Bosma Murder Trial 05.12.16 - Day 48

CJPRINCESS · May 12, 2016

ArianeEmory said:
Ah, so he falls back to an alternate satchel because he got blood and maybe GSR on the primary.

Yes, I believe so. I vaguely remember the confusion over the satchels here on WS. People were confused over the bags being differnt in the photos but that's because there were two satchels. If I remember correctly, they were also 2 differnt brands.

ArianeEmory · May 12, 2016

canadiangirl said:
There is just so many holes and questions left unanswered at this point I find it difficult to see how the <modsnip> suddenly believes a man who didn't come forward until yesterday. I am doubtful he found it in his heart to do the right thing at this point in time. He's trying to save himself. JMO

Hmm, I understand the drive to use hyperbole, but I don't think any of us fence-sitters are suggesting he be "freed". Even if his story is 100% true I think he needs more time to reflect before he can be turned loose on humanity. He still ended up best buds with a murderer and you don't get there through clean living.

spanishshara · May 12, 2016

canadiangirl said:
Never been carded. Lived in Toronto my whole life. I don't know anyone who's been carded either. I have never heard of it until this case.

I'm a TA and I hear about it lots of time from students. It's been a well-documented and talked about issue in Toronto for a long time now iirc. Even more now since the ban.

spanishshara · May 12, 2016

MS pretending he doesn't know where the gun is/general area aside, it's a shame the gun was never fired in a test vs the glass IMO. Especially since DM didn't call evidence and MS detailed his version of events.

CJPRINCESS · May 12, 2016

canadiangirl said:
There is just so many holes and questions left unanswered at this point I find it difficult to see how the <modsnip> suddenly believes a man who didn't come forward until yesterday. I am doubtful he found it in his heart to do the right thing at this point in time. He's trying to save himself. JMO

But in all fairness, we don't know if he intended to take the stand from day one or not. Even if he did give a statement through his lawyer to LE, would we have been privy to this information? Seems "coincidental" that LE got most of the fact correct from May 6th but didn't have solid evidence to prove their theory.

I'm in no way saying "free MS" IMO, he deserves time just like DM! But if what he is saying is true, does he rightfully deserve a 1st degree murder conviction? Acessory after the fact seems to have a hefty sentence as well. I believe it's up to 25yrs. At this point if the Jury finds him innocent of Murder, wouldn't AATF be better then no conviction at all?

Ontario Mom · May 12, 2016

canadiangirl said:
There is just so many holes and questions left unanswered at this point I find it difficult to see how the <modsnip> suddenly believes a man who didn't come forward until yesterday. I am doubtful he found it in his heart to do the right thing at this point in time. He's trying to save himself. JMO

<modsnip>

As for all the unanswered questions, that's kind of on TD, since MS can't answer anything TD didn't ask. He didn't ask A LOT, and I think we all found that frustrating.

As for those who found him (generally) believable "suddenly" believing him, I don't see it that way. There are loads of people that never believed he shot TB from the very beginning. There are also some who never were convinced it was a premeditated murder. A truck theft, yes, but cold blooded murder, no. At least not on MS's part. (I wasn't following the discussion of the "sausage" pics/texts and furniture but I'm guessing that sealed it for a lot of folks here. I can't comment on that because I don't know the details of those discussions and my eyes would melt out of my head trying to go back and find it all).

As for MS doing the right thing after all this time, I suspect if this testimony he gave yesterday was not the same way he explained it in his interviews with LE, we'll find that out during cross. If it was, however, his story has never changed. It does appear that is the case, since MM testified to almost exactly the same stuff MS said (the parts she knew, anyway).

I think cross is where the rubber will come off the wheels, if there is any to come off.

moo.

JuneBug67 · May 12, 2016

canadiangirl said:
There is just so many holes and questions left unanswered at this point I find it difficult to see how the <modsnip> suddenly believes a man who didn't come forward until yesterday. I am doubtful he found it in his heart to do the right thing at this point in time. He's trying to save himself. JMO

He was charged with first degree murder. Any lawyer would have told him to remain silent, and yesterday was, literally, the first time he could come forward in the process that begin with his arrest three years ago. I don't hold remaining silent against anybody. Once you're charged the police and Crown are not your friends. Testifying in his circumstances is a Hail Mary pass and the odds are against him. All I can say about his testimony at this point is I am listening. We'll see how the rest of this unfolds.

Arnie M · May 12, 2016

LoyalSleuth said:
Aftwr all that MS has admitted to on the stand, what does he benefit by not telling where the gun is?

Yes , telling court where the gun is would add 1000% to his credibility ... but most likely there is more to it than that .

He either sold it or gave it to someone and does not want to snitch on them ..... or he did bury it in the forest (to get it out of his possession) .... but landmarked it so he could give instructions for someone else to pick it up later.

A lot of drug transfers are done that way .... parks (forest) provide a good setting ..... testimony shows they have already used that method ..... ie: bring the stuff to Shoppers Drug Mart (bag of weed and toolbox) .... all the druggies knew it meant the drop off point was the stairwell in the rear parking lot at Shoppers.

From Smich's point of view he cannot snitch on whoever (might) have the gun .... he knows doing that would bring him a lifetime of grief in jail. His life would be in danger every day .

Crooks have a weird code .... to them rape and snitching are unforgivable sins (but murder is not)

Georgeo · May 12, 2016

JuneBug67 said:
He was charged with first degree murder. Any lawyer would have told him to remain silent, and yesterday was, literally, the first time he could come forward in the process that begin with his arrest three years ago. I don't hold remaining silent against anybody. Once you're charged the police and Crown are not your friends. Testifying in his circumstances is a Hail Mary pass and the odds are against him. All I can say about his testimony at this point is I am listening. We'll see how the rest of this unfolds.

MS took a risk by going on the stand. DM probably is freaking out that he was outwitted and out played so far. Cross should be very telling on Monday. Can't wait to hear Pillay with his argumentative tone start on MS. There may be fireworks (pun intended)! Jmo. Imo

RandomName479 · May 12, 2016

LoyalSleuth said:
Aftwr all that MS has admitted to on the stand, what does he benefit by not telling where the gun is?

Sent from my SM-A500W using Tapatalk

THIS has been what is bothering me. I have a hard time believing MS doesn't know where he buried the gun, but OTOH I see absolutely no benefit to him lying about it. I went for a hike tonight on a trail I have done many times.....but I reversed the loop.....and got completely lost....so maybe his story isn't as unbelievable as I initially thought......MOO

NashBridges2 · May 12, 2016

Ontario Mom said:
Most of what MS said in his testimony does sound believable. That doesn't make anyone a bleeding heart, nor does it negate the hell the Bosma family went through (and will continue to go through for the rest of their lives). It is actually possible MS is telling the truth about how it went down that night.

moo.

Great post. The jury will be instructed that they can choose to believe all, some or none of a witnesses testimony. It doesn't have to be all or nothing. I think he told some truths and some lies, the main thing I believe is that he wasn't in the vehicle when TB was shot because I think he would have unknowingly transferred blood, or GSR to the SUV However, I think he is lying about not knowing about the gun or the murder plans before hand.

Elisabeth · May 12, 2016

Arnie M said:
Yes , telling court where the gun is would add 1000% to his credibility ... but most likely there is more to it than that .

He either sold it or gave it to someone and does not want to snitch on them ..... or he did bury it in the forest (to get it out of his possession) .... but landmarked it so he could give instructions for someone else to pick it up later.

A lot of drug transfers are done that way .... parks (forest) provide a good setting ..... testimony shows they have already used that method ..... ie: bring the stuff to Shoppers Drug Mart (bag of weed and toolbox) .... all the druggies knew it meant the drop off point was the stairwell in the rear parking lot at Shoppers.

From Smich's point of view he cannot snitch on whoever (might) have the gun .... he knows doing that would bring him a lifetime of grief in jail. His life would be in danger every day .

Crooks have a weird code .... to them rape and snitching are unforgivable sins (but murder is not)

and also piss off whoever sold the gun to DM/MS. It might be identifiable/used in other crimes and get the seller in hot water.

Stirner · May 12, 2016

NashBridges2 said:
Great post. The jury will be instructed that they can choose to believe all, some or none of a witnesses testimony. It doesn't have to be all or nothing. I think he told some truths and some lies, the main thing I believe is that he wasn't in the vehicle when TB was shot because I think he would have unknowingly transferred blood, or GSR to the Tahoe. However, I think he is lying about not knowing about the gun or the murder plans before hand.

What Tahoe? There's no Tahoe. We know DM had a Yukon. There is video of a truck that was described as 'it could be a Yukon or a Tahoe' because they have the same body shape. But we know it's a Yukon, because there was no Tahoe.

Elisabeth · May 12, 2016

RandomName479 said:
THIS has been what is bothering me. I have a hard time believing MS doesn't know where he buried the gun, but OTOH I see absolutely no benefit to him lying about it. I went for a hike tonight on a trail I have done many times.....but I reversed the loop.....and got completely lost....so maybe his story isn't as unbelievable as I initially thought......MOO

I am terrible with directions and am always checking for the CN tower to get my bearings.

I have completely panicked when going off trail in Algonquin Park. (There were lots of bearings there - not as big as CN tower - but a lake for example). In my panic, I didn't pay attention.

NashBridges2 · May 12, 2016

Stirner said:
What Tahoe? There's no Tahoe. We know DM had a Yukon. There is video of a truck that was described as 'it could be a Yukon or a Tahoe' because they have the same body shape. But we know it's a Yukon, because there was no Tahoe.

I edited my post, I'm exhausted, on a stretch of 7 midnight shifts and no sleep, brain fart and couldn't remember if it was a Yukon or Tahoe so now it's just says SUV lol

Georgeo · May 12, 2016

I wonder if the lawyers in this case are reading this website each day to see what public's perception is after a day's testimony.

canadiangirl · May 12, 2016

RandomName479 said:
THIS has been what is bothering me. I have a hard time believing MS doesn't know where he buried the gun, but OTOH I see absolutely no benefit to him lying about it. I went for a hike tonight on a trail I have done many times.....but I reversed the loop.....and got completely lost....so maybe his story isn't as unbelievable as I initially thought......MOO

But for a guy who doesn't drive and spends a lot of time on foot or a bike as mode of transportation, I cant see him not knowing where he went. He grew up there did he not? I can tell you every park and path where I grew up. I spent my entire summers with friends outside until street lights came on. It just seems very wishy washy to me.

RandomName479 · May 12, 2016

canadiangirl said:
But for a guy who doesn't drive and spends a lot of time on foot or a bike as mode of transportation, I cant see him not knowing where he went. He grew up there did he not? I can tell you every park and path where I grew up. I spent my entire summers with friends outside until street lights came on. It just seems very wishy washy to me.

You could be right. I'm just pointing out that it could be possible....if it was dark....lots of trails....I'm not familiar with that particular area, so I can't weigh in on that. I'm not sure I believe he doesn't know what happened to the gun. I found today's testimony much less credible FWIW.

deugirtni · May 12, 2016

swedie said:
Sorry but I cringe when anyone refers to these characters as "kids." They are grown adult men.

And yes I could see this might have been why DM was pulled over and carded...out cruising around in the wee hours of the morning, scoping out stuff to steal. Or perhaps different businesses they stole from had grainy video surveillance of a Yukon on their premises, they reported theft to LE and LE was pulling people over with Yukons. LE wouldn't have to tell the driver/owner the real reason why they were pulling them over. MOO.

Remember when they stole the bobcat, and then discovered that it had GPS on it? The police showed up, IIRC. I wonder if that could be when he was carded. Actually, he could have been carded a number of times, for all we know?

hopingforjustice · May 12, 2016

Jug Up said:
Not surprisingly, Dungey is very careful with his questioning following the murder, and MS is quite vague in his answers. No idea where the gun is? Really? Talk about full of ****. I am surprised Dungey even asked the question, knowing the answer. It just makes Smich seem like a liar, IMO.

On another note, if, as MS says, they were only scoping out a truck and would steal in later, one would assume they were also just "scoping" when the went out with Igor, in broad daylight, the day before. Why then, as Igor testified, did DM turn to MS following the Israeli army comment, and "you don't want to know what I did." If they were only scoping out the truck, why would he do that, as if to say "No way we are doing this?" Why not just finish the test drive, and agree later that it wasn't a truck they wanted?

Was it because they were planning to overpower Igor and when that comment was made, DM and MS decided that wasn't such a good idea because they were going to get their asses whipped? Why would DM have to turn around at all?

MOO

BBM

TD is a very bright lawyer. There is no doubt in my mind that he knew was he was doing in his line of questioning. I am sure he has gone over and practiced the cross exam with MS very thoroughly. There is an awful lot that could be questioned re: MS testimony, but can it be crossed by DM's team without further implicating DM? I think we are about to see some very interesting legal work. JMO

Bosma Murder Trial 05.12.16 - Day 48

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