Jodi Arias Trial discussion, #3

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I have been reading most of the post on here, and I thought it would be a good idea to become a member. I sometimes have trouble reading everything, but I had a question. Has there been any mention of the 20 photos taken of him in the shower? Was he actually posing? Was there ever any mention of his hands? I can't help but question if his hands were tied up or not. The last picture we see of him appears to have his arms up instead of on his sides. The dragging photo also shows his hands up, but are they like that because they are bound together in front. If these posing in the shower pics show his hands, I guess that would answer my question, but haven't really found that info anywhere.

I believe she tied him up and made him get in the shower while using the gun to make him do this. The knife was there for cutting the cords or rope/tassles later. I am wondering if he is sitting in the shower bound while she is threatening to use the gun, but the gun jams. He makes a run for so she grabs the knife. She starts to stab him in the back and he turns to fight while still bound. I can't help thinking that this is why he was unable to fight her off as well. When he tries to grab the knife, she cuts his hands and stabs him in the chest. He tries to flee the seen, but she runs after him desperate to take him down. I think she cut his throat at the end of the bathroom hall, and that is where we catch her dragging him back. I can't explain why his head is off the ground unless she has him by the hair or scalp.

Has anyone noticed these two red line around his neck while sitting in the shower? You can see them from the front and right side. It makes me think something sinister was going on prior to the shower. I can't help thinking she tortured him somehow. I could be wrong. I noticed another forum mentioned that those lines were folds in his neck. I am not so sure. I don't see them in any of his other pics.

Okay I went on long enough. Just wanted to know if any mention was made of the shower pictures prior to the last one.

:wagon:

WELCOME! Glad you joined us! And great first post...
 
Hi Guys

Just wanted to say a big thank you to everybody again today for your efforts posting about the trial. Been great to be able to get into work and sit and read through them all and get caught up (as I am in the UK).

Thank you xxxxxxxxx
 
This picture haunts me.
It looks as though he had been crying

I have seen crime scene photos before so the ones of Travis' bloated and swollen body doesnt haunt me nearly as much as this photo of a very alive Travis. To know shortly after this photo was taken he would be slaughtered in the manner he was is so heartbreaking.

There is something in his eyes that bothers me. I have looked at this photo many times now. I cant quite pin it down. It is as if he has a look of puzzlement, surprise,pensive, frustration, or fear. He looks very tense.

It doesnt seem to be a photo of a man who knew he was going to be experiencing a wild sexcapade with a sex maniac to me.

It really makes me want to cry for him. I have looked at so many many photos of an alive Travis now and one thing Ive noticed in 99.9% of them he was smiling brightly with such a sweet smile in most all of them.
 
For reference, quotes from Travis' last blog, posted May 18, 2008...respectfully redacted for relevancy:
Then I turned 30. As I tend to do, I did a little soul searching and realized that I was lonely. A quote from David O McKay kept haunting me. “No success can compensate for failure in the home.” I was a different type of homeless, one with just as few legitimate excuses as the other type bumming for change at a freeway off ramp. Around then I realized it was time to adjust my priorities and date with marriage in mind. Not to ask some one on a date because I planned on marrying them, but to date someone to look for the possibility of marriage with them. This type of dating to me is like a very long job interview and can be exponentially more mentally taxing. Desperately trying to find out if my date has an axe murderer penned up inside of her and knowing she is wondering the same thing about me. That’s usually when I think myself into a panic and start acting weird in consequence to trying so hard to act normal.
I want someone to love me for the Gold that is with in me and is willing to dig with me to extract it.
http://travisalexander.blogspot.co.uk/
 
I have seen crime scene photos before so the ones of Travis' bloated and swollen body doesnt haunt me nearly as much as this photo of a very alive Travis. To know shortly after this photo was taken he would be slaughtered in the manner he was is so heartbreaking.

There is something in his eyes that bothers me. I have looked at this photo many times now. I cant quite pin it down. It is as if he has a look of puzzlement, surprise,pensive, frustration, or fear. He looks very tense.

It doesnt seem to be a photo of a man who knew he was going to be experiencing a wild sexcapade with a sex maniac to me.

It really makes me want to cry for him. I have looked at so many many photos of an alive Travis now and one thing Ive noticed in 99.9% of them he was smiling brightly with such a sweet smile in most all of them.

To me, he looks like someone who is being bullied. I don't use the word lightly but I can't think of a better one. But someone who is in the midst of a nightmare that won't end, a nightmare with another person. The look to me says, "When will you stop? I'm exhausted and miserable... Please stop, please."

I think that's it -- almost a pleading look in his eyes, like he's about to cry b/c he is so miserable and angry and wants someone to leave him alone.

ETA: And has realized that he is in over his head and dealing with a madwoman, someone who will NOT stop. And he looks hopeless and sad, tired and angry. But pleading for the person to stop b/c he has lost control of the situation, mentally and maybe physically. :(

ETA again: And fear.
 
Karla Homolka/Bernardo is an interesting case for this kind of behaviour. She and her soon-to-be-husband killed a girl several days before they were married. She smiled happily/normally in all the pictures. She wanted a happy marriage and thought nothing of peppering it with multiple murders and rape. She talked about the murders (in her confession, post-plea bargain) in such a matter of fact way. It was like painting the house.

She also claimed abuse, which was present towards the end of her marriage, but it was later determined that she was doing a lot of the luring, drugging, and raping too. The police bought her story until the video tapes were found....

Also, she showed little common sense at key points after she made her plea bargain. At one point, she had to give LE a tour of her house to show where "her husband committed the crimes", and what did she wear.... a woman's version school girl outfit. Ironic because one of their 4 victims was wearing a real girls school outfit when she was kidnapped by Karla and Paul.

And don't get me started with her sexual behaviours. Very aggressive.

:waitasec: we wont start about this karla...but i will give my :twocents:! Karla was in fact abused a lot by Paul, even before they got married. She was 17 years old, and in fact he was already a sadic, stalker and a predator BEFORE he met Karla. Clearly when she got the plea bargain, she had to play it cool and between me and you all; anybody would have done the same (showing the house, tapes and etc)because she got away with only 12 years.Casting her as a victim of his predatory behaviour her role was <reduced>..was it wrong? YES...but contrary to JA,karla was in fact abused and a LOT.



Was Jodi ever offered any sort of plea?
 
For reference, quotes from Travis' last blog, posted May 18, 2008...respectfully redacted for relevancy:


http://travisalexander.blogspot.co.uk/

Thank you.

I love to read his blog. Travis was a deep thinker and I admire that.

He knew Jodi wasnt the answer. She may have even been the axe murderer he thought he may have run into. She sure became the slasher murderer.

I often wonder if Travis was afraid to say 'no' to Jodi so he tried to cajole her instead and tried to be friends thinking it would be far better for him emotionally that he did.

He knew she had slit his tires twice yet he didnt report her to the police. Was he afraid if he did her rage would only get worse? Just like those who are abused think if they report it the abuse will only get worse? I think Travis felt trapped and in the end..........he was.

IMO
 
Waiting to get a fresh new thread for the day I feel somewhat like a baby in the morning waiting for a diaper change. lol
 
To me, he looks like someone who is being bullied. I don't use the word lightly but I can't think of a better one. But someone who is in the midst of a nightmare that won't end, a nightmare with another person. The look to me says, "When will you stop? I'm exhausted and miserable... Please stop, please."

I think that's it -- almost a pleading look in his eyes, like he's about to cry b/c he is so miserable and angry and wants someone to leave him alone.

ETA: And has realized that he is in over his head and dealing with a madwoman, someone who will NOT stop. And he looks hopeless and sad, tired and angry. But pleading for the person to stop b/c he has lost control of the situation, mentally and maybe physically. :(

Yes as if he is being intimidated and knows he is helpless to stop it.:( Like 'please lets get this over with.'

It is so ironic.......the photo itself if we didnt know the aftermath is a stunning photo of Travis close up and he is very handsome in this photo, imo.

I am beginning to wonder now if deep down Travis was very afraid of Jodi and tried to appease her when she came there unexpectedly.
 
Thank you.

I love to read his blog. Travis was a deep thinker and I admire that.

He knew Jodi wasnt the answer. She may have even been the axe murderer he thought he may have run into. She sure became the slasher murderer.

I often wonder if Travis was afraid to say 'no' to Jodi so he tried to conjole her instead and tried to be friends thinking it would be far better for him emotionally that he did.

He knew she had slit his tires twice yet he didnt report her to the police. Was he afraid if he did her rage would only get worse? Just like those who are abused think if they report it the abuse will only get worse? I think Travis felt trapped and in the end..........he was.

IMO

I think he didn't report her b/c she was a master manipulator who conned him into feeling guilty for trying to break things off with her. In the end, he may have felt bad for her. Just speculating - I think there are many reasons he didn't turn her in.

But I do believe this: he would have the next day after the picture in the shower, if he had lived through whatever h3ll he was going through at the time. I think whatever it was, it was bad enough for him to realize he was dealing with a monster... :(
 
Poor guy, he didn't deserve what his horrific ending. I hope she spared his dog, Napoleon.
 
Thank you.

I love to read his blog. Travis was a deep thinker and I admire that.

He knew Jodi wasnt the answer. She may have even been the axe murderer he thought he may have run into. She sure became the slasher murderer.

I often wonder if Travis was afraid to say 'no' to Jodi so he tried to conjole her instead and tried to be friends thinking it would be far better for him emotionally that he did.

He knew she had slit his tires twice yet he didnt report her to the police. Was he afraid if he did her rage would only get worse? Just like those who are abused think if they report it the abuse will only get worse? I think Travis felt trapped and in the end..........he was.

IMO
I only wish I knew the answers, OBE. I can only really speak for myself but as much as I was afraid of my ex there was also an overwhelming amount of embarrassment and shame at the predicament I found myself in. I felt the world's biggest fool falling for whom I fell for.

And to make matters worse I bought into his manipulative tactics that my loved ones would believe it really was all my fault and be even more disappointed in me; I'd lose custody of our children because he had emails (so much like Travis') in which I was railing on him and very much appear unstable to the untrained observer; no one else would ever 'put up with me' and the like. (Oh - and my ex also used threats of suicide and a couple of attempts when I threatened to leave. Kids dad - big manipulation.)
 
I have seen crime scene photos before so the ones of Travis' bloated and swollen body doesnt haunt me nearly as much as this photo of a very alive Travis. To know shortly after this photo was taken he would be slaughtered in the manner he was is so heartbreaking.

There is something in his eyes that bothers me. I have looked at this photo many times now. I cant quite pin it down. It is as if he has a look of puzzlement, surprise,pensive, frustration, or fear. He looks very tense.

It doesnt seem to be a photo of a man who knew he was going to be experiencing a wild sexcapade with a sex maniac to me.

It really makes me want to cry for him. I have looked at so many many photos of an alive Travis now and one thing Ive noticed in 99.9% of them he was smiling brightly with such a sweet smile in most all of them.

bbm. I totally agree.

My impression is that she said something that was 180 degrees away from the "fun" afternoon they had had. In that moment he realized that what he didn't want to think about her was true. That she WAS capable of much worse than stalking and tire slashing. And it was too late, he was in a vulnerable position and she actly swiftly before he could fully process it. I think he was a guy that tried to believe the best about people and it, unfortunately, was turned against him.
 
I think he didn't report her b/c she was a master manipulator who conned him into feeling guilty for trying to break things off with her. In the end, he may have felt bad for her. Just speculating - I think there are many reasons he didn't turn her in.

But I do believe this: he would have the next day after the picture in the shower, if he had lived through whatever h3ll he was going through at the time. I think whatever it was, it was bad enough for him to realize he was dealing with a monster... :(

I completely agree.
 
I just had a thought...

She had no defensive wounds to speak of, right? A big problem for the defense and her whole argument of killing in self-defense.

What if, in the picture we saw, she had been doing things to purposefully anger him, hoping he would get angry and attack her in some way physically, leaving marks that would support her case? But he never would do anything back to her...? Maybe she just pushed him and pushed him but it didn't work. So she finally just killed him anyway.

That's my new theory: she needed defensive wounds and tried to push him over the edge, to the point of physical attack or restraint from him. But poor Travis didn't have it in him. And the picture shows it. Desperation.
 
Jodi Arias Trial Day 4 (Full)
States witness, Ryan Burns, met defendant at a PPL event, defendant visited him in Utah hours after killing Travis
States witness, Maureen Smith, Mesa PD, Forensic Latent Print Examiner II
States witness, Kevin Biggs, Mesa PD, Forensic Latent Print Examiner II
States witness, Maureen Smith, recalled
States witness, Heather Conner, direct examination continued
States witness, Esteban Flores, recalled
[url]http://youtu.be/_mG-HoiBA1k[/URL]

Direct to Maureen Smith's testimony http://youtu.be/_mG-HoiBA1k?t=2h29m57s
Direct to Kevin Biggs' testimony, Mesa PD, Forensic Latent Print Examiner II http://youtu.be/_mG-HoiBA1k?t=2h34m38s
Direct to Maureen Smith's recall testimony http://youtu.be/_mG-HoiBA1k?t=2h41m42s
Direct to Heather Conner's testimony http://youtu.be/_mG-HoiBA1k?t=2h43m50s
Direct to Esteban Flores' testimony http://youtu.be/_mG-HoiBA1k?t=3h29m40s



Jodi Arias Trial Day 3 (Full)

States witness, Heather Conner, continued
States witness, Dr. Kevin Horn, Maricopa County Medical Examiner (40:38)
States witness, Elizabeth Northcutt, City of Mesa Forensic Firearms Examiner (3:04:40)
http://youtu.be/1tZKYBlfkxI

Direct to Dr. Kevin Horn's testimony http://youtu.be/1tZKYBlfkxI?t=40m38s
Direct to Elizabeth Northcutt's testimony http://youtu.be/1tZKYBlfkxI?t=3h4m40s


Last weeks testimony

Jodi Arias Trial Day 1 (Audio Only)
Opening statements of prosecution and defense
States witness, Marie "Mimi" Hall, friend of Travis, went on 3 dates with him
http://youtu.be/Ip7EN8uoD-Q

Jodi Arias Trial Day 2 (Part1)
States witness, Esteban Flores, Case Agent, Homicide Detective, City of Mesa
http://youtu.be/qdiZADvLaEY

Jodi Arias Trial Day 2 (Part2)
States witness, Esteban Flores, continued
States witness, Heather Conner, Mesa PD, Latent Print Examiner
http://youtu.be/Cpcc37rmk4A
 
I just had a thought...

She had no defensive wounds to speak of, right? A big problem for the defense and her whole argument of killing in self-defense.

What if, in the picture we saw, she had been doing things to purposefully anger him, hoping he would get angry and attack her in some way physically, leaving marks that would support her case? But he never would do anything back to her...? Maybe she just pushed him and pushed him but it didn't work. So she finally just killed him anyway.

That's my new theory: she needed defensive wounds and tried to push him over the edge, to the point of physical attack or restraint from him. But poor Travis didn't have it in him. And the picture shows it. Desperation.

Great idea and imo not only explains the look on his face but his crouched/stooped/kneeling position in the shower.
 
New Thread for today! Goodmorning members and guests!

move on over... this thread will close in a few minutes

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8709563#post8709563"]Jodi Arias Trial discussion, #4 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]
 
As of May 5th Jodi was still commenting on Travis' blog too. I could well be wrong because I haven't seen everything but she seems to follow him online for at least a bit. Depending on what's out there that could lend validity to her stalking him.

He started his blog April 17th. She started April 27th.
Her last blog entry is May 10th. His is May 18th.

I wonder if we'll be privy to anything that happened between them after May 5th but before the murder. It still says a lot to me that she knew the exact date they broke up over a year later but couldn't recall the particulars of moving back to Cali when it was much more recent.
 
yes,that picture of Travis alive is almost harder to look at than the crime scene pictures.IMO he knows at that point Jodi is about to do something horrible.IMO Jodi is likely threatening him with the gun at that point.
 
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