GUILTY GA - Jorelys Rivera, 7, Canton, 2 Dec 2011 - #5

stillwatersc · Dec 21, 2011

Comments on FB are considered rumor, not fact.

stillwatersc · Dec 21, 2011

Bluesky#1 said:
On Friday, December 2nd, Joseline and her roommate/coworker allegedly worked the graveyard shift and the graveyard shift ended when Jorelys should have been at the bus stop waiting for her bus to arrive.

According to MSM, the graveyard shift ended at 7:15 AM. Jorelys was already getting off the bus at school by 7:10 AM - while her mom was still at work. Buses begin picking up students far sooner than that. Jorelys could have been on the bus as early as 6:30 AM. I don't know how her mom could have possibly seen her that morning. Also, I would like to see documentation that JR's mom's roommate worked the same shift as her mom.

This information was pulled directly from the Canton Elementary School website.
http://www.cherokee.k12.ga.us/Schoo...Information/Student Arrival and Departure.pdf
Student Arrival and Departure
Student arrival:
7:10 drop-off by bus or car
7:30 suggested time to report to classroom
7:45 Tardy bell for attendance and official instructional day begins
2:15 Dismissal

Official school day hours are 7:45-2:15.

cat thief · Dec 21, 2011

Bluesky#1 said:
Jorelys needed to be woken up very early everyday of the week in order to prepare for school and on Friday morning it was the live-in teenager's responsibility to ensure Jorelys arrived at the bus stop on time.

We don't know what mood the babysitter was in and what the atmosphere was in the home.
Her responsibilities included caring for 2 very young children simultaneously. If the babysitter had to accompany Jorelys to the bus stop, this meant she had to bring Jorelys' two young siblings with her.

On Friday, December 2nd, Joseline and her roommate/coworker allegedly worked the graveyard shift and the graveyard shift ended when Jorelys should have been at the bus stop waiting for her bus to arrive.

The babysitter was in charge of the children Friday morning so the babysitter and children know what happened inside the home. I wonder if there was any abuse going on that the mother wasn't aware of? I think the girl who is Jorely's older sister can talk because when Joseline took her to a neighbor's apartment to ask if Jorelys was there, the media report said Jorelys' sister asked the person who answered the door if her sister was there while their mother remained silent.

We don't know if Jorelys showed up at school Friday morning and whether the mother and her coworker left work early or showed up that day and unfortunately we can't access these records but Jorelys school records and Joseline and her live-in coworker's work schedule for Friday, Dec 2nd needs to be reviewed.

I think it would be difficult to arouse a child out of a deep sleep and I don't know what type of relationship Jorelys had with her 17 y.o. caretaker. What techniques did she use to wake Jorelys up with? Did she yell and scream at her, throw cold water on her face and slap her? Was the 17 y.o. a patient and caring caregiver? Who was in charge of disciplining the children? Did the mother call in and check on her children throughout the day and converse often with the babysitter?

Occam's razor is a principle that generally recommends from among competing hypotheses selecting the one that makes the fewest new assumptions

Very interesting and creative but I'm going with the simplest version.

Magdalyn · Dec 21, 2011

krimekat said:
It was not in MSM as I indicated in my original post; it was posted on FB he was at KMart, not WM, therefore there would be no video of him at WM . . .

I'm going to lean toward believing what I hear see on the MSM and local Georgia news as opposed to a Facebook posting. (Especially is it's a Facebook posting of one of his friends/family. They'd be a little ... biased, moreso than a reporter who knows neither the victim or the alleged perp, and who spoke with LE himself/herself.)

K Mart doesn't have video cameras? I'm pretty sure they do, I've seen job listings for employment monitoring them.

Kmart, Walmart, wherever he SAID he was, he was not there, and it has been verified. He's not on any tape at either location. LE can not just go to a judge and say "he lied to us, made false statements, we can't prove how we know this, just trust us on this judge, now lock him up."

And if there was any confusion--say he meant to say he was at K-Mart but he accidentally said Wal-Mart, his court appointed (and by all accounts amazing) lawyer would have squared that away toot-sweet. In fact, him being at either store would have cleared him. Alas, he's still sitting in jail. Cause he wasn't at Wal Mart. Or K-Mart. But he said he was. So he lied.

Dr. Know? · Dec 21, 2011

Oh my. Some interesting facts about the vacant apartment & what was found.

Cherokee Co. Sheriff's Internal Affairs report on Rivera murder released

snipped

The report also went on to say that a search and rescue crew member, along with a maintenance man from the complex, accompanied McMullen during his search.

snipped again

According to the report, Carr went on to say that it appeared someone was sleeping in the vacant apartment without permission, but that it did not occur to him that any harm had come to Jorelys.

more at link

http://www.11alive.com/rss/article/...eleased?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Wonder if it was RB who was with the deputy. Just says maintenance man. hmmm

marazul · Dec 21, 2011

krimekat said:
Do "we all know how truthful RB can be"? I have no idea :fence: until evidence is presented

Do we know anything? LE is tight-lipped about this. Last I read they are still piecing together an investigation & possibly searching for other suspects . . . did they ever find Jorelys' notebook/diary? Answers are in there.

I think she may have had an older "boyfriend". Opinion only.

Oh yeah, and the internal affairs report on the handling of the case in the early stages:
http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/local/internal-affairs-report-released-jorelys-rivera-ca/nF68Y/

I honestly doubt there is much in the "diary". I have two girls who were both 7 in the last 4 years, and they both had diaries..it was little drawings, I love my family, my sister is mean, Dear Santa I want a puppy.. mostly misspelled attempts at very child like themes..not only my kids, but of all their friends and all my friends who also have kids I have NEVER heard of a first grader with an "older boyfriend"..kids this age think anyone out of their grade is a baby, and anyone older is a big kid..there is not much intersex mixing outside of siblings at this age..this is FIRST GRADE we are talking about, not a 13 year old who will write about crushes and family problems...boys are "yucky" until at the least fourth of fifth grade... I understand that children this age can be molested, or can engage in "doctor" play etc. with close relatives or friends, but to be in first grade and having a "secret older (consensual) boyfriend" seems like a far-fetched idea to me.

I also believe LE was all over the family and would have zeroed in quickly on any neighborhood claims of mistreatment by babysitters or abuse. I believe the one mistake in this family was that the children were allowed way too much freedom for their ages, there was not sufficient supervision, but I wouldn't by any means consider these to be neglected or abused children...IMO when you see this type of lack of supervision and it is in her own neighborhood, when the family moved apartments in the same complex in order to have a ground floor closer to the playground (that was mentioned in MSM earlier link), I think the problem is the family felt a false sense of security and was even naive, but I do not think this is abuse or neglect in any way.

stillwatersc · Dec 21, 2011

dr. Know? said:
oh my. Some interesting facts about the vacant apartment & what was found.

cherokee co. Sheriff's internal affairs report on rivera murder released

snipped

the report also went on to say that a search and rescue crew member, along with a maintenance man from the complex, accompanied mcmullen during his search.

Snipped again

according to the report, carr went on to say that it appeared someone was sleeping in the vacant apartment without permission, but that it did not occur to him that any harm had come to jorelys.

More at link

http://www.11alive.com/rss/article/...eleased?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

wonder if it was rb who was with the deputy. Just says maintenance man. Hmmm

what!!!!????

according to the report, he went on to say that it didn't appear to be "that bad" since he thought the blood stains were feces.

katydid23 · Dec 21, 2011

stillwatersc said:
what!!!!????

I agree. WTH?

It will be unreal if we come to find out that the perp was the one who showed them around that vacant apt.

If so, then it will make sense why they may have overlooked some things because he may have had a good story to help them move on.

marazul · Dec 21, 2011

I need help understanding how blood can be mistaken for feces...are they saying they thought they were looking at a feces-covered room, but it turned out to be a blood-covered room with no feces?

angela · Dec 21, 2011

Dr. Know? said:
Oh my. Some interesting facts about the vacant apartment & what was found.

Cherokee Co. Sheriff's Internal Affairs report on Rivera murder released

snipped

The report also went on to say that a search and rescue crew member, along with a maintenance man from the complex, accompanied McMullen during his search.

snipped again

According to the report, Carr went on to say that it appeared someone was sleeping in the vacant apartment without permission, but that it did not occur to him that any harm had come to Jorelys.

more at link

http://www.11alive.com/rss/article/...eleased?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Wonder if it was RB who was with the deputy. Just says maintenance man. hmmm

I have always thought that things in this case just didn't quite add up. This just adds to that.

Magdalyn · Dec 21, 2011

marazul said:
I need help understanding how blood can be mistaken for feces...are they saying they thought they were looking at a feces-covered room, but it turned out to be a blood-covered room with no feces?

The only thing I can come up with is that they used the term 'feces' to include loose stool, or, ugh, liquid poo.

Was this on Saturday or Friday night? Either way, I'm just wondering if it was dried into a brownish color, and in context of being in/around the toilet, people assumed it was a nasty diarrhea scene and having decided that, didn't wanna look at it any more.

I'm not in any way excusing the oversight, just trying to figure out how blood could be confused for poo.

krimekat · Dec 21, 2011

stillwatersc said:
Comments on FB are considered rumor, not fact.

As I indicated in my original post it was a FB comment early during the investigation, not noted in MSM.

We were able to garner LOTS of information (prior to pages being offline).

:whiteflag:

Dr. Know? · Dec 21, 2011

This article is about the deputy. I didn't realize the deputy took a 5% pay cut. 4 people mistook the blood for feces in the bathroom? All over the floor and toilet?

http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/local/internal-affairs-report-released-jorelys-rivera-ca/nF68Y/

From the article I posted before this one, I wonder if RB had been sleeping in that apartment? Was the apartment searched on Saturday?

katydid23 · Dec 21, 2011

krimekat said:
As I indicated in my original post it was a FB comment early during the investigation, not noted in MSM.

We were able to garner LOTS of information (prior to pages being offline).

:whiteflag:

So are you saying that you think Brunn was at K-mart that afternoon?

stillwatersc · Dec 21, 2011

marazul said:
I need help understanding how blood can be mistaken for feces...are they saying they thought they were looking at a feces-covered room, but it turned out to be a blood-covered room with no feces?

Maybe a quick thinking maintenance guy told them.... "You don't want to go in there. They ****'ed all over the place". So a brief glimpse & they saw what they expected to see. IMO still a stretch.

But at this point they didn't know what had happened to her. They were still looking for a missing child, not a bloody crime scene.

marazul · Dec 21, 2011

Magdalyn said:
The only thing I can come up with is that they used the term 'feces' to include loose stool, or, ugh, liquid poo.

Was this on Saturday or Friday night? Either way, I'm just wondering if it was dried into a brownish color, and in context of being in/around the toilet, people assumed it was a nasty diarrhea scene and having decided that, didn't wanna look at it any more.

I'm not in any way excusing the oversight, just trying to figure out how blood could be confused for poo.

from link http://www.11alive.com/rss/article/...eleased?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

"The report said Sgt. Wess Dixon and his partner, Kendra Chapman, searched the apartment and found what they said they thought were feces all over the floor and toilet in the unit's master bathroom"

So if all that they thought was feces was actually blood, then there was blood all over the floor and toilet? Wow..

Dr. Know? · Dec 21, 2011

And another article.

snipped

The Ledger-News has filed a request under Georgias Open Records Act to obtain the internal affairs investigation case file.

That file, under the law, will not be open for public inspection until 10 days after the investigation was closed. Lt. Jay Baker, public information officer for the sheriffs office, said the file is set to be released today (Dec. 21).

http://www.ledgernews.com/news/1115...naction?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

cat thief · Dec 21, 2011

katydid23 said:
I agree. WTH?

It will be unreal if we come to find out that the perp was the one who showed them around that vacant apt.

If so, then it will make sense why they may have overlooked some things because he may have had a good story to help them move on.

Which would make the police work even more embarrassing. :clown:

stillwatersc · Dec 21, 2011

marazul said:
from link http://www.11alive.com/rss/article/...eleased?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

"The report said Sgt. Wess Dixon and his partner, Kendra Chapman, searched the apartment and found what they said they thought were feces all over the floor and toilet in the unit's master bathroom"

So if all that they thought was feces was actually blood, then there was blood all over the floor and toilet? Wow..

Would the power have been turned off at the apartment & they were using flashlights? Often apartment bathrooms have no window.

Dr. Know? · Dec 21, 2011

stillwatersc said:
Would the power have been turned off at the apartment & they were using flashlights? Often apartment bathrooms have no window.

Apartments & rentals usually just get switched back to the complex or owners name. I can't see this complex leaving it off while workers have to repair the unit and it needs to be cleaned. Plus it's cold. They'd leave the thermostat set low to keep pipes from freezing etc...

GUILTY GA - Jorelys Rivera, 7, Canton, 2 Dec 2011 - #5

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