Four People Murdered in VA College Town #3

[Heroine]

Originally Posted by PAXIMUS

Yea I am west coast so its still early here forgive my ignorance. However, that is all a matter of public record now and the Clerk of the Court will be able to tell anyone who calls what those dates represent. So if anyone is in VA and can call for us in the morning we should be able to determine whats going on here because IF the 13th was the date of ONE OF THE KILLINGS and we have Emma and Mel acting their happy spunkly selves on myspace AFTER that date, then we possibly have a whole new breed of animal on our hands here as to how and why those murders took place...

Possibly, but I still think Sam could have posted those comments. Are there any comments made by Mel after the 13th? I don't remember seeing any. The reason I ask is because Emma's info would have been saved on her computer which enabled Sam to sign into her account.

[Heroine]

Originally Posted by PAXIMUS

Yes see one of my first posts yesterday when I suggested in a fit of rage and jealousy Sam went off on Mel and Emma to show them what real horror was all about and forced them to watch him kill the mother and then later killed them after perhaps further making Emma watch him kill Mel, this was my theory since day one and it makes perfect sense to me.

I had speculated on the same theory as well since day one, maybe not in that exact order but similar. Their last few days could have been torturous, possibly ever since they returned from the concert.

[PAXIMUS]

Originally Posted by AndresEscobar

The date doesn't have to be the exact date of the murders and, in my opinion, is almost certainly wrong in this instance. If Sam isn't talking, and they don't know an exact date, they will put an approximate date. It can always be amended later.

Absolutely, we probably shouldnt read too much in to that date yet.

[AndresEscobar]

Originally Posted by PAXIMUS

(respectfully snipped)

The one problem with this theory is that there are no reported defensive wounds or other signs of struggle by Emma and Mel, IF we had some evidence of ROPE MARKS on the bodies then we could counclude this theory is highly possible, that Emma and Mel were perhaps tied up and forced to watch a real horrorcore rap being played out before their eyes. Sam may have been so angry and felt so betrayed that he felt obligated to show these girls the real thing.

If Emma and Mel were tied up, there would be rope marks and other markings to indicate they were restrained before they were killed.

[PAXIMUS]

Originally Posted by Heroine

I had speculated on the same theory as well since day one, maybe not in that exact order but similar. Their last few days could have been torturous, possibly ever since they returned from the concert.

I concur. Sadly we may never know the truth and Sam might use his silence to strike a deal to get death penalty off the table, he may agree to talk and tell what happened if they give him life instead of death but this is Virginia and I dont think they will play games with him, he will end up on death row.

[PAXIMUS]

Originally Posted by AndresEscobar

If Emma and Mel were tied up, there would be rope marks and other markings to indicate they were restrained before they were killed.

Thats the problem and ALSO if they were tied up and forced to watch a murder on the 13th, the murder being the mom, then there is NO WAY Sam would have let them sign on to myspace and we know they did at least as late as the 15th, unless Herione is right and that was Sam posing as Emma.

IF there was torture or making Mel and Emma watch murders as I suspect it seems further unlikely that Sam would allow them access to their myspace and in Mel's case, a phone to call her mom which all took place after the 13th.


More questions than answers here...

[NativeGirl]

Originally Posted by PAXIMUS

I concur. Sadly we may never know the truth and Sam might use his silence to strike a deal to get death penalty off the table, he may agree to talk and tell what happened if they give him life instead of death but this is Virginia and I dont think they will play games with him, he will end up on death row.

Yup.. He's getting death I bet and I hope so.... I think VA could care less about the facts.. he had shown enough being a smart ass saying Jesus told him to do it and with that evil grin. May God have Mercy on his soul.

[dangrsmind]

Originally Posted by AndresEscobar

If Emma and Mel were tied up, there would be rope marks and other markings to indicate they were restrained before they were killed.

All the reports to date have indicated the girls were killed in their sleep or while defenseless.

[PAXIMUS]

Originally Posted by AndresEscobar

If Emma and Mel were tied up, there would be rope marks and other markings to indicate they were restrained before they were killed.

Thats the problem and ALSO if they were tied up and forced to watch a murder on the 13th, the murder being the mom, then there is NO WAY Sam would have let them sign on to myspace and we know they did at least as late as the 15th, unless Herione is right and that was Sam posing as Emma.


If there was torture or anything going on as far as Sam making the girls watch it seems highly unlikely that he would have allowed them access to phones or computers.

More questions than answers here...

[ziggy]

I just think that in order to get the indictments out and the charges leveled they used the earliest possible date and the evidence gathering phase by LE and the prosecution for trial will bring more clarity as to the possible timeline. Not reading anything into that date.

[Heroine]

Originally Posted by PAXIMUS

Thats the problem and ALSO if they were tied up and forced to watch a murder on the 13th, the murdering being the mom, then there is NO WAY Sam would have let them sign on to myspace and we know they did at least as late as the 15th, unless Herione is right and that was Sam posing as Emma.

IF there was torture or making Mel and Emma watch murders as I suspect it seems further unlikely that Sam would allow them access to their myspace and in Mel's case, a phone to call her mom which all took place after the 13th.


More questions than answers here...

If you think about it though, if he were smart, (which we have no evidence of) then he would have wanted mel to speak with her mom, possibly even forcing her to call her mom so that her mom wasn't suspicious. Just a thought, but still only speculation.

[Heroine]

Originally Posted by ziggy

I just think that in order to get the indictments out and the charges leveled they used the earliest possible date and the evidence gathering phase by LE and the prosecution for trial will bring more clarity as to the possible timeline. Not reading anything into that date.

You could be exactly right. I look at it this way though, at least now we have more to speculate....
It had gone kind of cold to us and somewhat boring, but now there has been a little light shed on the topic again which gives us something to think about.

[Heroine]

Originally Posted by dangrsmind

All the reports to date have indicated the girls were killed in their sleep or while defenseless.

I wouldn't have to be tied up to be scared s**tless after watching someone else die though, but then again how would they have been able to fall asleep?

[PAXIMUS]

Originally Posted by NativeGirl

Yup.. He's getting death I bet and I hope so.... I think VA could care less about the facts.. he had shown enough being a smart ass saying Jesus told him to do it and with that evil grin. May God have Mercy on his soul.

Well I respect and understand your point, as a practicing Buddhist I am against all forms of killing so I cant support the death penalty but to each state their own, if that is what the citizens of VA want then that is what they should get.

[PAXIMUS]

I tried to call the Clerks office but they were closed it seems since all I got was a voice msg, so I put in a call to the local newspaper and was able to get someone on the phone and this person told me that the dates in the indictment do not indicate the date that anyone died and since they still do not know the times of death they are simply using the 13th as a time frame for when the crimes may have started.

[ziggy]

I thought I read a relative of Melanie's or someone explaining when the last time her Mom talked to her, but now in searching the Melanie Wells articles I can't find it, nor on any timeline. Reports say Mel's Mom didn't hear from her when she was supposed to and got suspicious, other than that, nada.

Motive from beyond Sam: Jealousy from raz...I think it's possible she was jealous of younger, more attractive girls and didn't like the competition. As nice as she seems to be to them, she kept her enemies close me thinks. I know girls like that. She fits my profile of that type anyway. She also said in an article that Sam was a huge push-over - that you could push him over and walk all over him. Hmm.
raz said some contradictory stuff in that interview; and we can't find out her real name.
She was the one I originally put focus on - her "being there" for Emma and under the guise of understanding and guidance corrupted the s4!t out of her. She refuses to take any responsibility. I smell lying skank and it was raz that was called and then Shrim found out. She is just central to this. Seems she treated Sam like a pet - lildemonfrog.

[deita]

Originally Posted by ziggy

I thought I read a relative of Melanie's or someone explaining when the last time her Mom talked to her, but now in searching the Melanie Wells articles I can't find it, nor on any timeline.

www2.timesdispatch.com

Wells' parents told Berkeley County authorities that the last time they were in contact with Melanie was 1:23 a.m. Sept. 15.

Thomas Wells had arranged to pick his daughter up Sept. 16. They agreed he would call her one hour before he arrived, Gardner said, but Wells could not reach her and returned home after waiting seven hours and knocking on Kelley's door.

[PAXIMUS]

Originally Posted by ziggy

I thought I read a relative of Melanie's or someone explaining when the last time her Mom talked to her, but now in searching the Melanie Wells articles I can't find it, nor on any timeline. Reports say Mel's Mom didn't hear from her when she was supposed to and got suspicious, other than that, nada.

Motive from beyond Sam: Jealousy from raz...I think it's possible she was jealous of younger, more attractive girls and didn't like the competition. As nice as she seems to be to them, she kept her enemies close me thinks. I know girls like that. She fits my profile of that type anyway. She also said in an article that Sam was a huge push-over - that you could push him over and walk all over him. Hmm.
raz said some contradictory stuff in that interview; and we can't find out her real name.
She was the one I originally put focus on - her "being there" for Emma and under the guise of understanding and guidance corrupted the s4!t out of her. She refuses to take any responsibility. I smell lying skank and it was raz that was called and then Shrim found out. She is just central to this. Seems she treated Sam like a pet - lildemonfrog.

Good stuff keep it comin'. From the outset I felt Raz was showing signs of having something to hide and in my discussions with Shrim he would give me no access to her, she has been strangely silent all this time and also as we know from an earlier post told PIXY "people need to keep their mouths shut so we all dont get in trouble, we know more than the media and police right now."

So there you have it. As I stated before in the true sense of a satanic/occult type cult the HIGH PRIESTESS which plays the role of Isis/Mary Magdalene within these organizations is often the one who calls the shots and sits above the High Priest himself but works more behind the scenes as the sacred feminine aspect of the Hieros Gamos or scared union.

Personally I think Raz calls all the shots and Sick is her little puppet.

[PAXIMUS]

I think it is also worth noting that Mel and Emma were clearly singled out if not 'targeted' by Shrim and Raz. It is clear from video footage and myspace comments and other things that those two were very much singled out and chosen if you will. They made song lyrics about them, they picked them out of the crowd at the SFTW event, perhaps we could go as far as saying Raz doing Mel's hair was the Judas Kiss, just speculation of course but well worth noting along the lines of DM's previous research. Perhaps we are looking at a chosen sacrifice here.

[ziggy]

Originally Posted by PAXIMUS

I think it is also worth noting that Mel and Emma were clearly singled out if not 'targeted' by Shrim and Raz. It is clear from video footage and myspace comments and other things that those two were very much singled out and chosen if you will. They made song lyrics about them, they picked them out of the crowd at the SFTW event, perhaps we could go as far as saying Raz doing Mel's hair was the Judas Kiss, just speculation of course but well worth noting along the lines of DM's previous research. Perhaps we are looking at a chosen sacrifice here.

Wow I never thought of that but could be. WHY would raz spend so much time with these two girls - there are plenty of fans, but these three: pixy, Mel, Emma are the ones in the backstage pictures. raz is the one who introduced Emma and Mel so that they could become friends. I mean she's not all that, but look at Shrim, he's pretty lucky to have that considering what she brings to the label and fits into his life.

I'm sure she can call the shots. But, the more popular the fat bald rapper becomes, the more the chicks probably want his attention. Maybe that bothered her and she set them up and/or raz is sick enough (judging from the interview by pixy and lyric content etc. she is) to get girls for Shrim - offer them up ala Manson style, just open sex and showing loyalty. A 16 year old girl would be just the ticket for the twisted and just as clever as she is to make Shrim think she's a great girlfriend and deserving of the pedestal from which she can rule, there's no doubt she has no conscience and would do anything she wanted without regret. Dunno. She's key here, she is.

[PAXIMUS]

Originally Posted by ziggy

Wow I never thought of that but could be. WHY would raz spend so much time with these two girls - there are plenty of fans, but these three: pixy, Mel, Emma are the ones in the backstage pictures. raz is the one who introduced Emma and Mel so that they could become friends. I mean she's not all that, but look at Shrim, he's pretty lucky to have that considering what she brings to the label and fits into his life.

I'm sure she can call the shots. But, the more popular the fat bald rapper becomes, the more the chicks probably want his attention. Maybe that bothered her and she set them up and/or raz is sick enough (judging from the interview by pixy and lyric content etc. she is) to get girls for Shrim - offer them up ala Manson style, just open sex and showing loyalty. A 16 year old girl would be just the ticket for the twisted and just as clever as she is to make Shrim think she's a great girlfriend and deserving of the pedestal from which she can rule, there's no doubt she has no conscience and would do anything she wanted without regret. Dunno. She's key here, she is.

Thats my point exactly, if you step back and take a look at the whole picture in the most objective way possible it is very clear that Emma and Mel were singled out and choosen for whatever reason by Raz and Shrim but especially Raz, she for some reason took a liking for these two above all the other fans she/they had. Emma was named Ragdoll because of the Ragdoll teddybear that is often seen on the covers of Raz's albums and on her myspace graphics and I think DM covered some of this earlier in his posts. Emma also had the name RazsDolly as one of her many other myspace aliases, so there is a clear pattern and plenty of evidence that these two girls were very much singled out by Raz and Shrim for what reason we do not know, there were plenty of other fans more in the age range of Shrim and Raz that you would think that they would have a closer relationship but for some reason they choose these two young girls to make song lyrics about, to pick out of the crowd at events and sing directly to them at events even chanting their names during performances etc.

All of this, of course may mean nothing but being the sleuths that we all are we do have an obligation to look more closely at it and follow it as far as it will take us.

It is also worth noting that on Raz's myspace page she has TONS of pictures of fans etc and the majority of them seem to be pictures of her with these two girls and there are also a few of her with SAM who she calls LILDEMONFROG as opposed to DOG, and on one picture in particular of him she has the comment under the picture "I REALLY LOVE THIS KID" so this establishes something of a close and special relationship between Raz, the victims and the perp.

What this means I do not know but again it is worth noting.

[dangrsmind]

Originally Posted by ziggy

Wow I never thought of that but could be. WHY would raz spend so much time with these two girls - there are plenty of fans, but these three: pixy, Mel, Emma are the ones in the backstage pictures. raz is the one who introduced Emma and Mel so that they could become friends. I mean she's not all that, but look at Shrim, he's pretty lucky to have that considering what she brings to the label and fits into his life.

I'm sure she can call the shots. But, the more popular the fat bald rapper becomes, the more the chicks probably want his attention. Maybe that bothered her and she set them up and/or raz is sick enough (judging from the interview by pixy and lyric content etc. she is) to get girls for Shrim - offer them up ala Manson style, just open sex and showing loyalty. A 16 year old girl would be just the ticket for the twisted and just as clever as she is to make Shrim think she's a great girlfriend and deserving of the pedestal from which she can rule, there's no doubt she has no conscience and would do anything she wanted without regret. Dunno. She's key here, she is.

Contrary to the myth of Razakel from which she takes the name which I posted earlier. In this story a man named Razakel makes a deal with the devil and becomes a slave to the demon Asmodeous.

But, see also my analysis of her MySpacepage image where she is depicted as the seated demoness.

Sometimes reversals are part of the secret.

[dangrsmind]

Originally Posted by PAXIMUS

I think it is also worth noting that Mel and Emma were clearly singled out if not 'targeted' by Shrim and Raz. It is clear from video footage and myspace comments and other things that those two were very much singled out and chosen if you will. They made song lyrics about them, they picked them out of the crowd at the SFTW event, perhaps we could go as far as saying Raz doing Mel's hair was the Judas Kiss, just speculation of course but well worth noting along the lines of DM's previous research. Perhaps we are looking at a chosen sacrifice here.

On Razakel's MySpace page there is a depiction of a "dead" ragdoll that seems to have been killed by a bad abortion. The doll is blinded in the right eye...

And then there is Sam the graphic artist who had chosen a name that is a reference to a demon (both Inuyasha and Humbaba are demons) for his online handle.

Edited to add image:

[dangrsmind]

Here's the ragdoll:

ragdoll.JPG

[AndresEscobar]

Originally Posted by dangrsmind

All the reports to date have indicated the girls were killed in their sleep or while defenseless.

Yeah, i know, I was just trying to put an end the brewing speculation that the girls were tied up while Sam killed the mother on the thirteenth.