IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #20

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True. It would be scarier to hide a body and live the rest of your life with fear and a guilty conscience though.

The longer the body stays hidden, the less chance there is any forensic evidence could be recovered if the body is ever found.
 
JR and JW are/were in SPEA at IU. SPEA is active in the surrounding counties and their respective creeks and rivers. Of particular interest is an article I found from March 24 2011 when both POIs would have been in the program. The article mentions recent SPEA student work at "watershed" between Martinsville and Trafalgar. The article states that the watershed "encompasses" 60,000 rural acres in Morgan and Johnson counties.

This article makes me think either of these 2 POIs would know something about the rural areas surrounding btown. Not necessarily stating that they were involved in the student investigation, but I'm sure their majors led them (in classes or assignments) to those areas that are very very rural.
 
JR and JW are/were in SPEA at IU. SPEA is active in the surrounding counties and their respective creeks and rivers. Of particular interest is an article I found from March 24 2011 when both POIs would have been in the program. The article mentions recent SPEA student work at "watershed" between Martinsville and Trafalgar. The article states that the watershed "encompasses" 60,000 rural acres in Morgan and Johnson counties.

This article makes me think either of these 2 POIs would know something about the rural areas surrounding btown. Not necessarily stating that they were involved in the student investigation, but I'm sure their majors led them (in classes or assignments) to those areas that are very very rural.

They were both Management majors--a completely different course of study than Environmental sciences. They likely never even stepped outside for a course.
 
I just want the Spierer's to get their daughter back and I question if the words they say are specific enough to appeal to the person who knows or motivate a family member of this person to tell where LS is, if this is their goal.



Whoever did this will be haunted forever, confession or not.

Can you give examples or ideas of what you have in mind for greater specificity? And do you think they have a secondary goal? I'm not questioning you, just curious because I don't quite follow. Thanks.
 
That's a good and interesting point. With each passing day the perp becomes more and more distanced and removed. If he is in another country the likelihood is greater and easier. Witnesses, OTOH may be more prone to speak up later rather than sooner.

I would be very keen on reading any material that addresses this "window"--if there is one that has been tracked. For example, young adults who've committed murder or manslaughter--they get an education, start up the career ladder, meet someone, then when they have babies, ZING! they face their moral conscience for the first time. Or they experience an illness or major loss that does the same thing. Basically what drives people to confess.

Pondering ....:idea:

I don't know about actual tracking, but the death or incarceration of another POI or, as you stated, firsthand births/health crises/deaths, might compel a person to confide what he/she knows.

This is a depressing example, but what opened the other case I follow is a conversation between two polygraphers. One mentioned a particular POI implicating himself on a polygraph years ago but not being further investigated. The other jumped on it because he was a former neighbor of the last victim ... the case was why he entered the business. The polygrapher who confided said something about everybody being dead now. Well, the father of the last victim isn't dead. He's 80 and still wants answers. The former neighbor called him and he pushed hard for further investigation, resulting in a grand jury.

I so don't want LS' parents to go through that, so I hope somebody cracks ASAP.
 
Nothing there that raises a red flag.

You are correct. The link merely establishes that JW is in the SPEA program as a management major, which was my point in that post as you had said he was not in SPEA.

The next link establishes that SPEA is active in the surrounding counties and had a recent major find about e. coli.

http://www.indiana.edu/~spea/news/indian_creek.shtml

I'm not positive, but he (and possibly JR) prob had CORE courses required through SPEA that were not management related. It's speculation (as are most things people are posting here), but it would give at least 2 main POIs possible knowledge of rural areas surrounding b-town and Martinsville.
 
I'm not positive, but he (and possibly JR) prob had CORE courses required through SPEA that were not management related.

They have to take two natural sciences courses from a long list of options. It's possible those courses involved field visits outside Btown, but that's not a safe assumption.
 
You are correct. The link merely establishes that JW is in the SPEA program as a management major, which was my point in that post as you had said he was not in SPEA.

The next link establishes that SPEA is active in the surrounding counties and had a recent major find about e. coli.

http://www.indiana.edu/~spea/news/indian_creek.shtml

I'm not positive, but he (and possibly JR) prob had CORE courses required through SPEA that were not management related. It's speculation (as are most things people are posting here), but it would give at least 2 main POIs possible knowledge of rural areas surrounding b-town and Martinsville.

Read my post. I did not say he was not in SPEA. I know he's in SPEA. :banghead: I've made that point here before more than once. And we've already established that JR and JW both could be familiar with areas outside of Bloomington because of hazing practices in AEPi.
 
Read my post. I did not say he was not in SPEA. I know he's in SPEA. :banghead: I've made that point here before more than once. And we've already established that JR and JW both could be familiar with areas outside of Bloomington because of hazing practices in AEPi.

No worries - maybe I misread your comment. I'm aware of the AEPi angle, and this just adds to the possibility that they (JR and JW) could be knowledgeable about the rural areas.

Also, is special K still a drug people do? I'm a recent graduate and did my fair share of partying. I vaguely recall ketamine use in high school, but I do not remember any mention of it in college.
 
No one in the media, LE or close to the players has said anything about ketamine. The talk/rumors have been about cocaine and xanax.

Similarly, no one has said anything to contradict the assertions that MB is CR's second-banana, was not necessarily involved in the partying of the evening, and was at work on two papers that were turned in the next day, receiving good marks.

I'm afraid thesaint's speculation on these scores simply takes our eyes off the ball.
Whether you agree or disagree with a speculative theory, I would welcome them rather than rehash the same old theories over and over because as it stands right now, what ball are our eyes being taken off of? If we take ALL the info we have been given at face value, then we have to assume everyone is also 100% telling the truth and that is not the case.
IMO If one cannot provide facts or strongly suggestive reasons to counter a theory, and not "just because" type reasons, then just let it ride and see where it ends up.
 
Whether you agree or disagree with a speculative theory, I would welcome them rather than rehash the same old theories over and over because as it stands right now, what ball are our eyes being taken off of? If we take ALL the info we have been given at face value, then we have to assume everyone is also 100% telling the truth and that is not the case.
IMO If one cannot provide facts or strongly suggestive reasons to counter a theory, and not "just because" type reasons, then just let it ride and see where it ends up.

Another factor is that cocaine is often cut with various other drugs, and depending on what and how much is used to cut it, that could be significant.

From Medscape:

Among the substances used to cut cocaine are local anesthetics (eg, procaine, lidocaine, tetracaine), other stimulants (eg, amphetamine, caffeine, methylphenidate, strychnine), lysergic acid diethylamide (LSD), phencyclidine (PCP), phenytoin, heroin, marijuana, and hashish.

Recent reports describe agranulocytosis following use of cocaine contaminated with the veterinary antihelminthic levamisole.[4] Levamisole was found in every cocaine-positive toxicology case reported by a major forensic laboratory.[5] The Drug Enforcement Administration reports that levamisole has been identified in cocaine seized in widely separated geographic areas ranging from New York, to Illinois, Florida, Kansas, and Missouri, as well as drug seizures in South America, and coroners specimens in the United Kingdom.[6] Levamisole increases dopamine levels in the same areas of the brain as does cocaine, possibly accounting for its current ubiquity.[4]

Other adulterants may include quinine, talc (ie, magnesium silicate), ascorbic acid, boric acid, chalk, laundry detergent, meat tenderizer, laxatives, plaster of Paris, cornstarch, and lactose.
 
Another factor is that cocaine is often cut with various other drugs, and depending on what and how much is used to cut it, that could be significant.

From Medscape:

I had to laugh at some of that - you cannot cut cocaine with LSD, at least not in the normal sense. Cutting is using a less expensive filler to create more cocaine to sell. LSD is so very potent, minute quantities are very powereful. So you could not be adding more than a teenie tiny amount... and coke that makes you trip - like LSD does - well, let's just say it would be a very noticeable different product.
So take this all with a grain of salt, as if there is one report of something happening, it may have a good chance of ending up in the literature and then on Medscape, but really because it is an oddity, and not at all the norm. OTOH, I've heard more and more reports of the levamisole and I know it to be a fairly widespread problem nowadays. Off topic, who figures these things out??? I mean, who tries snorting levamisole and says "hey this stuff is good!" it's a deworming agent given to animals, who even THOUGHT to try it???
 
I did some research on levamisole. The source and its website is listed below each quote. Emphasis is mine in the quotes.

“Levamisole (marketed as the hydrochloride salt under the trade name Ergamisol)” Wikipedia [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Levamisole"]Levamisole - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia@@AMEPARAM@@/wiki/File:Levamisole_Structural_Formulae.png" class="image"><img alt="" src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5d/Levamisole_Structural_Formulae.png/200px-Levamisole_Structural_Formulae.png"@@AMEPARAM@@commons/thumb/5/5d/Levamisole_Structural_Formulae.png/200px-Levamisole_Structural_Formulae.png[/ame]

"Eighty-two percent of seized cocaine contains levamisole, according to an April 2011 report by the U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration.” ABC News http://abcnews.go.com/Health/Wellne...-veterinary-drug-levamisole/story?id=13902353

“Levamisole appears to be added to cocaine from the outset, in the countries of origin. The substance has been found in various concentrations in cocaine analyzed in countries around the world, from Switzerland to Australia. And urine tests of cocaine users attending a drug clinic at San Francisco General Hospital in 2009 — one floor above Graf's office — found that 90% of samples were positive for levamisole; similar tests in Seattle revealed that 80% of cocaine users there had levamisole in their systems.” Time Magazine http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1955112,00.html

“Eldo Kuzhikandathil, assistant professor of pharmacology at the University of Medicine and Dentistry of New Jersey, suggests that levamisole may indirectly increase the number of D1 dopamine receptors in the brain by affecting gene expression there. 'Cocaine increases D1 expression,' he says, 'and this [levamisole] would probably accentuate that,' which could enhance both highs and craving."
Time http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1955112,00.html

“Alcohol should be avoided or used with caution while taking levamisole.”


“Levamisole side effects
If you experience any of the following serious side effects from levamisole, seek emergency medical attention or contact your doctor immediately:
• an allergic reaction (including difficulty breathing; closing of the throat; swelling of the lips, tongue, or face; or hives);
• decreased bone marrow function or blood problems (extreme fatigue; or fever, chills, or signs of infection); or
• nervous system problems (confusion or loss of consciousness, extreme fatigue, memory loss, muscle weakness, numbness or tingling; seizure, speech disturbances)
Drugs.com http://www.drugs.com/mtm/levamisole.html
 
I just want the Spierer's to get their daughter back and I question if the words they say are specific enough to appeal to the person who knows or motivate a family member of this person to tell where LS is, if this is their goal.



Whoever did this will be haunted forever, confession or not.
I believe they have already begun to get a lot more specific.IMO it was either them or LE that leaked the contents of the tape of LS falling while getting out of the elevator and then went on to call CR story of amnesia and being helped home a lie.LE has been in sole possession of this tape for close to two months.Who else could the journal news consider capable of viewing this tape.I do not believe some smallwood employee saw the tape before LE served their search warrant and waited two months to talk to a reported about it.Much more likely LE has viewed all the evidence,talked to all the witnesses and do not believe CR story and they have begun to turn the pressure up.
 
:great:
<snipped>
So take this all with a grain of salt, as if there is one report of something happening, it may have a good chance of ending up in the literature and then on Medscape, but really because it is an oddity, and not at all the norm. OTOH, I've heard more and more reports of the levamisole and I know it to be a fairly widespread problem nowadays. Off topic, who figures these things out??? I mean, who tries snorting levamisole and says "hey this stuff is good!" it's a deworming agent given to animals, who even THOUGHT to try it???
:great:

Clear your nose and rid yourself of parasites at the same time!
 
I believe they have already begun to get a lot more specific.IMO it was either them or LE that leaked the contents of the tape of LS falling while getting out of the elevator and then went on to call CR story of amnesia and being helped home a lie.

I would believe that it was someone in LE - there are leaks all the time from police departments - but I would have thought that it would have been leaked to a local reporter that knew whoever the leaker was, rather than someone at the Journal News in Westchester (lohud.com) if that were the case. On the other hand, maybe it was someone who knew his/her job would be in jeopardy if revealed and didn't trust any of the local reporters.

It seems implausible to me that her parents were the people who leaked the information. For one, they've said a number of times now that they are on board with LE and it's hard for me to imagine them doing anything that LE would consider harmful to the investigation.

That her parents are the source of the leak seems even less likely to me because of the tone of the quotes. For example, "As for this idea that she was Florence Nightingale and taking him back because she was concerned, she wasn't in any condition to take care of herself, let alone another human being," is hard for me to imagine coming out of her mother's or father's mouth.

http://www.lohud.com/article/201107...lding-video-no-condition-help-friend-get-home
 
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