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The Killing Season - Websleuths

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View Poll Results: Did Elizabeth kill Gabriel?

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  • yes

    80 44.20%
  • no

    101 55.80%

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  1. #1
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    Theories: Why Would Elizabeth kill Gabriel?

    Elizabeth told Logan that she killed Gabriel, and put his "dead, blue body" in a dumpster.

    Given her violent temper, could she have been telling the truth?
    Last edited by BeanE; 04-15-2010 at 08:43 AM. Reason: Change title to not be misleading
    .... ....... My posts are my opinion, only.

  2. #2
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    Unfortunately she has shown Logan that she is capable of something like this.

  3. #3
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    I believe she is capable of this, but I am holding out hope she didn't. For some reason, I just have a strong feeling he is alive and well hidden. If so, I think she probably told LM that just to spite him.
    100 years from now, it won't matter what kind of car you drove or how big your house was. What will matter is that you were important in the eyes of a child.


  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by YellowSubmarine View Post
    I believe she is capable of this, but I am holding out hope she didn't. For some reason, I just have a strong feeling he is alive and well hidden. If so, I think she probably told LM that just to spite him.
    Exactly my thoughts too. Though I think she is definitely capable of killing him, I really think he's still alive somewhere, with someone. I just hope he gets returned to his daddy soon.

  5. #5
    I've been following this case from the second that it broke on the news. Elizabeth killing Gabriel would be the very last option on my list of things that I think might have actually happened. Everything, including her confessing to killing him, points me in another direction.

    I think Gabriel is alive, hidden, and I think key players in the case know exactly where he is.

  6. #6
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    Does anyone feel it is possible that Gabriel died from an accidental overdose- from Elizabeth being negligent, and giving him too much medicine?

    From there, she may have panicked, and disposed of his body.

    After that is when she would have contacted Logan to tell him she killed the baby.
    Last edited by smart blonde; 01-26-2010 at 06:09 PM. Reason: correct typo
    .... ....... My posts are my opinion, only.

  7. #7
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    I hate to type this, I really do, but I think she is capable of murder.
    When EJ trashed the apartment and cut up the clothes, the one thing I never saw mentioned was any injury to herself, I'm sure we would have heard about blood or the need for stitches if there was any.
    She was not in blind rage, she was in a calculated rage. That, IMO, is the kind of person capable of planned murder. A person in a blind rage, cutting up a hard to cut item like clothing, even with scissors is bound to be slicing and end up cutting themselves. A person in a calculated rage will be careful to keep themselves safe, and do the maximum damage.

    On the other side, my personal belief is that she did not kill him. She would not have confessed if she had, IMO. She would have just kept running and that text would never have been sent. I believe that was diversion, plain and simple.
    She's smart enough to know that prosecuting without a body is hard and even harder in waters as muddy as these have become.

    ETA: If she did kill him it is my belief that it was an accident of some sort, and she sent the text to Logan in a half out of her mind state. I don't imagine her being rational if she drugged him and he died. I don't believe she liked Gabe, but when faced with your own deceased child, there would have to be some reaction even if it's only panic.
    Last edited by not_my_kids; 01-26-2010 at 03:16 PM.
    JMO. Unless there's a link, I can't prove it.

  8. #8
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    At first I thought everything pointing to Gabriel being murdered. Now I am more optimistic that he is alive. TPS and her antics have me going in this direction. I truly believe she is the key. I think JS is an unwitting pawn and he is blindly following her direction.

  9. #9
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    Kimberlyd125 is offline Softball is for everyone. Fast pitch is for athletes.
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    Quote Originally Posted by A_Closer_Look View Post
    I've been following this case from the second that it broke on the news. Elizabeth killing Gabriel would be the very last option on my list of things that I think might have actually happened. Everything, including her confessing to killing him, points me in another direction.

    I think Gabriel is alive, hidden, and I think key players in the case know exactly where he is.
    My thoughts exactly!!

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  10. #10
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    I just don't see her sitting in jail, not even helping with a composite sketch, etc., if he is still alive. I really don't.

    She must realize that helping to produce a living Gabriel would greatly reduce her potential sentences.

    Her silence, in my opinion, lends itself to Gabriel being deceased.
    .... ....... My posts are my opinion, only.


  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by A_Closer_Look View Post
    I've been following this case from the second that it broke on the news. Elizabeth killing Gabriel would be the very last option on my list of things that I think might have actually happened. Everything, including her confessing to killing him, points me in another direction.

    I think Gabriel is alive, hidden, and I think key players in the case know exactly where he is.
    ITA. I think TS knows exactly where he is!!

  12. #12
    I have gone back and forth on this one. But the accidental/false tweet yesterday and the new phone call from EJ to TPS have given me new hope. If Gabe is alive, I don't believe there is a mystery couple. He is being well hidden - for Tammi. (Of course, MOO.)

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by not_my_kids View Post
    I hate to type this, I really do, but I think she is capable of murder.
    When EJ trashed the apartment and cut up the clothes, the one thing I never saw mentioned was any injury to herself, I'm sure we would have heard about blood or the need for stitches if there was any.
    She was not in blind rage, she was in a calculated rage. That, IMO, is the kind of person capable of planned murder. A person in a blind rage, cutting up a hard to cut item like clothing, even with scissors is bound to be slicing and end up cutting themselves. A person in a calculated rage will be careful to keep themselves safe, and do the maximum damage.

    On the other side, my personal belief is that she did not kill him. She would not have confessed if she had, IMO. She would have just kept running and that text would never have been sent. I believe that was diversion, plain and simple. She's smart enough to know that prosecuting without a body is hard and even harder in waters as muddy as these have become.

    ETA: If she did kill him it is my belief that it was an accident of some sort, and she sent the text to Logan in a half out of her mind state. I don't imagine her being rational if she drugged him and he died. I don't believe she liked Gabe, but when faced with your own deceased child, there would have to be some reaction even if it's only panic.
    Really really good points about the difference in blind rage and calculated rage. I would loooove to agree with you on her having at least some reaction to a just deceased child, but with an extreme lack of empathy and no other human around to show her how to "mimic" appropriate emotions, she just might have felt overwhelming relief that "it was all over".

    I also think it possible that with her new id and leaving the car behind, that she would never be found the rest of her life. Many do disappear down that rabbit hole to never be found again, sadly.

    True story again: a nice man in his 60's moved into a tiny town nestled deep in the Ozark mountains about 20 years ago. Such a gentlemanly person, helpful to neighbors, the kinda guy you'd want your grandkids to know. Married and had a nice long run of it. This year he was arrested for murdering his wife 20 years ago just before he ran with new id and created a new life for himself. It just took awhile for authorities to track him down. People around there are still reeling from the shock. No one thought him capable of such a thing in a million years.

    So, although I'm not totally convinced of it, I do think it possible that EJ thought she had free license to torture Logan like that right before she disappeared into a whole new life.

    Biggest fact that leads me AWAY from that theory is that I don't think she would then tell him where the body was after she was out of the country if she had really killed him. Maybe Logan asked her what dumpster and where and she was caught short without an answer because there really WAS no dumpster. Logan has surely seen her through these temper tantrums many times and can probably tell when she's been caught in a lie (I know someone quite well like that and I know their "tells" when they lie). That might be why he feels that she didn't kill Gabe, even though he knows she's capable of it.

  14. #14
    Very sadly, I think, based on all the information we have, that it is highly likely that Elizabeth harmed Gabriel.

    All information we have, to me, points to Elizabeth acting on her own, alone, in SA, in a situation in which she was enraged and felt desperate. There looks to have been a change in plans from giving Gabe to Tammi. This left her with an extremely short timeframe to find someone to give Gabriel to. I think the likelihood of her being able to find someone to give him to is very small.

    Given all that, the apparent pressure applied to her to return to AZ on Dec 26, her statements to Logan on Dec 27, her refusal to speak on the phone to Tammi on Dec 27, and her refusal to help LE find Gabriel, it just seems that her having harmed is what is most likely.

    I pray it isn't so. I pray that she found someone to give him to with whom he is safe and well.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by not_my_kids View Post
    I hate to type this, I really do, but I think she is capable of murder.
    When EJ trashed the apartment and cut up the clothes, the one thing I never saw mentioned was any injury to herself, I'm sure we would have heard about blood or the need for stitches if there was any.
    She was not in blind rage, she was in a calculated rage. That, IMO, is the kind of person capable of planned murder. A person in a blind rage, cutting up a hard to cut item like clothing, even with scissors is bound to be slicing and end up cutting themselves. A person in a calculated rage will be careful to keep themselves safe, and do the maximum damage.

    On the other side, my personal belief is that she did not kill him. She would not have confessed if she had, IMO. She would have just kept running and that text would never have been sent. I believe that was diversion, plain and simple. She's smart enough to know that prosecuting without a body is hard and even harder in waters as muddy as these have become.

    ETA: If she did kill him it is my belief that it was an accident of some sort, and she sent the text to Logan in a half out of her mind state. I don't imagine her being rational if she drugged him and he died. I don't believe she liked Gabe, but when faced with your own deceased child, there would have to be some reaction even if it's only panic.
    I'm gonna contradict myself after reading your post again (yes, your posts are always worthy of second readings and more thought )

    It is sooo true that if authorities had bought immediately into a deceased Gabriel, they would have been focused right there in San Antonio. If she used this as a diversion (more plotting ala Smith-style) then Gabriel was either sent far far away from San Antonio, or they thought peeps would be so busy looking for a body that they wouldn't look in the surrounding area for a live Gabriel.

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