FL FL - Michelle Parker, 33, Orlando, 17 Nov 2011 - #13

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Mr. Noatak said:
My opinions only, no facts here:

I see a poster stating that Ironhorse's sighting of the Hummer was "just before 3". Can someone steer me to any post where Ironhorse has updated his information? Or at least, give me what the consensus time of the Hummer sighting by Ironhorse was- closer to 3 or closer to 4? Thanks.
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Think it was postet in the thread that is being cleaned up for some wrong information. But if my memory serves me correct, his sighting would be before she got to Dale.
 
Jazzmaster said:
What concerns me is I can now see why police haven't arrested Dale. Unless they have some pretty darn good evidence that they are keeping close lipped, there is no way they'd secure a conviction. IMO if they had that kind of evidence, Dale would not be a free man.

Based on all the hours I have focused on this case, if I were a juror and the case were today I couldn't say guilty. Even though I STRONGLY suspect Dale was involved, I would have to go with "not guilty" based on reasonable doubt.
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Respectfully snipped.
You summed up my thoughts perfectly. If this is frustrating for us, I can't imagine how frustrating it must be for law enforcement. I think that they have done a great job of staying focused on their goal and not allowing information to be leaked to the press.

I hope that today is the day that they find Michelle...
 
telemag said:
I really can't see them having a ton of evidence against Dale by day ten. I'm not sure what the time frame is for a speedy trial but let's assume 6 months. So LE will not arrest Dale until they are sure they can build a case within this time frame? So I am guessing that at this point with a ton of evidence as you call it they still are not confident enough to make an arrest and come to trial within the speedy trial time frame.
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I think they have enough to name him a suspect but not enough to arrest and charge him. They need more than circumstantial evidence to charge someone with murder. First they have to prove she was murdered, and then they have to have sufficient reason to believe he is the one who murdered her. I agree with you, I don't think they have a ton of evidence or he would have been arrested by now.
I wonder if they have used cadavar dogs on the Hummer and Dale's pickup as well as Dale Sr.'s vehicle? Or the garage, if he concealed her body there until he could dispose of it? If it's true that these dogs can pick up the scent of a dead body within minutes of death, then seems to me they would have a pretty good idea of who disposed of her body. Maybe that's the evidence they need for an arrest.
 
katydid23 said:
I don't think so for two reasons. One, there is no drug history as far as we know. And she worked as a bartender in a very popular bar. She would not need to go to a sketchy area and buy anything, imo. She could have anything she wanted through her work connections probably.

Also, I have never heard of a random abduxctor or drug dealer taking the victims phone to reply to a text. imoo
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Agreed. Plusher car was found in a high crime area but her phone was not. Nela goes theough a nice neighborhood with million dollar houses on the lake.
 
It's interesting to me that yesterday Chief Paul Rooney of the Orlando Police Department stated he stands behind his initial ruling that Dale Smith is still the primary suspect. This would indicate to me that so far nothing retrieved from Michelle's phone clears Dale. Many of us have come up with alternative theories but there has been no evidence that this could have been someone other than Dale.
 
It might help to remember, too.... it is not LE's decision when to arrest. It's up to the DA, or as it is in FL, the SA. I don't know at which point they assign the team of prosecutors to the case, but at any rate, LE does not make the decision alone of when to arrest/charge him. It's a joint process, as Smooth said very well.
 
TxLady2 said:
It might help to remember, too.... it is not LE's decision when to arrest. It's up to the DA, or as it is in FL, the SA. I don't know at which point they assign the team of prosecutors to the case, but at any rate, LE does not make the decision alone of when to arrest/charge him. It's a joint process, as Smooth said very well.
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I sure do hope that they are able to gather enough evidence quickly! I pray constantly for the return of MP to her family and loved ones.

Where are you Michelle?
 
Omachka said:
:welcome4: I'm so sorry that this is happening. It must be hard when you know the family of someone who is missing... and especially from a small, close-knit community like Geneva.

I have been thinking that perhaps the day care is close to the beauty shop in Oviedo which makes it handy for Michelle and her mother when they are working there. We know that she left the shop to pick up the children at 2:30 but I wonder if perhaps she got her son off to school in the AM and then drove to Oviedo with the twins, dropped them at day care and then went in to work at the beauty shop. Then, when she left the shop at 2:30 all she needed to do was pick up the twins at day care in Oviedo which would have taken a little while (to gather their things, sign them out, etc.) and then go on to DS2's from there arriving at 3:18 like the video shows. Do you know if that timing would be close to correct? This would leave the timing of driving back and forth from Oviedo to Geneva off the timeline all together and gives her around 45 minutes to gather the children and drive to DS2's.
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Sorry if all this has been discussed, I am just now logging in to catch up from yesterday....

There are quite a few daycares in close proximity to the salon. As in, it would take you less than 5 minutes to get to 2 that i can think of off hand. (i dont know if i am allowed to name the salon or where it is, or if that has already been done) Leaving the salon and picking the kids up at 2:30 would make it very possible to get to Dales by 3:18, in fact that timing sounds about right, assuming that she took 417. If she did take 417, then depending on where the daycare is located, there are 2 most likely ramps that she could have taken to get on that road. The on ramp at SR 434, or the ramp at Red Bug Lake Road.
 
With regards to the phone along with the last ping. I believe it was at 6:50 when the son contacted YS and shortly thereafter MP did not show up for her work at 7:30. I can only assume this might be when YS contacted LE and then they may have texted or phone MP phone and this is when DS Jr. knew the police were finally involved. He then decided to head home to ensure nothing was left for LE to find with chucking the phone enroute home. IMO he kept the phone to have knowledge as to what her family was thinking or doing and when LE was contacted.

Also, I had heard on the news the day before yesterday, Bob Kealing stating they had found her phone in the weedline (news preview) which means it was not submerged in water. Does anyone have a way to contact Bob Kealing to confirm this? I thought I had saw on here that someone had a way of contacting Bob - I think it might have been Patty G....

Today or Tomorrow - timing permitted, I will go and take some more photos of these two bridges for those here at WS to view and look at just where this phone may have been found. Cleared areas and areas that may have been walked on numberous times. Also see if there is debris that was cleared on the banks of Lake Conway by these bridges.....
 
It is very difficult for LE to prove someone is deceased without a body or a crime scene or some other compelling evidence, i.e. maybe a suicide note at the edge of a lake, for example. And then to put together a case based on circumstances which include the presumption of death, well, that is even more difficult. I'm just not sure how much LE can do, if Michelle is not found. I've read the much-mentioned on WS website which details "no body" cases going back a century or so, and almost all of them have either a crime scene or a witness to acts of physical violence/specific threats against the victim by the suspect, at the very least. And those that were pursued were usually charged years after the person went missing...

Locating Michelle is really the key to everything...JMO. Hoping that phone turns out to be a literal roadmap.
 
cluciano63 said:
It is very difficult for LE to prove someone is deceased without a body or a crime scene or some other compelling evidence, i.e. maybe a suicide note at the edge of a lake, for example. And then to put together a case based on circumstances which include the presumption of death, well, that is even more difficult. I'm just not sure how much LE can do, if Michelle is not found. I've read the much-mentioned on WS website which details "no body" cases going back a century or so, and almost all of them have either a crime scene or a witness to acts of physical violence/specific threats against the victim by the suspect, at the very least. And those that were pursued were usually charged years after the person went missing...

Locating Michelle is really the key to everything...JMO. Hoping that phone turns out to be a literal roadmap.
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I believe that there are witnesses to acts of violence. The children. IIRC Michelle said that he "put his hands on her".
 
With regards to the visitation schedule, imo MN advised DS Jr. that he might want to think about doing this as and when he gets arrested I am sure he would want his parents to help in raising these children. IMO he did so under advise of attorneys so that he would have some form of contact with his children if and should he be arrested.

I also read about the gators naturally disposing of the remains, I have always heard they prefer live food wiith movement. Unless they are starving they do not prefer decomposition. You would still find clothing articles along with storing or weighting items.....
 
telemag said:
I really can't see them having a ton of evidence against Dale by day ten. I'm not sure what the time frame is for a speedy trial but let's assume 6 months. So LE will not arrest Dale until they are sure they can build a case within this time frame? So I am guessing that at this point with a ton of evidence as you call it they still are not confident enough to make an arrest and come to trial within the speedy trial time frame.
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I can offer a small personal insight into speedy arrests (or lack thereof).

My daughter was 12 and sexually battered by a neighbor. It was reported on 20th Dec, lengthy statements taken from her on 23rd Dec.

This was already on probation for drug offenses, he was also on bond from a sexual assault on a minor from the Sept that year, he lived next door next to the school bus stop.

He assaulted a friend of my daughter the SAME day, and there was DNA in all cases.

He was not arrested and charged until January 12th.

So even with all the evidence and history, it still took a while. He is currently serving 15 years, as he took a plea deal.
 
NSS said:
I can offer a small personal insight into speedy arrests (or lack thereof).

My daughter was 12 and sexually battered by a neighbor. It was reported on 20th Dec, lengthy statements taken from her on 23rd Dec.

This was already on probation for drug offenses, he was also on bond from a sexual assault on a minor from the Sept that year, he lived next door next to the school bus stop.

He assaulted a friend of my daughter the SAME day, and there was DNA in all cases.

He was not arrested and charged until January 12th.

So even with all the evidence and history, it still took a while. He is currently serving 15 years, as he took a plea deal.
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I am sorry that your daughter and family had to go through that. :blowkiss:
 
AlwaysWright said:
With regards to the visitation schedule, imo MN advised DS Jr. that he might want to think about doing this as and when he gets arrested I am sure he would want his parents to help in raising these children. IMO he did so under advise of attorneys so that he would have some form of contact with his children if and should he be arrested.

I also read about the gators naturally disposing of the remains, I have always heard they prefer live food wiith movement. Unless they are starving they do not prefer decomposition. You would still find clothing articles along with storing or weighting items.....
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SwampMama had a different take on gator food prefs:

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - FL FL - Michelle Parker, 33, Orlando, 17 Nov 2011 #13
 
4BB said:
This quote from Yvonne has always bugged me..

"He is crying every time I talk to him on the phone," Stewart said. "He loves my daughter. They just didn't get along."
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telemag said:
Why does this bug you?
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<Deep breath>

I'll tell you why this information "bugs" me. I am trying not to be driven and overtaken by emotion, specifically hate. Although Dale seems not in the least a likeable person, given his past history and his cold demeanor whenever we've seen him on video, not to mention his apparent action with the camera person, a couple of snippets of detail, such as Yvonne's words above, give me a glimpse of humanity in this man. I saw another article in which Yvonne mentioned the occasion of her talking with him and embracing him after the hearing where he retained custody of the twins. As I remember, she said that he sobbed and shook during that exchange.

Don't get me wrong. I am not trying to defend him or in any way promote sympathy for him. And I appreciate that some of you may see those episodes as just Dale's attempts at manipulation, and as Yvonne wisely trying to keep open the connection for the sake of the twins. But someone posted yesterday the suggestion that Dale could be a sociopath, without conscience. I can see the possibility of this, certainly, and so the suggestion that Dale is holding in some emotional pain that he might only reveal to Yvonne (and perhaps his family and close friends, but we don't hear about that) gives me some hope, believe it or not.

If Dale did something monstrous to Michelle that ended her life, and then rushed around madly to cover up the deed, which certainly seems to be the case based even on the little evidence the public has right now, then a spark of humanity and conscience is a good sign that, in my opinion, we should acknowledge. It suggests that what he may have done is weighing on him, perhaps heavily and even nightmarishly.

The hope this could give us is that he will more likely reveal, or even confess, what took place.

I know it may be a slim chance indeed that this will happen. But if he is in fact an emotionless sociopath, we would have no chance of that at all.

(All IMO, of course)
 
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