GUILTY GA - Lauren Giddings, 27, Macon, 26 June 2011 # 4

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<snipped> Not the most scientific explanation, but a little more about Right Brain/Left Brain thinking: http://delicategeniusblog.com/?p=552

PsychoMom (or others with pyschology or psychiatry training), what do you make of SMD's constant use of the words "I mean" interspersed throughout every statement he makes. In addition to being a habit of speaking, can it be that he is trying subconsciously to make himself (his true self) understood to the interviewer and the public? Why is it so important to him to establish a personal connection with the reporter? He is stating facts in great detail, but he seems concerned that she does not really understand him.

Or -- and say so if it is -- is the above paragraph of mine just psychobabble?
 
I respectfully disagree with PsychoMom's assessment as well.
But, to be fair, remember that unlike the other friends:
- he lives there, his car is trapped in the parking lot, and he has no place to go
- he is not "in" her circle of friends (and appears not to have any), so he has no one to talk to to get anything off his chest, etc...
- we already recognize from other things he's done that he's somewhat starved for attention

So, I guess his choices were to:
a. talk to reporters, who were the only people around willing to listen/talk to him
b. go for a walk and get away from the area
c. just sit somewhere in his own little bubble

b (or c) would have been a much better choice :)

Definitely agree that he should have walked away. I got the feeling he was just waiting to go home, and they found him. When he began talking, I saw someone just trying to give some information. I think he did want to talk it out with someone. This was someone that lived in the same place he did, so there is some concern no matter who you are. Someone living right next to you disappears, you are going to be concerned about safety issues. You know someone is missing and hear a body is found. You are going to be a little freaked out. I can see all of that as being normal reactions of someone innocent. Even the babbling afterward. Some people shut down when upset or shocked. Others start running off about every single moment they had contact with the person. The whos and whats start playing out in your head, and sometimes fall out of your mouth. Could be completely innocent. Or it could be back peddling.

I can't blame SM for murder based on the info we have been provided so far. I am holding out for more info. I can tell a lot of you think I am saying he is innocent of everything. I'm not. I am saying it isn't clearly him at this point, and because of it isn't clear, I want to work through other theories, too.

Back to the other video. I had no idea who this person was. No name was posted on it. I posted it because it was another 'friend' of LG, and he was discussing a lot about her and this incident. Many people on here focused on how SM reacted on his video when the body was found. They picked every little movement and word apart. Freezing single things into proof of his criminal mind. One recurring theme is looking down and to the left. That seems to scream lying murderer to a lot of people. I noticed this other person did that constantly. So, would that make him just as guilty?

To justiceforlauren, thank you for the link you provided. I think we can all take a lesson from LG's sister's comments:
"It's hard to believe, you want to hope that it's no one, but obviously someone did do this. I don't know, I'm not in the FBI or an investigator and we all have our theories in our head, but until we know for sure, 100 percent , we believe in the justice system and he [McDaniel] like everybody else is innocent until proven guilty,...and right now he's innocent," said Wheeler.
 
PsychoMom (or others with pyschology or psychiatry training), what do you make of SMD's constant use of the words "I mean" interspersed throughout every statement he makes. In addition to being a habit of speaking, can it be that he is trying subconsciously to make himself (his true self) understood to the interviewer and the public? Why is it so important to him to establish a personal connection with the reporter? He is stating facts in great detail, but he seems concerned that she does not really understand him.

Or -- and say so if it is -- is the above paragraph of mine just psychobabble?

lol! It can mean a lot of things, or it can mean nothing. Sometimes words are habits. How many people do you know who drop in the "like" word every 5 seconds? Or end every comment with "ya know what I mean?" He could be one of those. Or he could be so freaked out that he can't get the words out the way he wants to, so he keeps trying to get them clear in his head. Or he could be afraid he is coming off as insincere and trying to cover for himself. I am leaning towards the first two. Habit or freak out. But others will see it as insincere right off the bat.

Use your own judgment, but remain open to the other options. If you don't remain open to the other views, then you get tunnel vision. Once that happens, you will be blind to any other possibilities. You can miss out on a lot of other options bouncing around, and may miss out on the truth, as well. I am still open to anyone being the killer. I am playing it all out in my mind, looking at it both ways.
 
Hmmm... maybe she just tossed it, because she had already graduated, and felt that she didn't need it anymore?

I think it could be any number of things, but it could be just that she mislaid it or lost it somewhere. On the other hand, it could be significant. I just have never given that detail much thought space.

At this point, my mind is more on what will come out of this meeting with LE and the DA on Monday. I think we should expect something significant in advance of the bond hearing. (Of course, I think that every time a presser is called, so what do I know?!?:crazy:)
 
At this point, my mind is more on what will come out of this meeting with LE and the DA on Monday. I think we should expect something significant in advance of the bond hearing. (Of course, I think that every time a presser is called, so what do I know?!?:crazy:)

I believe that you're right. One way or another, we are going to know SOMETHING prior to next Thursday.
 
Post by Sandstorm

He also makes a comment about her car that is odd to me:
When asked by the reporter Michelle Quesada if that was Lauren's car. He states that "No that car was Detective Patterson's... Lauren's car had been there for days."
Why would he think that her car had been there for days? How would he know that she had not driven her car when he was not aware?

***************************
These are very tell tale signs for me.
What do you think about these points?
Your ideas are appreciated.
shortened for brevity

GREAT post, Sandstorm.

I noticed that too about what he said about Lauren's car, and I wondered the exact same thing.
 
Sorry, PhychoMom . . . With all respect for your professional opinion about SMD's demeanor on camera, I think you are neglecting to consider one of the most important questions here. WHY is he doing the interview at all?

How many of LG's law school friends, including those who looked for her Wed. night and went to the MPD with SMD on Thursday, consented to an interview? Zero. Why is that?

Several reasons: they are personally upset about the disappearance of their friend LG; and (later) even more upset about her death; and they consider this a personal loss. They want to be with and talk with their friends who knew LG, not to communicate with the public or explain things to a pushy reporter who did not know LG and is acting in a manner most of us would find offensive, wanting to record video of either anguish, maudlin sentimentality, or shock. Surely people don't want to display themselves to others at a time such as this.

After the friends are informed that LG has been killed, they realize that a crime has been committed and desire to cooperate fully with LE, but would think that media questions to them at this time are both intrusive and likely to not assist LE in solving the crime and arresting the perpetrator.

SMD, on the other hand, is moved to give all sorts of information in extreme detail. That is a defensible action, especially when he thinks LG is missing, but after he learns a body has been found, I think it indicates that he is making a terribly bad decision to attempt to sell the media on the alternative theories (snatched while running; hoodlums; BF) that he has thought through so many times in the past 5 days. He has rehearsed these facts and he wants to publish them, hence the continued interview after he regains his composure and returns from the ATT building.

He even remembers the name of the detective whose car in in front of the apts. He has been paying acute attention to all the details of the investigation, more than I think is normal.

More than anything else, though, the fact that he goes on camera repeatedly tells me he has a reason other than concern for Lauren Giddings.

Best post yet Thinman and ITA!
 
Something that I have been thinking about, and this may have already been discussed in a previous thread, but whatever happened to her Mercer ID? If you look in the police report, it says that her Mercer Student ID could not be found.

http://download.gannett.edgesuite.net/wmaz/docs/giddingsreport1.pdf

After reading the following article, it made me wonder if the killer kept it as a memento.

http://www.johndouglasmindhunter.com/articles/030213.php

I pointed that out early on, since it was noted in the police report.

I wondered if it was in whatever clothing she was wearing that night.
 
Sorry, PhychoMom . . . With all respect for your professional opinion about SMD's demeanor on camera, I think you are neglecting to consider one of the most important questions here. WHY is he doing the interview at all?

How many of LG's law school friends, including those who looked for her Wed. night and went to the MPD with SMD on Thursday, consented to an interview? Zero. Why is that?

Several reasons: they are personally upset about the disappearance of their friend LG; and (later) even more upset about her death; and they consider this a personal loss. They want to be with and talk with their friends who knew LG, not to communicate with the public or explain things to a pushy reporter who did not know LG and is acting in a manner most of us would find offensive, wanting to record video of either anguish, maudlin sentimentality, or shock. Surely people don't want to display themselves to others at a time such as this.

After the friends are informed that LG has been killed, they realize that a crime has been committed and desire to cooperate fully with LE, but would think that media questions to them at this time are both intrusive and likely to not assist LE in solving the crime and arresting the perpetrator.

SMD, on the other hand, is moved to give all sorts of information in extreme detail. That is a defensible action, especially when he thinks LG is missing, but after he learns a body has been found, I think it indicates that he is making a terribly bad decision to attempt to sell the media on the alternative theories (snatched while running; hoodlums; BF) that he has thought through so many times in the past 5 days. He has rehearsed these facts and he wants to publish them, hence the continued interview after he regains his composure and returns from the ATT building.

He even remembers the name of the detective whose car in in front of the apts. He has been paying acute attention to all the details of the investigation, more than I think is normal.

More than anything else, though, the fact that he goes on camera repeatedly tells me he has a reason other than concern for Lauren Giddings.
(Bold sections by Sandstorm)

Thinman, you did a really good job describing how Lauren's friends would react to this tragedy. My family member was a good friend of Lauren; in fact, they were hanging out together at a downtown club on Friday night, June 24. They were running buddies as well.

My family member call to inform me that Lauren was missing on early Thurs morning, June 30. My FM was very worried and said, "please pray for Lauren's safety." BTW I do not get prayer request from this FM very often, so I knew this was a serious concern.

Then, within a few hours my FM called again to inform me that Lauren was found dead outside her apartment.

Let me tell you, my FM was in complete shock, disbelief, shaken, deeply hurt, and distressed. My FM could hardly make it through work. Actually, no work was done, rather those at work who also knew Lauren all met and talked among themselves. Then, as the details unfolded and the dismemberment was disclosed, my FM went into complete shutdown and did not want to talk about it at all.

My FM who had planned to go out of town to a concert for the July 4th weekend, canceled. FM informed me "I can't go out to a concert, partying and celebrating." FM informed me that staying home and staying busy with hobbies was a better choice at this time.

FM did gather with some other HHH at one of their houses downtown Macon, and they talked and told some funny and loving stories about Lauren. The meeting was in honor of Lauren and only lasted a couple of hours in the early evening on the July 4th weekend. The rest of the weekend for my FM was quiet with only another friend of Lauren's stopping by.

As you described: Lauren's friends wanted privacy; they were badly shaken. I am very close to my FM, but when we talked, I had to think of other topics in an effort to help my FM maintain. And when I asked how are you doing, the reply was "I am trying to stay busy and not focus on it." There is no way my FM would have talked to a reporter. Absolutely no way.

And you were right again, Lauren's friends were fully cooperative with LE: My FM was called in to the police station for a 45- 60 min interview with the FBI, as were many of Lauren's friends.

In summary, Thinman, your perception is right on: Those who were friends of Lauren would not go before a camera. Their hearts were and still are crushed at the loss of their friend. They do not want to talk about it because it is toooooo painful.
 
PsychoMom (or others with pyschology or psychiatry training), what do you make of SMD's constant use of the words "I mean" interspersed throughout every statement he makes. In addition to being a habit of speaking, can it be that he is trying subconsciously to make himself (his true self) understood to the interviewer and the public? Why is it so important to him to establish a personal connection with the reporter? He is stating facts in great detail, but he seems concerned that she does not really understand him.

Or -- and say so if it is -- is the above paragraph of mine just psychobabble?

Thanks for this post Thinman. I'm pretty sure you are the first person to mention this idiosyncrasy of his (the constant use of "I mean") that I also noticed the very first time I watched the short, edited version of the interview very early on. It may mean absolutely nothing, but I definately noticed it, and for whatever reason, it really got under my skin. I'm just glad that someone else noticed that and brought it up. Just like "ya know" and "ya know what I mean" can indicate a certain uncertainty and self-reassuarance to what someone is saying....in order to convince not only others of his truth, but to convince himself as well. MOO!
 
If McD was excluded from many of his fellow law students' social activities and then Lauren was thoughtful enough of his feelings to invite him to the pre-graduation celebration, I can see where he might have misinterpreted Lauren's friendliness. I wonder if even McD realized she was in a serious relationship, considering her BF lives in Atlanta? McD probably didn't see the BF around very often and LG wouldn't have appeared to be in a relationship with anyone at Mercer (she wasn't) so, heartened by LG's cordiality toward him and feeling pressured by the knowledge they would soon be parting ways, maybe he began to pursue her aggressively. Too aggressively. Anyway, I can see a possible motive IF the killer is McD, whether or not her death was accidental or intentional -- even premeditated.

If the killer did have a romantic obsession with LG, I wonder if he kept her torso because he was abusing it (sexually)? I'm not sure that would constitute necrophilia, as Angelanalyzes speculated as a possible motive, since it wasn't death or corpses he was obsessed with (IMO), but with LG herself. If he had made his romantic intentions known to her and she resisted, he may have seen her death as his only hope of having a relationship with her.

Not all people who engage in necrophilia are the types to be obsessed with corpses or break into funeral homes for access. It is more an extension of the initial crime that they keep the body and abuse it afterwards, either due to the sense of ultimate power it gives them and/or the sense that they are still "with" the object of their fixation. Ted Bundy would often return to the dumping sites to have sex with the corpses of his victims, but he was also a sexual sadist who very much enjoyed the suffering of live victims.
I agree that if McDaniel is the perp, it's very possible he saw her death [accidental or intentional] as the only way he could "have her" and that would explain his need to keep the body. He had little to no assurance that people wouldn't start poking around even sooner than they did, and it would be much safer for him to have dumped the body elsewhere, right away, yet he held onto it, not to mention he dismembered the remains, which I feel could only be explained as a means of avoiding detection if he had dumped the remains in a clandestine grave. Dismembering the remains and keeping them negates the whole purpose of avoiding detection, so he either had a different, more disturbing reason for treating the body that way or had an overly complex plan that was interrupted before he could fully execute it. JMO.
 
(Bold sections by Sandstorm)

Thinman, you did a really good job describing how Lauren's friends would react to this tragedy. My family member was a good friend of Lauren; in fact, they were hanging out together at a downtown club on Friday night, June 24. They were running buddies as well. <snipped>

Let me tell you, my FM was in complete shock, disbelief, shaken, deeply hurt, and distressed. My FM could hardly make it through work. Actually, no work was done, rather those at work who also knew Lauren all met and talked among themselves. Then, as the details unfolded and the dismemberment was disclosed, my FM went into complete shutdown and did not want to discuss it with me at all.

My FM who had planned to go out of town to a concert for the July 4th weekend, canceled. FM informed me "I can't go out to a concert, partying and celebrating." FM informed me that staying home and staying busy with hobbies was a better choice at this time. <snipped>

And when I asked how are you doing, the reply was "I am trying to stay busy and not focus on it." There is no way my FM would have talked to a reporter. Absolutely no way. [/U]

Thanks for that personal example of your FM, Sandstorm.

And, don't forget, all LG's law school classmates had the bar exam looming in a couple of weeks. "Staying busy" was easy for them (although I'll bet keeping their concentration was not).

Some are comparing the video interview with JK with SMD's extended video soliloquy. I see them as different as night and day:

JK looked away, true, but he was thinking in response to questions that were not factual in nature. When he had thought, he then turned his eyes toward the reporter (not the camera). My own experience is that it is very unnatural to look into the camera unless the person asking the question is right behind the lens.

IMO, JK's demeanor is very normal for a friend of LG's, given that the video is sometime Friday or Saturday and he's had time to absorb the shock of the news.

I'm wondering whether JK was ambushed by the reporter as he came (perhaps) to lay flowers at the iron fence or otherwise leave a momento~?
 
Something that I have been thinking about, and this may have already been discussed in a previous thread, but whatever happened to her Mercer ID? <snipped> After reading the following article, it made me wonder if the killer kept it as a memento.

http://www.johndouglasmindhunter.com/articles/030213.php

Very interesting article, McMunn. I have been discounting the importance of the missing Mercer ID, largely because a law student posted that it is very expensive and inconvenient for a student to replace a lost ID and because the ID's usefulness is only to access the law building after hours, which graduates did not need to do in studying for the bar exam (also previously posted).

The odds of the perpetrator (SMD?) keeping the ID as a momento were significantly upped in my estimation because it fits with one other very strange fact that we know -- SMD kept 2 condoms for over two years (perhaps as a momento of his having snuck into his fellow students' apartments)? That motive would fit with the condoms being displayed in such as way as to result in the detective's interest and inquiry into why he had them.

If it's just condoms in a drawer, the reason why the owner has them is obvious. But if they form some sort of trophy display, then the investigator would ask and SMD (apparently) replied with, again, too much information.
 
Re: the new found video in which it shoes McD goes and sits on a curb while seemingly upset.. McMunn's statement about it seems to be a different angle or even cameraman and how strange/odd it would be for McD to have more than one similar reactions to being told of the body being found.. This really had me thinking and I went back to the Michelle Quesada Interview that we have the full audio and transcript of(thanks again to Destini).. And in going back and listening and reading I am now wondering if infact this may be completely different cameraman and be indeed just as McMunn mentioned a separate and different reaction to his being told by the media about the body..

I'll explain why I think this is "POSSIBLE" that it's a different/separate interview than what we saw with Michelle Quesada.. First reason being is because IIRC *when McD learns about the body being found on cam with Michelle interviewing I don't recall seeing him sit on the curb upset but rather there is some discussion between he and the reporter her asking if he's ok and Michelle says that he then enters into the AT&T building for what she assumed was to cool Down in the A/C, possibly get a drink of water, and to calm down or gather his thoughts from learning of the body discovered.. Then as we know as he exits the AT&T building Michelle approaches him OFF CAM just to check if he's ok and that he again is very chatty about his neighbor so she once again starts rolling ON CAM.. to which as we know continues on for several more minutes of McD's chatty conversing about Lauren.. The interview then ends with Michelle saying they moved on and went to speak with apt mgr BB.. So to my knowledge there wasn't this curb scene in that fullout interview.. Secondly it's what Michelle then tells Kenny(on the live audio we have linked along with Destini's having transcribed these words as well so anyone can go back and hear or read these things that I am stating was said by Michelle).. Kenny asked Michelle what was McD doing after she finished interviewing him and moved on to the apt mgr.. She states that when they left the scene(Barristers Halls apts) that McD was still on the scene giving interview with who she believed was "The Telegraph" news media.. Her making that statement made me think that it is possible that the footage was possibly McD speaking with these other news media that Michelle Quesada said she witnessed as she was leaving that McD was doing interviews with..

I am not claiming that for absolute certain they are two separate reactions of McD being told of the body being discovered, but rather only saying that given all the info stated ^above^ leads me to believe it could be possible... just an opinion and a possibility nothing more..

+++++++ NOW ONTO SOMETHING COMPLETELY SEPARATE ++++++

Another thing that I have been thinking about regarding the reaction that occurred while on cam with Michelle Quesada when he first learns there has been a body discovered on the property.. I know back when we didn't know where the torso was found or whether it was in a trash bin or just laid out and easily seen possibly even as Many of us thought that it could have been even displayed intentionally to be seen and found.. So now in retrospect my knowing that the torso was actually in a trash bin.. IMO not intending AT ALL TO HAVE BEEN FOUND BUT RATHER THE INTENTION WAS FOR IT TO HAVE BEEN HAULED OFF WITH THE TRASH PICK UP THAT WAS KNOWN TO BE SCHEDULED FOR THAT DAY.. so, as I said in retrospect with that knowledge and now looking back at McD's reaction to the news that the torso had been found I can definitely see that if indeed he turns out to be the perpetrator of this heinous murder.. WELL.. THAT REACTION YOU BETTER BELIEVE WAS A PUNCH TO THE GUT!! LEFT FOR A WHILE SPEECHLESS HAVING TO GO SIT DOWN AND GATHER HIS THOUGHTS IN THE AT&T BUILDING!!!

That visceral reaction that is seen and heard would make sense given the intention was that the torso would have been long gone and hauled away with the apt complex trash that was to be picked up!!! No torso, no body, No Lauren, No murder!!!! And Lauren just is another name on another Missing Persons flyer for God knows how Many years!!!
That discovery of that torso was at minimum at 2 punch to the gut that left him breathless and rendered him speechless for moments to come.. It was the realization of this happy go lucky plan that thus far was playing out smoothly just got yanked out from under his feet before he even knew what hit him..

IMO looking back on this reaction with what most of us believe to be that the absolute intention was for that torso to have been hauled off to the dump and not discovered right there 50 feet from his and Laurens front doors.. It makes the reaction just that much more understandable IMO..

Jmo, tho in now looking back in retrospect with a different view from knowledge that has been Learned since that time..

Exactly. If he had hoped the garbage would be taking her body that day in time, which is the only reasonable explanation for putting it in the trash next to his house since he knew the schedule, finding out that the police managed to intercept the trash pick up and find the body would certainly be cause to "need a moment" and seem taken aback. He didn't ask many questions when he was informed, either, which I found odd.
 
Having never laid eyes on McD before the first time I watched the interview earlier this month, I have no frame of reference to gauge whether his reactions are normal for him. Seeing it again, however, my initial reaction holds. His speech and mannerisms appear affected and disingenuous.

The other point I find troubling, as I've mentioned before, is the fact that a law school graduate -- one who worked in the district attorney's office no less -- upon learning that LG's body had been discovered would know that as a potential witness, it was highly inappropriate to continue talking with the reporters. Yet, even after a twenty minute break which allowed him time to collect his thoughts and compose himself, he returned to offer details of the friends' search, including their names, the condition of the apartment, and the contents of the e-mail. Not to mention, for an individual jolted by a shocking revelation, his recall is pretty amazing.

EXTREMELY good point. I would bet that police were even frustrated at the amount of info he revealed in the interview, and as a law grad he of course would know the impact those revelations could have on a homicide investigation. Seriously. It seemed motivated by self-interest of some sort.
 
Was SMcD known to wear knives on his person while at school?

Is wearing big knives in GA something that is "normal"? Like, a hunting thing?
 
Yes, he was in for questioning when the discovery of the body was made. I guess the media got him before he could realize/determine what was then going on and that Lauren's body had been found.

The trash is taken out every Thursday. I think they were going through trash in the cans later due to a report of a foul order. A poster here who visited the scene actually reported something (discussed early on...maybe the second thread) and it may have been her report that prompted that.

I would hate to think my report is what caused that, because I still think it was nothing but a dead animal it's just I could not get to the source under the rest of the garbage. They came back in force the day after my report IIRC, but I'd assume they'd have sent at least 1 officer to check out a report of the smell of decomp in the trash bins right next to LG's apartment. :waitasec:
 
Was SMcD known to wear knives on his person while at school?

Is wearing big knives in GA something that is "normal"? Like, a hunting thing?

I don't ever see anyone wearing a knife out in public. Most people conceal them, if they're carrying. I'm not aware if he did carry one at school. I don't know if they have metal detectors at Mercer, but I would think that carrying a weapon at school would be a big no-no.
 
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