FL - 17-yo Teen Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #3

Sensei · Mar 22, 2012

Horace Finklestein said:
GZ may have thought Trayvon was armed, he obviously thought he was up to no good, so he may well have been in fear for his life.

He was NOT in fear for his life when he called 911
He was NOT in fear for his life when he left his truck
He was NOT in fear for his life when he continued to chase TM, even in the face of the 911 operator telling him that he didn't need to do that and that LE was on the way.
He was NOT in fear for his life when TM's girlfriend heard him ask TM what he was doing around here, and less than 3 minutes later TM was DEAD.

So apparently in the time it takes to pop a bag of microwave popcorn he went from being the Self appointed neighborhood watch and large and in charge with a nine mil pistol on his person, to a person who is in such fear that he is going to be killed that he feels his ONLY option is to kill the other person

And while I realize that it could happen that fast if he rounded the corner and TM had thrown the business end of an ak 47 or a mac 10 in his face....it is beyond my comprehension what a 17 yr old kid armed with Arizona iced tea a bag of skittles and an earbud could have done that would induce that level of fear in a 27 year old man who was bigger and armed with a loaded pistol

Sorry but that dog won't hunt IMO, JMHO and stuff.

annalia · Mar 22, 2012

HiHater said:
So let me get this right.

Next time I see someone who is up to no good, and possibly armed---I need to follow them, confront them, and ask what they are doing.

Got it.

Makes perfect sense.

Then shoot them and cry that you were scared.

Velouria · Mar 22, 2012

Ada said:
Witness said they saw blood on his head and nose, I believe. We don't know who's blood it was because no one checked. Witness also said GZ had his own hands on his own head. Where his hands covered in Trayvon's blood before he rubbed his head? Who knows??

Blood does not automatically mean there is an injury beneath it.

Sure would have been nice if the responding officers bothered to look into any of this at the time. Could have cleared a lot of things up right from the start.

AWESOME post, Ada! :rocker:

mikeysmommom · Mar 22, 2012

HiHater said:
The witness mistook white for red and vice versa.

Instead of GZ maybe taking his jacket off or putting it on.

Nonsensical.

Sometimes, it really IS the most logical and simple explanation that's true.

Red is red ..........White is white at night white shirt is the easiest color to see,red is harder to see at night.A change like that would make me not believe the truth is being told by said witness.Is a link available about this witness changing colors of the shirt? I would like to read it.

waltzingmatilda · Mar 22, 2012

Trayvon's petition is over 1,300,000.

http://www.change.org/petitions/pro...qTpX&utm_medium=email&utm_source=action_alert

Blue_Dolphin308 · Mar 22, 2012

Paramedics were just called to the back of the stage. They asked someone to call 911. not sure what hat is all about...

JeannaT · Mar 22, 2012

HiHater said:
Does anyone else wonder why there seems to be only one stray article that quotes a witness as saying GZ was the one screaming for help?

Maybe it's just me...

I've listened to the 911 call several times and I can't tell what's going on. I don't hear "help" although maybe that was said, I just can't hear it. The voices of the caller and dispatcher are so loud that I can't turn the volume up loud enough to hear the background battle.

It doesn't even sound like words to me. I certainly don't hear any wimpering, I hear what sounds like a bellowing that doesn't contain any actual words.

The verbal altercation had been going on for at least a minute by the time that call was made from what I can tell - there are several callers who all say they can hear shouting, so it goes on much longer than what was caught on that 911 tape.

Without computer audio enhancement and voice pattern comparisons, I can't imagine deciding who was doing the bellowing.

Ada · Mar 22, 2012

JeannaT said:
That's not true. He was treated at the scene by paramedics. I'm certain a paramedic can tell smeared blood that splashed on him vs. blood from the wounds on GZ's head.

If we could all just stick to the facts, or official quotes, and not just guess at things like it isn't known whose blood was on GZ this conversation would go better.

What were the paramedic's findings then? Did they say "oh he's been beat around the head" or did they wipe Trayvon's blood off his head and send him on his way? I don't know. Do you?

annalia · Mar 22, 2012

HiHater said:
Does anyone else wonder why there seems to be only one stray article that quotes a witness as saying GZ was the one screaming for help?

Maybe it's just me...

Is that the same article that mixed up the parents names?

JeannaT · Mar 22, 2012

Blue_Dolphin308 said:
Paramedics were just called to the back of the stage. They asked someone to call 911. not sure what hat is all about...

Hopefully it's just someone who fainted from heat or something.

Velouria · Mar 22, 2012

Blue_Dolphin308 said:
Paramedics were just called to the back of the stage. They asked someone to call 911. not sure what hat is all about...

I hope they're not calling to report a suspicious black person.

JeannaT · Mar 22, 2012

Ada said:
What were the paramedic's findings then? Did they say "oh he's been beat around the head" or did they wipe Trayvon's blood off his head and send him on his way? I don't know. Do you?

The findings were that he had blood coming from the back of his head and from his nose. We don't know what further treatment he required, if any, because that hasn't been discussed.

I don't think a cop would put that he had a wound on the back of his head and to his nose, and grass and twigs and moisture on his back as if he had been on his back on the ground, if an EMT had said he's got blood splashed on him from the victim.

Horace Finklestein · Mar 22, 2012

Marshmallow said:
then why in the world did he go after him and accost him?

I doubt he expected to be attacked, he may have thought he could resolve things peaceably.

HiHater · Mar 22, 2012

annalia said:
Is that the same article that mixed up the parents names?

Yes, of course...

Horace Finklestein · Mar 22, 2012

HiHater said:
You're choosing to rely on one inaccurate report, after it's been pointed out to you that the article is, in fact, inaccurate... We should ignore the other witnesses who heard a CHILD screaming. Those who say it was Trayvon.

Why does George Zimmerman have on both a red jacket according to some and a white shirt according to others. At what point during this fatally intense physical combat did he have time to undress?

How do we know the entire article was inaccurate? Trayvon was not a child and we don't know if it was him screaming as of yet.

Horace Finklestein · Mar 22, 2012

Marshmallow said:
we do know who the aggressor was, Mr Zimmerman got out of his car, with gun in his possession and went after Mr Martin to confront him. He had no reason to do so other than to cause an altercation.

Oh I disagree. Following someone and asking what they're doing is not an aggressive act, and there is no evidence he wanted to start a physical fight.

Lovejac · Mar 22, 2012

HiHater said:
So let me get this right.

Next time I see someone who is up to no good, and possibly armed---I need to follow them, confront them, and ask what they are doing.

Got it.

Makes perfect sense.

But of course that is exactly what you should do............when you're carrying a 9 mm handgun

Ada · Mar 22, 2012

JeannaT said:
The findings were that he had blood coming from the back of his head and from his nose. We don't know what further treatment he required, if any, because that hasn't been discussed.

I don't think a cop would put that he had a wound on the back of his head and to his nose, and grass and twigs and moisture on his back as if he had been on his back on the ground, if an EMT had said he's got blood splashed on him from the victim.

I think we'd better find someone with links, because I remember it differently than you do. IIRC, it was said there was blood 'on' the back of his head and nose. I don't recall hearing the blood was coming 'from' the back of his head and nose.

Do you know where we can find these findings?

jjenny · Mar 22, 2012

annalia said:
Is that the same article that mixed up the parents names?

There is another article that claims a 13 year old boy saw GZ on the ground wearing red.

"It was dark, and the boy did not see how the fight started, in fact, he only saw one person, a man in a red shirt Zimmerman who was on the ground."
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news...ing-zimmerman-letter-20120315,0,1716605.story

JeannaT · Mar 22, 2012

HiHater said:
You're choosing to rely on one inaccurate report, after it's been pointed out to you that the article is, in fact, inaccurate... We should ignore the other witnesses who heard a CHILD screaming. Those who say it was Trayvon.

Why does George Zimmerman have on both a red jacket according to some and a white shirt according to others. At what point during this fatally intense physical combat did he have time to undress?

My guess is, the "person in the white shirt" was Trayvon who was wearing a light colored hoodie. If it's the same hoodie he was wearing in the most recent pic I've seen of him, it could certainly look white in near darkness.

FL - 17-yo Teen Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #3

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