Casey & Family Psychological Profile #8

Status
Not open for further replies.
Thankyou Chiquita! For some reason this post brought me back to the beginning when KC(first jail visit with family) immediately felt she needed to appease her parents with the comment, "Don't worry I didn't say anything." I know we have beat this statement up but since reading RP LE interview It makes me feel that the subject was immediate as in the last couple of mon. and the visit may have been entirely different had KC not have said that. From that moment on they talked to kC as if she was at camp, they apologized for not being good parents (GA), telling her she didn't have to work when Caylee is found, on and on and on. I'v been so frustrated that I find myself googling the most out of the box searches to find more. Just to give peeps a sample, I found that CMA also stands for Crystal Meth Anoneymous. Told you I was frustratingly board.

---------------------------
Hi Karen, your CMA has me ROFLOL..I also think about that statement,many times.I feel it is an important fact because no one has mentioned it since.There is a secret there ~ I pray I live long enough for the trial,( LOL) to find out what it is.If this case doesn;t drive us all to drink,nothing will.:clap: Take care.
 
I have a question about denying the pregnancy. we know that the Anthony's denied pregnancy to the outside world, but do we know if they denied it between themselves? Keeping the dates open to question would help to keep ma father out of the picture.

Paternity is a bit OT, but it does relate to the family dynamics so hopefully we can keep it along that vein.

I just don't see how CA did not Not know her only daughter was pregnant. JMO but I think the whole family knew, they just didn't want everyone else knowing. You would think CA would have purchased KC baggy clothing to wear to the wedding weekend though. The A's lie, they just don't do it well.
 
I have a question about denying the pregnancy. we know that the Anthony's denied pregnancy to the outside world, but do we know if they denied it between themselves? Keeping the dates open to question would help to keep ma father out of the picture.

Paternity is a bit OT, but it does relate to the family dynamics so hopefully we can keep it along that vein.

-------------
They probably did. Casey gets ready to go to the hospital,G and C are pacing :bigstick:Casey says "why all the excitement, I'm just having a wart removed". LOL..sorry I'm sick and on a med that blows me away.:Banane51:
 
Or maybe the guy was married then and still is. It could be as simple as that.

Could be, but I don't think The A's would take the Moral High Ground over money. JMO but if CA thought she could squeeze a nickel out of some guy to help with expenses, I think she would have pushed KC to do so.
 
Could be, but I don't think The A's would take the Moral High Ground over money. JMO but if CA thought she could squeeze a nickel out of some guy to help with expenses, I think she would have pushed KC to do so.
Exactly my thoughts ! First I really think Cindy knew about Casey's pregnancy early on and told Casey that it needed to be kept from her father and brother for as long as they could. I remember George telling LE about the day they (Casey and Cindy) had to sit him down and tell him he was going to be a Grandfather.

I wonder how many of them (besides Casey) knew Jesse was not the father and when did they find that out ? Richard seems to think they knew looong before the test came back, I wouldn't be surprised at all.

After Jesse was proven to not be Caylee's father, I would think George would have been all over Casey about who the father is. Like usual, I wonder if that's when Cindy stepped in and pushed him away from Casey ?

How and when they came up with this dead father story, IDK, but I bet it was invented to shut George up after Jesse's paternity test came back negative.
 
I will say up front that I do not support the DP, just a general disclaimer.

But your post made me think of something and so I want to pose the question. is the DP almost a 'distraction" to a murder trial? What I mean is, because a life is at stake, do the gloves come off and as you say anything and everything really are fair game? How different would it be if there was not DP on the table in terms of bringing the family dynamics into the courtroom?
or would it really be the same?

Very good point. It will be very different, during the penalty phase. I imagine that the ...uh, discord...that existed between CA and KC will be eluded to during trial (the state's case in chief). ie, controlling mother, the fact that CA held Caylee before KC, and other random facts to plant seeds in the jurors' minds. HOWEVER, the penalty phase will be much, much more invasive. The gloves will come off and AL will fill us all in on ALL the family secrets. At that point AL's ONLY job will be to create sympathy and to give the jurors a reason...any reason...not to impose the DP. My $$$ is on AL. She will be spilling every secret known about the Anthonys. I've read up on her a lot since she joined the Defense team. More often than not, she traces everything back to childhood dysfunction. I'm betting Cindy has studied her, too. I have often wondered about that day in court - when AL was introduced but before her pro hac vice had been filed - Cindy was in bad shape that day. Obviously had been crying before she even walked into the courthouse. I wondered then if her sadness had anything to do with what she read, or had been told about AL. Just when CA would think things couldn't get any worse....

It is sad really. I don't approve of much CA has done in raising Casey or, for that matter, much of anything she has done since June 16, 2008. However, I know how important image is to her and I hate to see any of the Anthonys suffer even more humiliation. I guess I think losing Caylee and losing their daughter to prison (LWOP) is enough.
 
CA knew she was pregnant... she had to

i bet LE has the songram records.......:eek: and witness statements when CA was in the office with KC :crazy:
 
I have a question about denying the pregnancy. we know that the Anthony's denied pregnancy to the outside world, but do we know if they denied it between themselves? Keeping the dates open to question would help to keep ma father out of the picture.

Paternity is a bit OT, but it does relate to the family dynamics so hopefully we can keep it along that vein.

Looks like I'm pretty much alone in my thinking, but I am not convinced that they acknowledged it between themselves at all. Hanging out by myself again on this one, but I do believe CA especially lived in a state of denial. If she didn't acknowledge it, it didn't really exist.

Today I reviewed old FBI interviews of GA. He talks about one time Lee picked KC up from somewhere (the airport, maybe?) and Lee asked about the obvious protruding belly.....I can't recall exactly what he asked, but he shot straight with her...something along the lines of, "So who is the daddy?" or "When is the baby due?". KC replied with something like, "oh no, not pregnant, just badly bloated". GA said it made Lee furioius that KC lied to him and tried to sell him that. According to GA, that incident severely damaged Lee and KC's relationship.

eta: sorry for not linking that FBI interview, but there are 7 videos. I don't recall which one, but I'm pretty sure it is after #3. I had no clue this would come up or I would have paid attention! lol
 
I don't member how it went over to the jury but D. Downs pulled the incest card about her dad. I can sure see this happening here to.
 
I have a hard time with the word "denial" to CA. She maneuvers a conversation to the spot where she is in control of beliefs/truth of the statments or questions. If she doean't like what is being said then she changes the wording to suit how she wants the message to be. I just have a hard time calling that denial.
 
I have a hard time with the word "denial" to CA. She maneuvers a conversation to the spot where she is in control of beliefs/truth of the statments or questions. If she doean't like what is being said then she changes the wording to suit how she wants the message to be. I just have a hard time calling that denial.

I agree with everything you just said, Mama. :blowkiss:


I'm talking about the kind of denial where you stick your head deep into the sand when you can't handle acknowledging the obvious because...."well, that can't be. that just wouldn't happen in my family." I do think she did a lot of that.
 
I'm going to start by saying I expect to receive alot of dissenting opinions but... I'm putting it out there anyway...

I don't believe that KC is a "true sociopath" at least not clinically speaking... She does exhibit quite a few of the traits associated with sociopathy, narcissism, depression , anxiety and dare I say it? PTSD.... I'm sorry, but she does...

True sociopaths are born that way and the evidence will present itself in early childhood and before the age of 15. As far as I can tell, and please someone correct me if I am wrong, but it is my understanding that KC was able to express positive emotions and feelings for people, was very well behaved in school, never in any trouble and made good grades... until she dropped out right before graduation in 2004. I would really love to know the reason why she did because I see that as the jumping off point for the buildup that had been occurring for years. [WARNING SIGN #1]

Sociopathic behavior (along with the other myriad of potential KC diagnosis) is a learned response. KC was raised in a home with a mother that has been described as having & has on several occasions exhibited the following characteristics in public; inconsistent maternal enforcement of rules, loud arguments between the parents, low maternal educational aspirations for the child, maternal difficulty controlling anger toward the child, maternal possessiveness, maternal use of guilt to control the child, maternal verbal abuse, paternal assistance to the child's mother, and paternal fulfillment of the role of father. (I posted that description earlier) [WARNING SIGN #2]

It is my contention that something happened in early 2004 to cause KC to quit school just shy of graduation and then find herself pregnant within 6 months or so.... I suspect the pressure to be perfect was finally building and KC was rebelling a little more at a time. My gut tells me that KC was raped either by placing herself into a compromising situation (and feels responsible) or she truly was forcibly raped... either way it would be traumatic enough to possibly cause PSTD and get the ball rolling with her new persona. [WARNING SIGN #3]

Regardless of whether or not she was raped, it is evident that she did not want to be pregnant. I would not doubt that she denied to herself that she was pregnant long before she finally had no other choice but to admit it to her parents. She confessed to at least one friend that she did not want the baby and wanted to give it up for adoption but that her mother was making her have the baby. Yet another example of CA's controlling behavior and now KC is really trapped with her parents. I'll go ahead and now say that, in and of itself may have caused some PTSD... throw in some major hormone changes before and after birth (PPD) (especially in that house) and we (the outside observers) could pull up our lawn chairs and wait for the top to fly off the pressure cooker. [WARNING SIGNS # 4 & #5]

However.... KC wasn't fully cooked yet.... she had a relationship with Jesse that would have provided an escape from her parent's house (but still probably not from under CA's thumb) but that relationship failed.... It appears that event was yet another stepping stone in her downward spiral... from what I can tell, it seems as though that time frame corresponds to when the excessive lying, stealing from family and promiscuity really started to take off... the sociopathic/narcissistic/adjustment disorder with mixed anxiety and depression KC was emerging from her cocoon.. [WARNING SIGNS #6, #7 & #8]

Jesse reports in November that he had thought about getting back together with KC but she had changed. Jesse also reports that KC had a seizure (I know alot about this has been discussed) but random seizures (with no prior history) can be another warning sign from your body that something is wrong in your brain, chemically and/or structurally, add that to the other stressors in KC’s life and the disorder pot starts boiling even harder. [WARNING SIGNS #9 & #10]

I know that she told two different friends on two separate occasions that she wanted to check herself into a mental hospital, telling them she was depressed and felt trapped. I believe the last call was in December/January 2008 (again, correct me if I am wrong). [WARNING SIGNS #11 & #12]

I believe by February 2008 KC was beginning to fantasize about her parents being out of her life and possibly Caylee as well (if only to spite her mother).. By March 2008 (when the computer searches began) she was starting to consider it even more and jumped from fantasizing to planning. She was looking for ways to accomplish the task when the day would come…. [WARNING SIGN #13 - in all fairness this would be hard to detect unless you were searching for it]

However… Given the dates below… regardless of whether or not she had actually completed all she needed for her “mission”… the middle of June appears to be the timeframe she was targeting anyway.

May 13th - KC starts talking to Amy about moving in together and that CA would be signing the house over to her in mid-June. About 3 weeks later Amy says that CA took back the agreement because she had 30 days to do so.... then said 2 days later GA was cheating on CA. (setting up murder/suicide?)

May 19th - KC provides Amy with a tentative move-in date of June 18th...

June 13th KC says GA has a mini-stroke and she can't go to Jax with Amy to get her car...

June15th - CA & Caylee visit GGP's.... alleged blowup fight at the A's that evening; CA strangles KC.

June 16th - KC & Caylee leave without taking extra clothes. They come back to the house and well... by now... KC has officially "snapped"… it was probably the night before but obviously she is in “mission mode”…. it is anyone's guess as to the exact method; duct tape to silence, to smother her mouth & nose, put her in the pool to drown/suffocate w/ the tape on, taped her up, wrapped her in the pooh blanket, put her in the laundry bag and then into the plastic bin in her car and drove away... then put her in garbage bags before she dumped her in the woods (to make it look like trash instead of a body)... and of course there is the possibility that part of her “mission mode” was that the duct tape was placed to make it look like a kidnapping so KC wouldn't be blamed when she was found… which brings us to the lying and how could anyone be that stupid to think that anyone is going to believe this story…

APD's are not always skilled liars because they expect their victims to believe what they say and don't know how to react when people don't buy their stories... they are very capable of turning off interpersonal connections when they are faced with the truth or stressful events. During acts that they know are wrong but just don't care enough to stop themselves it is very easy for them to disassociate themselves from what they are doing. That provides them with the ability to commit violent acts without feeling remorse.

KC’s lack of emotions except when she is the one being punished are good visual demonstrations of her disassociation with Caylee (no tears) and show that her only concern is for herself (tears). It is abundantly evident when people talk about Caylee, she shows no emotion except hostility and redirects the focus to KC as the victim. She only demonstrates tears when discussing her own suffering or punishment.

In summary... CA & GA provided an environment that would foster emotional and psychological damage by predisposing KC to their own maladaptive parental disorders. [Parents battling for control over one another & their offspring, insisting always on perfection, lying when it is not and literally getting away with murder for years… again, its learned behavior…]

And please don't misunderstand... I speak from experience... I could be a poster child for the most messed up family in the US but instead I prefer to be grateful that I didn't end up on the back of a milk carton.... I have little sympathy for people that grow up in very dysfunctional households and consistently blame their parents as the reason they are unable to function in society as well as others. If are you are able to recognize that you have a problem; then you are able to do something about it.... get help; therapy, medication - BOTH (trust me)... or at least have a warning label tattooed on your forehead for the rest of us to know that you are BSC...
(if I had a nickel....)
 
I have a question about denying the pregnancy. we know that the Anthony's denied pregnancy to the outside world, but do we know if they denied it between themselves? Keeping the dates open to question would help to keep ma father out of the picture.

Paternity is a bit OT, but it does relate to the family dynamics so hopefully we can keep it along that vein.

I agree - those sonogram pix on the wall of KC or Caylee's room (seemed to have been put up after all the redecorating efforts) always struck me as strange. I'm wondering if we could revisit old pictures (were they in the Jennifer D interview or perhaps the People Magazine?) and have a medical professional look at them, then we could certainly tell at what stage they were.

If they were prior to seven months, (and assuming they were KC's and not something lying around the Gentiva office that later became wall art Chez Hopespring), then we know for sure that CA at least knew about the pregnancy much earlier (and had the decency to get her the medical attention a former nurse would have certainly have insisted her own daughter received). If they were taken seven months or later, well, then that might support that theory that sometime after the Rick's wedding and before the birth, KC had them taken. It was too long ago for me to remember, but I know I had sonograms much earlier than seven months in pregnancy. I don't know the protocol, either about how early and how often they are taken these days (or in what instances they are taken in the last trimester), but perhaps a younger mom or medical professional could answer that.

It just seemed to me a little odd that those sonograms were proudly displayed on the wall, when in reality, if a nurse grandmother was claiming to have neglected to not only discover her daughter's condition until the third trimester, but failed to seek medical health during the first two critical trimesters to make sure everything was going well and that KC was following all the normal instructions(prenatal vitamins, attention to blood pressure, detecting or preventing common prenatal problems, etc) she wouldn't have advertised that as family photo art.

So, either CA was clearly lying to the public about her ignorance of KC's condition while in private she was taking proper care of a pregnant daughter, or she was telling the truth to the public about her embarrassing inability to detect pregnancy as a medical professional, as well as admitting providing improper medical attention to a pregnant teenager due to said ignorance or naivete. Either way she doesn't come out looking like the "great mom" she claims she is to the FBI.

I hope some talented sleuther can help us put this together...because I think the answer does directly bear on the topic of the thread.
 
What does "PTSD" mean?
That's Post Traumatic Stress Disorder. It was frequently diagnosed in war vets back in the Vietnam era, but now is also recognized in people who have suffered various types of trauma like abusive childhoods, victim of a violent crime, etc...

Ooops, I didn't see all the responses before I posted.
 
Thanks e-body.
I sure was hoping it was something to do with "multiple personalities". LOL
 
Thanks e-body.
I sure was hoping it was something to do with "multiple personalities". LOL

We need a smilie with the little guy pulling the pin on a grenade and just rolling it right across the floor, lmao....

:HBwhiteflag:

lubyoumucho mama!
 
Yes, I know alot of people do not have fathers in their lives. But everyone egg needs a sperm. There is no acknowlegement of said sperm in Caylee's life.

It does happen.
I have no clue who my father is.
My mother (who was a lunatic) wouldn't tell me who he was.
Literally said it was none of my business.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
184
Guests online
4,402
Total visitors
4,586

Forum statistics

Threads
591,842
Messages
17,959,896
Members
228,622
Latest member
crimedeepdives23
Back
Top