Starting from scratch - Page 6

Kentjbkent · #**126** 11-03-2009, 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roselvr

I almost feel bad that I tried to organize the facts.
Sorry it had to be posted the way it was; I was NOT able to PM it to her due to it being so long. With her being sick and doing so much as it is; I was trying to help her (and everyone else) as separating fact from fiction has been making MY head spin. Once we get the post set up; Believe can put in a new post & lock if that's what she desires.

By nature, I'm a lot like Kate Gosselin, in that I'm very anal about stuff & like to try to keep things organized. If you saw the computer forum I used to mod at you'd know I suffer bad OCD.

I think you did a great job and I think it will be very useful, especially if we continually update it with new information!

Thanks!!

Julessleuther · #**127** 11-03-2009, 09:11 PM

Completely O/T but I could not resist the Kate Gosselin comment...

You poor thing? You have eight children and a loser ex-husband who is milking you for every penny? LOL Sorry, I am being a naughty girl today...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roselvr

What I just did was deleted the last post I made, then went to the original here post 111 and pasted in the newest with the notes to Cubby. Feel free to hit edit on my post, copy it, then paste it into yours; then it will be the most up to date & mine can get deleted/edited out. Easier to just edit.

I almost feel bad that I tried to organize the facts.
Sorry it had to be posted the way it was; I was NOT able to PM it to her due to it being so long. With her being sick and doing so much as it is; I was trying to help her (and everyone else) as separating fact from fiction has been making MY head spin. Once we get the post set up; Believe can put in a new post & lock if that's what she desires.

By nature, I'm a lot like Kate Gosselin, in that I'm very anal about stuff & like to try to keep things organized. If you saw the computer forum I used to mod at you'd know I suffer bad OCD.

Roselvr · #**128** 11-03-2009, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Julessleuther

Completely O/T but I could not resist the Kate Gosselin comment...

You poor thing? You have eight children and a loser ex-husband who is milking you for every penny? LOL Sorry, I am being a naughty girl today...

Thanks for the laugh.. needed it badly today.

Cubby · #**129** 11-03-2009, 09:24 PM

Roselvr, I appreciate the manner in which you are condensing the info. It's helping me alot! rather than too much bits and pc's all over. I appreciate it very much, thank you.

believe09 · #**130** 11-04-2009, 08:32 AM

Don't feel bad, Rose!!! I was not being hostile or criticizing AT ALL-I think it is an excellent plan...it was my attempt at humor and nothing more. I think pulling together a stickie with what we can collect in terms of information and sources is a great idea.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roselvr

What I just did was deleted the last post I made, then went to the original here post 111 and pasted in the newest with the notes to Cubby. Feel free to hit edit on my post, copy it, then paste it into yours; then it will be the most up to date & mine can get deleted/edited out. Easier to just edit.

I almost feel bad that I tried to organize the facts.
Sorry it had to be posted the way it was; I was NOT able to PM it to her due to it being so long. With her being sick and doing so much as it is; I was trying to help her (and everyone else) as separating fact from fiction has been making MY head spin. Once we get the post set up; Believe can put in a new post & lock if that's what she desires.

By nature, I'm a lot like Kate Gosselin, in that I'm very anal about stuff & like to try to keep things organized. If you saw the computer forum I used to mod at you'd know I suffer bad OCD.

Roselvr · #**131** 11-04-2009, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by believe09

Don't feel bad, Rose!!! I was not being hostile or criticizing AT ALL-I think it is an excellent plan...it was my attempt at humor and nothing more. I think pulling together a stickie with what we can collect in terms of information and sources is a great idea.

Sorry, bad day yesterday.
Turning into high stress morning.

dreamweaver · #**132** 11-04-2009, 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roselvr

Sorry, bad day yesterday.
Turning into high stress morning.

=============
Roselvr:

Having all verified information at hand is a great idea.
A sticky thread. I like it.

Take care of yourself. Breathe.

believe09 · #**133** 11-04-2009, 03:10 PM

Guys-LilE is a genius.....wait til you see what lil came up with....supports the catastrophic event theory!!!!

dreamweaver · #**134** 11-04-2009, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by believe09

Guys-LilE is a genius.....wait til you see what lil came up with....supports the catastrophic event theory!!!!

========================

Uh, maybe it is just me,
but I have no idea what you are talking about.
..catastrophic event theory...????
Help.

Julessleuther · #**135** 11-04-2009, 03:36 PM

LOL. I am guessing she perhaps means that he was caught in one of the hurricanes that came through the area right before he was found. I am all ears (or in this case eyes!)

Quote:

Originally Posted by dreamweaver

========================

Uh, maybe it is just me,
but I have no idea what you are talking about.
..catastrophic event theory...????
Help.

believe09 · #**136** 11-04-2009, 03:40 PM

Hey arent you guys living inside of my head yet???

The catastrophic event theory= (in Believe's mind) is a concept that all of his scarring came from a single event like a car accident.

In otherwords, maybe his elbow was broken, his neck was broken etc...at one time. Maybe his neck is fused.

Does this make more sense?

I will go take some Aleve now....

Quote:

Originally Posted by dreamweaver

========================

Uh, maybe it is just me,
but I have no idea what you are talking about.
..catastrophic event theory...????
Help.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Julessleuther

LOL. I am guessing she perhaps means that he was caught in one of the hurricanes that came through the area right before he was found. I am all ears (or in this case eyes!)

Julessleuther · #**137** 11-04-2009, 03:40 PM

Nope, my bad...it looks like they are discussing it on the other thread...

Roselvr · #**138** 11-04-2009, 05:08 PM

I think this is the thread in question

link

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lil'E

George Everette Melton
http://www.nampn.org/cases/melton_george.html

"Melton suffered a head injury prior to his 1997
disappearance. He may be disoriented and have trouble recognizing people and
places, and may not recall his identity as a result of his condition."

Quote:

Originally Posted by dreamweaver

=============
Roselvr:

Having all verified information at hand is a great idea.
A sticky thread. I like it.

Take care of yourself. Breathe.

Thanks. A valium would work better. lol

believe09 · #**139** 11-04-2009, 07:59 PM

I hope Lil will forgive me if I close the loop-

Lil wanted to know if any studies had been done on BK's neck and spine. Given the location of the scar on his neck, s/he said he appeared to have scarring that was similar to someone she knows-right to the scar on his jaw. S/he indicated that the divet on the jaw of the person she knows was because the halo for the persons broken neck was screwed into that persons jaw.

I loved it as an alternative to the abscessed tooth theory-perhaps BK had his neck fused and his elbow repaired during a "catastrophic event" such as a car accident.

I could not find an example of a Halo brace that screwed into the jaw....so hopefully Lil will come back and comment...

Lil'E · #**140** 11-04-2009, 08:21 PM

Sorry Believe, I was watching the grandkids today and just noticed your post here. Glad you posted it. For those of you that are wondering what the heck I was talking about, I sent Believe a PM this morning and ...well I will just post it here as well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lil'E
Hello Believe,

I have a question for you, could you please elaborate on the extent of Benjaman's surgery on the cervical spine? It looks like it was an anterior incision with a horizontal cut from the close up photos of him in the red shirt. This could be to fuse or repair a disc. I am curious if he has had a recent mri or x ray of the head and cervical spine? The reason for my curiosity is I have seen these scars before on a friend of mine's mother who was in a bad car accident. She even had the same indentation in her jaw (broken), a pin was place there and removed after healing. If indeed this was the reason for his surgery I would like to research traffic accidents and juxtapose them with missing adults.

Much Thanks
Lil'E

I do wish we could get him a simple x ray and see if this was his scenario, and the rest should be easy considering such great talent we have here at WS. You all amaze me.

Believe..thanks again! BTW I am female.

Roselvr · #**141** 11-04-2009, 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by believe09

I hope Lil will forgive me if I close the loop-

Lil wanted to know if any studies had been done on BK's neck and spine. Given the location of the scar on his neck, s/he said he appeared to have scarring that was similar to someone she knows-right to the scar on his jaw. S/he indicated that the divet on the jaw of the person she knows was because the halo for the persons broken neck was screwed into that persons jaw.

I loved it as an alternative to the abscessed tooth theory-perhaps BK had his neck fused and his elbow repaired during a "catastrophic event" such as a car accident.

I could not find an example of a Halo brace that screwed into the jaw....so hopefully Lil will come back and comment...

To add to that, I also saw something similar with the elbow surgery which is why I was asking for pin location.

If they did something like that, I don't think it's regular spine surgery. It would be something very invasive and probably something to do with the part of the skull where it meets the spine.

Lil'E · #**142** 11-04-2009, 10:41 PM

The only photographic image I could find of the device used to stabalize the lower mandible is an older black and white picture but it should give you some insight as to why the patient is left with a punctue scar in the jaw. Here is the link, one of the photos is a bit gross, so beware.

http://www.nzetc.org/tm/scholarly/te...pt1-c16-4.html

Zaha · #**143** 11-04-2009, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lil'E

The only photographic image I could find of the device used to stabalize the lower mandible is an older black and white picture but it should give you some insight as to why the patient is left with a punctue scar in the jaw. Here is the link, one of the photos is a bit gross, so beware.

http://www.nzetc.org/tm/scholarly/te...pt1-c16-4.html

Ouch!

Roselvr · #**144** 11-06-2009, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lil'E

The only photographic image I could find of the device used to stabalize the lower mandible is an older black and white picture but it should give you some insight as to why the patient is left with a punctue scar in the jaw. Here is the link, one of the photos is a bit gross, so beware.

http://www.nzetc.org/tm/scholarly/te...pt1-c16-4.html

Thank you.

I was looking around the site after you posted it; I was reading this is from World War I and II. I'm now curious how long they used an appliance like that.

~Snip~

The advances that took place during the Second World War then were: (i) Much-improved methods of fixation, particularly in edentulous cases. (ii) Better control of infection by using antibiotics. (iii) The use of cancellous bone, which is more viable under conditions of infection.

Lil'E · #**145** 11-10-2009, 12:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roselvr

Thank you.

I was looking around the site after you posted it; I was reading this is from World War I and II. I'm now curious how long they used an appliance like that.

~Snip~

The advances that took place during the Second World War then were: (i) Much-improved methods of fixation, particularly in edentulous cases. (ii) Better control of infection by using antibiotics. (iii) The use of cancellous bone, which is more viable under conditions of infection.

Roselvr, my friend's mother was using a device similar to this in the mid 60's, I am not sure what method is currently being used. Should I come across info on the subject I will certainly post it.

cleo612 · #**146** 11-10-2009, 03:40 AM

I am really new to this case. I have seen the forum for it here at WS for months and always seem to skip over it for some reason. I just happened to see the Starting from Scratch thread and thought I would pop in to see what the case is all about. I am only on page 2 of this thread, so this may have already been brought up in previous threads, or even in this one, but I have an idea.

It was mentioned that Mr. Kyle has 2 pins in his elbow. Most surgical pins have serial numbers that can be traced. Has this been considered as an option for tracking who may have received these pins? Obviously, it would require a surgical procedure in order to read the numbers, but 5 years is a very long time for this man to be wondering who he is. He deserves to know his identity.

One other question I have is whether or not there is a listing showing things that have already been done in order to publicize this case, as well as rule outs on other missing persons?

I will be back tomorrow to catch up on the rest of this thread. I am intrigued now.

believe09 · #**147** 11-10-2009, 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cleo612

I am really new to this case. I have seen the forum for it here at WS for months and always seem to skip over it for some reason. I just happened to see the Starting from Scratch thread and thought I would pop in to see what the case is all about. I am only on page 2 of this thread, so this may have already been brought up in previous threads, or even in this one, but I have an idea.

It was mentioned that Mr. Kyle has 2 pins in his elbow. Most surgical pins have serial numbers that can be traced. Has this been considered as an option for tracking who may have received these pins? Obviously, it would require a surgical procedure in order to read the numbers, but 5 years is a very long time for this man to be wondering who he is. He deserves to know his identity.

One other question I have is whether or not there is a listing showing things that have already been done in order to publicize this case, as well as rule outs on other missing persons?

I will be back tomorrow to catch up on the rest of this thread. I am intrigued now.

Welcome!!!!

We love fresh eyes. The simple answer is yes and yes to both of your questions-Mr. Kyle is not a fan of having the pin removed in order to see if there is a serial number on it, and I for one support him. There is probably enough calcification over it that it would be a problem and may not bear any result if it was put in prior to pins being marked.

Read through the forum for the list of rule outs and the media contacts that have been made for him...

Roselvr · #**148** 11-11-2009, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by believe09

The simple answer is yes and yes to both of your questions-Mr. Kyle is not a fan of having the pin removed in order to see if there is a serial number on it, and I for one support him. There is probably enough calcification over it that it would be a problem and may not bear any result if it was put in prior to pins being marked.

There probably is no serial number on it.
IIRC, things like this do not get serial numbers.