OH - Pike County: 8 people from one family dead as police hunt for killer(s) - #30

Betty P said:

The other theory we've discussed is that the local individuals who were involved in illegal drug activities and angry over custody issues called on some pros from outside the area to take them out. It's possible the locals who were angry and felt threatened by the Rhodens were connected to some larger organized crime group.

I think some overestimate the number of local people who were angry with the Rhoden family. There were a few, but not a huge mob. Every time I hear that theory, I visualize an angry mob of locals with pitchforks,guns and torches swarming down Union Hill and laying waste the entire family. It's an unrealistic scenario to think an inexperienced mob who were angry about inheriting a few acres of undeveloped land or lost a derby race or got in a fistfight over something someone said on Facebook could commit such a heinous crime and leave no evidence, keep quiet, etc.

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I don't think there's a huge number of locals who wanted the R family dead, but at the mention of an inexperienced mob, not to be speaking ill of the dead, but it is known that's how the Rs were known for fighting with others. Inexperienced mobs can be dangerous. j.s.

I don't think that a large mob of people hated the Rs, nor went there after an evening after drinkin' a few, and decided to off the Rs on the spur of the moment, but it only takes one, fairly intelligent, very angry, person to do a lot of damage, and add one, or maybe two, more folks onto that, and I could very well see someone from the area doing this, over retribution, greed, hate, etc... WS is full of people who have killed their relatives over some pretty bizarre reasons.

IF the killers were not from the area, came in from out of town to do the deed, then I believe most definitely a familial connection fed them intimate information regarding the R's daily lives. Somebody sold them out for a price. Could the lives of the children have been that price? Is there a Judas among the families? They drew maps of the insides of the trailers, they knew which trailer to hit first (if only 1 or 2 shooters) and they had to be in communication with the killers that night/morning. JMO.

Seems unlikely that the R's were doing the actual trafficking of the MJ based on the numerous stops by LE. We don't even know if the MJ had recently been harvested to be trafficked. Sounds like they were starting a new grow with the plants found at KR's trailer. Based on what I have read, the MJ grows were a huge shock to the local community. The R's knew how to keep a secret and so did the people who were trafficking it. I believe the M's know how to keep quiet too. Well quiet until this happened that is. JM has been extremely uncooperative. And I don't blame him because I believe he knows the answers. Loose lips sink ships. Or will get your entire family murdered in the dead of the night.

rsd1200 said:

I don't think there's a huge number of locals who wanted the R family dead, but at the mention of an inexperienced mob, not to be speaking ill of the dead, but it is known that's how the Rs were known for fighting with others. Inexperienced mobs can be dangerous. j.s.

I don't think that a large mob of people hated the Rs, nor went there after an evening after drinkin' a few, and decided to off the Rs on the spur of the moment, but it only takes one, fairly intelligent, very angry, person to do a lot of damage, and add one, or maybe two, more folks onto that, and I could very well see someone from the area doing this, over retribution, greed, hate, etc... WS is full of people who have killed their relatives over some pretty bizarre reasons.

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Yes, there are plenty of cases of people getting angry and killing relatives, but usually not 8 at one time in 4 different homes. And they're usually caught by making enough mistakes or having a mental meltdown. But we've had that discussion before, I know. :truce:

plumloco said:

Has anybody checked AW facebook lately?

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No...why?

Betty P said:

Yes, there are plenty of cases of people getting angry and killing relatives, but usually not 8 at one time in 4 different homes. And they're usually caught by making enough mistakes or having a mental meltdown. But we've had that discussion before, I know. :truce:

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I know, and I know that at least two or ten of us will likely have it again, before this is solved... Same as everything else in this case. We've hashed it out over and over, and I'm not trying to be cantankerous, but this is where I come to try and think this through.:gaah: I wish there was something new. I don't believe you're theory couldn't happen. I honestly believe nearly anyone's theory could have happened, (my top three included), outside of men from mars, that could have gotten eight people murdered. I am not going to share much personal stuff, but, I will say, that if the Rs were dealing, someone in LE knew. They either weren't big enough fish to fry, weren't selling hard stuff, or had connections. In a town/county, the size of Piketon, someone in LE would have known.

Bootsctr said:

IF the killers were not from the area, came in from out of town to do the deed, then I believe most definitely a familial connection fed them intimate information regarding the R's daily lives. Somebody sold them out for a price. Could the lives of the children have been that price? Is there a Judas among the families? They drew maps of the insides of the trailers, they knew which trailer to hit first (if only 1 or 2 shooters) and they had to be in communication with the killers that night/morning. JMO.

Seems unlikely that the R's were doing the actual trafficking of the MJ based on the numerous stops by LE. We don't even know if the MJ had recently been harvested to be trafficked. Sounds like they were starting a new grow with the plants found at KR's trailer. Based on what I have read, the MJ grows were a huge shock to the local community. The R's knew how to keep a secret and so did the people who were trafficking it. I believe the M's know how to keep quiet too. Well quiet until this happened that is. JM has been extremely uncooperative. And I don't blame him because I believe he knows the answers. Loose lips sink ships. Or will get your entire family murdered in the dead of the night.

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The one home that I think they'd have possibly needed some type of a more detailed layout info would have been DR's. DR's had just been purchased, it also had an addition, and a basement. Iirc, it was not a typical trailer.

In April, I agree, if they were prepping the plants to be moved outdoors.

I don't think I've ever heard JM speak except at his hearing.

rsd1200 said:

I know, and I know that at least two or ten of us will likely have it again, before this is solved... Same as everything else in this case. We've hashed it out over and over, and I'm not trying to be cantankerous, but this is where I come to try and think this through.:gaah: I wish there was something new. I don't believe you're theory couldn't happen. I honestly believe nearly anyone's theory could have happened, (my top three included), outside of men from mars, that could have gotten eight people murdered. I am not going to share much personal stuff, but, I will say, that if the Rs were dealing, someone in LE knew. They either weren't big enough fish to fry, weren't selling hard stuff, or had connections. In a town/county, the size of Piketon, someone in LE would have known.

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I agree, I never believed Reader's statement that he didn't know anything about the family before the murders. Perhaps that's an indication they were working as informants for LE. They probably have other locals working as informants, too, hence the reason to keep details of the investigation secret. Did they also have DEA agents working the area? They should have, but that's no guarantee.

If CRSr was working as an informant and they left him to keep growing and selling weed, who were they trying to trap? If the W family was involved in a major enterprise, were they (and their associates) the targets of the investigation? Could the W family have gotten wind of it and called in some outside help?

This is always where it gets tricky - trying to make the custody fight and drug dealing scenarios fit.

Gunslinging Granny said:

Don't let your dogs out at rest areas along highways. There are used syringes thrown everywhere. My tiny dog almost stepped on a used syringe (with needle) today in the grassy pet area. :maddening:

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How horrible! Glad your precious baby is ok. What is wrong with people?

Betty P said:

I agree, I never believed Reader's statement that he didn't know anything about the family before the murders. Perhaps that's an indication they were working as informants for LE. They probably have other locals working as informants, too, hence the reason to keep details of the investigation secret. Did they also have DEA agents working the area? They should have, but that's no guarantee.

If CRSr was working as an informant and they left him to keep growing and selling weed, who were they trying to trap? If the W family was involved in a major enterprise, were they (and their associates) the targets of the investigation? Could the W family have gotten wind of it and called in some outside help?

This is always where it gets tricky - trying to make the custody fight and drug dealing scenarios fit.

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On the surface, and on paper, they didn't know the Rs in a criminal capacity. They'd never been charged with anything other than moving violations, and back in their younger days, a couple other things, but never something that legally stated they were growing/selling/using.

The scenario with the Ws could fit with anyone if they were narcing on someone with those connections. Then again, maybe someone knew that the Rs were about to take a fall, and thought that they would bring them down with them, and they couldn't let that happen. Maybe the Rs decided to back out of something they were into with someone else and it didn't end well. If it were Heroin, or meth, that was found, in a large quantity, I'd feel more comfortable with the above scenarios.

They eradicated an entire family branch, except for the babies, who are not being raised by Rs, or Ms, (afawk). It just seems awfully personal to me.

Betty P said:

I agree, I never believed Reader's statement that he didn't know anything about the family before the murders. Perhaps that's an indication they were working as informants for LE. They probably have other locals working as informants, too, hence the reason to keep details of the investigation secret. Did they also have DEA agents working the area? They should have, but that's no guarantee.

If CRSr was working as an informant and they left him to keep growing and selling weed, who were they trying to trap? If the W family was involved in a major enterprise, were they (and their associates) the targets of the investigation? Could the W family have gotten wind of it and called in some outside help?

This is always where it gets tricky - trying to make the custody fight and drug dealing scenarios fit.

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I have always wondered if all the secrecy was because of a huge undercover operation getting exposed if the case were to be solved. If the Rs were informing in exchange for immunity, that would really piss off a competitor. I was sitting here thinking about how many times some of these ideas have been revisited and the song "Circle in the Sand" popped in my head. We're going round and round...
Circle in the sand
Round and round
Rising of the moon as the sun goes down.

Can anyone local or near Piketon verify that the cars/equipment are missing from the impound lot in Waverly? The Pike Co Ohio Sheriff's office has an announcement on their page about an "Impound Auction" on August 19, 2017. If these are​ the Rhoden's vehicles being auctioned, what's going on?

There is a case in the news in the Dayton, Ohio area about a newborn being murdered, burned, then buried behind the house. The mother was 18 or 19 years old. They were not a poor family. Police say it happened because the family couldn't have the social stigma of the daughter having a baby. Not even if she gave it up for adoption. So you never know what the reason may be for murder.

Interesting article from 2013.

KD, a drug dealer who used his pawnshop as a front, testified in a 2010 trial that he bought votes for then-county Sheriff EJ and other candidates in the 1980s and 1990s. That bought him protection, D said, when a prosecutor asked how his involvement in politics related to his drug business. "Well, I knew that as long as I stayed in Clay County that I would never have no problem with none of the local officials," D testified. "I had EJ's word on that, that he would never bother me."

The case has ties to two other cases in the area in which defendants are charged with murder for allegedly killing three people they thought had cooperated with police.

http://www.kentucky.com/news/special-reports/fifty-years-of-night/article44456061.html

amauet1 said:

Can anyone local or near Piketon verify that the cars/equipment are missing from the impound lot in Waverly? The Pike Co Ohio Sheriff's office has an announcement on their page about an "Impound Auction" on August 19, 2017. If these are​ the Rhoden's vehicles being auctioned, what's going on?

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I will run past tomorrow and look. (Tuesday.)
However, the last I looked, its hard to say what belonged to who and so on. I THINK the auction is for other impounded vehicles, not sure. I know sometimes other confiscated vehicles will sell. Wonder if sheriff's office would tell if one called?

In my state, if a crime is committed in a vehicle (transporting dope, etc), the vehicle is impounded until a trial or plea bargain occurs. If the person is found or pleads guilty, the sheriff's office will auction the vehicle after placing notification (including VIN) in the legal section of our local newspaper.

Dudly said:

I have always wondered if all the secrecy was because of a huge undercover operation getting exposed if the case were to be solved. If the Rs were informing in exchange for immunity, that would really piss off a competitor. I was sitting here thinking about how many times some of these ideas have been revisited and the song "Circle in the Sand" popped in my head. We're going round and round...
Circle in the sand
Round and round
Rising of the moon as the sun goes down.

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Huge drug bust < murderers taken off the street

pearl said:

In my state, if a crime is committed in a vehicle (transporting dope, etc), the vehicle is impounded until a trial or plea bargain occurs. If the person is found or pleads guilty, the sheriff's office will auction the vehicle after placing notification (including VIN) in the legal section of our local newspaper.

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They are mishandling that in a lot of states too. Impounding one's vehicle, and property, over something they know is not trafficking is wrong, yet they are doing so.

rsd1200 said:

They are mishandling that in a lot of states too. Impounding one's vehicle, and property, over something they know is not trafficking is wrong, yet they are doing so.

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So many things are wrong in this case. Two things I would like to see in 2018. Kid Rock win a senate seat and someone arrested for this crime. Sigh.

<modsnip>
Back on topic; This is a news story from where a couple friends live. I found it odd that they just closed the case without getting the final "critical" lab results back, and, also that she was found in much the same way as her mother was found. It's been over 18 mos, to get lab results, and they still lack some they refer to as "critical", and this is one daughter, suspected of murder, of her mother. So I guess there could be lab results still sitting out there in the R/G case too. I guess patience is a virtue.

http://www.wkyt.com/content/news/In...nt-yard-of-Lincoln-County-home-364852521.html

http://www.amnews.com/2017/08/04/stanford-murder-suspect-dies-investigation-closed/

I've been looking back through FB profiles and focused on FR's for awhile. I know I'm sounding like a broken record but, in 2010 the car clutter was pretty much non existent,up until around 2014, when they started to show up, and on up until the murders.

In looking back through FR's FB, you can see that he was building his derby cars at an old barn (I'm guessing at 799 LF). There was car clutter there starting around 2012.

The big white barn, and the trailer that FR was living in, didn't show up until between 2012 - 2014 (according to map data and PVA records). I'm seeing it not showing up, on maps, prior to that, at least. (The trailer that FR/HHG (and I suspect, DR, CR, and HMR for a time) were living in, according to PVA records, was/is owned by a cousin to CR1.)

After the big white barn was built, you can go to FR's profile and there is a photo of his car, in front of the big white barn, in Oct, 2014. Before that, in May of 2011, he's got photos of his derby cars in front of the old barn (LF?). In mid 2015, the car clutter on LF is pretty much gone. My point being, I do believe that the white barn was built to work on vehicles. Maybe not solely FR's vehicles, but vehicles nonetheless. Having their own shop, in trying to get into a used car business, would be a necessity. They were selling cars in the price range of under $5k, and FR seemed to be getting into building, and selling, derby cars. His derby passion was one of the main reasons his former relationship didn't work out (youth was also another likely factor). HHG was a stay at home mother, and seemed to enjoy the derbies. That seemed to work for them.

FR's FB shows a young man who may have had a bit of a hot temper at times, but I see no drug problems there at all. In fact, it showed over the years that he was becoming more involved with his children, family oriented, went to school to learn a trade, and worked every day. On the surface he looks like the average young father.

Just pondering.