NH NH - Maura Murray, 21, Haverhill, 9 Feb 2004 - # 8

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telemag said:
Scoops, just because Maura was looking at different areas right up until the time she left didn't mean she had no idea where she was going when she got into her car. Obviously she did know once she started down the road. Remember that Maura told her school she would be gone for a week so maybe Maura and her "friend" were planning on hiking to different areas over the course of a week. Maybe she had a set course to take as far as which trails and mountains to climb and in what order. This could be the answer as to why she was "all over the place" on her computer.
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We can both agree that once Maura got out of amherst, she had a destination in mind.

But there was a lot of search activity vie mapquest etc.. that maura was doing right up until the point she got in her car and left the campus.

And it would be one thing, if she was searching for a place to stay and varied her search between hotels, condos, etc... that were in a certain area, but to be searching places in two entirely different states hours apart from one another, at least to me doesn't sound like a person who has made up their mind yet on where to go.

even though Maura searched for destinations in two different states, each place she searched all had the common link of being right next to or into a mountain/hiking destination.

Her father had been quoted has telling his children a possible way he might take his own life one day was to take a bunch of alcohol and head for the mountains.

But I guess that could all just be a very bad coincidence or something her father didn't want her or his other children to read too much into. Both Maura and her dad were pasionate about the mountains though.
 
I will say that from hearing a radio interview done with investigators on the Maura murray case a few months ago, that they have concluded that Maura will be found one day within a five mile radius of where her car was wrecked at.

They lean towards foul play happening to Maura the night her car broke down.
 
I find it so unlikey in my mind anyway that Maura could be alive. If she was it would be the story of the decade, but one thing I keep thinking about. Would anybody even know who Maura was even if they saw her? Personally I haven't known about this case for that long and most people don't have a clue about who Maura Murray is. Let's assume she is alive and one of us from here saw her on the street or in a mall, would we really know for sure it was her. After all it's been quite a long time. Maura could and probabley does look a lot different.
 
scoops said:
I will say that from hearing a radio interview done with investigators on the Maura murray case a few months ago, that they have concluded that Maura will be found one day within a five mile radius of where her car was wrecked at.

They lean towards foul play happening to Maura the night her car broke down.
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Was this interview with the NH Cold Case Unit investigators?
 
telemag said:
I find it so unlikey in my mind anyway that Maura could be alive. If she was it would be the story of the decade, but one thing I keep thinking about. Would anybody even know who Maura was even if they saw her? Personally I haven't known about this case for that long and most people don't have a clue about who Maura Murray is. Let's assume she is alive and one of us from here saw her on the street or in a mall, would we really know for sure it was her. After all it's been quite a long time. Maura could and probabley does look a lot different.
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I agree. In fact, I've seen women who resemble her, but I know they are not her. Maura was at least part Irish, so she has a common look in New England. She could have gained weight too, which would change her look.
I think a family member or a very close friend might recognize her though.
 
scoops said:
here is a link to the radio interview. Note some of these investigators were hired by the Murray's, yet I almost got the impression from this interview that things may have soured between Fred and the investigators, But i could be wrong.

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/crimew...ire-investigates-tuesdays-900-pm-eastern-time
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I listened to the interview, but I wished the interviewer asked the investigator what was the different info from the first interviews with the neighbors on Rt. 112 and the second interview with them. In other words, the investigator said one of the neighbors had info they didn't think was important or connected with Maura's disappearance, but did mention it in a second interview. I wonder what that info was . . Could it be the contractor's sighting of the runner on Feb. 9th or something else? Also, I wish the interviewer asked the investigator what his theory is on what happened to Maura.
 
telemag said:
I'm up in the air about this guy too. I would like to know if he had a girlfriend at the time of her disappearance. It sounds like He was really into Maura and if she did happen to call him after a time and wanted to meet I doubt he would have said no. They seemed like the perfect match as far as hiking and such. He would have been the perfect one to contact for a nice hiking getaway.
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After getting to town, she could have called on him on a public phone for advice on what to do and a ride. Perhaps, he came up to NH from Amherst to pick her up or help her out, but ends up hurting her. This may be far fetched.

As for relationships, I'm guessing she was more comfortable with Billy, then with Hoss. There may have been a cultural difference, he wasn't aware of. She noticed it though.

Just some thoughts, I could be wrong.
 
McSpy said:
I listened to the interview, but I wished the interviewer asked the investigator what was the different info from the first interviews with the neighbors on Rt. 112 and the second interview with them. In other words, the investigator said one of the neighbors had info they didn't think was important or connected with Maura's disappearance, but did mention it in a second interview. I wonder what that info was . . Could it be the contractor's sighting of the runner on Feb. 9th or something else? Also, I wish the interviewer asked the investigator what his theory is on what happened to Maura.
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Yeah, I re-listened to the interview as well and I am confusing this interview with a newspaper article done in which one of these two investigators (Shamshak or Healy) talked about dragging a nearby lake/pond near where Maura wrecked and that they had concluded she would be found within a short distance in miles from where she wrecked.
 
scoops said:
the condo location is right near the hiking trails and mountains where hotels would not be so accessible to that.

We know she called the condo owners, we don't know for sure she attempted to rent a condo. The phone call lasted three minutes total.

Maura didn't have the kind of money to be gone a full week and living at a condo resort, she maybe had enough for one night only, even if they could rent a room for her which they couldn't.

If you are meeting someone, you kind of need to have a destination to meet set-up ahead of time.

She searched for one place in vermont and one place in New Hampshire that were three hours away from one another and her searches were taking place
right up to the point she left.

does it really seem likely that she contacted a person and said let's meet in vermont, then called him/her back just a few minutes before she left her campus and said, no scratch that, lets meet in new hampshire instead.

If she was driving to meet someone in particular, wouldn't she be able to pinpoint this person's location within a three hour radius and not be back and forth with her search directions. This other person would say, hey come see
me, I am in xxxx.
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I lean to her going to NH alone and on a whim. She was winging it. Renner's investigations are interesting, so I'm keeping an open mind. However, there is nothing supporting her meeting anyone, except the amount of alcohol she bought. Yet, that could have meant SHE was going to do a lot of drinking over the week, or she wanted to have different kinds of alcoholic drinks to choose from on that trip.
 
scoops said:
Yeah, I re-listened to the interview as well and I am confusing this interview with a newspaper article done in which one of these two investigators (Shamshak or Healy) talked about dragging a nearby lake/pond near where Maura wrecked and that they had concluded she would be found within a short distance in miles from where she wrecked.
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Do you have a link for that article?
 
pittsburghgirl said:
Why would she call a condo owner if she wasn't interested in renting a condo? For all we know, she may have been looking to invite someone to join her for a few days. She was supposed to call her dad that night; if she really wanted a chance to think over what was bothering her, and she wanted to talk to her father, she could have siad, "Hey, I've got a condo up here. Could you come up and stay for a few days?" Or she may have felt a condo would be safer for a single female than a motel. I know I have an awful time trying to relax in a hotel or motel.
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I think it is possible she didn't realize the cost of a condo and that you need to reserve one ahead of time with a deposit. She probably didn't have much experience in renting travel lodging. JMO
 
McSpy said:
After getting to town, she could have called on him on a public phone for advice on what to do and a ride. Perhaps, he came up to NH from Amherst to pick her up or help her out, but ends up hurting her. This may be far fetched.

As for relationships, I'm guessing she was more comfortable with Billy, then with Hoss. There may have been a cultural difference, he wasn't aware of. She noticed it though.

Just some thoughts, I could be wrong.
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Kinda was thinking the same theory as you. Does anyone know where Hoss lived at the time Maura went missing?
 
McSpy said:
Do you have a link for that article?
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The article was from the SOCO piece that came out not too long ago.

here is the excerpt:

“We’re certain she is within a five-mile radius. She was murdered, we are looking for her body. We’ve searched around one pond in Haverhill with a Quincy (Mass) diving team. We plan to search the pond again shortly.”

This wasn't either shamshak or Healy but rather his name is terrence O'Connell. He was directly hired by Fred Murray to investigate and it is not clear to me if he is working directly with the NH league of investigators or independently on his own.

Either way, I am surprised I remebered that tidbit, because I never have liked that article much. Thought it was very slanted.

I was just going off memory, so I think I fused O'Connell with the other investigators and he may very well be working directly with them anyway.
 
scoops said:
The article was from the SOCO piece that came out not too long ago.

here is the excerpt:

“We’re certain she is within a five-mile radius. She was murdered, we are looking for her body. We’ve searched around one pond in Haverhill with a Quincy (Mass) diving team. We plan to search the pond again shortly.”

This wasn't either shamshak or Healy but rather his name is terrence O'Connell. He was directly hired by Fred Murray to investigate and it is not clear to me if he is working directly with the NH league of investigators or independently on his own.

Either way, I am surprised I remebered that tidbit, because I never have liked that article much. Thought it was very slanted.

I was just going off memory, so I think I fused O'Connell with the other investigators and he may very well be working directly with them anyway.
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Seems certain, I wonder why?
 
McSpy said:
I think it is possible she didn't realize the cost of a condo and that you need to reserve one ahead of time with a deposit. She probably didn't have much experience in renting travel lodging. JMO
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I think you are right. It's also possible (and compatible with your point) that Maura was like many people who hope that a property owner might discount a unit rather than let it sit vacant--or perhaps she was trying to be smart, not wanting to leave without having an idea of where she might stay or to get i to driving around, looking for a place in the dark. My recollection is that the family had stayed in condos before, so that might have been the "first thought." This part of the mystery seems pretty self-evident and straight-forward. She wanted to go to the mountains and needed a place to stay, so she did some searching and made a few calls.

Sometimes mysterious cases that have been solved remind us that the clues we have are not all that mysterious. Chandra Levy had googled "Rock Creek Park" and there was all sorts of speculation that she had gone there to meet with Gary Condit, or someone working for him. Turns out she was looking for a place to jog. Wrong place, wrong time. It is likely, in my view, that Maura was just looking for a place to stay.
 
McSpy said:
I think it is possible she didn't realize the cost of a condo and that you need to reserve one ahead of time with a deposit. She probably didn't have much experience in renting travel lodging. JMO
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Hadn't she stayed there before with her Dad or some place similar? I find it hard to believe she had no clue of the cost. For all we know she could have made the reservations for all their outings.
 
Couple of thoughts:

-- I'm reading a lot of comments regarding MM's decision-making process immediately after the second accident. The mostly likely truth is that she was significantly impaired by alcohol and perhaps by concussion, which means that logic isn't a very good guide in determining what she was thinking.

-- I'm also reading about her love of hiking. As one poster noted, mountain climbing in winter is an entirely different matter than hiking in summer. I could understand her desire to take a bottle up on the trail somewhere and end her life, but otherwise the notion that she was intending to hike on this trip seems far-fetched to me. (In some of these areas, you'd have a very difficult time battling your way through even to the foot of the trail, not to mention finding the trail at all.)

-- I'm guessing that she had at least a tentative plan and destination when she set out, but after a certain amount of alcohol and a few wrong turns, I'm not sure her arrival at the accident scene is a very good indication of her original intent. She may have just been wandering in a fog at that point.

-- My reading of Renner's blog suggests to me that LE has always known many of the facts that are now emerging, but that they have, perhaps erroneously, concluded that these facts are not important or else have been unable to verify them.
 
Thoughts/questions about the tip that Renner published about a MM car loan account being open and current several years after her disappearance:

Until MM is declared dead or a court intervenes, I assume her accounts would stay open. A court would intervene only if someone (a family member) petitioned for authority to manage her financial affairs until she was found. But a college student might have very few financial affairs -- perhaps only a car loan automatically paid each month out of a checking account. I could imagine that rather than hire a lawyer to petition the court, the father might have decided just to feed the checking account enough to keep the loan current. Could that explain the tip Renner got? That payments were being made long after MM disappeared? Or am I missing something?
 
pittsburghgirl said:
I think you are right. It's also possible (and compatible with your point) that Maura was like many people who hope that a property owner might discount a unit rather than let it sit vacant--or perhaps she was trying to be smart, not wanting to leave without having an idea of where she might stay or to get i to driving around, looking for a place in the dark. My recollection is that the family had stayed in condos before, so that might have been the "first thought." This part of the mystery seems pretty self-evident and straight-forward. She wanted to go to the mountains and needed a place to stay, so she did some searching and made a few calls.

Sometimes mysterious cases that have been solved remind us that the clues we have are not all that mysterious. Chandra Levy had googled "Rock Creek Park" and there was all sorts of speculation that she had gone there to meet with Gary Condit, or someone working for him. Turns out she was looking for a place to jog. Wrong place, wrong time. It is likely, in my view, that Maura
was just looking for a place to stay.
Click to expand...

I think Maura forgot about ski season up there, which can fill rooms. Although, there may have been rooms available on a Monday.
 
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