CANADA Canada - Audrey Gleave, 73, Ancaster ON, 30 Dec 2010 #5

dotr said:

From the obit. page, it was mentioned that a tree was planted in Beckett-Glaves Memorial Forest in honour of Audrey , I wonder if it is well looked after and thriving, or if it has been in any way damaged or vandalized?

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I was wondering that as well. Is someone (even the killer perhaps) visiting the tree to either do damage or to prune it and give it loving care? Has someone been hired to professionally care for the tree? Is the tree marked with AG's name and dates? Are LE 'watching' visitors to the tree?

:moo:

Much earlier, I said that I felt the unusual (just because we hadn't heard of it before???) Swedish memorialization video / pics was similar to an "elf yourself" site. I still can't find the "Hero" site itself, but have managed to find the words that accompany the memorialization pics:

Can you hear me? In Times like these, we have to ask ourselves several important questions. How can you, I, our friends and children really trust that what we see on TV and hear on the radio is true? How do we know that our opinions are really our own? How can we be sure that the weak voices are heard and not scared into silence?

I can tell you how. There is one person we can thank for all of this. We can thank this person for giving us new perspectives. We can thank this person for giving us a choice. This person gives us an alternative to uniformity and short term thinking. We owe this person for making an ordinary day into something special. A day when we rise from the TV couch and say: "I've changed my opinion". There's only one word that does full justice to that person: HERO.

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Based on the wording, IMO this is indicative of the influence AG had on her acquaintances and/or students, and is nothing more than someone who had been inspired by her and wanted to memorialize her in a social networking setting as their Hero.

Here's a link that explains the origin of the video:

(if the link doesn't drop right down, scroll to Pg 116 of the book excerpt)

http://books.google.ca/books?id=QQn...hat does full justice to that person"&f=false

Chorley8 said:

http://www.beckettglaves.com/book-of-memories/619536/Gleave-Audrey/view-a-photo.php?PhotoId=509614

http://www.beckettglaves.com/book-of-memories/619536/Gleave-Audrey/view-a-photo.php?PhotoId=509610

The second of these says We can thank this person for giving us a choice the other there is a demonstration a sign reads Our Swedish Hero.

(The photos are at the bottom right corner of the memorial page if someone can link using thumbnails I don't know how that would be great).

People can be given a lot of choices but choice my mind brings up pro-choice. This is relevant in Ancaster because of the anti-abortion killings don't know much about that case. Possible scenarios come to mind here: Audrey was possibly searching for a child given up for adoption someone here documented that someone with her name was. That person now knowing who she is could find out and be told she had actually tried to arrange an abortion. Or apart from this adoption case (if true) she could have had an abortion and someone could hold a grudge. Or it could be political in the sense that the person was incensed by an pro-choice position.

But I am really pushing the evidence here I mean I don't know why those photos were shopped in that way or by who, whether they refer to the abortion issue (they seem to I think?) and even what Audrey's views were. I know years ago abortion would have been difficult to arrange in Canada I mean when Audrey was young.

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http://saintdune.blogspot.ca/2010/07/hero.html

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Hazel thanks though it is the image of the woman holding the card saying choice that made me wonder but yes it is possibly and hopefully a student tribute

I am oriented towards the financial motive myself though the violence speaks against it

And possibly No Stone and others are right and it is a violent sex murder against like so many others a woman and maybe Hrab is right and it is a stranger

And on top of it we just have financial elements that look suspicious but really are not or we have less than stellar human behavior piggy backing on a terrible crime

I think Woodlands discussion of the will is pertinent

hazel thanks your link just showed up so you covered that

Chorley8 said:

hazel thanks your link just showed up so you covered that

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no problem at all Chorley (by the way, the link shows up only when logged in. If not login, I think the link is clickable)

This following article is totally unrelated. I guess this has already been discussed on another thread, but just in case there is no thread, I'll just post this link in here:

Peel police find 2 hands in Mississauga river
http://www.1310news.com/news/national/article/392368--peel-police-find-2-hands-in-mississauga-river

ETA link to appropriate thread: Canada - Mississauga - Fem Body parts in Credit River - Aug'12

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Thinking of rash, violent men taking and driving cars, this alleged one came to my attention...
http://www.quintenews.com/2011/11/wanted-kingston-man-arrested/22839/
"After colliding with a vehicle on Dixon Road… then ditching the car on Ridgeview Lane… the suspect fled on foot and broke into a Murray Street apartment.
The apartment owner suffered a serious… non-life threatening injury.. and police lost the suspect.
But Kingston police found 41-year old Christopher Edgar in Kingston Thursday.
He was arrested and charged with sexual assault, forcible confinement, break and enter, possession of stolen property, dangerous driving and flight from police".

Thinking this woman was lucky to get away from this large man and wondering about confinement, sexual assault and violence, are there are others ... who could not get away ?...


http://www.kix935.com/more.jsp?content=20111114_111646_6840Quinte West OPP, Kingston Police and the Repeat Offender Parole Enforcement team picked up 41-year-old Christopher EDGAR last Thursday. He's been charged with sexual assault and forcible confinement after an apartment in Trenton was broken into and a woman was seriously injured

Well here we are at the beginning of the week of SV's murder anniversary. I STILL have this ungodly, niggling feeling that SV and AG were killed by the same person.

No, I have no proof. Just a deep gut feeling. Same with SL.

What ever happened with the DNA testing for the SV killer? Do we know anything about that? Have LE 'given up'? I hope not.

And as the nights get cooler and the trees will soon change colour, I keep coming back to AG and the way she was killed. At Christmas/New Year. AG will remain in my heart and soul forever.....at least until this crime is solved. And after that time as well.

And I shall NOT give up digging and searching and praying and hoping for an outcome from LE.

Rant over............lease:

NSU: I have the same feeling that Sonia's and Audrey's murders are not "stand alones" -- hence why I don't share the same suspicions of other posters here about financial motive (although i respect the work of those theorists, and recognize that I could be very mistaken; I remind us all that LE insists there is no connection between SV and AG). NSU, I psoted a video link for Sonia http://video.cnews.canoe.ca/video/f...f-varaschins-murder-approaching/1802865072001 on her page -- but there's really no new info.

And Audrey's case seems especially quiet in the news.

I know this is Audrey's page, but I just wanted to mention briefly that CityTV is having a press conference for the Sonia Varaschin investigation today (aug 29). LE is conducting a new search of the area where Sonia was found, apparently based on new info from the public. Today/tonight/tomorrow marks the sad 2-year anniversary of Sonia's unsolved murder.
Hope this is more than a photo opp....
It would be such a relief to see some movement in Sonia's case.

I have posted this info here because I know some of us worry about a connection between Audrey's and Sonia's deaths.

2soccermom said:

NSU: I have the same feeling that Sonia's and Audrey's murders are not "stand alones" -- hence why I don't share the same suspicions of other posters here about financial motive (although i respect the work of those theorists, and recognize that I could be very mistaken; I remind us all that LE insists there is no connection between SV and AG). NSU, I psoted a video link for Sonia http://video.cnews.canoe.ca/video/f...f-varaschins-murder-approaching/1802865072001 on her page -- but there's really no new info.

And Audrey's case seems especially quiet in the news.

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I haven't yet emphasized: the info about the missing bankbooks and bank info is key in two ways:

1. Why would they be missing? It is a very odd souvenir for a sexual maniac to take.

2. Equally important: how would LV and others know they were "missing"? And a very important point why would they emphasize that they were missing? After all it might be enough to say that they couldn't locate them. To emphasize: she had never been in Audrey's house so would not be able to say what was missing and as someone here pointed out even PK could hardly say that with any real assurance.

3. Going around to banks and asking whether someone has an account there doesn't sound very efficient. Did the executor really hit all the banks? And then there are trust companies, out of town banks etc.

4. On that note does anyone know how, when you are an executor, you find out where someone banked? Is there a central database so that, you know, you would be sure you had all their accounts? What about safety deposits, securities anything? Surely you don't just go around and ask?

Did Audrey keep gold, metals or cash in her own home? Or was she rumoured to?

I would be interested to know what her reputation was in the places she frequented. In towns like Ancaster and Lynden ever mild eccentricities can get someone labelled as crazy. Not letting people in your house could start rumours. (Bringing Soccer M's theory into it this it would be especially relevant to young people - if I was LE I would ask around the high school thinking of an under the radar young person or persons). In high income towns like Ancaster there are always disaffected teens who are not given proper attention by their parents and with so much roaming space things can get pretty wild. In the past Ancaster like other high income towns had lots of teen drug users don't know about now.

I noticed that the husband of the F. neighbour Audrey corresponded with when interviewed was sort of smirking or half smiling and said it concerned him because it was right across the street/road - that sounds incredibly distant. When people are murdered in Toronto in even the roughest hoods there are always a lot of grieving upset neighbours.

So why would this husband be so cool? (I am not blaming him just asking what it was about Audrey).

Why would P.K. post the Happy New Year's on FB you'd think all you would be talking about that day and as many people as you could would be Audrey. (Again not blaming him but something just doesn't jive why so cool?).

And then LV's description of the crime as "unconscionable" again a rather removed remark.

I find some of the attitude to AG a bit strange and it is not easy to see how she deserved it - and for it to continue after her death is strange. The media focus on her as a hermit which hardly fits someone who goes for drives in a Camarro, has weekly meetings with people, is very interested in the world.

I will cut this off but could go on and on on this issue: PK waiting by the car after finding her body.... if the police find a dead body in an unsecured house they get back-up. In such a relatively isolated spot how did he know he was safe? Where is all of this sang-froid coming from?

Looking for a connection between threads, this caught my eye ....
SPOTLIGHT CASE VA - Amy Bradley, 23, Petersburg, 24 March 1998 - Page 35 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

Revealing comments, NVC.....
http://www.thespec.com/news/local/article/595858--who-is-audrey-gleave

Quoted from Chorley8:

<<< 4. On that note does anyone know how, when you are an executor, you find out where someone banked? Is there a central database so that, you know, you would be sure you had all their accounts? What about safety deposits, securities anything? Surely you don't just go around and ask? >>>


My husband and I are the executors (when the time comes) for an elderly friend of ours. Yes.....we have all of her banking info, her yearly income tax statements, her yearly charitable contributions, a key to her house, her desire for her beloved pets......basically everything.

Limited Mobility? How could Audrey golf with limited mobility. She was short of breath from smoking and yet she still managed to golf. Or did she give up golfing - does anyone know?
How can LV call Audrey reclusive, when Audrey went to her Coffee Club and golfed with her friends? Also shopped, and got about town. I don't believe Lv's term reclusive is one that I would use for her.

Hamilton has generously opened arms to a "persecuted" group, some of whom pay attention to bank accounts...
http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Crime/2012/08/31/20160686.html

"The Canada Border Services Agency admits it's worried about "significant criminal activity" among Hungarian Roma - sometimes called Gypsies - who've made dubious refugee claims.

"The information provided to the criminal investigations division indicates that individuals believed to be from the Roma community, and involved in criminal activity, most commonly engage in skimming fraud and cheque fraud,"


snip

"The CBSA report also says Toronto police have warned there "is an indication that local gangs may be developing" among the mass arrivals of young Roma refugee claimants"

This is the more welcoming side..
[video=youtube;4k0IRq4nSnA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4k0IRq4nSnA[/video]

J.W.has a new book coming out that will include Audrey's case.
Death's Shadow: True Tales of Homicide: Amazon.ca: Jon Wells: Books

Chorley8 said:

...

I will cut this off but could go on and on on this issue: PK waiting by the car after finding her body.... if the police find a dead body in an unsecured house they get back-up. In such a relatively isolated spot how did he know he was safe? Where is all of this sang-froid coming from?

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Sorry for repeating myself (I've posted my response before; I know lots of folks don't agree but here it is anew): Pk has said that he didn't realize at first she was deceased; his initial thought was that she may have slipped on the ice. I know this is hard for many of us to believe, given that LE has called Audrey's murder an especially brutal one (I don't remember the exact wording). But we don't know if the savagery was immediately visible; there was a "sexual component" and indication that the killer made off with something "like a trophy" from the victim. That may not have been immediately visible to PK. And it is not unusual for people who encounter trauma to experience particular coping mechanisms; denial or refusal are classic responses. PK may not have been consciously able to recognize that Audrey was murdered --either because the material evidence did not indicate this except on close inspection OR because of psychic defensive mechanism. But something drove him out of her garage; at that moment, waiting outside, it would be reasonable to assume he was probably realizing she was gone.

I don't know who is guilty or innocent in Audrey's death. But for my part, I don't see PKs actions here as specifically cause for suspicion.We all cope differently with trauma -- and yet denial or refusal to recognize the severity of particular conditions is not an atypical response.