TX TX - Julie Moseley, 9, Mary Trlica, 17, Lisa Wilson, 14, Fort Worth, 23 Dec 1974 - #1

New Posts

Status
Not open for further replies.
Sadly, I don't think any of the three of them are alive to contact the family members. But it does confound me too... no traces to confirm anything, that's always hard for me to comprehend. But with this much time elapsing, development in the area, people moving and growth of an area population-wise I guess it's "easy" for what may once have been evidence of something becoming buried beneath progress... or just the lost to the winds of time.

I don't give up hope tho... I do believe all of them are solvable, somehow.
 
Warning: this became longer than expected!

I don't believe the girls ran away. If you're 17 you may think nothing of running away with your 14-year-old friend, but you'd have to know you'd catch hell and maybe face kidnapping charges for taking along a 9-year-old that you barely know.

While most missing teens were classified as runaways by default in those days, Rachel and Ranee would have known that fleeing with a 9yo would make LE more likely to pursue them.

I doubt they'd have wanted to spend a week babysitting a 9yo holed up in a motel instead of going out to enjoy what Houston had to offer, and they would have had to buy all Julie Ann's meals since she didn't have any money for even the mall trip.

The only reason I can come up with as to why they might have taken Julie Ann is if she'd confided that something wasn't right at home and they wanted to protect her, but it sounds like her home life was fine before she went missing.

I don't think Ranee would have run away if it meant missing that night's Christmas party and the chance to show off her promise ring and share her happy news. Even if her pre-engagement to Terry was intended to be kept secret because of their age, she must have been eager to tell a few close friends, and why would she miss a party with her new fiance?

I don't think Rachel wrote the letter that arrived Christmas Eve, simply because it makes no mention of Julie Ann. If Rachel and Julie Ann barely knew each other, Tommy would have had little reason to call Julie Ann's mom to see if Rachel was there. I can't imagine Rachel calmly writing to her husband to say she and her friend had split for a week and failing to mention that they'd also brought along the neighbor girl. It seems like whoever wrote the letter was only concerned with letting Tommy know the girls left voluntarily. I think the letter was primarily written to give the families and LE false hope that the girls would be back in a week, and to avoid serious search efforts from being undertaken.

I doubt the letter's author was related to any of the girls because their relatives would have heard Rachel call her husband exclusively by his nickname "Tommy" and not Thomas, and to avoid suspicion the writer would have used the same name Rachel addressed him by.

I think the letter was written and mailed before their disappearance and the perpetrator did not expect Julie Ann to accompany the girls to the mall. The perp probably knew the girls before that night and he or she planned to move their car to the Sears lot if they didn't already choose to park there. Had they told anyone about buying gifts at Sears vs. elsewhere in the mall, making it reasonable to expect they'd park nearest that store?

Why a mailed letter anyway? By the time it arrived their families would have noticed they were gone and found the car at the mall in an otherwise empty lot, so why not just leave the note in the car for their parents to find? Why would you run away and mess around buying postage, envelopes and possibly stationery as well as finding a mailbox to send the letter from when you could just jot a note to leave in the locked car? I agree, get some DNA off that envelope and off the back of the stamp!

On the "latest news" page on missingtrio.com, there is an article about a former LE officer who had been working security for Sears at the time and saw the girls riding with a young mall security guard in a pickup. I suspect he was entirely innocent and just a young guy trying to flirt with the girls by offering them an escort back to their car, but it's strange that he denied ever being with the girls when LE tracked him down years later. It's also weird that Ranee would be laughing and having a great time in the pickup at 11:30 p.m. She would have missed the Christmas party she was to attend with Terry.
 
Hi, I'm new here, mostly lurk, but had a few thoughts to add to this. I remember hearing about this case in Houston. It was on the news quite a bit since the girls were thought to have possibly gone to Houston. I also remember the mail being very slow in those days so there is no way that letter would have arrived as quick as it did unless it had been mailed at least 3-4 days before the girls went missing. Unlikely, I think.

I'm going to throw out some ideas that came to me in hopes of discussion or to be trounced on. LOL. If the murders weren't an abduction, what other possible motives exist?

That letter is IMO the most significant piece of info. I don't know who wrote it, but I think it was designed to protect the perp/s. What if young Rachel was pregnant? Her husband already had a 2 yr. old he was having to support. Maybe Rachel was the intended victim, and having the other two girls along made the murder look like an abduction when it wasn't.

It also struck me as odd for a teen-aged guy to give a girl a promise ring early in the morning. Wouldn't that be something done on an evening date at dinner?

Deb Hopper mentioned the girls might have been sold into white slavery. I find that an odd statement. I grew up in Dallas, graduated high school in the second half of the 60s, and I don't think I ever heard anyone mention white slavery or even knew such a thing existed. Ok, I led a sheltered life. If it had been prevalent, knowing my mother, I'm sure I would've been warned about it.

What if this Deb Hopper was into some really bad stuff and bad people. Might she have sacrificed her sister to save her own skin? Maybe she'd been threatened with the death of her whole family if Rachel wasn't handed over. Seems unlikely, but just thought I'd throw it out there since it was another thought I had. Or, perhaps white slavery was just another ruse by her to protect the killer or killers.

That the bodies have never been found, it doesn't seem likely the killers were youthful, but on the other hand, teenagers know all the out of the way places for parking or hiding out to drink. It could be that the killers knew the area extremely well; hence why their bodies have never been found. If Deb was living with Rachel and Rachel's husband, and they were the alibis for each other, the two of them could have been the ones. Typically, I think youthful lovers have more trouble with jealousy. If Rachel had known her husband had been with her sister would she have allowed her to stay with them? I think not.

Also, if it was someone that knew the girls, how would they have gotten rid of the bodies so quickly, and so well? Was anyone employed as a heavy equipment operator, driving a backhoe or something?

I'll bet that letter led the police to dismiss the case at first as runaways. If so, that may have given the killers time to dispose of the bodies. There were lots of runaways back in those days, young people going off to find themselves. Perhaps LE didn't put as much thought into this as they should have.

Wonder if there is any connection between any of the people that knew these girls or a family member with either of the two towns mentioned as possibilities for where the letters supposedly originated? Maybe some grandparents who lived in one of those two places....justthinkin
 
This is a sad case. Of course they're all sad. Being a parent myself, I just can't imagine the depth of grief these parents have had to go through all these years, not ever knowing what happened to their little girls.

Anyone know the status of this case? Is anyone in LE actively involved in this case or is it just gathering dust? These families need answers.
 
Justthinkin, I agree that letter IS weird. I think someone purposely discarded the rest of the Trlica's Dec. 24 mail so Tommy would have no chance of mistaking the letter for another Christmas card that he wasn't going to waste time opening while his wife was missing.

It says there was no town name stamped on the envelope, only a ZIP code. Was this normal in Texas in 1974 or evidence that somebody used one of those date stamps to make it look as though the letter had been posted? The stamp I'm thinking of is one of those Trodat Printy-dater units with the moveable numbers. I'm not sure how you'd fake the wavy cancellation lines over the stamp, however.

It's hard to predict when a letter is going to arrive, especially during the Christmas rush. The perpetrator wouldn't want it to arrive before the girls actually disappeared because it would be dismissed as a bizarre prank at best and hint at impending danger for the girls at worst. Either way it would throw off the abduction plans.

Tommy retrieved the letter on Dec. 24, but I wonder who typically retrieved the mail and who retrieved it from the mailbox Dec. 22, 23, and so on in case the letter arrived earlier than expected. Would Rachel typically be the first one home after school to get the mail and Debra and Tommy would arrive home from their jobs later?

I wish Debra would take a polygraph test and I can see why the others are upset that she's refused, but I suspect she is innocent. If her supposed motive to get Rachel out of the picture was to have Tommy for herself, it doesn't sound like she made any effort to rekindle her past relationship with him once Rachel was gone.

What about this Army Navy store the girls visited before going to the mall? They'd been there before when they'd originally put the items on layaway, and maybe someone who worked there knew exactly which day they'd be returning for their purchases. From friendly chit-chat this employee could have learned the girls were also heading to the mall that day, maybe to pick up some layaways there.
 
I wish I knew why Rusty believed he might have only been days away from finding Rachel in December 2000 when he was interviewed for the Star-Telegram article. The article said he avoided on-the-record comments about what might have happened to the girls, but he might have said something off the record that the reporter couldn't include in her article (nor share with anyone else, so contacting her wouldn't help.)

I have no idea why he and Dan James think Rachel returns to town every Christmas. Why would she return to visit local stores like Wal-mart but not stop by to at least catch a glimpse of her family? Why would she choose a predictable pattern for her visits that someone could use to find her the following year? I understand Rusty's desire to believe she is still alive but I can't see how somebody could be keeping tabs on her around the clock to make sure she doesn't contact her family, yet that same person allows her to visit at Christmas. And if she really is visiting local stores at Christmas, why hasn't she been caught on security cameras yet?
 
I know zip about how or what the post office uses to stamp dates and locations. Yes, the letter should have had the name of the town from which it was mailed, stamped on it. At least that is my recollection from that time period, maybe not. Don't go by my recollections on such a thing. My memory is not the best.

Maybe someone/s from the Army-Navy store followed the girls to the mall, waited them out. Parked beside their car, and when they came out, grabbed one, and placed a gun on the others. And yet, how would someone get away with that in a crowded mall parking lot? Wouldn't at least one of the girls had a chance to scream or run away, even if she was brought back by one of the perps? Hard to imagine with 3 girls there was no screaming unless they knew their killer or one of them did. Could have gone off with that person to drink or smoke pot, something, and were killed wherever they'd been taken to.

I'm thinking the most likely suspect is the one who wrote the letter or forced Rachel to write it. How do we know that envelope wasn't from a letter that Tommy had received at an earlier point in time, and one that had arrived with a blank space where, normally. the sender puts their name and address?

I missed that about the Army Navy store on first read. Going to read all the info over again.
 
Someone posted a theory that the girls might have done drugs in someone else's vehicle in the parking lot and Julie Ann fatally overdosed as a result, then the other two fled.

If they were invited to use any drugs in someone's van, I doubt they had anything stronger than pot or beer. I can't see Renee wanting to be less than sober by the time the party rolled around that afternoon or evening, so I doubt she would have chosen that day to try something that would incapacitate her for hours.

Also, I can see a 9yo following the older girls and maybe smoking a joint to appear cool, and maybe a teenager who's already stoned failing to use good judgement and allowing her much-younger friend to have a joint, but you can't OD on a joint.

My knowledge of drugs is limited, but most of the drugs with any risk of overdose have to be injected or snorted and those methods would have been very unpalatable to a child her age. Most kids are terrified of needles at the doctor's. I can't for one minute imagine the older girls drugging her against her will, either. Does anyone know whether marijuana in the 1970s was ever laced with more toxic drugs, and was any of it showing up in the Fort Worth area in 1974?
 
It doesn't have to be an overdose, per se. She could have had an allergic or adverse reaction that led to a more serious situation. For instance: Smoke --> asthma attack --> respiratory failure.
 
tatertot said:
Someone posted a theory that the girls might have done drugs in someone else's vehicle in the parking lot and Julie Ann fatally overdosed as a result, then the other two fled.

If they were invited to use any drugs in someone's van, I doubt they had anything stronger than pot or beer. I can't see Renee wanting to be less than sober by the time the party rolled around that afternoon or evening, so I doubt she would have chosen that day to try something that would incapacitate her for hours.

Also, I can see a 9yo following the older girls and maybe smoking a joint to appear cool, and maybe a teenager who's already stoned failing to use good judgement and allowing her much-younger friend to have a joint, but you can't OD on a joint.

My knowledge of drugs is limited, but most of the drugs with any risk of overdose have to be injected or snorted and those methods would have been very unpalatable to a child her age. Most kids are terrified of needles at the doctor's. I can't for one minute imagine the older girls drugging her against her will, either. Does anyone know whether marijuana in the 1970s was ever laced with more toxic drugs, and was any of it showing up in the Fort Worth area in 1974?
Click to expand...
I know of one drug dealer who operated in the DFW area in the mid 70's. He would lace joints with a horse tranquilizer called "Angel Dust". Reactions were varied from panic attacks to paranoia. If Julie smoked one of these revved up joints, she may have freaked out and who know what could have happened.
 
I've done a little checking into this case, and here's what I've found so far. Long post.

I don't know where it originated, but there has been some misleading information put out on this case, and then repeated on other websites and by the media.

I questioned that in 1974 the US post office could move so fast as to deliver a letter the same day as it was postmarked. Well, they didn't. The letter was postmarked on the 24th, but wasn't received until the girls had been missing for several days.

The Ft. Worth Police reported that the letter was not mailed from Weatherford or Eliasville, but was mailed in Ft. Worth. I have no idea why bogus info would be put out, but it certainly doesn't help solve this case.

Another thing, Rachel's car had been found by 6:00PM on the day the girls went missing. The stores hadn't even closed. The parents of the girls reacted quickly. When the girls didn't show up by 4:00PM the parents started worrying, and by 5:00PM, knew something was really wrong. They called the police, the hospitals, the girls' friends, everything a panicked parent would do, they did. The parents said the police initially dismissed the girls' disappearance as runaways.

I think I will call the Ft. Worth Police next Monday to find out, first hand, what info that's been made public is solid, and what isn't.

Does not look like the police think this was a random kidnapping. Tommy Trlica, Rachel's husband was under suspicion very soon after the fact, and he has not been the only suspect.

According to Rusty Arnold, his sister, Debra Arnold Hopper did finally consented to a polygraph test in 2001. At that time, Rusty Arnold expected to have the case solved shortly. Since that didn't happen, I'm guessing that Debra Hopper passed the polygraph test. I'll see what I can find out.

I don't know what else he does, but Rusty Arnold is also a singer/performer, and has written a song about the disappearance. I really don't know what to make of him. The song may have served two purposes, getting the girls names out there, but also, a more self-serving purpose. I have not yet listened to the song. It is posted online.

Rusty Arnold also claims to have very good information that his sister is alive, and returns to Ft. Worth every year around Christmas. He claims he has credible eye-witnesses, people who know, knew Rachel. I can't imagine, in all this time, if that were the case that someone wouldn't have turned her in to LE. If Rachel were alive she would have to live somewhere and work somewhere, and yet no neighbor or co-worker has come forward with a lead on her whereabouts. If they had, she would've been taken into custody, and this would've been on every TV station in the country and online.

It's been reported that Tommy Trlica offered a $2000 reward, but after a year, sold his house and moved away. I know he married a third time, and his present wife (if they haven't divorced) is a Linda Ishmael who graduated from high school in Frisco, Tx in 1976. I found her on reunion.com where she listed herself as Linda Ishmael Trlica. In 2000. they reportedly were living in east Texas. January of 2008, they were living in Galveston, Tx. Found her and Tommy Trlica listed in attendance at funeral on an obit. listing for Linda's brother. She has numerous siblings. I had to ask myself how she and Tommy Trlica met, and when. With 13 siblings, I wondered if one of her brothers wasn't working with Trlica in Ft. Worth or wasn't hanging out with him in 1974. Of course, if he left Ft. Worth, he may have moved to Frisco.

Here are a few links in no particular order:
http://www.missingtrio.com/TRIO/news41301.htm
http://tinyurl.com/8hqpxk

http://namesdatabase.com/schools/US/TX/Frisco/Frisco High School

http://www.e-cinc.com/obituariesn.html.
http://www.angelfire.com/mi3/mpccn/trlica.html
http://chriscrimeforum.freeforums.org/3-young-girls-go-to-the-mall-t987.html

I did not find the one link I really wanted to post which contained several articles from several different newspapers. I will keep looking. In the meantime, I apologize for any repetition in links that others may have already posted. I am just too tired to think.

One thing that struck me as odd, is that the families hired a P.I. to work the case in 1975. He died in 1979; his death listed as drug overdose and suicide, and "all his papers destroyed as per his request." I will check that out with the Ft. Worth Police because that sounds hinkey to me.
 
Hi justthinkin, I'm glad to see this case forum active! Wow, you've really pointed out some interesting things. I'm grateful for the links and talking points - don't apologize! I can't express enough how good it is to have a fresh pair of eyes going over this case.

Some things, like the letter, have always made my mind go in circles. Now understanding there's some inaccuracies possibly, now I know why. What strikes me odd is that the website was created and maintained by Rusty Arnold, if I'm not mistaken, yet inaccuracies such as when the letter arrived are not corrected by him. The newspaper article posted on the front page of the website leads one to believe the girls disappeared on the 23rd, the letter postmarked on the 24th also arrived on the 24th. Having verified accurate info would be good.

I have listened to Rusty Arnold's song on the missingtrio website. I think it was meant as a touching tribute. I doubt it would ever lead him into a career. (no offense meant to him or anyone else, just saying what I feel) I checked that site a week or so ago, hoping for an update since the last time I had gone there. Unfortunately there's nothing new.

I've never be able to wrap my head around the idea that Rachel was still living and returning to town regularly.

The PI having requested all his paper to be destroyed - I can take that two ways. 1. Hinky and, 2. being a PI perhaps he felt the nature of the information in his files and papers shouldn't be poured over by just anyone and everyone after his death. I can understand that. But... had he intentionally took his life wouldn't ya think he'd have destroyed his files himself beforehand making sure that job was done as he wanted it to be? That in itself takes me back to ... hinky.

I look forward to any info you come up with justthinkin.

justthinkin said:
I've done a little checking into this case, and here's what I've found so far. Long post.

I don't know where it originated, but there has been some misleading information put out on this case, and then repeated on other websites and by the media.

I questioned that in 1974 the US post office could move so fast as to deliver a letter the same day as it was postmarked. Well, they didn't. The letter was postmarked on the 24th, but wasn't received until the girls had been missing for several days.

The Ft. Worth Police reported that the letter was not mailed from Weatherford or Eliasville, but was mailed in Ft. Worth. I have no idea why bogus info would be put out, but it certainly doesn't help solve this case.

Another thing, Rachel's car had been found by 6:00PM on the day the girls went missing. The stores hadn't even closed. The parents of the girls reacted quickly. When the girls didn't show up by 4:00PM the parents started worrying, and by 5:00PM, knew something was really wrong. They called the police, the hospitals, the girls' friends, everything a panicked parent would do, they did. The parents said the police initially dismissed the girls' disappearance as runaways.

I think I will call the Ft. Worth Police next Monday to find out, first hand, what info that's been made public is solid, and what isn't.

Does not look like the police think this was a random kidnapping. Tommy Trlica, Rachel's husband was under suspicion very soon after the fact, and he has not been the only suspect.

According to Rusty Arnold, his sister, Debra Arnold Hopper did finally consented to a polygraph test in 2001. At that time, Rusty Arnold expected to have the case solved shortly. Since that didn't happen, I'm guessing that Debra Hopper passed the polygraph test. I'll see what I can find out.

I don't know what else he does, but Rusty Arnold is also a singer/performer, and has written a song about the disappearance. I really don't know what to make of him. The song may have served two purposes, getting the girls names out there, but also, a more self-serving purpose. I have not yet listened to the song. It is posted online.

Rusty Arnold also claims to have very good information that his sister is alive, and returns to Ft. Worth every year around Christmas. He claims he has credible eye-witnesses, people who know, knew Rachel. I can't imagine, in all this time, if that were the case that someone wouldn't have turned her in to LE. If Rachel were alive she would have to live somewhere and work somewhere, and yet no neighbor or co-worker has come forward with a lead on her whereabouts. If they had, she would've been taken into custody, and this would've been on every TV station in the country and online.

It's been reported that Tommy Trlica offered a $2000 reward, but after a year, sold his house and moved away. I know he married a third time, and his present wife (if they haven't divorced) is a Linda Ishmael who graduated from high school in Frisco, Tx in 1976. I found her on reunion.com where she listed herself as Linda Ishmael Trlica. In 2000. they reportedly were living in east Texas. January of 2008, they were living in Galveston, Tx. Found her and Tommy Trlica listed in attendance at funeral on an obit. listing for Linda's brother. She has numerous siblings. I had to ask myself how she and Tommy Trlica met, and when. With 13 siblings, I wondered if one of her brothers wasn't working with Trlica in Ft. Worth or wasn't hanging out with him in 1974. Of course, if he left Ft. Worth, he may have moved to Frisco.

Here are a few links in no particular order:
http://www.missingtrio.com/TRIO/news41301.htm
http://tinyurl.com/8hqpxk

http://namesdatabase.com/schools/US/TX/Frisco/Frisco High School

http://www.e-cinc.com/obituariesn.html.
http://www.angelfire.com/mi3/mpccn/trlica.html
http://chriscrimeforum.freeforums.org/3-young-girls-go-to-the-mall-t987.html

I did not find the one link I really wanted to post which contained several articles from several different newspapers. I will keep looking. In the meantime, I apologize for any repetition in links that others may have already posted. I am just too tired to think.

One thing that struck me as odd, is that the families hired a P.I. to work the case in 1975. He died in 1979; his death listed as drug overdose and suicide, and "all his papers destroyed as per his request." I will check that out with the Ft. Worth Police because that sounds hinkey to me.
Click to expand...
 
It does make sense that the families would notice them gone by 4 p.m. since that's when Ranee had planned to be back to prepare for the Christmas party that evening. (Julie Ann had to be back by 6 p.m. according to the article on missingtrio.com.)

If the family found the car by 6 p.m., when did they move it out of the lot? The security guard says he saw the girls in a pickup with another security guard at 11:30 p.m., still on mall property. I can't see how they'd be laughing if they'd missed Ranee's party, kept a 9yo 5.5 hours past her curfew and possibly discovered their car was no longer where they'd left it in the parking lot. Unless of course they'd left the mall and were returning with the guard but hadn't discovered that the car was missing yet.

If Swaim really did order his notes on the case destroyed when they could have helped someone, that must've been a real slap in the face to the families and it makes me angry.

Why would Tommy have been a suspect? Did he have to work on Christmas Eve? You'd think they could have eliminated him as a suspect quickly if it could be proven he'd been at work.
 
I'm going to have dedicate the time to go back and re-read everything available. It's never "set" well with me about them supposedly having been seen in the truck with the mall security guy. sigh, it just doesn't make sense in a number of ways.

Just thinking aloud and making a note to myself really. It just feels like it's time for this case to have some clarity and true focus.
 
Thanks, snowme.

I think the info that Hutchins gave is bogus. In one of the newspaper articles it was reported that several family members set up a watch, and watched that car all night to see if the girls or anyone came back to that car. Now that makes lots of sense to me. If the police first decided the girls were runaways, then it would be up to the parents to do everything in their power until they could make believers of the police.

According to Hutchins he reported what he'd seen to the police, and never heard back, and didn't see the story in the papers anymore. So he waited until 2000 or 2001 to come forward again????....He had to have lived under a rock not to notice that story in the papers. I think he just wanted to be associated with the case in some way for a little fame. Either that or the police need to take a closer look at that guy.

He claims he worked in LE in the 60s, quit, and then went to work for Sears security. Security has always paid less than LE as far as I know, so why would he do that? Maybe he didn't quit. Maybe he was fired from LE or maybe he never worked in LE at all. There was at least one other report that the girls were seen with a security person. Maybe there's even more to it than that. Don't know.

I've been puzzling about several things. Somewhere I read that before the girls went shopping, Rachel had to drop off Tommy's little boy to the child's mother's house or apt. Then the girls went shopping. I've only seen that reported once.

Then I have read where the girls went to an Army Navy store to get some things out of layaway first before heading to the mall. The only way for someone to know that is they had to be told by one of the girls before the girls left on the shopping trip. Secondly, what was supposedly found in the car were some gift wrapped packages, and a sack with a new pair of jeans. Do they sell jeans at Army Surplus stores? I'm not aware of it if they do. If the jeans weren't bought at the surplus store, then what happened to the purchases from the surplus store? Were they in the trunk of the car?

What is the actual estimated time the girls would've arrived at the mall? I feel sure they had been abducted by 4:00PM or else, Renee would've called her mom to let her know they were running late, and they'd be late for the party. My understanding is that her mom was to attend this same Christmas party.

We need more information to work with. If Texas had an open discovery law like Florida, this case would benefit from it as would so many others. Only the prosecution benefits from privacy policies whereas, the victims, the victim's families, taxpayers, truth, the whole justice system benefits from open file discovery.

In the meantime, LE really needs to issue a clear statement of known facts about this case that have been made public, eliminating any false info floating around, and releasing any new info they can.

If anyone runs across a web page with articles on this case from several newspapers, please post a link. Until then, I'll keep looking 'til I find it.

Some detectives had been assigned back in 2001 or 2000 to work this case again. I wonder if anyone's still actively working it.

Family members are usually the first suspects in a murder case until or unless the facts present a different story. Learned that from John Douglas's book, Mind Hunter. The reason why family is first suspected is that more people are killed by family members than by anyone else. If they can't be eliminated as suspects, they're going to remain on the list of suspects.
 
tator,

To answer your question directly, apparently someone reported to LE that Rachel was unhappy in her marriage. That immediately would throw up a red flag to LE.

I'd like to know Trlica's whereabouts, the day before the disappearances, the day of, and the week after that. I'd like to know the time of day he first heard the girls were missing, and his reaction. I'd like to know if he went with those parents while they "staked out" Rachel's car. I'd like to know where Deb Arnold was too, and her reaction, etc. I'd like to know if any of the girls were wearing a watch, if any of them had ever spoken of meeting someone new at that mall or having a friend who worked at that mall or ever mentioned any people they knew who hung out at the mall prior to their disappearance. It's unlikely Julie Ann would've known any such persons, but the two older girls, it's a possibility.

Which two families had vacationed together? The Moseleys and the Wilsons or the Arnolds and the Wilsons? If it was the Moseleys and the Wilsons, then I think that Renee would've related to Julie Ann as an older sister might have. If that were true, she'd have been watching out for Julie Ann, and was probably why her mother let her go with the two older girls. So for that reason, I don't think the two older ones got Julie Ann into a situation that put her at risk, at least not knowingly. Renee would've felt responsible for Julie Ann. Maybe I'm wrong, and maybe the older girls were wild as march hares. Don't know.

I think if I'd have been at a mall, and a younger child had accompanied me there, I don't think I would've left the mall with friends of mine, and taken a 9yr. old with me. I'd have probably told them, "sorry, some other time." Now if Rachel's husband showed up, I think I'd have treated that relationship differently, and might have gone somewhere with she, her husband, and taking the 9 yr. old with me.

It's important to think under what circumstances would these girls leave the mall, and who they might have left with if they weren't just nabbed out of the parking lot. How much influence did RacheI exert over Renee or vice versa? Which girl was the leader and which the follower? If Rachel was unhappy in her relationship, it might have been that she'd met someone else, a bad someone else (unbeknownst to her just how bad), and she could have had it set up for that person to meet them at the mall that day so her husband wouldn't find out. Heck, maybe she was friends with the boyfriend that Deb Arnold was having trouble with.

Whatever guy, maybe he brought a friend of his along with him to the mall that day, and initially Rachel left with them, leaving Renee and Julie Ann at the mall. I can see something like this happening easily. Rachel goes off with two guys, guys her age or older. Something gets out of hand, and Rachel is killed. If Renee and Julie Ann could identify the two guys Rachel left with, then Rachel's killers might have come back to the mall, lured the other two girls away from the mall, saying something was wrong with Rachel, and they needed to come quick. Then they killed the two younger girls, the only witnesses who could say Rachel was last seen in their company. It's a good theory, but I dont' know how the letter would fit into it.....
 
justthinkin, I set out to find the page that had several newspaper articles on the case for you and meandered and stumbled into something else. By the way, before I get into that, you are aware that one of the links you provided a few posts up contained several articles too, right? This one: http://tinyurl.com/8hqpxk I'm guessing it's another site you're looking for but want to be sure.

Now, in trying to find a site with several articles on it I searched a phrase like "fort worth 1974 murders" just to see if I could find something that would give me a general glimpse at what other incidents may have taken place around the general time period. I came across a well laid-out site for a cold case Carla Walker (Feb. '74). The site is the effort of a retired Detective John Terrell (FWPD). There's much information there and one thing I was looking for was if there was a hint at all that our missing girls here may be linked at all to the suspect in Miss Walker's case. Indeed, Detective Terrell believes there just might be a link. The main page for Carla Walker's case:

http://www.ejweb.com/!jfc/main.shtml

The suspect in Miss Walker's case is William Ted Wilhoit, he is a convicted sex offender currently paroled. His offender database page:

https://records.txdps.state.tx.us/D...ex=Individual&IND_IDN=7078246&SearchType=Name

His name really caught my attention as it seemed slightly familiar. I've heard it on local news (actually a nearby city that he has connections with, but since I live in a rural area they are considered our local stations). It gives me the creeps that he's "down the road".

Anyway, I've not read all of the case info at Miss Walker's site, I intend to. I may read it before I dive back into the information here for our three girls, just to see if anything clicks ahead of time.
 
I'll keep looking for articles as well.

The mall must have been closed, possibly for hours, by 11:30 p.m. when the security guard said he saw the girls in a younger security guard's pickup. Presumably at this hour the lot was virtually empty, save for Rachel's abandoned car and whatever vehicle the parents were inside while they staked out her car.

The article said the two guards had a "run-in" and words were exchanged but then everyone laughed and they drove off. Er...with a background in law enforcement, would you allow one of your younger coworkers to cruise a deserted parking lot with three young girls who are out way past legal curfew? I can see him looking the other way while the younger guard cruised with the two teens he might have wanted to impress, but definitely not with a nine-year-old in the truck.


I wonder how many times during either guard's shift (the elder guard worked for Sears) the girls had been paged over the mall's intercom and whether the pages could be heard from inside the Sears store as well as the rest of the mall. If the older guard had heard the pages throughout the day and all three girls' names were mentioned, why wouldn't he have connected this to the three in the car?

A few more questions:

Was the younger guard a Sears employee or employed elsewhere in the mall? Did he work indoors or was his sole job to patrol the parking lot?

Exactly how much media attention did this case get? Were fliers posted at the mall where the older guard would have seen them on his rounds, or did police return to interview the guards? It's very hard to believe he assumed the girls had been found. Surely the guards must have discussed the disappearance on their lunch breaks or in the guard stations!
 
Wonder if the girls were victims of Henry Lee Lucas and/or Ottis Toole?
 
snowme,

http://tinyurl.com/8hqpxk That link must be the one I was thinking of. Like I said, I was really tired that night.

I read through the Walker case as Terrell had it, and while I admire his tenacity, I'm not sure I can agree with him about Wilhoit, and here's why.

Terrell compared Wilhoit to Bundy, and yet we don't have a string of unsolved murders over a number of years that coincide with Wilhoit's known locations. Most serial rapists graduate to murder, and stay there. They don't go back to just raping. By saying that, I am not making light of raping at all. It's a serious, serious crime.

It's hard to say if the jury was wrong in finding Wilhoit not guilty in the trial where Wilhoit was charged with attempted rape and shooting a woman. Back in those days it was thought the woman herself played a role in getting raped. Thank goodness we've grown as a society, and have come to see rape for what it is--an unprovoked attack on women.

In my unprofessional opinion, Wilhoit was a burglar, albeit, a opportunistic burglar, who would rape if opportunity presented itself.
Still, he was in the area where Carla Walker, Rachel Trlica, Renee Wilson, and Julie Ann Moseley all disappeared, and at the time couldn't be ruled out entirely. Did I read that evidence had been lost or destroyed in the Walker case? I think so. So without evidence to prove otherwise and a trial, Wilhoit is innocent, and will remain so.

Terrell claims that McCoy identified Wilhoit as the one who hit him over the head, and took Carla Walker from the car, but that was years later, and people's memory gets fuzzy after awhile. Also, the crime happened around midnight in a darkened parking lot. We have only McCoy's word on what happened there, and he moved to Alaska. It always bothers me when people move away from an area where they've been involved in a crime in some capacity.

From what I gathered from Terrell's website, Wilhoit's MO was to strike at night and attack lone women. That's the opposite circumstance of the three missing girls in Ft. Worth.

tater,
Back in those days even during Christmas time, stores closed at 9:00PM
I don't think we'd gone to them staying open 'til 10 yet. We didn't have almost instant fliers either--no computers to quickly print them out on. That would've taken several days probably.

Hutchins report just makes no sense at all. First, if the parents were staking out the car, they'd have seen both security guards and the girls. So it didn't happen the way he said. Second, if the girls had been abducted, why would they be brought back to the mall parking lot only to be taken away again? No way.
Thirdly, as you said yourself, Renee wouldn't have missed the party, and Julie Ann would've never stayed gone that long. She was just 9 yrs. old. She'd have been in so much trouble she'd have been grounded for a year. Maybe Renee too.

As much as we would like to see this case solved, I don't think it's going to ever happen unless those girls' bodies are found. Even then, their remains would have to show they'd been bludgeoned or shot or stabbed or strangled. An MO is needed to point to a known perp. And maybe the perp wasn't a known criminal.

The ME couldn't even determine the method of death in the Caylee Anthony case as there were no marks on the bones to indicate the type of foul play. Sure if the girls' bodies are found, we know they were murdered because they've been missing so long, but finding fibers from the perp/s clothing or anything else...I'm guessing would be impossible.
I've read that even bones start deteriorating after time. It's sad.

Maybe we are just hopelessly spinning our wheels on this. If nothing else, it'd be nice to bring complete closure to the parents and families of these girls. Locate the bodies so they could have a proper burial. Then at least, the worry of not knowing where the girls are would be over for these parents and families.

All we have is a point of disappearance. That's it, no blood evidence, no nothing except that letter. Was it checked against Renee's handwriting or Julie's? Don't know.

Frustration is setting in already.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

DNASolves

Who is Escambia County John Doe (1989)?

Members online

... and 73 more.
Total: 3,939 (members: 74, guests: 3,865)

Online statistics

Members online
74
Guests online
3,865
Total visitors
3,939
Totals may include hidden visitors.

Forum statistics

Threads
591,663
Messages
17,957,220
Members
228,583
Latest member
Vjeanine
Back
Top