consider all when the body was placed and whether or not the body had ever been moved.

    If the body was in the trunk for 2.6 days, what stages of decomp would the body have gone through? It is possible the body was left in the trunk for 2 days because it was in a state of rigor which made it difficult for her to remove.

    This will be covered in court I would imagine.
    Last edited by LambChop; 12-22-2009 at 01:29 PM.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jolynna View Post
    A question from the site: Could bacon grease wiped onto a napkin be mistaken for adipocere?

    Answer:
    D.P. Lyle, MD said, on October 3, 2009 at 6:07 am
    Visually they might appear similar but the lab would have no trouble distinguishing one from the other.
    So the same for any of those little fatty peices that fall out of salami-While the fatty acid make-up in salami and adipoce is similar, there are, I am sure, big differences microscopically and chemically. Someone in another thread pointed this out to me, makes sense that there are similarities but big differences.
    Oranges and lemons both have citric acid, but they are not the same and can probably be seperated on the cellular and chemical level.

  14. #14
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    Another of my favs....Warning...some decomposed body pics

    http://schools.fwps.org/tj/decker/decomp/110108.pdf

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just Jayla View Post
    So the same for any of those little fatty peices that fall out of salami-While the fatty acid make-up in salami and adipoce is similar, there are, I am sure, big differences microscopically and chemically. Someone in another thread pointed this out to me, makes sense that there are similarities but big differences.
    Oranges and lemons both have citric acid, but they are not the same and can probably be seperated on the cellular and chemical level.
    Hi, again....I read the blog questions/answers...I was taking the "bacon grease" on the paper towels question to mean like the grease wiped out of the frying pan AFTER cooking...that's what my reply was addressing....not just the actual "grease" meaning the fat BEFORE cooking....if thats what the poster was questioning in the blog....again, as the Dr. mentioned, even before cooking, the "grease" is composed of more than the linoleic/linolenic/butyric, which, IIRC, that was what was ID'd on the towels (plus the cannabis, etc)....reg "bacon fat" (lard) is mostly palmitic, stearic, oleic, not much linoleic.....although NO butyric, which smells like sour puke, would be present.
    Last edited by MyTinkieGirl; 12-22-2009 at 06:18 PM.

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