Are the Ramseys involved or not?

Are the Ramseys involved or not?

  • The Ramseys are somehow involved in the crime and/or cover-up

    Votes: 883 75.3%
  • The Ramseys are not involved at all in the crime or cover-up

    Votes: 291 24.8%

  • Total voters
    1,173
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@ Hotyh

socialists, anarchists, and francophone gentlemen in Colorado.
I found some ......


gentlemen, ie english term
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sp%C3%A9cial:Recherche?search=gentlemen&go=Lire

The Denver Gentlemen (1995-29005):
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Denver_Gentlemen


TDG, 1995, Colorado:
http://www.smoochrecords.com/releases.html#smooch016

within the 'Goth' scene:
http://www.westword.com/1997-01-09/music/feedback/

my space, The Denver Gentlemen:
http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=30874201




anarchists in Colorado, music scene:
http://colorado.indymedia.org/node/593

Louis Vuitton Night, Looey Vooey,
"Denver's Most Undemocratic Anarchist Variety Show":
http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=30874201



Colorado Indymedia:
http://colorado.indymedia.org/taxonomy/term/1351
 
This is quite interesting.

But let's not forget one thing. RiverRat said it best:

And adds an extra dose of reality that Patsy and her fondness for all things fancy French comes through load and clear.

No need to traverse the world.

Let's see...
The name JonBenét is French...
JB's pediatrician, Dr. Beuf...name is French
She even named the little statue outside, where she hid a house key....Pierre.
And there were not one, but TWO dogs named Jacque. Can anybody think of anything else? Oh, and her use of attaché.

For those of you that don't know...I found this little tidbit. My mom, who passed away in 97, used to correct me when I mispronounced JB's name..

"JonBenet was named after her father, with the name pronounced in a French-inspired manner as zhawn-ben-AY."
 
The trend is IDI. The media, TV shows, and LE all trend IDI. Why not just give up this stale, dead-end RDI fiasco? (Is fiasco French or Italian?)

The author of the RN isn't French, but they aren't English as first language either. That much is obvious. There's nobody I know of that misspells business.

Maybe someone with less usage of the capitalist term?
 
fiasco, italiano, mi amigo.



I find it kinda interesting, I guess ..... b cuz ...... I'm relatively new to the JBR 'material', less than a year, not even close to a decade, so it's ALL very interesting to me. Maybe a rehash for you?

I find the RDI, IDI, BDI scenarios of equal interest; equally valid within within this money buys process story of justice.

Hey ..... and the Fat Cats were cute, no?



I've never been trendy, so I'm of no real consequence here, occupying a little patch of online space, thinking about ....... bad translations and what's so clearly lost through translation, eh?

and I must confess, ...................

well ......"Hold on to Your Toupees and Hats!", I misspell bussiness, frequently.
 
I don't quite understand ...... meaning a foreigner? or ..... what do you mean?

I'm not on the fence, not at all. I'm a FFDI type, and I think the terms 'fat cats', 'Victory!' and even 'group of individuals' all have a socialist aspect.

Fat cats is a derogatory expression directed at JR simply because he had personal wealth. In modern western culture, with yuppies and beemers, 'fat cat' comes out of nowhere. Its almost archaic.

Victory! was considered by Clint VanZandt to be 'revolutionary,' and that it 'harked back to foreign powers'. RDI has repeatedly, over and over, pointed out thats not what he meant. But that is what he said.
 
Ransom note: http://www.statementanalysis.com/ramseynote/

IMO As the note progresses the 'french flavour' diminishes.


First Page:

1. "Mr.[Monsieur] http://www.wordreference.com/fren/monsieur Ramsey.
2. Listen [ Ecoutez] carefully!
ecoutez isn't usually said with a 'qualifier', no need, but it has compound forms, bien ecoutez ...
http://www.wordreference.com/fren/ecoutez & ecoutez



We are a group of individuals [un groupe d'individus],

source: headline http://www.casafree.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=3511

3. a small [ petit ,~e ], little, small http://www.wordreference.com/fren/petite

foreign faction [faction , feminine noun] http://www.wordreference.com/fren/faction

We xx respect [respecter, transitive verb] your bussiness
4. but not the country that it serves. At this time [Maintenant ,adverb = now= at this point in time] http://www.wordreference.com/fren/maintenant,

we have
5. your daughter in our posession [possession, feminine noun; compound form = en possession] http://www.wordreference.com/fren/possession ,.

She is safe and unharmed


6. if you want her to see 1997, you must follow our instructions to
7. the letter.
8. You will withdraw $118,000.00 from your account. $100,000 will be
9. in $100 bills and the remaining $18,000 in $20 bills. Make sure
10. that you bring an adequate size


attache [ attache, feminine noun; attache = anglification of porte-docements] http://www.wordreference.com/fren/attache


to the bank. When you get
11. home you will put the money in a brown paper bag. I will call you
12. between 8 and 10 am tomorrow to instruct you on delivery. The
13. delivery will be exhausting so I advise you to be rested. If we
14. monitor you getting the money early, we might call you early to


15. arrange [arranger, transitive verb ] http://www.wordreference.com/fren/arrange

an earlier delivery of the



Second Page:


money and hence a earlier
16. delivery pickup of your daughter.

17. Any deviation [deviation, feminine noun: English: diversion - perversion ] http://www.wordreference.com/fren/deviation





of my instructions will result in the immediate
18. execution of your daughter. You will also be denied her remains


19. for proper burial. The two gentlemen [Monsieur, English: gentleman ]
http://www.wordreference.com/fren/Monsieur

watching over [ garder, transitive verb, English:guard - watch ] http://www.wordreference.com/fren/garder

your daughter
20. do not particularly like you so I advise you not to provoke them.
21. Speaking to anyone about your situation, such as Police, F.B.I.,
22. etc., will result in your daughter being beheaded. If we catch you
23. talking to a stray dog, she dies. If you alert bank authorities, she
24. dies. If the money is in any way marked or tampered with, she dies.
25. You will be scanned for electronic devices and if any are found, she
26. dies. You can try to deceive us but be warned that we are familiar
27. with Law enforcement countermeasures and tactics. You stand a 99%
28. chance of killing your daughter if you try to out smart us. Follow
29. our instructions



Third Page:

and you stand a 100% chance of getting her back.
30. You and your family are under constant scrutiny as well as the
31. authorities. Don't try to grow a brain John. You are not the only
32. fat cat around so don't think that killing will be difficult. Don't
33. underestimate us John. Use that good southern common sense of yours.
34. It is up to you now John!
35. Victory!
36. S.B.T.C."




Ransom Note, image: http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/ransom1.html
 
I'm not on the fence, not at all. I'm a FFDI type, and I think the terms 'fat cats', 'Victory!' and even 'group of individuals' all have a socialist aspect.

Fat cats is a derogatory expression directed at JR simply because he had personal wealth. In modern western culture, with yuppies and beemers, 'fat cat' comes out of nowhere. Its almost archaic.

Victory! was considered by Clint VanZandt to be 'revolutionary,' and that it 'harked back to foreign powers'. RDI has repeatedly, over and over, pointed out thats not what he meant. But that is what he said.

Ya, shoot,
Ok ... ty ... I get ya,

SFF.

I just 'see' all these 'french' overtones dispersed? within the note, yet only three references (interpretations) to socialism, one on the first page and two on the last page of the note.





Socialistes!?
 
Ya, shoot,
Ok ... ty ... I get ya,

SFF.

I just 'see' all these 'french' overtones dispersed? within the note, yet only three references (interpretations) to socialism, one on the first page and two on the last page of the note.





Socialistes!?

Better make that four references.

"...but not the country that it serves".

Socialism is typically opposing the US, and not silently either.
 
http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/notorious_murders/famous/ramsey/book_10.html

During the interview, Thomas described how out of 73 suspects whose writing samples were analyzed by experts in comparison with the note, Patsy Ramsey was the only one who could not be excluded as its author. He also accused Patsy Ramsey of changing her handwriting after the murder. "In the ransom note, almost exclusively the lowercase manuscript a was used, I think, 98 percent of the time," he said. "What was telling was that after the Ramseys were given a copy of the ransom note, the lowercase manuscript a almost disappeared entirely from Patsy's post-homicide writing. Writing samples from Ramseys' personal letters and notes she wrote before the killing contain 732 manuscript a's that look like the lowercase typewritten a, but they are written by hand. She switched to a cursive a after the murder."

Another point that Thomas made was that the ransom note was signed "S.B.T.C." which allegedly stands for what the note described as "a small foreign faction" that had kidnapped JonBenet for a $118,000 ransom. Thomas indicated that this fact also pointed to Patsy Ramsey, as she often used acronyms. He cited a Christmas note to a friend that was signed "P.P.R.B.S.J.," which she said stood for "Patsy Paugh Ramsey, Bachelor of Science in Journalism." He also said the tear pattern of the ransom-note paper matched Patsy Ramsey's personal note pad, and the felt-tip pen used to write the note matched a pen found in a cup in the Ramseys' kitchen.



Had no idea about the underlined part,hmmm........
 
http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/notorious_murders/famous/ramsey/book_10.html

During the interview, Thomas described how out of 73 suspects whose writing samples were analyzed by experts in comparison with the note, Patsy Ramsey was the only one who could not be excluded as its author. He also accused Patsy Ramsey of changing her handwriting after the murder. "In the ransom note, almost exclusively the lowercase manuscript a was used, I think, 98 percent of the time," he said. "What was telling was that after the Ramseys were given a copy of the ransom note, the lowercase manuscript a almost disappeared entirely from Patsy's post-homicide writing. Writing samples from Ramseys' personal letters and notes she wrote before the killing contain 732 manuscript a's that look like the lowercase typewritten a, but they are written by hand. She switched to a cursive a after the murder."

Another point that Thomas made was that the ransom note was signed "S.B.T.C." which allegedly stands for what the note described as "a small foreign faction" that had kidnapped JonBenet for a $118,000 ransom. Thomas indicated that this fact also pointed to Patsy Ramsey, as she often used acronyms. He cited a Christmas note to a friend that was signed "P.P.R.B.S.J.," which she said stood for "Patsy Paugh Ramsey, Bachelor of Science in Journalism." He also said the tear pattern of the ransom-note paper matched Patsy Ramsey's personal note pad, and the felt-tip pen used to write the note matched a pen found in a cup in the Ramseys' kitchen.



Had no idea about the underlined part,hmmm........

I did. That's why I put it in the book.
 
Was wondering about the "no ramsey prints on the ransom note"....
Did she forget to take the gloves off when she wrote it(after messing up the crime scene,staging sounds too nice) ?Didn't they touch it at all after she wrote it?How careful.
Sometimes it can backfire....cause it would have been normal for their prints to be on it. :D
The absence of them on it though says a lot to me.
 
Was wondering about the "no ramsey prints on the ransom note"....
Did she forget to take the gloves off when she wrote it(after messing up the crime scene,staging sounds too nice) ?Didn't they touch it at all after she wrote it?How careful.
Sometimes it can backfire....cause it would have been normal for their prints to be on it. :D
The absence of them on it though says a lot to me.

Exactly! Patsy had rubber gloves, needles, syringes, alcohol swabs...etc..that she kept in one of the bathroom drawers...a drawer that was left partly open, the night of the murder. She was shown a picture of the drawer, and she said..."I don't know WHY that drawer would be open like that". DUHHHHH....she LEFT it open, in her haste...that's why. IMO...Patsy used those rubber gloves when writing that RN, that is why her prints are not on the paper. She never handed the RN to John to read, he never touched it at all...that is why HIS prints are not on the RN paper. (He already knew what it said, because IMO, he dictated most or all of it to her, why would he need to read it?) I also believe that RN was NEVER on that spiral staircase, at all.

Another thing...after Mr. Ramsey...the note said..."LISTEN CAREFULLY". Who would write that in a note, you don't LISTEN to a note...you read a note. IMO...John was dictating the note to Patsy...and he was saying to HER..."Listen carefully"...and she thought that it was part of the RN...so she wrote it. He didn't have time to proof read it..so he had no idea that she had written it, until later. And I am sure that he probably thought..."Patsy, how stupid could you be?"
 
Exactly! Patsy had rubber gloves, needles, syringes, alcohol swabs...etc..that she kept in one of the bathroom drawers...a drawer that was left partly open, the night of the murder. She was shown a picture of the drawer, and she said..."I don't know WHY that drawer would be open like that". DUHHHHH....she LEFT it open, in her haste...that's why. IMO...Patsy used those rubber gloves when writing that RN, that is why her prints are not on the paper. She never handed the RN to John to read, he never touched it at all...that is why HIS prints are not on the RN paper. (He already knew what it said, because IMO, he dictated most or all of it to her, why would he need to read it?) I also believe that RN was NEVER on that spiral staircase, at all.

Another thing...after Mr. Ramsey...the note said..."LISTEN CAREFULLY". Who would write that in a note, you don't LISTEN to a note...you read a note. IMO...John was dictating the note to Patsy...and he was saying to HER..."Listen carefully"...and she thought that it was part of the RN...so she wrote it. He didn't have time to proof read it..so he had no idea that she had written it, until later. And I am sure that he probably thought..."Patsy, how stupid could you be?"

I agree re "listen carefully".
Another unbelievable thing to me,the note says she DIES if you call the police and the first thing you do is exactly that?You don't stop for 5 seconds to think about that THREAT?Especially when you're told you're being watched?Any normal parent with normal instincts would do that IMO.But then again,they knew there's no threat,eh.

The RN looks/sounds to me like someone just copied different parts from 4,5 different scenarios and put that RN together.Makes no sense,doesn't matter how you read/look at it.There was no calm psycho intruder sitting on a chair writing it because he was feeling so lonely waiting for them to come home,it was someone desperate needing a way out.
 
I agree re "listen carefully".
Another unbelievable thing to me,the note says she DIES if you call the police and the first thing you do is exactly that?You don't stop for 5 seconds to think about that THREAT?Especially when you're told you're being watched?Any normal parent with normal instincts would do that IMO.But then again,they knew there's no threat,eh.

The RN looks/sounds to me like someone just copied different parts from 4,5 different scenarios and put that RN together.Makes no sense,doesn't matter how you read/look at it.There was no calm psycho intruder sitting on a chair writing it because he was feeling so lonely waiting for them to come home,it was someone desperate needing a way out.

Exactly!

Not only did Patsy call 911, but then they called over a bunch of their friends. Even though the note said that if they so much as talked to a "dog"...their daughter would die. Another thing...Patsy in her interview said that John was calm, cool and collected during this whole thing...so WHY didn't HE call 911????? Patsy admitted that she was "frantic". In a situation that requires 911 to be call....you don't get the person that is an emotional wreck to do it...you get the person that is calm, cool and collected to do it. IMO...Patsy was quite literally the drama queen...acting was her "thing"...so of course, she is going to be the only choice to make the 911 call. She wasn't even crying during the call...she just sounded out of breath for some reason...guess all of that running up and down the stairs to the basement for the staging, was tiring. And you are right again....there was not some calm psycho in their home that night...with time to kill...writing an almost three page RN. It was written out of desperation.
 
http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/notorious_murders/famous/ramsey/book_10.html

During the interview, Thomas described how out of 73 suspects whose writing samples were analyzed by experts in comparison with the note, Patsy Ramsey was the only one who could not be excluded as its author. He also accused Patsy Ramsey of changing her handwriting after the murder. "In the ransom note, almost exclusively the lowercase manuscript a was used, I think, 98 percent of the time," he said. "What was telling was that after the Ramseys were given a copy of the ransom note, the lowercase manuscript a almost disappeared entirely from Patsy's post-homicide writing. Writing samples from Ramseys' personal letters and notes she wrote before the killing contain 732 manuscript a's that look like the lowercase typewritten a, but they are written by hand. She switched to a cursive a after the murder."

Another point that Thomas made was that the ransom note was signed "S.B.T.C." which allegedly stands for what the note described as "a small foreign faction" that had kidnapped JonBenet for a $118,000 ransom. Thomas indicated that this fact also pointed to Patsy Ramsey, as she often used acronyms. He cited a Christmas note to a friend that was signed "P.P.R.B.S.J.," which she said stood for "Patsy Paugh Ramsey, Bachelor of Science in Journalism." He also said the tear pattern of the ransom-note paper matched Patsy Ramsey's personal note pad, and the felt-tip pen used to write the note matched a pen found in a cup in the Ramseys' kitchen.





Had no idea about the underlined part,hmmm........

Hi Madeline. Ty for posting the link.

"Even the tear-pattern of the ransom-note paper matched Patsy Ramsey's personal note pad" ......

Well, even a match of the 'tear pattern'. That's a "hmmmm" for me.
 
Exactly!

Not only did Patsy call 911, but then they called over a bunch of their friends. Even though the note said that if they so much as talked to a "dog"...their daughter would die. Another thing...Patsy in her interview said that John was calm, cool and collected during this whole thing...so WHY didn't HE call 911????? Patsy admitted that she was "frantic". In a situation that requires 911 to be call....you don't get the person that is an emotional wreck to do it...you get the person that is calm, cool and collected to do it. IMO...Patsy was quite literally the drama queen...acting was her "thing"...so of course, she is going to be the only choice to make the 911 call. She wasn't even crying during the call...she just sounded out of breath for some reason...guess all of that running up and down the stairs to the basement for the staging, was tiring. And you are right again....there was not some calm psycho in their home that night...with time to kill...writing an almost three page RN. It was written out of desperation.

Hi Ames, Those are very interesting observations.


I was wondering ...... now, with the new touch dna evidence, why the BPD would not be be able to access the Ramsey's phone records for that night ........given the scenario that the IDI may have spent hours in the Ramsey's home.
 
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