MO - Lisa Irwin, 10 months, Kansas City, 4 Oct 2011 - #4

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Maybe there is a rift in the family about cooperating with LE. I suppose that it could be that someone in the family decided to stop cooperating and said so to the police, then others in the family said "what the heck did you do a stupid thing like that for?" or "speak for yourself, I'm sticking with LE". If they are spending the evening trying to talk some sense in to one or more family members, that could explain delaying a full statement until the morning.

If the family is experiencing a difference of opinion, I predict that someone hasn't told the others the whole truth and will be found out pretty quick.
 
What was that ladies name and why wasn't it published. How do we even know she is family or how do the reporters know?
 
LaLaw2000 said:
I have not read all of the posts on this thread yet, but am catching up.

I think it is okay now to say what I have been thinking all along since LE has announced that the parents are no longer cooperating.

LE has always made it a point to state that the parents are cooperating. They have never stated that the parents were cleared, IIRC. We all know LE works from the family on out to clear people. They have not been able to totally clear the family at all. They only stated that they were cooperating.

Now if we de-personalize this situation and just look at what we know, there are plenty of red flags, IMO. We know that it has been stated that the window was not the point of entry. We know that the fiance came home from work and found the lights on in the home and the front door unlocked (that has to be a first for a kidnapper!). I read that the far right window had been tampered with. IMO, LE and the FBI could absolutely determine whether the window was the point of entry such as the dust on the outside window sill, etc..

Then comes the story that the fiance checked the boys and baby Lisa's room determining that she was gone. Why would he rush in and tell Debbie that baby Lisa was gone???? How would he know that she had not taken the baby to bed with her because the baby was sick???

Jeremy and Debbie rush around the house looking for baby Lisa. Why? I will never believe that a 10 month old could climb out of a crib.

The parents then find that 3 cell phones were missing. Okay, but LE and the FBI would be able to get an emergency warrant to get the cell phone records, IMO, in order to look at recent calls and to track the cell phones themselves. I do not understand the missing cell phones, the lights on, and the front door unlocked left that way by kidnappers.

Baby Lisa had a cough. Could she have overdosed on cough medicine accidently? Did they panic and dispose of baby Lisa? I agree that this mother is totally heartbroken and frightened. She has lost a beautiful, happy baby and baby Lisa was her only daughter. Even if an accident happened, she would still be heartbroken and the sobbing be real.

I'm sorry, but this whole story had me in doubt from the beginning and I knew I couldn't come right out and say it. Now that the parents are no longer cooperating with LE, I am even more afraid that something happened to baby Lisa right there in her own home. There is a story that does not make sense, and LE & FBI cannot seem to clear them. LE and the FBI probably started with the really tough questions the parents either could not answer or did not want to answer, IMO, and they stopped cooperating. Captain Young had to know what the general public would think when that announcement was made.

Please, God, let me be terribly wrong.

MOO, MOO, MOO.
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Sadly the events surrounding this case sound all too familiar.
Door unlocked and lights on is not a first-think Haleigh Cummings case!
Dad at work when abduction occured, one of the first stories in the media was Dad came home from work, found Haleigh missing and woke Misty then the story changed. Granted she was not 10 mos. but they stated they looked for her before calling LE. LE states family/those close to Haleigh are cooperating then after awhile they no longer are. LE does not name any suspects but clears no one. They state "everyone is a suspect".
Overdose and inside job, yes, it is possible in both cases. jmo
 
Okay as to the cel phones and when they were revealed as missing, I am putting this one to bed with Steve Young's own statement. Emphasis added by me.

"I can confirm that the family told us that there are three cellphones missing from the home. They told us that that morning. What the detectives have done with that I don't know," said Capt. Young earlier on Thursday. "Clearly it hasn't led to a big break in the case or I'd probably be able to talk about it. I can't get into details of what we're doing but it's safe to say we're leaving no stone unturned."


ETA this paragraph
(I am taking that THAT to mean THE morning of the event. Otherwise I think he would have said this morning. Now let the debates begin about if it means THAT morning the cel phones were discussed with media)

http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-lis...rch-for-missing-baby-20111006,0,2371703.story

As to the statement by the unidentified female that was contacted at the family home, I hope and pray that is not the case. I want to know who this unidentified female is, hopefully not their new family spokesperson and realllllly hopefully not a lawyer, if one is indeed involved at this point!
 
Dr.Fessel said:
What was that ladies name and why wasn't it published. How do we even know she is family or how do the reporters know?
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I read her name on one of the KC news sites....I'm not sure which one at this moment, I just closed all my tabs as I am about to head off to bed.

All I remember is they posted her last name as Irwin.

ETA: I found it...I don't know if I'm allowed to type it out?
It's on the front page here:
http://www.nbcactionnews.com/
 
TGIRecovered said:
Maybe there is a rift in the family about cooperating with LE. I suppose that it could be that someone in the family decided to stop cooperating and said so to the police, then others in the family said "what the heck did you do a stupid thing like that for?" or "speak for yourself, I'm sticking with LE". If they are spending the evening trying to talk some sense in to one or more family members, that could explain delaying a full statement until the morning.

If the family is experiencing a difference of opinion, I predict that someone hasn't told the others the whole truth and will be found out pretty quick.
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I think you are spot on with your analysis.
 
I don't think LE would have had a PC to say what they said if there was a simple misunderstanding between one family member and another...JMO
 
This is just so sad..going to bed with a heavy heart..will be praying Lisa comes home over night or tomorrow!
 
Most of us don't live our lives prepared for the possibility that the government is going to come into our homes and look into every nook and cranny, not only physically in our closets and drawers, but also delve into everything we've ever stored on our computers, cell phones, and everywhere else.

IMO, a very significant percentage of people have things on their computers that they would not like others to see. Maybe they photograph kinky things in the bedroom. Maybe they have an unusual fetish that would raise eyebrows. Maybe they play an online game, like Second Life, and keep logs of their activities as they experiment with things they would never, ever try in real life. There are countless things people do that are not necessarily even illegal, but are very private.

These are the kinds of intimate things that are, suddenly, no longer intimate when something like this happens. I like to think that every parent of a missing child would throw their doors open and welcome LE to look wherever and whenever they need to... but what if you know you are innocent and that the police rifling through your collection of beast *advertiser censored* is going to do nothing to help find your child, and everything to make LE and the public waste time looking in the wrong direction?

What do you do then? I don't know. Maybe LE accuses you of not cooperating when you say, "No, you can't look at my computer disks".

I'm not saying this has happened. I'm just saying.
 
~n/t~ said:
I agree. That's a heck of a lot of people who want harm done to your family. Why?
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Well, it could be something as simple as some of those people are those who have keys to your home. I don't know, just an idea...
 
AnonymousD said:
I read her name on one of the KC news sites....I'm not sure which one at this moment, I just closed all my tabs as I am about to head off to bed.

All I remember is they posted her last name as Irwin.

ETA: I found it...I don't know if I'm allowed to type it out?
It's on the front page here:
http://www.nbcactionnews.com/
Click to expand...

I could seriously kiss you right now!

Thank you.
 
elepher50 said:
Whoever that lady is speaking on behalf of the family, spoke very frankly and even thanked LE for all they are doing. I for one believe that the family is still cooperating with LE so what is LE up to??? WTH????
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I think the family realizes how bad it looks for them not to cooperate with the police and they are trying to do damage control. Also, I think this was a sister of the father's. She only knows what she has been told. Personally, unless there is some kind of strategy here, I believe LE right now.
 
Okay, all day with this cell phone back-and-forth, I was doubting myself, BUT, I *knew* I remembered seeing a series of posts based on a MSM article on the first day stating that the police had taken the parents' cell phones.

Here is the start of the discussion:
[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7185559&postcount=83"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - MO MO - AMBER ALERT: Lisa Irwin, 10 months, Kansas City, 4 Oct 2011 - #1[/ame]

I wonder if this is the same aunt as made the statement this evening, and I also wonder if she is related to the MikeLeRette who posted on the live feed that something besides Lisa was taken from the home.

This has been making me crazy all day. I may be crazy, but I'm not wrong, right?
 
Here I think this is the same lady in this video that spoke for the family tonight. She is standing in front of Jeremy and Debbie during the discussion.

***Debbie and Jeremy have a heated discussion with LE before speeding off in police car to command center to find out about possible new lead. http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-lisa...,5671503.story
 
Bravo tiredblondy, nice catch. :)
 
norest4thewicked said:
OK...I'm upset and have to get this off my chest. I haven't made a judgment on whether the parents are or are not involved in this, but it really makes me mad that people are insinuating that something is "wrong" with the dad because he isn't acting "right?" Tell me please how a person who has just been involved with causing their child to be missing "act?" And, how should a person "act" if they are innocent? This is ridiculous to think that any of us can know how a person should act! Maybe his mother or father or close friend would be able to read him, but I would propose that not one person on this board can do that!

This is a victim friendly site and I'm just tired of reading it.
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That sound you hear is my applause.

ETA: Throughout these threads I've been thinking about my son, daughter-in-law and my three grandmunchkins, ages 4, 2 and 9 months. My son is terrible about letting his phone die. My DIL keeps hers on the kitchen counter, away from the kids. They have no land line. Heck, the only person I know that still has a land line is my dad. My son has to work through the night sometimes. My grandson and oldest granddaughter choose their own sleepwear, including shorts and tee shirts sometimes. If something happened to one of their kids, there is no way the parents would be responsible. AND if the police kept focusing on son and DIL, my son would be fit to be tied...as would I. And I'd be calling every lawyer I knew to get someone to help us, pronto. And yes, if I thought the police were spinning their wheels, I'd "quit cooperating" (MIND YOU...that's LE's interpretation), and I'd be looking for any other avenues of help I could find...anyone who'd start looking beyond our family and toward anyone who might have taken the child. We would all be walking around like zombies and acting "off." And there'd be a ton of folks trying to nitpick any little thing to try to foist blame onto my son and DIL...and they would be dead wrong. So it is extremely upsetting to sit here and see these parents maligned over and over.
 
Did the LE really say that the children would "remain out of sight?"

Parents got upset today, LE tried to smooth it over. Reason not clear.

Is there any possibility that the two boys were placed in protective custody today?

Parents may have said they won't be cooperating with LE anymore. But I would almost bet that they will give a presser in the next couple of days. Either them or their attorney or family representative.
 
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