Why did Madeleine 'go missing'?

Why did Madeleine 'go missing'?

  • She was abducted

    Votes: 187 36.7%
  • She wandered off and disappeared

    Votes: 14 2.8%
  • She was overdosed on sedatives; parents covered it up

    Votes: 168 33.0%
  • She met with an accident; parents covered it up

    Votes: 65 12.8%
  • One of her parents was violent to her and killed her

    Votes: 63 12.4%
  • Any other reason Madeleine went missing

    Votes: 12 2.4%

  • Total voters
    509
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I totally agree Salem. There are many pics where Madeleine does not look like a happy child - that one where she is biting her lip & looking up at the camera. I don't think the child was happy & definitely not with kate. Any mother who could not give a direct message to her daughter saying that she loved her is very very weird. That comment "she knows we love her" said it all to me! They are good actors but I think that she hated Madeleine so much she couldn't even act on this occasion, so incredibly sad!
 
I totally agree Salem. There are many pics where Madeleine does not look like a happy child - that one where she is biting her lip & looking up at the camera. I don't think the child was happy & definitely not with kate. Any mother who could not give a direct message to her daughter saying that she loved her is very very weird. That comment "she knows we love her" said it all to me! They are good actors but I think that she hated Madeleine so much she couldn't even act on this occasion, so incredibly sad!

The "She knows we love her" comment always grated on my nerves. It reminds me of when I was in big trouble with my parents as a child. "You know we love you BUT..." It usually came with a lecture, a spanking or a grounding. If it started like that, I was ready to hide.:chicken:
 
Guys, nobody replied to my question (check last message and youtube link on this thread) how true is that Gerry brought a book about how to hide cadavers from the US in July?
 
I think the book you are referring to SleuthMom is "No Stone Unturned" which is a book about forensics investigations (see: http://www.amazon.com/No-Stone-Unturned-Forensic-Investigators/dp/0786015772). I have heard that there was a copy found in the villa but this has never been confirmed officially.

I am skeptical because if he had purchased the book prior to their vacation then it might suggest that Maddie's death was premeditated, which I have never believed.

If it was purchased on the trip to the states then that would point to the possibility that the body was moved and I have never believed that either.

I have thought that this was probably a forum myth based on GM using the phrase "no stone unturned" in an early blog entry. Someone made the connection to this book and then ran with it.

Just my opinion, you never know with this case.
 
I think the book you are referring to SleuthMom is "No Stone Unturned" which is a book about forensics investigations (see: http://www.amazon.com/No-Stone-Unturned-Forensic-Investigators/dp/0786015772). I have heard that there was a copy found in the villa but this has never been confirmed officially.

I am skeptical because if he had purchased the book prior to their vacation then it might suggest that Maddie's death was premeditated, which I have never believed.

If it was purchased on the trip to the states then that would point to the possibility that the body was moved and I have never believed that either.

I have thought that this was probably a forum myth based on GM using the phrase "no stone unturned" in an early blog entry. Someone made the connection to this book and then ran with it.

Just my opinion, you never know with this case.

What do you think happened to the body Colomon? What do you think about the DNA in the car? Just interested to know what your theory is, you obviously think it was placed somewhere & left there if you don't believe it was moved!
I am not sure about this either, the Pet Crematorium always stands out to me for some reason!
So do you think she was killed on the 2nd & body gone at that point?
 
I don't think the body was moved either but it was thrown to the waters.
 
I think the body was moved. I think that guy from South Africa actually got pretty close to where Maddie was and the McCanns had to move her before LE did a real search of the area. I don't put much faith in the SA guy's method.... I just think he got lucky.

And Barnaby, the pet crematorium really stands out to me also. I will admit that I thought the lawyer was going to find something in the reservoir and I was very disappointed when he didn't, so I could be wrong here also and can't wait until something comes out so we will know!!!

Salem
 
I don't think the body was moved either but it was thrown to the waters.

It is certainly possible Sleuth, so weighted down that it will never show up! I am still wondering about the DNA in the car though!

I think the body was moved. I think that guy from South Africa actually got pretty close to where Maddie was and the McCanns had to move her before LE did a real search of the area. I don't put much faith in the SA guy's method.... I just think he got lucky.

And Barnaby, the pet crematorium really stands out to me also. I will admit that I thought the lawyer was going to find something in the reservoir and I was very disappointed when he didn't, so I could be wrong here also and can't wait until something comes out so we will know!!!

Salem

I never thought the lawyer was going to find anything in the resevoir Salem as he said he had an underworld tip that she was abducted, raped (God I hate even typing that) & thrown in the resevoir, I never believed that to be true!

Now the guy from the Pet crem said that a couple showed up, said they were foreign but had no accent, spoke perfect English with an English accent! They said there were two dogs in the bags. What are the chances of 2 pet dogs dying at the same time? He said they were not sad like people usually are & didn't want the ashes as is usual!
It is grotesque I know but they were doctors & could have concealed the remains inside the dogs! Hence the big clean up in the apartment!
 
I truly don't think that Madeleine will be found, and yes, I think there was some moving around after the death. The pet crematorium is horribly convenient and close, but you would think that someone there would open up the bags, so I don't think that's a real possibility.
 
I thought the guy said he didn't open the bags? If IRC, LE said they checked out the crematoriam.

Also, remember when four or five of us felt like they were close to finding Maddie a few months back? I wonder where they were searching then? Maybe it was at that barn place?...... So many possibilities.

As for the lawyer, Barnaby - I was hoping he was lying about the underworld tip and that it was really a tip from one or more of the Tapas 7. I didn't think he would spend all that money if he wasn't pretty sure he was going to find something, even if he was banking on collecting the reward. Obviously, wishful thinking on my part.

Tex (can I call you that?) I think you are right. I don't she will be found, given Gerry's challenge to the LE to find her and prove they did it. So sad.

Salem
 
I truly don't think that Madeleine will be found, and yes, I think there was some moving around after the death. The pet crematorium is horribly convenient and close, but you would think that someone there would open up the bags, so I don't think that's a real possibility.

The guy said that he didn't open the bags Texana so who knows what was in them!

I thought the guy said he didn't open the bags? If IRC, LE said they checked out the crematoriam.

Also, remember when four or five of us felt like they were close to finding Maddie a few months back? I wonder where they were searching then? Maybe it was at that barn place?...... So many possibilities.

As for the lawyer, Barnaby - I was hoping he was lying about the underworld tip and that it was really a tip from one or more of the Tapas 7. I didn't think he would spend all that money if he wasn't pretty sure he was going to find something, even if he was banking on collecting the reward. Obviously, wishful thinking on my part.

Tex (can I call you that?) I think you are right. I don't she will be found, given Gerry's challenge to the LE to find her and prove they did it. So sad.

Salem

Yes you are right Salem , he did say that he didn't open the bags but surely if forensics examined the site there would be some evidence of human remains? Maybe not especially if Portugese do not have adequate investigatory resources.

I really never considered the possibility that the tip off might be from the Tapas crew! The lawyer was pretty convinced that something would be found when he spent all that money, I admit!

Agreed, wherever they dumped her I think it was pretty fool proof in view of that ultimatum that Gerry issued! Seems like they have committed the perfect crime! I hope they can live with themselves, so far they seem to be doing A-OK! I so hope the old saying is true in this case "Murder will out"
 
Cant stand it; when KM held out her hands during that recent intv to "shake" madeleine, that was it for me; her hands freaked me out. I was outta there. I had chills down my spine, I have no doubt that Madel met her end with the blow to her head or face. From that hand. This is what I believe, but I also have to state that giving your kids sedatives and then overdosing them, would be invol manslaughter/homicide not "an accident".

KM was there when Madel "went" just another abnormal phrase that KM used when describing how she died. She just "went". That day. When Madeleine Went. I think that was how she said it. So very disturbing. Hurtful, to think maybe that was the last thing that happened to a beautiful little child that should have had it all. something was wrong in that home. Something was wrong with Madel too; many of us have seen that in her photos. Her face, the weight loss and weight gain. Her little medical records would be key to this investigation. i have to have hope that the UK has them, and is sharing all they can in this case about who this couple really is. good Poll, looks like most agree she died by KMs hand. Since we all know that GM was playing his third game of tennis and KM had to be "checked" on.....whatever that was about. I'd say mental state. I'll go with that based on the diary writings. Glad that MJ and I copied them when we had them. Those pages of notes. But, they need FBI enhancement to read, they are too blurry. But what was reported to BE on those pages? good enough for me. Always has been always will be.
 
Yeah, the pet crematorium guy said he didn't open the bags, but if you are doing a body dump, you're betting the guy won't, which is not a safe bet.

It's possible, of course, but honestly, if the two guys with the bag story is true, chances are they've been shown photos of the Tapas diners, and they didn't identify them--again, if the story is true.

There are far too many rural spots and of course, the ocean, to make anything else far too risky and unnecessary.
 
Cant stand it; when KM held out her hands during that recent intv to "shake" madeleine, that was it for me; her hands freaked me out. I was outta there. I had chills down my spine, I have no doubt that Madel met her end with the blow to her head or face. From that hand. This is what I believe, but I also have to state that giving your kids sedatives and then overdosing them, would be invol manslaughter/homicide not "an accident".

KM was there when Madel "went" just another abnormal phrase that KM used when describing how she died. She just "went". That day. When Madeleine Went. I think that was how she said it. So very disturbing. Hurtful, to think maybe that was the last thing that happened to a beautiful little child that should have had it all. something was wrong in that home. Something was wrong with Madel too; many of us have seen that in her photos. Her face, the weight loss and weight gain. Her little medical records would be key to this investigation. i have to have hope that the UK has them, and is sharing all they can in this case about who this couple really is. good Poll, looks like most agree she died by KMs hand. Since we all know that GM was playing his third game of tennis and KM had to be "checked" on.....whatever that was about. I'd say mental state. I'll go with that based on the diary writings. Glad that MJ and I copied them when we had them. Those pages of notes. But, they need FBI enhancement to read, they are too blurry. But what was reported to BE on those pages? good enough for me. Always has been always will be.

We are definitely on the same page chronictonic, nice to see you posting!
:blowkiss:
 
What do you think happened to the body Colomon? What do you think about the DNA in the car? Just interested to know what your theory is, you obviously think it was placed somewhere & left there if you don't believe it was moved!
I am not sure about this either, the Pet Crematorium always stands out to me for some reason!
So do you think she was killed on the 2nd & body gone at that point?

My theory is #1 on the theories thread (see: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1665998&postcount=1) and I think that the DNA in the car was from transference (i know, I know, I just really think that). I think GM realized that he left something with the body that could be connected back to him if she was ever found. Maybe she was wearing the clothes from the pool picture instead of the PJs or maybe she was wrapped in that Aztec blanket he purchased just before their trip and there was DNA on that blanket, the wrong kind of DNA. It is possible that there was a second visit to the body and clothing/something removed and then hidden in the boot.

Cristavo (the author of The Star of Madeleine) agrees with me. She was never moved. She is still there today.

I am a HUGE believer in Occams Razor (google it).
 
good points, Colomom.

Do we have any youtube references for the video clip where Kate shakes her hands?
 
I have refused to look at this story on WS because I was sure everyone thought she was really abducted and I would be flamed (as usual) for thinking the parents killed her!!
I am surprised and glad that some of you see right through these evil parents!
They should be arrested for child endangerment and neglect first then questioned about the death of this baby.
 
I have refused to look at this story on WS because I was sure everyone thought she was really abducted and I would be flamed (as usual) for thinking the parents killed her!!
I am surprised and glad that some of you see right through these evil parents!
They should be arrested for child endangerment and neglect first then questioned about the death of this baby.

The line I highlighted above is so right-on that it really is a slap in the face, a wake-up call, if you will, for how this case should have been handled from the very beginning. While I have been a big supporter of the PJ from day 1, I think they really dropped the ball on this point. I can only guess that it must have been phone calls from powerful people that prevented them for doing just that, first thing.

Makes me think that there are going to be more than just Kate and Gerry who will ultimately have to answer for this cover-up.

~All entirely IMHO, of course~

Thanks for posting Pixies!! Glad you stopped by :)
 
Cant stand it; when KM held out her hands during that recent intv to "shake" madeleine, that was it for me; her hands freaked me out. I was outta there. I had chills down my spine, I have no doubt that Madel met her end with the blow to her head or face. From that hand. This is what I believe, but I also have to state that giving your kids sedatives and then overdosing them, would be invol manslaughter/homicide not "an accident".

KM was there when Madel "went" just another abnormal phrase that KM used when describing how she died. She just "went". That day. When Madeleine Went. I think that was how she said it. So very disturbing. Hurtful, to think maybe that was the last thing that happened to a beautiful little child that should have had it all. something was wrong in that home. Something was wrong with Madel too; many of us have seen that in her photos. Her face, the weight loss and weight gain. Her little medical records would be key to this investigation. i have to have hope that the UK has them, and is sharing all they can in this case about who this couple really is. good Poll, looks like most agree she died by KMs hand. Since we all know that GM was playing his third game of tennis and KM had to be "checked" on.....whatever that was about. I'd say mental state. I'll go with that based on the diary writings. Glad that MJ and I copied them when we had them. Those pages of notes. But, they need FBI enhancement to read, they are too blurry. But what was reported to BE on those pages? good enough for me. Always has been always will be.

Absolutely agree Chronictonic & nice to meet you! That "shaking" was diabolical! I have a feeling that poor little baby got many a shake!

Madeleine was also too small for her age, something that they never ever publicised & what would have been a vital piece of information in searching for her!

Yeah, the pet crematorium guy said he didn't open the bags, but if you are doing a body dump, you're betting the guy won't, which is not a safe bet.

It's possible, of course, but honestly, if the two guys with the bag story is true, chances are they've been shown photos of the Tapas diners, and they didn't identify them--again, if the story is true.

There are far too many rural spots and of course, the ocean, to make anything else far too risky and unnecessary.

Well my theory of actually hiding body pieces inside the dogs, gross though it is, may be a possibility. These two wouldn't have any problems cutting up dogs! It is probably a very far fetched theory but the one way in which they wouldn't be worried about the guy opening the bags & how they are so confident the body will never be found!
Wherever they disposed of her they are pretty sure that it is safe. How could you be sure of that if they simply buried her, no there is something more to this I think!

I also thought that he could have identified the McCanns but they may have been disguised in some way & remember he is a criminal also, maybe honour among thieves!

My theory is #1 on the theories thread (see: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1665998&postcount=1) and I think that the DNA in the car was from transference (i know, I know, I just really think that). I think GM realized that he left something with the body that could be connected back to him if she was ever found. Maybe she was wearing the clothes from the pool picture instead of the PJs or maybe she was wrapped in that Aztec blanket he purchased just before their trip and there was DNA on that blanket, the wrong kind of DNA. It is possible that there was a second visit to the body and clothing/something removed and then hidden in the boot.

Cristavo (the author of The Star of Madeleine) agrees with me. She was never moved. She is still there today.

I am a HUGE believer in Occams Razor (google it).

You are probably right Colomom, the most obvious probably true! Thanks for posting this I forgot I had read your theory before.

If the body was revisited then it rules out the dumping at sea & the Pet Crem so hopefully somewhere along the line the remains will be found but as I said above they seem pretty confident that it won't!

I have refused to look at this story on WS because I was sure everyone thought she was really abducted and I would be flamed (as usual) for thinking the parents killed her!!
I am surprised and glad that some of you see right through these evil parents!
They should be arrested for child endangerment and neglect first then questioned about the death of this baby.

Nice to meet you pixies, you are definitely in the company of like minded people in the main here!
 
good points, Colomom.

Do we have any youtube references for the video clip where Kate shakes her hands?

Morning Tex,

It is in the ITV documentary and I see it here: http://www.itv.com/News/newsspecial/MadeleineMcCannoneyearon/Articles/McCannsrevealall/default.html

I cannot confirm that it works cuz I am on a Mac and haven't tried it on my Windows machine yet. I expect it will be posted on YouTube but I don't see it yet. I will watch for it. The ITV doc is 2 hours long. Hate to make you sit through all of that.

As I understand it, it shows Kate grabbing air, as if to grab Maddie's shoulders, and then a shaking movement, as if she was shaking Maddie. I don't know if I really want to see it.
 
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