Members' Theories

An excellent point.
Have an e-pat on the back for that one!

UKGuy said:

wonderllama,
Kolar might not have a theory. He might actually know with certainty who did it. He knows the law so just cannot name his suspect so to speak.



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I totally agree. In fact, I believe this case was solved years ago. That accounts for the fact that Boulder has admitted that no one is presently assigned to the case, and all the posturing by the new DA was just empty words. This case cannot be prosecuted and that is that. Patsy is dead, and BT cannot EVER be prosecuted, or even attached to the case at all because of his age at the time. So really, while we cannot prove it, we do know.
What a shame that all those innocent people accused in this case can never be publicly vindicated. I guess it's because it they were, LE might have to say why, and if they admit the case is really solved, it would be pretty obvious who was involved. If they said they knew who it was, then what would be the reason for NOT arresting them? Well- the reason is because one is dead and one is not able to be named.
And actually, the same reason applies to why JR cannot be prosecuted for obstruction of justice or tampering with evidence (her body). Because if that is known publicly, who else would he be covering for? It's a brick wall, no matter which way you look at it.

DeeDee249 said:

I totally agree. In fact, I believe this case was solved years ago. That accounts for the fact that Boulder has admitted that no one is presently assigned to the case, and all the posturing by the new DA was just empty words. This case cannot be prosecuted and that is that. Patsy is dead, and BT cannot EVER be prosecuted, or even attached to the case at all because of his age at the time. So really, while we cannot prove it, we do know.
What a shame that all those innocent people accused in this case can never be publicly vindicated. I guess it's because it they were, LE might have to say why, and if they admit the case is really solved, it would be pretty obvious who was involved. If they said they knew who it was, then what would be the reason for NOT arresting them? Well- the reason is because one is dead and one is not able to be named.
And actually, the same reason applies to why JR cannot be prosecuted for obstruction of justice or tampering with evidence (her body). Because if that is known publicly, who else would he be covering for? It's a brick wall, no matter which way you look at it.

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Obstruction of justice is a misdemeanor, and there's a 1-2 year statue of limitation on those.

eileenhawkeye said:

Obstruction of justice is a misdemeanor, and there's a 1-2 year statue of limitation on those.

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What about tampering with evidence, especially a body. I'd think that might be more serious.

DeeDee249 said:

I totally agree. In fact, I believe this case was solved years ago. That accounts for the fact that Boulder has admitted that no one is presently assigned to the case, and all the posturing by the new DA was just empty words. This case cannot be prosecuted and that is that. Patsy is dead, and BT cannot EVER be prosecuted, or even attached to the case at all because of his age at the time. So really, while we cannot prove it, we do know.
What a shame that all those innocent people accused in this case can never be publicly vindicated. I guess it's because it they were, LE might have to say why, and if they admit the case is really solved, it would be pretty obvious who was involved. If they said they knew who it was, then what would be the reason for NOT arresting them? Well- the reason is because one is dead and one is not able to be named.
And actually, the same reason applies to why JR cannot be prosecuted for obstruction of justice or tampering with evidence (her body). Because if that is known publicly, who else would he be covering for? It's a brick wall, no matter which way you look at it.

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DeeDee249,
Sure, and I have to wonder is this the same reason why JR is seen in public, all smiles, doing media interviews, selling his books etc?

Normally suspects try to evade the media, big time. Just like BR does.

I reckon at some point the dam will break, and we will get a spate of JonBenet documentaries, which will point the finger at someone.

For Kolar to self publish suggests to me that he something more to say than just a rehash of the case. He could play a pivotal role in any new documentaries, e.g. Ex-JonBenet Investigator Reveals New Insights for Channel X!


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wonderllama said:

I'm starting to think that Acme there just about summed it up.
Assuming you don't believe in the Intruder Theory, it is now the only real theory that fits with the evidence.

Burke, then Patsy, then John.

John & Patsy said all along that they didn't kill their daughter, and they didn't, or at least not with a bash to the head.

I haven't read Kolar's book, it'll be some time before I do, but from the posts here it really does seem like Tricia said - all the pieces are coming together.

Kolar was very clear about avoiding conversations relating to Burke in the interview with Tricia and rightly so. No questions can be answered without him actually revealing his own personal theory, and that is clearly going to get him in to trouble.

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Except that it doesn't fit the evidence. There was a dead body in the basement when the 911 call was made. The RN is inconsistent with a body. The body well hidden is inconsistent with an intruder.

Ok well I had a dream which caused me to change my first theory about what really happend to Jonbenet Ramsey! At first that older brother was the one I thought had something to do with it cause he is creepy to me lol but any how I had the weirdest dream about that night.I had a dream I opened the door and there stood Patsy Ramsey at there home in boulder and she was wearing the outfit she had on that night. She wanted to show me what had really happend. first she walks me into this small kitchen area and shows me the pad she wrote the randsom letter on then she walks me into the main kitchen. I guess and thier set burke and jonbenet it as like 12o in the mourning they were eating I guess a late night snack. burke and jonenet where fighting the way kids do but burke had a flashlight in front of him. patsy went up stairs to get ready or bed leaving them in the kitchen and burke grabbed the flash light and wacked her on the head cause she was making him mad. He hit her hard she screamed load patsy runs down stairs grabs her and she was out. she freaks she calls for jon to come fast he does than they send burke to his room and after the relize she was gone they start to panic jon keeps saying call the 911 patsy frezzes and takes the phone from jon screaming they will put him in jail! so in a panic patsy starts to plan how to save burke and what to do she wasnt thinking clearly she couldnt think so then she decides to sit down it came to her to fake a kidnapping and all that jon makes it look like a bad kiddnapping gone wrong but he did all that in the kitchen than moved her to the basement crying and freaked out patsy writes the letter they set the sceane and then call the cops burke didnt know that had killed her he was worried. His parents were angry he didnt know what happend they sent him back to his room! Anyway this was just a dream but when I woke up it really freaked me out no i am not claming to be psychic or anything here so dont get the wrong idea just a strange dream but it did make sense to me after! I have never met any of them in my life and when this all really happend I was like 13 or so but to dream it like that was very strange to me!

Sorry for all the typos my keyoard sticks and my connection was lagging!

seekthetruthalways said:

Ok well I had a dream which caused me to change my first theory about what really happend to Jonbenet Ramsey! At first that older brother was the one I thought had something to do with it cause he is creepy to me lol but any how I had the weirdest dream about that night.I had a dream I opened the door and there stood Patsy Ramsey at there home in boulder and she was wearing the outfit she had on that night. She wanted to show me what had really happend. first she walks me into this small kitchen area and shows me the pad she wrote the randsom letter on then she walks me into the main kitchen. I guess and thier set burke and jonbenet it as like 12o in the mourning they were eating I guess a late night snack. burke and jonenet where fighting the way kids do but burke had a flashlight in front of him. patsy went up stairs to get ready or bed leaving them in the kitchen and burke grabbed the flash light and wacked her on the head cause she was making him mad. He hit her hard she screamed load patsy runs down stairs grabs her and she was out. she freaks she calls for jon to come fast he does than they send burke to his room and after the relize she was gone they start to panic jon keeps saying call the 911 patsy frezzes and takes the phone from jon screaming they will put him in jail! so in a panic patsy starts to plan how to save burke and what to do she wasnt thinking clearly she couldnt think so then she decides to sit down it came to her to fake a kidnapping and all that jon makes it look like a bad kiddnapping gone wrong but he did all that in the kitchen than moved her to the basement crying and freaked out patsy writes the letter they set the sceane and then call the cops burke didnt know that had killed her he was worried. His parents were angry he didnt know what happend they sent him back to his room! Anyway this was just a dream but when I woke up it really freaked me out no i am not claming to be psychic or anything here so dont get the wrong idea just a strange dream but it did make sense to me after! I have never met any of them in my life and when this all really happend I was like 13 or so but to dream it like that was very strange to me!

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seekthetruthalways,
It could be that you are a natural Lucid Dreamer? Anway what you dreamt is as good as other theories I've seen posted, particularly as you factor in the flashlight.

The thing that seems to be different that night, from other nights, is that JonBenet was whacked on the head. So maybe it was BR and he flipped with the consequences you describe.


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yes I think now it makes sense it was a kids fight that turned tragic because burke lost his temper and hit her hard. In my opinion I dont think he intented to kill her he was just throwing a fit. I dont think he relized he had killed her. The parents flew into a panic as any parents would except instead of doing the right thing they coverd it up and didnt do a great job but they were really not thinking clearly at that point! This story really broke my heart when it happend as do any that have to do with children but after I had that dream it really changed my opinion as to what happend that night! as weird as it is to dream something like that and to change your opinion but it all came together atleast in my way of seeing it!

Chrishope said:

Except that it doesn't fit the evidence. There was a dead body in the basement when the 911 call was made. The RN is inconsistent with a body. The body well hidden is inconsistent with an intruder.

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I'm not saying an intruder, I'm saying Burke.
*slap*

hehe

seekthetruthalways said:

Ok well I had a dream which caused me to change my first theory about what really happend to Jonbenet Ramsey! At first that older brother was the one I thought had something to do with it cause he is creepy to me lol but any how I had the weirdest dream about that night.I had a dream I opened the door and there stood Patsy Ramsey at there home in boulder and she was wearing the outfit she had on that night. She wanted to show me what had really happend. first she walks me into this small kitchen area and shows me the pad she wrote the randsom letter on then she walks me into the main kitchen. I guess and thier set burke and jonbenet it as like 12o in the mourning they were eating I guess a late night snack. burke and jonenet where fighting the way kids do but burke had a flashlight in front of him. patsy went up stairs to get ready or bed leaving them in the kitchen and burke grabbed the flash light and wacked her on the head cause she was making him mad. He hit her hard she screamed load patsy runs down stairs grabs her and she was out. she freaks she calls for jon to come fast he does than they send burke to his room and after the relize she was gone they start to panic jon keeps saying call the 911 patsy frezzes and takes the phone from jon screaming they will put him in jail! so in a panic patsy starts to plan how to save burke and what to do she wasnt thinking clearly she couldnt think so then she decides to sit down it came to her to fake a kidnapping and all that jon makes it look like a bad kiddnapping gone wrong but he did all that in the kitchen than moved her to the basement crying and freaked out patsy writes the letter they set the sceane and then call the cops burke didnt know that had killed her he was worried. His parents were angry he didnt know what happend they sent him back to his room! Anyway this was just a dream but when I woke up it really freaked me out no i am not claming to be psychic or anything here so dont get the wrong idea just a strange dream but it did make sense to me after! I have never met any of them in my life and when this all really happend I was like 13 or so but to dream it like that was very strange to me!

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Hey, this sounds as good as other theories I have had myself and read.

docg said:

I recently posted summaries of the most popular theories of this case, including IDI, PDI, P & J DI, and BDI.

My point in each case is to reveal how fantastic, and in fact utterly implausible, each one is. While a great many on this and other forums have proposed scenarios that fit some of the evidence, when we consider all the evidence, they all have very serious problems and in fact break down completely. I invite anyone who feels that my summary of his or her favorite theory is unfair to respond with a comment on the blog.

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so-- kolar, thomas, hunter and the other ppl involved in the actual investigation who believe it was a family member(s) other than JR, along with more posters than i can count both here and @ FFJ --and numerous other internet forums-- are all wrong? people who've seen the evidence first hand? people who've interacted with patsy and seen with their own eyes what she's all about? all wrong?

:banghead:

A thought came to me last night.....what if we have 2 parents staging the crime scene at different times? One that did the original staging and one that changed that staging? I think PR would be the one to do the original staging since her fibers are all over JBR and when she was finished with the body she went upstairs to stage the house. When JR came down to the basement and saw what PR had done, he knew that it was way too much so he started to undo some of it. He wiped the blood off the body and redressed or covered JBR from the waist down. I don’t know which parent then pulled the garrote to finish the job but I just don’t feel that it would be JR. With this scenario his un-staging (IMO) might be seen as loving or at the very least an attempt to give JBR some of her modesty/dignity back.

There are some pretty reasonable theories on here and when i say reasonable I don't mean they are any good or in anyway related to how I perceive the story myself - I mean that if we lived in a reasonable world then simple answers would be the logical and most truthful.

However, we do not live in a reasonable world and I believe a ring of people were responsible for this death and that it was planned and deliberate.

There are some people who are paedophiles who believe in children joining in with sexual activity and who are aroused by children perhaps because they cannot attain or maintain adult relationships or whatever, but I also believe there are religious elements: for example those who believe it is their duty to bestow upon the children the consequences of the perceived sins of the parents: for example: if the dad was going away on business and he was cheating on his wife - with prostitutes or a workmate or whatever (perhpas because his wife was poorly and also they lost another child too I believe) then these organised groups target the children - systematically and continually.
I believe these groups operate in degrees or stages of behaviour - hard to explain or find the right words... what happens to the children is incremental: the first thing is to instil fear so the child will not speak up (I believe some groups also use deceptive language which if repeated by a child will seem non-sensical or confusing or which will not be understood in some way: for example all the males in the group might say: I am your daddy and all the women might say: I am your mummy - or they might say - hello we are the monsters..) so if the child says there is a monster in the basement or daddy was in the basement - noone thinks listens or believes.. so in this way the non-reaction around them normalises the peculiar pehaviour the children are experiencing - the next thing also is to love the cildren: your parents are bad but we love you - even though the group is in involved in the most hideous forms of human behaviour possible - the killing of animals and people to gain behavioural and social control - the systematic kidnapping of children (whereby the child is returned home after each theft).
where was I ?

I believe both children were being systematically stolen. I believe when the young lad played garotte - he was mimicking what he had seen.
I believe the 911 call was made by one of the children because things were getting incrementally closer to what the child perceived as no longer a game and something which was a greater fear than that which had previously been imposed to shut them up.

I believe the parents are innocent. I believe the boy witnessed things no child should ever witness but he remains silent to protect his parents and perhaps other children or people.

I believe he stayed in bed all day through nervous shock.

I believe that these types of groups administer their actions step by step - it is possible it is all being filmed recorded or photographed - to prove the step has been achieved - perhaps to earn money whether this is done by those who attain the pictures or images or by those who receive them.

I believe the little child was drugged and unaware - I need to believe this - I believe the pictures were for the group - which in a way acts as a religious deterrent to the group abou t the consequences of thou shalt not commit adultery.

I believe the ransom note was a lie to take the spotlight off the true nature of the crime and the group who may not feel criminal but righteous but who possibly feel persecuted by those who do not understand.
I believe the series of photos had been completed and the last image was to be the death of the child - or her sending to the lord or whatever these people call it.

I believe the paintbrush is some sort of re-enactment of the foulness of the father's adulterous betrayal of the family and the wee child was abused for each of his sins over time.
If the job lot for each - next photo or film in the series was offered out and first in best dressed then some groups may even have performed in orgies of they got the incremental evidence first.

The final shot was attained by a ring who wanted to divert attention from their true purpose.

The ransome note - further acts as a deterrent to all those in the "know" about the operations of systems such as this and "she dies" may not have been a threat to the little girl any more but may have referred to another child randomly chosen or as a warning to the brother about his mother.

To threaten to cut off the head is a common threat by these people and these children have witnessed behaedings and burnings during their indoctrinations into these groups and that is why these groups exist and are so communal - cos there is no way out - no one to tell - no one to listen.

The teacher came forward and claimed a degree of guilt but this could not be proven so he was never charged - he was one of many.
The boy may even have been told to crack his sister's head - not fatally killing her but being made to believe it was all his fault. he is an onnocent child. We were all innocent children - once.

I have no pity for any of these people who perpetrate any of these things and allow families to suffer in the way this one has. The mother and father losing their child being accused family falling apart wondering what had happened to their child - feeling the guilt of not having woken - not haing known - not having been ale to protect against such a beast as they could not have prepared for or understood - because some things are just not reasonable.

It is also possible there was no intruder creeping round the bedrroms on this particular night - the children may have been charged with the task of leaving thru the broken window themselves - the boy returning wit the note to be placed and then someone returning with the little girl and the act/s carried out elsewhere - perhaps. rest In Peace Little Baby Girl and Your Lovely Mom who tried so hard to give you a good life the best way she knew how.. xxxx

wonderllama said:

I'm not saying an intruder, I'm saying Burke.
*slap*

hehe

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I know what you mean. BR hit JB in the head with a golf club, so JR/PR conspire to save BR from - nothing. To achieve this lofty goal, they stage a kidnapping scenario.

But my reply is that a kidnapping is inconsistent with a RN, and PR called 911 when the body was in the house which is inconsistent the need to dump the body - if the kidnapping scenario is going to be plausible. So it's not consistent with the evidence. The scenario they have apparently tried to stage is inconsistent with the evidence.

Chrishope said:

I know what you mean. BR hit JB in the head with a golf club, so JR/PR conspire to save BR from - nothing. To achieve this lofty goal, they stage a kidnapping scenario.

But my reply is that a kidnapping is inconsistent with a RN, and PR called 911 when the body was in the house which is inconsistent the need to dump the body - if the kidnapping scenario is going to be plausible. So it's not consistent with the evidence. The scenario they have apparently tried to stage is inconsistent with the evidence.

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And this is exactly what one frequently finds in (poorly) staged scenes: the staging contradicts the evidence, and investigators become suspicious.
I think the Ramseys wavered back and forth for quite sime time as for what staged scene they were going to present to the police. Maybe they initially thought hat a sexual predator scenario alone would be enough, but then added the 'foreign faction kidnapping attempt' to direct the police away from immediately focusing on the family.

rashomon said:

And this is exactly what one frequently finds in (poorly) staged scenes: the staging contradicts the evidence, and investigators become suspicious.
I think the Ramseys wavered back and forth for quite sime time as for what staged scene they were going to present to the police. Maybe they initially thought hat a sexual predator scenario alone would be enough, but then added the 'foreign faction kidnapping attempt' to direct the police away from immediately focusing on the family.

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I suspect that if two first time murderers were going to stage, they'd have talked to each other and come up with one consistent, coherent, somewhat plausible scenario. Instead we have an inconsistent kidnapping scenario and an even more inconsistent sexual predator scenario.

It does appear as if two people went off, each with their own staging in mind, or that they wavered and finally decided to throw elements of two scenarios in the mix. I think it looks this way because Patsy wasn't in on the plan. JR has to "unstage" the window because it's too obvious that no one came in that way. He's left with a RN and a body, and no point of entry (except possibly someone with a key) It looks mostly like a kidnapping scenario, until the body is found. At that point we are asked to think sexual predator, even though the staging isn't consistent with that scenario.

I don't see them coming up with a kidnapping scenario w/o also planning to dump the body. The kidnapping evaporates the minute the body is found, and by all rights, that should have happened about 6:30am?

I guess it comes down to personal preference. You can view the inconsistent staging as the work of two first time criminals who didn't know what they were doing. Or you can see it as one first time criminal staging a kidnapping which is then basically destroyed by an unexpected 911 call.

Patsy has cancer, she lost a child 2 years previous to the loss of Jonbenet (I think so - the Ramsey's 22 year old child in a car crash) and circumstances have given her cause to believe that that her little daughter is being molested and her "friends" perhaps have caused her to lay suspicion about this on her husband's door step. She is absolute turmoil what with the grief over one child who has passed away, the grief over her pride and joy possibly being molested by her partner (she douches her daughter to clean her in an attempt to psychologically cleanse her own mind from the foulness of what she canot bear to accept or cope with) and also she is sick with cancer and fears if she dies her baby girl will be left in this man's clutches; her mind is in turmoil: but her "friends" support her and offer her an alternative.. : if they take custody of Jonbenet as "Godparents" then if Patsy can't fight the cancer and dies, then she will be out of her father's clutches, but no - this won't work.. so how about if she disappears.. perhaps a kidnapping... Patsy can still see her - somewhere she is safe from her father.. and if she can't beat the cancer at least the child will be safe.. maybe.... it would be a whole lot better than Patsy dying and perhaps taking Jonbenet with her to the grave.... a plot is formulated...
Patsy lets her "friends" in after her husband has gone to bed - she tells Jonbenet she is going on an adventure and will see her soon and she is helping her get away from bad daddy... Jonbenet has been allowed to pack a going away bag of a book and a nightie.. Patsy plants the ransom note thinking this will be money to look after JonBenet for a while and that if she passes away Jonbenet will receive money via inheritance on behalf of the God parents perhaps....

Patsy feigns a scream at finding the ransom note and calls the police as instructed... friends and police come and a search ensues.. Frank White checks the cellar/basement and says JonBenet is not there.. she is later found in the basement dead - this was not part of the deal Patsy has signed up to.. her "friends explain that Jonbenet's head was cracked on something... they recognised she was about to die and because the police had been called over the kidnapping, they ended her suffering and faked the death scene... Patsy cannot say anything because she was party to the kidnapping and feels she cannot betray the friends who tried to help save her daughter.. they tell her the paintbrush was used to incriminate the dad to try to get rid of him as well... inside Patsy rationalises some small degree of peace that her child is safe now and that she will see her soon in heaven as well

In actual fact what Patsy does not know is that it is her "friends" who have been abusing her daughter and who wanted to steal her away to underground paedophile activities/ child slavery and also take the family money for themselves while causing false doubts and suspicions in her mind to aid them in their plot.

Something somewhere went wrong which caused JonBenet to understand that daddy wasn't bad but she was being sent away with the bad mummies and daddies and they have whacked her to shut her up perhaps and then had to bring her back to the house...

it is possible the friends never had any intention of letting the child live ever but needed a plan to accommodate the death scene of their religious/paedophilic/whatever ritual to clain their due for the final picture in the series as prescribed in my post above...

I'm gathering my thoughts, and wanted to let you know and not think I've blown you off in answering.

But let me start with the statement of Pasty choosing "Godparents" to hand JonBenet off to if she died. Pasty could never, ever, not in a million years ,give up John Ramsey right's to JonBenet. Never. Only John Ramsey could sever his rights to his daughter and he would never do that. Never.

If JonBenet had been taken he would of searched the world over to find her. But JonBenet wasn't taken by anyone. She was killed by someone in her family. It happens all the time. It happened in this family.

John Ramsey could have ten times the amount asked for in the ransom letter, in less than twenty fours hours, and not of blinked an eye. He was good for it. But there never was a plot between Pasty and "friends"for them to come in that house and take JonBenet. Never.

I think DeeDee and others can help you with the facts of this sad story much better that I can. They would be my source to go to in this case. They know this forwards and backwards and can point you in the direction that law enforcement was being led by the evidence found with and on JonBenet.

There are many thoughts on what happened to JonBenet and yours are thought provoking. So could you please go first and tell me what led you to those conclusions.


Fleet. His name is Fleet White and he and his wife Priscilla have been about the only ones that have taken a stand on the side of justice for JonBenet.