GZ Case - Defense Perspective

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Curiosity: Why did Mr. O'Mara ask Judge Recksiedler to step aside? I understand her husband had some deal with reporting the case to CNN (?) but I don't see how that would play on anything in court.
 
vlpate said:
ABC has made many, many, misleading statements based on what Crump and Tracy Martin have told them, so why would I believe this report? The Chief, Serino himself, and Wolfinger all said they didn't have enough probable cause to arrest GZ. Even if Serino did want to arrest him that night, an investigation by SPD changed his mind. JMO
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Well, then thank goodness for the DA's investigator. Bet no one was going to try and twist his arm. lol
 
Phoenixfla said:
Lean towards - no, but if they prove beyond a reasonable doubt, I would have no problem finding him guilty. I have said that from the beginning.
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I'm pretty much where you are but IMO the 2nd degree appears to be such a stretch that I don't think I could convict on anything greater than manslaughter.
 
AJ Noiter said:
Curiosity: Why did Mr. O'Mara ask Judge Recksiedler to step aside? I understand her husband had some deal with reporting the case to CNN (?) but I don't see how that would play on anything in court.
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The judge disclosed the fact herself and opted out by stepping down because her husband was a "talking head" for CNN. I would say she had some concerns, I don't think MOM did. Maybe she did not want her husband to have to give up his job at CNN. To the outside world it would have appeared as if he might have "inside" information even though he would not. It's a lot neater this way. jmo
 
AngelWings444 said:
There wasn't a challenger for the election. Nobody else could have won the election, as nobody challenged AC. An election is a couple years in the making, not a couple of months.

Reasonable doubt is already formed in people's mind, from a bond hearing?? Our justice system is in severe trouble, if that is the case. If "we" are to wait for evidence to convict GZ, then we certainly should allow the State to put on their case, or at least release SOME documents to believe he is not culpable, in any manner, for Trayvon's death. My goodness...

ETA: Will anyone here change their mind if the documents lean towards GZ being guilty? I wonder...
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Absolutely I will.
 
suzihawk said:
There were many reports of this in late March. Of course he denied! :rolleyes:

Was this before or after he stepped down from the case? I know it was before he suddenly decided not to run for re-election. I'm anxious to see what the DOJ uncovers.
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So. no link that directly sources Lee, Wolfinger, Serino, FBI, Special Prosecutor, anyone in LE, that says Serino wanted to arrest GZ?

BEM: Any links to those reports in late March that aren't parroting ABC's initial report?

April 2nd OS LINK
"Benjamin Crump sent a formal request to the federal agency Monday, saying he believes Wolfinger and police Chief Bill Lee Jr. met Feb. 26 and overruled a homicide investigator's recommendation that George Zimmerman be charged with manslaughter.

Monday afternoon, Wolfinger said there was no meeting and that the letter was based on "outright lies". He also denounced "those spreading … irresponsible rhetoric".

<snip>
Some news agencies have reported that Sanford's lead investigator, Chris Serino, wanted Zimmerman charged with manslaughter that night but Wolfinger's office put a stop to it. The city of Sanford issued a statement saying that is not true.
<snip>
Two weeks ago, during an exclusive interview with the Sentinel, Lee disclosed certain details of the investigation and during that session, attended by Serino and others, Serino said his investigation turned up no reliable evidence that cast doubt on Zimmerman's account – that he had acted in self-defense."

From the defense perspective, this is an important admission by the lead investigator who has not stepped down, nor has he been terminated."

Bold emphasis mine.
 
LambChop said:
The judge disclosed the fact herself and opted out by stepping down because her husband was a "talking head" for CNN. I would say she had some concerns, I don't think MOM did. Maybe she did not want her husband to have to give up his job at CNN. To the outside world it would have appeared as if he might have "inside" information even though he would not. It's a lot neater this way. jmo
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Thanks for the input. I, personally, don't care if he might have "inside" information or not, but that's me.
 
vlpate said:
So. no link that directly sources Lee, Wolfinger, Serino, FBI, Special Prosecutor, anyone in LE, that says Serino wanted to arrest GZ?

BEM: Any links to those reports in late March that aren't parroting ABC's initial report?

April 2nd OS LINK
"Benjamin Crump sent a formal request to the federal agency Monday, saying he believes Wolfinger and police Chief Bill Lee Jr. met Feb. 26 and overruled a homicide investigator's recommendation that George Zimmerman be charged with manslaughter.

Monday afternoon, Wolfinger said there was no meeting and that the letter was based on "outright lies". He also denounced "those spreading … irresponsible rhetoric".

<snip>
Some news agencies have reported that Sanford's lead investigator, Chris Serino, wanted Zimmerman charged with manslaughter that night but Wolfinger's office put a stop to it. The city of Sanford issued a statement saying that is not true.
<snip>
Two weeks ago, during an exclusive interview with the Sentinel, Lee disclosed certain details of the investigation and during that session, attended by Serino and others, Serino said his investigation turned up no reliable evidence that cast doubt on Zimmerman's account – that he had acted in self-defense."

From the defense perspective, this is an important admission by the lead investigator who has not stepped down, nor has he been terminated."

Bold emphasis mine.
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Maybe at the time it was Serino's gut feeling that GZ was lying and he had no "in hand" evidence but apparently the DA has it now? So whatever Chief Lee had to say that day, given that they obviously had not done a thorough investigation, is now coming back to haunt him. We can see holes with what little we know now. Interesting about the new chief. He likes to clean house from what I understand. jmo
 
AJ Noiter said:
Thanks for the input. I, personally, don't care if he might have "inside" information or not, but that's me.
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I don't think the Florida Bar would take too kindly if MOM were to complain. She did the right thing. Plus it opens up the possibility that somewhere right in the middle of the trial MOM may say....I want this judge to recluse herself......let's start over. I think it's an ethics matter. Some have it, some don't. jmo
 
vlpate said:
So. no link that directly sources Lee, Wolfinger, Serino, FBI, Special Prosecutor, anyone in LE, that says Serino wanted to arrest GZ?
Click to expand...

<snipped>

http://www.kltv.com/story/17270330/lead-inestigator-wanted-to-press-charges-in-trayvon-case

According to ABC News, lead investigator Chris Serino wanted to charge George Zimmerman with manslaughter after interviewing him on the night he shot Trayvon Martin, 17.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/trayvon-ma...orge-zimmerman-manslaughter/story?id=16011674

The lead homicide investigator in the shooting of unarmed teenager Trayvon Martin recommended that neighborhood watch captain George Zimmerman be charged with manslaughter the night of the shooting, multiple sources told ABC News.

But Sanford, Fla., Investigator Chris Serino was instructed to not press charges against Zimmerman because the state attorney's office headed by Norman Wolfinger determined there wasn't enough evidence to lead to a conviction, the sources told ABC News.

http://www.wbtv.com/story/17270330/lead-inestigator-wanted-to-press-charges-in-trayvon-case

According to ABC News, lead investigator Chris Serino wanted to charge George Zimmerman with manslaughter after interviewing him on the night he shot Trayvon Martin, 17.


ABC News reported the lead homicide investigator, Chris Serino, recommended that Zimmerman be charged with manslaughter, but the state attorney’s office felt there was not enough evidence to bring a case. He filed an affidavit on Feb. 26, the night Trayvon was killed, saying he did not believe Zimmerman’s claim of self-defense.


Read more: http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/03/29...-arrest-in-trayvon-martin-case/#ixzz1uEiHnDxf

----------

Is that enough?
 
suzihawk said:
<snipped>

http://www.kltv.com/story/17270330/lead-inestigator-wanted-to-press-charges-in-trayvon-case

According to ABC News, lead investigator Chris Serino wanted to charge George Zimmerman with manslaughter after interviewing him on the night he shot Trayvon Martin, 17.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/trayvon-ma...orge-zimmerman-manslaughter/story?id=16011674

The lead homicide investigator in the shooting of unarmed teenager Trayvon Martin recommended that neighborhood watch captain George Zimmerman be charged with manslaughter the night of the shooting, multiple sources told ABC News.

But Sanford, Fla., Investigator Chris Serino was instructed to not press charges against Zimmerman because the state attorney's office headed by Norman Wolfinger determined there wasn't enough evidence to lead to a conviction, the sources told ABC News.

http://www.wbtv.com/story/17270330/lead-inestigator-wanted-to-press-charges-in-trayvon-case

According to ABC News, lead investigator Chris Serino wanted to charge George Zimmerman with manslaughter after interviewing him on the night he shot Trayvon Martin, 17.


ABC News reported the lead homicide investigator, Chris Serino, recommended that Zimmerman be charged with manslaughter, but the state attorney’s office felt there was not enough evidence to bring a case. He filed an affidavit on Feb. 26, the night Trayvon was killed, saying he did not believe Zimmerman’s claim of self-defense.


Read more: http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/03/29...-arrest-in-trayvon-martin-case/#ixzz1uEiHnDxf

----------

Is that enough?
Click to expand...

I think the point is that all those references lead back to ABC News. And the ABC News sources are not identified nor are they even listed as being affiliated with LE.

IMO, the words out of Serino's mouth contradicting these reports are, at this time, more compelling than unnamed sources. Perhaps Serino will get on the stand and change his story but that remains to be seen.

JMO, OMO, and :moo:
 
gxm said:
I think the point is that all those references lead back to ABC News. And the ABC News sources are not identified nor are they even listed as being affiliated with LE.

IMO, the words out of Serino's mouth contradicting these reports are, at this time, more compelling than unnamed sources. Perhaps Serino will get on the stand and change his story but that remains to be seen.

JMO, OMO, and :moo:
Click to expand...

She asked for links. I provided them. I certainly don't expect her (or you) to agree with them.
 
suzihawk said:
She asked for links. I provided them. I certainly don't expect her (or you) to agree with them.
Click to expand...

Maybe you missed the qualifier? It was a long post, so understandable.
BEM: Any links to those reports in late March that aren't parroting ABC's initial report?"
Click to expand...

It's pointless to agree or disagree with something that has clearly been debunked as a lie.

Thank you for going to the trouble anyway!
 
suzihawk said:
She asked for links. I provided them. I certainly don't expect her (or you) to agree with them.
Click to expand...

Respectfully, I understood what vlpate was saying also. The point she/he was making is that ALL the articles go back to the ABC News report. ABC did not list ANY sources for saying that Serino wanted to press charges. They said it, everyone repeated it, but that does not necessarily make it true.

One thing I find fascinating is looking back through the initial articles and seeing the wildly inaccurate reporting in them. Its just crazy.
 
vlpate said:
So. no link that directly sources Lee, Wolfinger, Serino, FBI, Special Prosecutor, anyone in LE, that says Serino wanted to arrest GZ?

BEM: Any links to those reports in late March that aren't parroting ABC's initial report?

April 2nd OS LINK
"Benjamin Crump sent a formal request to the federal agency Monday, saying he believes Wolfinger and police Chief Bill Lee Jr. met Feb. 26 and overruled a homicide investigator's recommendation that George Zimmerman be charged with manslaughter.

Monday afternoon, Wolfinger said there was no meeting and that the letter was based on "outright lies". He also denounced "those spreading … irresponsible rhetoric".

<snip>
Some news agencies have reported that Sanford's lead investigator, Chris Serino, wanted Zimmerman charged with manslaughter that night but Wolfinger's office put a stop to it. The city of Sanford issued a statement saying that is not true.
<snip>
Two weeks ago, during an exclusive interview with the Sentinel, Lee disclosed certain details of the investigation and during that session, attended by Serino and others, Serino said his investigation turned up no reliable evidence that cast doubt on Zimmerman's account – that he had acted in self-defense."

From the defense perspective, this is an important admission by the lead investigator who has not stepped down, nor has he been terminated."

Bold emphasis mine.
Click to expand...

:tyou:
 
LambChop said:
I don't think the Florida Bar would take too kindly if MOM were to complain. She did the right thing. Plus it opens up the possibility that somewhere right in the middle of the trial MOM may say....I want this judge to recluse herself......let's start over. I think it's an ethics matter. Some have it, some don't. jmo
Click to expand...

I can agree with that. I do believe Mr. O'Mara did ask her to recuse herself, in a quick google search I found a number of articles, this is the first.


On Monday afternoon, Zimmerman’s lawyers filed a motion asking the trial judge, Jessica Recksiedler, to remove herself from the case due to an alleged conflict of interest. But the contents of that motion are not available from the court, because of a separate judge’s decision last Thursday—the day after Zimmerman’s arrest—to seal virtually every record in the court docket.
thedailybeast.com
Click to expand...
 
suzihawk said:
<snipped>

http://www.kltv.com/story/17270330/lead-inestigator-wanted-to-press-charges-in-trayvon-case

According to ABC News, lead investigator Chris Serino wanted to charge George Zimmerman with manslaughter after interviewing him on the night he shot Trayvon Martin, 17.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/trayvon-ma...orge-zimmerman-manslaughter/story?id=16011674

The lead homicide investigator in the shooting of unarmed teenager Trayvon Martin recommended that neighborhood watch captain George Zimmerman be charged with manslaughter the night of the shooting, multiple sources told ABC News.

But Sanford, Fla., Investigator Chris Serino was instructed to not press charges against Zimmerman because the state attorney's office headed by Norman Wolfinger determined there wasn't enough evidence to lead to a conviction, the sources told ABC News.

http://www.wbtv.com/story/17270330/lead-inestigator-wanted-to-press-charges-in-trayvon-case

According to ABC News, lead investigator Chris Serino wanted to charge George Zimmerman with manslaughter after interviewing him on the night he shot Trayvon Martin, 17.


ABC News reported the lead homicide investigator, Chris Serino, recommended that Zimmerman be charged with manslaughter, but the state attorney’s office felt there was not enough evidence to bring a case. He filed an affidavit on Feb. 26, the night Trayvon was killed, saying he did not believe Zimmerman’s claim of self-defense.


Read more: http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/03/29...-arrest-in-trayvon-martin-case/#ixzz1uEiHnDxf

----------

Is that enough?
Click to expand...

BBM

I'm going to make an assumption that this affidavit has not been made public yet (the one filed by Serino on the 26th)? My question is, why not? Once we get a doc dump, I fully expect that affidavit to be made public and if it's not, then I can't take that ABC report as factual.
 
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