17 yo Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #14

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RBBM - I'm pretty sure that was a media source misreporting that information.
http://www.examiner.com/unsolved-ca...ys-as-john-doe-after-mom-reported-him-missing
~"It is unclear why ABC News reported that Trayvon's body was left in the morgue for three days, classified as "John Doe."~
which the media has been a complete circus from day 1....they edited the 911 call to make it sound like GZ said he's black, the use of a first name for the victim and the last name of GZ, the old photos....it's just a mess
http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/nbc-deceptively-edits-george-zimmermans-words-on-911-tape/


Then why did they say this:

Ben Crump, an attorney for Martin's parents, told the panel that the family was convinced Martin was targeted for special attention because of his race, arguing that tougher laws against profiling might have averted the shooting.

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2...mily-alleges-racial-profiling-before-congress

I don't think they want an investigation at all, I think they want GZ to be arrested immediately without an investigation.
exactly, and I don't think this was a racial thing...whomever had been out that night that wasn't a regular in the neighborhood would have been followed by him.

The police have it and refuse to give it to the parents.
do you have a link to this?

But it is being investigated. Yes? The fact that protests are continuing leads one to believe that the protesters don't want an investigation, they want GZ hung out to dry.

JMO, OMO, and :moo:
I agree....there are no need for these protests - there is an active investigation.

Where was the crime scene tape put up, oh don't tell me, they didn't do that.
really? there was no tape? how do we know that?

So what? Just because Zimmerman didn't see the phone, or tell his daddy about it, Zimmeran Senior did not have the right to get on national TV and flagrantly call the Martins' LIARS.

To me it shows the arrogance and entitlement the whole Zimmerman family seems to ooze. What unmitigated gall!

I wonder what they will say in the courtroom while listening to Trayvon's girlfriend relate how their wonderful hotdogging son accosted Trayvon?

imo
where did they call them liars?

I support the Zimmermans. They have shown class in the midst of this mess.imo
I can't imagine what they are going through.




I also think that if TM suspensions, being found with jewelry, etc shouldn't matter then GZ's 911 calls etc, should not matter. You can't it one way and not the other.

also, was there any video of the purchase at the 7-11 that would have been time stamped? or a reciept? also a thread prior it was mentioned that TM's dad had called the jail looking for him - was that true?
 
I bet there have been some white kids walking slow wearing a hoodie.

Well, I'm one old Grammie who wears a hoodie while walking, with my head down because of the wind, maybe I'll be safe because mine is pink ???
 
That's a real life threatening booboo on the back of Zimmerman's head. He deserved what he got for pursuing TM, something he had no business doing. Too bad TM didn't get off as easily as GZ.
 
Morning papa. I get what you're saying about the time and distance - I just don't think Trayvon even got close to his back porch.

Here's a thought. Would it make a difference if say GZ went through the second cut-through between the buildings (close to your #6) and possibly Trayvon saw him come out there and turned around to walk back to the main sidewalk so he could get out to the street his house was on and walk down that street to his front door?

I could see him turning around and heading back to that first sidewalk. He didn't tell the gf that - but would he? Also I do think he would have said something to the gf about being that close to home.

IDK - it is odd how close he ended up from that turn with the time in question.

JMHO

BBM - I'm questioning it also, listening to the LE dispatch tape with GZ. IMO - GZ would have been at or near the rear corner of that building about the time the dispatch told him "We don't need you to do that." Assuming I have the proper positioning of his truck/suv near the beginning of the cut-off.
 
That's a real life threatening booboo on the back of Zimmerman's head. He deserved what he got for pursuing TM, something he had no business doing. Too bad TM didn't get off as easily as GZ.

He doesn't need life threatening injuries to claim SYG. In fact people without any injuries at all can claim SYG.
 
I think you're right. Why allow his fun to be curtailed?

By the way, his 14 week training consisted of one class a week that met something like an hour or two. He had practically no training at all. But he sure could be a big bad CAPTAIN on the homeowner's association watch.

I bet the HOA are dreading the day they ever allowed him to watch their community.

If the HOA does not have insurance they could be liable out-of-their-own-pockets for paying ANY civil suit from the Martins, and possibly even for Zimmerman's legal defense. I saw that stated from 2 different attorneys yesterday. WOW!

IMO

No matter what he had to do, GZ wasn't going to let this one 'get away'!
 
Sorry, I may have misunderstood what you were trying to post. To me a witch hunt "lynching" someone regardless if they are innocent or guilty just because you think they are guilty. I did not mean you are claiming it's a witch hunt. In any case, the same could be said about TM except he not alive to claim he is innocent or defend his guilt. People differ in their views, we don't all think alike. In the end the differences of opinions are responsible for not accepting events as face value which is good.

I think what we will find is that both of them viewed each other as a threat, only one had the gun and TM had a right to defend himself, too. It also appears that only a jury may be able to decide whether or not GZ was justified in shooting TM. Does not mean TM did anything wrong? Resisting someone that ends up in a fight with you on top does not mean you were the aggressor and because you are on the bottom does not mean you are the victim. It should be interesting to see how this unfolds. And it never should have been a clear cut decision by SA. I agree that this portion of the law needs to be changed. Everything should be investigated and not just dropped because someone claimed SYG. jmo

BBM

I 100% agree. The troubling thing is we might never know the true answers. The injuries (to both) and autopsy (to TM) will go a long way to perhaps explaining some of the true scenario but it probably will not explain everything. It's very hard to try to prove where one person's fear ends and anger begins.

I've learned from the past that usually the ones who 'threaten' the loudest are usually the ones who are most fearful when actual confrontation happens. I don't think it's any secret that GZ obviously felt fear from certain individuals, hence calling 911 a lot. I wonder how that fear would come into play once an actual confrontation took place. Would he 'man up' and take matters into his own hands? Or would he get so fearful that he do something to protect himself, even if he wasn't in true danger.

I'm not trying to explain away his 'non' injuries but I do believe there is a psychosis here that may need to be explored as well.
 
This is why, Robert Zimmerman claims, his son decided to keep following Martin, so he could obtain an address to give to police.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/03/2...at-his-son-threatened-his-life/#ixzz1qtdepnxt

Can we at least end the debate over whether GZ continued to follow TM at this point? GZ's father states clearly that GZ did continue to follow TM after dispatch advised him to stop.

I was so taken aback by the other statements GZ father seemingly pulled out of his hiney that I entirely missed this apparent confirmation of the continued pursuit til just now.

This also was stated by GZ's father:

Robert Zimmerman claims his son was going to the store when he spotted Martin walking through his neighborhood. George Zimmerman, he said, found it odd the teen was walking in between the town homes on a rainy night, rather than on the street or on the sidewalk.

So TM was taking a shortcut from Oregon Ave. onto Retreat View and cutting through so GZ did see him prior to the clubhouse and was following him prior to when TM stopped under the awning. He had to have seen him as he came out between the homes off of Oregon and driving slow. And we wonder why TM felt he was being followed????? jmo
 
He doesn't need life threatening injuries to claim SYG. In fact people without any injuries at all can claim SYG.

In fact, they can claim pretty much anything they want to when the other person is no longer able to tell their side of the story.
 
This is why, Robert Zimmerman claims, his son decided to keep following Martin, so he could obtain an address to give to police.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/03/2...at-his-son-threatened-his-life/#ixzz1qtdepnxt

Can we at least end the debate over whether GZ continued to follow TM at this point? GZ's father states clearly that GZ did continue to follow TM after dispatch advised him to stop.

I was so taken aback by the other statements GZ father seemingly pulled out of his hiney that I entirely missed this apparent confirmation of the continued pursuit til just now.

bbm

Yeah, and George had lived in that very same townhouse for YEARS. I don't believe for a minute that with all his *patrolling* he didn't know exactly what street he was on.

He probably had half the addresses in the entire community memorized ... especially if they had 7 and 9 year old troublesome, suspicious Black boys playing in the driveway

IMO, that was just another one of George's convenient LIES.

imho
 
It was on GMA this AM...other media will presumably have a link.
 
In fact, they can claim pretty much anything they want to when the other person is no longer able to tell their side of the story.

Yes, they can. And in this case Zimmerman apparently has some injuries to support his side of the story.
 
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/george-zimmerman-enhanced-video-shows-injury-trayvon-martin-16053206

IMO the trickle of blood on the back of GZ's head does not indicate he was assaulted by and aggressive TM. It does at least put to bed for me that there was indeed a physical struggle, close quarters, hand to hand combat situation. Whether that is because GZ initiated or TM initiated remains to be seen IMO.
Ok - so let's say there was an "injury" to the back of his head. I'm still not hearing anything about that broken nose - that, sccording to his brother, is STILL broken.

Even according to GZ's camp that punch to the nose was the INITIAL blow - it knocked him down and then TM beat his head on the sidewalk.

I still think - JMHO - that GZ did reach out and grab a hold of TM's sleeve (arm) and TM was having none of that and either pushed him or punched him. When GZ went to the ground he hit his head on the edge of the sidewalk. That would still jive with the back of the head injury.

Again, JMHO - what I'm seeing on the back of his head is not consistent with someone having their head repeatedly slammed into concrete. Its just not.

And I'm sticking with MHO that GZ reached out and grabbed TM first - initial contact.




JMHO
 
BBM

I 100% agree. The troubling thing is we might never know the true answers. The injuries (to both) and autopsy (to TM) will go a long way to perhaps explaining some of the true scenario but it probably will not explain everything. It's very hard to try to prove where one person's fear ends and anger begins.

I've learned from the past that usually the ones who 'threaten' the loudest are usually the ones who are most fearful when actual confrontation happens. I don't think it's any secret that GZ obviously felt fear from certain individuals, hence calling 911 a lot. I wonder how that fear would come into play once an actual confrontation took place. Would he 'man up' and take matters into his own hands? Or would he get so fearful that he do something to protect himself, even if he wasn't in true danger.

I'm not trying to explain away his 'non' injuries but I do believe there is a psychosis here that may need to be explored as well.

I also would not disregard the possibility that some of GZ's fear was fueled by his wife (not sleuthing her that is wrong). But I could see how a man with a wife that was fearful that some young aggressive male might break into their home and attack her would fuel GZ's suspicions and put him in a more aggressive mode. The 911 calls confirm her fears. Understanding that wanting to protect your family is a strong motivator it does not have to become an obsession which GZ appears to have been dealing with. jmo
 
What I fail to understand is GZ already had the upperhand since he had a loaded weapon. How does his 'reasonable' fear that Trayvon only had fists to his gun?

How does someone with a gun fear someone that only has a fist?

It appears he said all the right words, for the SA to dismiss that at his descretion instead of demanding an investigation.

If someone only has to utter, "I felt in fear of my life" against someone he chose to follow after being told not to, how is that people don't see who the real aggressor was in this uneven encounter?

I have my doubts that big, bad Zimmerman was in fear of anyone..he was intent on causing harm and did just that! I would love to know what happened right before GZ went out on his alleged errand run? Did something get his ire up?

He appears to have a hairpin trigger of anger. Anything could set him off. I don't view him as a productive member of society since the dude can't seem to keep himself employed before he's terminated for his angry outbursts..

He also was able to obtain a CWP due to him pleading down the felonies to misdemeanors and probably shouldn't have been trusted with a weapon. He's too irrational to think straight...like any hothead I had the displeasure to come in contact with..nothing you can say or do can change what they have in their mind at the time...irrational heads never prevail..level headed thinking is what he wasn't trained to do...or maybe doesn't have it within his resolve..

He's a dangerous person who needs to be kept off the streets or this is likely to occur again...:maddening:
 
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