GUILTY GA - Eight family members brutally murdered in Brunswick home, 29 Aug 2009

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sigsky said:
Looks like we may have a trial this year:

http://jacksonville.com/news/crime/2012-08-08/story/judge-faces-crucial-rulings-trial-guy-heinze-jr
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This part made me tear up.

BRUNSWICK - Blood-splattered children’s drawings may be among the evidence jurors see when Guy Heinze Jr. is tried for murder in the Aug. 29, 2009, beating deaths of his father and six others.

Whether prosecutors can use the pictures at trial, however, is still one of the issues presiding Superior Court Judge Stephen Scarlett must decide.
 
Soulmagent said:
30 to 45 days.

Anyone know if all the forensics are back from the state lab? Or if anything thing is?
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state says it still has stuff to test, doesn't sound to me like the slam dunk the state said it was when he was arrested,

so far all the evidence I have heard is he had blood on his shorts and moved a shotgun that had blood on it, he admits he was in trailer and saw bodies so defence can argue he got blood on him then, depends whose blood also, if it was Michaels (the teenage boy who had survived the initial attack but died later) then he should have his blood on him as according to him he found Michael at the door of the trailer and must have touched him when he realised he was alive,

the shotgun he said he moved as I have read he said he believed it was stolen so he moved it, he needs to explain why he even touched it, and why he removed it when LE has testified that he saw blood on it when he looked in Guys car, why would you touch a shotgun with blood on it when you had come home and found dead bloody bodies everywhere, who were your family, but then people do react/act in mystifying ways be they guilty or innocent when confronted with things like this,

not evidence but he admits he smoked crack night of murders, that is all that's been released so far,
 
oceanblueeyes said:
This part made me tear up.

BRUNSWICK - Blood-splattered children’s drawings may be among the evidence jurors see when Guy Heinze Jr. is tried for murder in the Aug. 29, 2009, beating deaths of his father and six others.

Whether prosecutors can use the pictures at trial, however, is still one of the issues presiding Superior Court Judge Stephen Scarlett must decide.
Click to expand...

Would it be too much to decide this case just based on the facts? What purpose does bringing in these drawings serve other than to play on the emotions of the jury. I hope the state has more pertinent evidence than this.

I am somewhat dismayed at the lack of media coverage of these hearings. I suspect Guy is destined to be quietly tucked away on death row. The case is too old and there is too much fresher news for this trial to gain any national traction. I've been trying to keep an open mind but I am steadily coming to the opinion that he is probably the lone perpetrator.
 
the drawings will be used to sway the jury emotionally, defence and state do all they can to have an emotional impact on a jury, they have yet to do any testing on the drawings to see whose blood is on them, so until or unless they do so I can't see the judge letting them in,

I am no longer shocked or surprised at the capriciousness of national media as to which victims or crimes get the most media traction,
 
joe jones said:
the drawings will be used to sway the jury emotionally, defence and state do all they can to have an emotional impact on a jury, they have yet to do any testing on the drawings to see whose blood is on them, so until or unless they do so I can't see the judge letting them in,

I am no longer shocked or surprised at the capriciousness of national media as to which victims or crimes get the most media traction,
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I was wondering what children did the drawings? Was it the 2 year old?

Or the 15/yo?

Were they pictures made years before? Or a 2 year olds artwork. Not that it matters it is pretty sad all arround but I did question it. The ages for childrens drawings among the victims is so wide that it made me question why they would be called childrens drawings verses artwork ,which IMO would fit much better as 2 year olds scribble and teens are not what you would picture making childrens drawings. Micheal however may have made child like drawings. Doesnt make it a childs drawing. So ,yeah I guess it is about the emotional impact.
 
joe jones said:
state says it still has stuff to test, doesn't sound to me like the slam dunk the state said it was when he was arrested,

so far all the evidence I have heard is he had blood on his shorts and moved a shotgun that had blood on it, he admits he was in trailer and saw bodies so defence can argue he got blood on him then, depends whose blood also, if it was Michaels (the teenage boy who had survived the initial attack but died later) then he should have his blood on him as according to him he found Michael at the door of the trailer and must have touched him when he realised he was alive,

the shotgun he said he moved as I have read he said he believed it was stolen so he moved it, he needs to explain why he even touched it, and why he removed it when LE has testified that he saw blood on it when he looked in Guys car, why would you touch a shotgun with blood on it when you had come home and found dead bloody bodies everywhere, who were your family, but then people do react/act in mystifying ways be they guilty or innocent when confronted with things like this,

not evidence but he admits he smoked crack night of murders, that is all that's been released so far,
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I also read earlier that blood was found on his underwear and the walking shorts he was wearing.

I dont think it is going to be easy to explain away. The first thing LE does is to get the person who 'found' the victim is to show them in detail everywhere they went and what they touched. So he is locked in to whatever he told them.

Also the type of blood found on his clothing can be highly significant. If it was blood spatter then that shows the blood was airborn at the time and landed on his clothing.

Still testing items doesnt show me this is a weak case whatsoever. The DA will continue to test items because if not... the defense will try to make something of it and why they didnt test that particular item. In the Cesar Lauren case the DA didnt even get the results back on the weapon he used to strike Maria Lauterbach in the head until 17 days before trial.

I imagine all evidence (discovery) will have to be done and presented to the defense 30 days before the trial commences. That is usually the cutoff time.

I have a feeling they will have quite a few lay witnesses too. Imo, something was going on in that family in regards to Jr and I think people knew it and will testify about it.

I also have a feeling that he may have been seen coming and going from the MHP when he told LE he was elsewhere. I remember when he was arrested the PC commented they had received results back from the lab on one of the items and they also had a witness come forward and that was enough to get probable cause to arrest and charge him with the murders and attempted murder.

IMO
 
sigsky said:
Would it be too much to decide this case just based on the facts? What purpose does bringing in these drawings serve other than to play on the emotions of the jury. I hope the state has more pertinent evidence than this.

I am somewhat dismayed at the lack of media coverage of these hearings. I suspect Guy is destined to be quietly tucked away on death row. The case is too old and there is too much fresher news for this trial to gain any national traction. I've been trying to keep an open mind but I am steadily coming to the opinion that he is probably the lone perpetrator.
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I dont really know why they are wanting this evidence in. It is hard to question them when we do not know the relevance. The blood spatter may have some significance as to whom it belonged to and where the drawings were located at the time. Perhaps it is to show if the person was standing, kneeling.. or laying on the floor when struck.

Often items are shown in court when the lead detective is testifying or by the forensic experts who are explaining how the victims were murdered and what the blood patterns told them. For all we know now it could have a smeared or bloody fingerprint of the defendant on them. I guess we will have to wait and see.

We have seen some very bloody gruesome and totally heartbreaking items displayed in other court cases before so this is not new. If the drawings show a particular pattern of blood perhaps the velosity of the swings then I think it should come in but of course that will be up to the Judge.

The DA sure didnt make the blood spatter wind up on the child's drawings. It is what it is. This is going to be an extremely hard case for any juror to get through. None of it is going to be pretty or whitewashed and it shouldnt be, imo.

Imo, it is no more devastating than when the DA brought in the stuff animal and black plastic garage bag that Couey used when he buried Jessica Lunsford alive after he had raped her for three days. Or bringing in the actual reciprocating saw Melanie McQuire used to cut her husband's body up.

Murder cases are often times very gruesome and so is the evidence and this one certainly is one of the worst since all the victims were bludgeoned to death and there are so many multiple victims in this case.

As for as the media....there really hasnt been that much to report. When there is any activity the media does report on it everytime.

I dont think this case will get national coverage or be televised on InSessions. Although they may mention it during their daily newscasts. I sure wish that it would be on IS but I expect they may be airing other cases. Although we have had a lot of Georgia cases shown on CTV/IS in the past but those were ones in the northern to middle part of the state.

However once the trial starts I certainly think Georgia and Florida reporters will be there in the courtroom everyday and will cover it until the verdict and if convicted...on to the sentencing phase.

IMO
 
houndstooth said:
I live in the neighboring county. I pass by this MHP several times a week.
Including the night before the murders.

I live a rather synchronicitous life.
Here is what happened the night before that I saw.

I was travelling north on 17 around 9:20pm.
I noticed a car pulled over by a cop on the side of the road.

A short way onward, I passed another one. With someone pulled over.
This is VERY unusual. So that when I was some distance from the drive to New Hope, I
could see from a long way off a car sitting there with their lights on under the streetlight. Normally, I wouldn't have paid any attention, but I was wondering if when I got closer it was going to be another cruiser and wondered what was up.

Because there was no traffic and the car could have pulled out at any time but chose to just sit there I was slowing down reflexively thinking "I don't want to get pulled over!".
But, when I was just about 75 yrds out, I could see it was like a gold Gran Torino, or some 80's 90's bomb. So I was just phew! When simultaneously a white equally beater station wagon pulled in behind it from the Park. As soon as I passed by on 17 the gold car pulled out squeeling tires in the opposite direction.
I watched it wondering what the heck! until the road curved and I didn't see if the white station wagon follow it.

The next morning of course I read about the murders at the Park. I immediately remembered the cars out by the road the night before and felt they may have been involved. I thought of it for a couple days wondering should I tell police or would that just be adding some wild goose chase info. I lived next door to some cops practically, so I decided when I saw them home I would just tell them the story.

I did. And though they aren't in that jurisdiction I thought they may have SOME info.
So I asked did Heinze happen to drive a gold car? He said yes, he thought he did.
But, he completely just dismissed my account and said it didn't bear any follow up.
And for me not to worry. I said thanks. I was relieved.

I think about it though all the time, nonetheless. I didn't really SEE anything.
It was the night before except, there may have been someone else who might.
You know?
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I see this link mentions the kind of car GuyJr was driving.

http://jacksonville.com/news/crime/...unswick-mass-murder-want-indictment-dismissed

And when he was questioned whether there were guns inside the residence, Heinze responded there were, but he had taken out a shotgun that he believed to have been stolen and put it in the trunk of the Mercury Cougar he was driving, Stalvey testified.

Read more at Jacksonville.com: http://jacksonville.com/news/crime/...urder-want-indictment-dismissed#ixzz23DQseHhi
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I thought it was also stated somewhere once,it was a hatchback but I maybe mistaken. Because this link refers to the trunk lid .

Heinze agreed, but Stalvey testified when he raised the trunk lid he didn’t touch the shotgun because it appeared to have blood on it.
Click to expand...


Has anyone ever heard of this case?

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30097
 
Soulmagent said:
I see this link mentions the kind of car GuyJr was driving.

http://jacksonville.com/news/crime/2012-08-06/story/lawyers-man-accused-brunswick-mass-murder-want-indictment-dismissed



I thought it was also stated somewhere once,it was a hatchback but I maybe mistaken. Because this link refers to the trunk lid .




Has anyone ever heard of this case?

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30097
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I remember this case vividly. Tifton is about 45 miles from where I live and its about 135 miles away from Brunswick.

They caught all three of them were found guilty and they were sentenced. 2 male defendants and one female defendant.

The motive was robbery because some Mexicans are leery of banks and are known to keep a large amount of cash on them.

Five men were killed and at least six other people were wounded in what appeared to be a string of robberies targeting Hispanic immigrants at trailer parks in and around Tifton in September 2005.

http://www.news4jax.com/news/Tift-C...rants/-/475880/2063632/-/15l4tv3/-/index.html
 
oceanblueeyes said:
Also the type of blood found on his clothing can be highly significant. If it was blood spatter then that shows the blood was airborn at the time and landed on his clothing.
Click to expand...

I haven't followed this case, just searched and found it to see how it turned out. Surprised to see it hasn't even gone to trial yet.

Yes the blood on his clothing will be a HUGE big deal. I would expect blood splatter to be all over the killer, in his hair, on the back of his shirt, shoulders etc.... I am doubtful that Heinz could have done this by himself.

This is sooooo very much like the Woolfolk murders (circa 1885, Bibb County), 7 family members killed with an axe and the sole survivor, the son, was charged and tried even though it seemed very unlikely one person could have done it. Ocean if you haven't read the book about it, Shadow Chasers, you should, it is a fascinating and rather sad story.
 
Sonya610 said:
I haven't followed this case, just searched and found it to see how it turned out. Surprised to see it hasn't even gone to trial yet.

Yes the blood on his clothing will be a HUGE big deal. I would expect blood splatter to be all over the killer, in his hair, on the back of his shirt, shoulders etc.... I am doubtful that Heinz could have done this by himself.

This is sooooo very much like the Woolfolk murders (circa 1885, Bibb County), 7 family members killed with an axe and the sole survivor, the son, was charged and tried even though it seemed very unlikely one person could have done it. Ocean if you haven't read the book about it, Shadow Chasers, you should, it is a fascinating and rather sad story.
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Another case comes to mind, that of the Deering family murders in 1866 in Philadelphia. Six members of the family and two others were killed by a hired hand. Axed to death. The murderer claimed that he had an accomplice, but none was ever found. The defense argued at his trial that it was unlikely one man could have done this. He was convicted, though, and executed soon after.

http://murderbygasslight.blogspot.com/2012/04/horror.html
 
well there case is weakend a little further, seems they got the evidence on the shorts in but only after a fight, if they had lost that I wonder how much evidence they would have left, and as reported he did say he must have got the blood on his shorts when he went into the scene as I am pretty certain if he is the killer the clothes he wore to do the killing would not be the same clothes he wore to return to the trailer,

and am beyond horrified to read the state may wish to use Byron as a witness, he was 2-3 when it happened, he has no place ever being in a court recounting anything he may or may not know, he is 6 now but what on earth can he offer as a reliable memory when he was a baby who suffered brain injuries,
says alot to me about the states case if they wish to use a witness who was 2-3 at time of murders,

in my opinion he will be damaged further if asked to do this
 
pleased to read they took fingernail scrapings from under the victims nails, I wonder if the hair found was pulled out from the root therefore there could be DNA

and some of the DNA will be finished testing on Friday, sounds like the judge wants this case finally resolved
 
joe jones said:
well there case is weakend a little further, seems they got the evidence on the shorts in but only after a fight, if they had lost that I wonder how much evidence they would have left, and as reported he did say he must have got the blood on his shorts when he went into the scene as I am pretty certain if he is the killer the clothes he wore to do the killing would not be the same clothes he wore to return to the trailer,

and am beyond horrified to read the state may wish to use Byron as a witness, he was 2-3 when it happened, he has no place ever being in a court recounting anything he may or may not know, he is 6 now but what on earth can he offer as a reliable memory when he was a baby who suffered brain injuries,
says alot to me about the states case if they wish to use a witness who was 2-3 at time of murders,

in my opinion he will be damaged further if asked to do this
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The shorts with blood on it is compelling evidence or the state wouldnt want it in. If he got blood on them it would have to be transfer blood if it was going to help him. With the defense fighting for it not to be entered shows me it isnt blood that was transferred. It also has to belong to Michael only. We know he did not check on everyone because Byron was alive yet he never mentions him needing help ASAP! It is obvious imo that Jr is no rocket scientist. The hiding of the weapon is proof of that. So he may have thought that LE would think the blood on his shorts came from him kneeling by Michael. I am sure he did not know that much can be learned by the pattern of the blood found.

What will sink his ship is if the bloody shorts show blood spatter. Blood spatter can only be applied when the blood is airborne and struck the shorts as he bludgeoned them to death. Or if other victims blood is found on the shorts mixed together. That will be a major problem.

A police officer can read from their notes if they talked with Byron. He was three at the time and I dont know how close to four he was. Christa Worthington's little girl was only 2 years old at the time her mother was murdered. In the trial a female police officer testified to what Amy told her. Also in the Jessie Davis case her child Blake was 2 years old at the time. His statements of "mommy's in the rug' and 'daddy hurt mommy' came into the trial. So there are other ways of getting Bryon's statements in. There is nothing that says Bryon had permanent brain damage. From what I have read he is doing great.

I think they have plenty of other evidence but it makes sense that they want his clothing entered. That tells me it does show that this not transference blood but something much more sinister and they also have the weapon that he hid and then lied that it was stolen. Why would he lie about that when he had to know it belonged to one of the adult men that lived in the home with him? Why would he even hide a shotgun with a splintered butt? How could he have the wherewithall to even think about a gun when he supposedly had just seen the most gruesome scene of his life? The police officer immediately saw blood on the shotgun but Jr didnt see it?

As far as some of his statements being dropped some of them will not be. And I believe he told the officers about the shotgun when he was at the scene and on scene officers' testimony the Judge allowed in.


imo
 
From those articles they hope to have a trial before the end of this year, about time, I am eagerly looking forward to hearing the evidence state has and whether they have a strong case
 
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