The Doe Network, Part 3: Who is Princess Blue?

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I would love to learn more about DNA. Thank you for asking.

I have never posted in this thread but have been keeping a close eye on developments. I know that in the previous thread some of you expressed an interest in learning more about DNA and matters such as this. I would love to help anyone who is still interested. I was thinking of drawing up a "lecture" about basic DNA and then maybe some more advanced topics. Let me know if anyone is interested in this.
 
I would love to learn more about DNA. Thank you for asking.

Great! :) I will try to work on something tomorrow. If there are any other topics you would interested in just let me know. I was thinking of signing up for a free website account so that anyone who was interested could access it. I will have to get my hubby to help me with that as websites are not my forte. haha. Ill let you know when Im done.
 
Thank you! Sounds wonderful :)

Great! :) I will try to work on something tomorrow. If there are any other topics you would interested in just let me know. I was thinking of signing up for a free website account so that anyone who was interested could access it. I will have to get my hubby to help me with that as websites are not my forte. haha. Ill let you know when Im done.
 
Princess Blue's story is on the front page of the Houston Press.

I think this is GREAT because the Houston Press has a wide circulation here in Houston, especially among 20-30 year olds. Maybe someone will read it and it will jog their memory.

http://www.houstonpress.com/2007-09-13/news/cold-case/

EDIT: There's a mention in the article about one of the members of Websleuths!!!


Reading this really makes me wonder about the police chief, Tommie Tolson. It's almost like he is hiding the facts of the case. Make me wounder what he really knows about princess blue.
 
I found it it is striking but how does that work. Would it not match up as well if is was me she was being compared to. Just curious I don't know much about the technology behind it.
 
I have never posted in this thread but have been keeping a close eye on developments. I know that in the previous thread some of you expressed an interest in learning more about DNA and matters such as this. I would love to help anyone who is still interested. I was thinking of drawing up a "lecture" about basic DNA and then maybe some more advanced topics. Let me know if anyone is interested in this.

Welcome Chloekins:). Yes, I for one would love to learn more about DNA and how it can help us understand this and other cases. Thank you very much for offering to give of your time and knowledge.

Lion
 
Welcome Chloekins:). Yes, I for one would love to learn more about DNA and how it can help us understand this and other cases. Thank you very much for offering to give of your time and knowledge.

Lion

Thank you so much for the warm welcome. I have started to write up some notes concerning the following subjects: Basic DNA, DNA replication, Protein Coding, Toxicology Components and Testing Processes, DNA Extraction and Amplification and DNA Comparisons. I came up with this on just a simple brainstorming last night after RKnowley expressed an interest as well. If there is something else you think of that would help let me know. I figure this will take me about a week or so. My hubby has already started setting up a basic website for me to put all this on.
 
Hi all-
and a warm "welcome back" to LionRun! We sure missed you!
Welcome to Chloekins!! :) Count me in on wanting to know much more about DNA...THANK YOU for your time and attn. to this case and others.

As for Princess Blue being compared to Kimberly Cheatham, yes, it has been started, and no, it is not ready! Lol! So, in essence, no real changes. Thanks to everyone for their patience and for continuing to look for other potential matches...as RKnowley said, somewhere to go if this turns out NOT to be a match between KC and PB.

warmly,
 
Thank you so much for the warm welcome. I have started to write up some notes concerning the following subjects: Basic DNA, DNA replication, Protein Coding, Toxicology Components and Testing Processes, DNA Extraction and Amplification and DNA Comparisons. I came up with this on just a simple brainstorming last night after RKnowley expressed an interest as well. If there is something else you think of that would help let me know. I figure this will take me about a week or so. My hubby has already started setting up a basic website for me to put all this on.

Your plan sounds great, Chloekins! And, again thank you so much for this gift. For a long time I have been hoping that the, "Field of Dreams" thing might come to light. In other words, "If you build it they will come." If we do all we can to build interest in who Princess Blue was in life, maybe others would join our efforts. This has happened, and I am so grateful.

There is one thing that I would like to know more about, but it is more anthropology related. For how long(vague approximate if it is all we can discern), can bone marrow stay viable for DNA testing/drug testing on remains left out in the open in the warm(with relatively mild winters), humid climate in the Houston, Texas area?

Sloane did some good research on this, and several of us have researched this as well. Still we have no real answer. This may be because there is no body farm in such a climate to give us remotely reliable data. It might be helpful to hunt down similar cases and note the cases where there both was and was not viable DNA in bone marrow. Maybe related facts from similar cases can be used as a very general guideline as to when Princess Blue might have died.

Lion
 
Hi all-
and a warm "welcome back" to LionRun! We sure missed you!
Welcome to Chloekins!! :) Count me in on wanting to know much more about DNA...THANK YOU for your time and attn. to this case and others.

As for Princess Blue being compared to Kimberly Cheatham, yes, it has been started, and no, it is not ready! Lol! So, in essence, no real changes. Thanks to everyone for their patience and for continuing to look for other potential matches...as RKnowley said, somewhere to go if this turns out NOT to be a match between KC and PB.

warmly,

Hello dear sloane:blowkiss:. It is so good to be back, and it is so good to be back in contact with you. Thank you for the update on Kimberly's DNA work-up.

Lion
 
There is one thing that I would like to know more about, but it is more anthropology related. For how long(vague approximate if it is all we can discern), can bone marrow stay viable for DNA testing/drug testing on remains left out in the open in the warm(with relatively mild winters), humid climate in the Houston, Texas area?

Lion

I would say that it would still be viable years after death as long as the bones were not fractured in any way. Remember that bones are like encasements, while they have minute holes that allow for mineral/gas exchange they are for the most part sealed. I would expect there to be still viable bone marrow for many years following death. The amount that they need to do mtDNA is very little as it is amplified using certain techniques. Without going into too much detail sometimes there are "holes" in the sequence that are filled in with expected ratios therefore even partial samples can still be used.

As far as tox screens using bone there is still a lot of work needed to be done in this area. It has been demonstrated that it is possible to identify certain types of drugs in bone matter the specifics are still being researched. These specifics are things such as what is the duration of usage required to began deposition into the bone, what are the levels of reaction that are required to deem a positive result, how does environment and overall health effect measurements and these sorts of things.

You can get viable tox screens from bone marrow for years afterwards especially in the case of opiates. While the concentration lowers a great deal as time goes by trace elements would still be possible to detect. Since this was done on our Princess there must have been some evidence or suspicion that she was a habitual drug user.

I will add this particular aspect to my topics and go into greater detail since its hard to go into the level of detail that is required on a post ;)
 
I would say that it would still be viable years after death as long as the bones were not fractured in any way. Remember that bones are like encasements, while they have minute holes that allow for mineral/gas exchange they are for the most part sealed. I would expect there to be still viable bone marrow for many years following death. The amount that they need to do mtDNA is very little as it is amplified using certain techniques. Without going into too much detail sometimes there are "holes" in the sequence that are filled in with expected ratios therefore even partial samples can still be used.

As far as tox screens using bone there is still a lot of work needed to be done in this area. It has been demonstrated that it is possible to identify certain types of drugs in bone matter the specifics are still being researched. These specifics are things such as what is the duration of usage required to began deposition into the bone, what are the levels of reaction that are required to deem a positive result, how does environment and overall health effect measurements and these sorts of things.

You can get viable tox screens from bone marrow for years afterwards especially in the case of opiates. While the concentration lowers a great deal as time goes by trace elements would still be possible to detect. Since this was done on our Princess there must have been some evidence or suspicion that she was a habitual drug user.

I will add this particular aspect to my topics and go into greater detail since its hard to go into the level of detail that is required on a post ;)

Thank you Chloekins:). As I recall it was stated in the tox results that she tested negative for opiates. That makes sense.

There may have been suspicion because of the sheer number of dead, known prostitutes found in the Houston area during that period. I don't know if there was any specific evidence indicating that she may have been a prostitute. But, of course that is possible. At this point we are open minded to whom she was and what her lifestyle was, because we don't have enough facts or evidence to indicate what her lifestyle may have been.

I understand about the integrity of the bones concerning the viability of testing. Thank you for clarifying further. I am looking forward to learning all I can, and again thank you very much.

Lion
 
Thank you Chloekins:). As I recall it was stated in the tox results that she tested negative for opiates. That makes sense.

There may have been suspicion because of the sheer number of dead, known prostitutes found in the Houston area during that period. I don't know if there was any specific evidence indicating that she may have been a prostitute. But, of course that is possible. At this point we are open minded to whom she was and what her lifestyle was, because we don't have enough facts or evidence to indicate what her lifestyle may have been.

I understand about the integrity of the bones concerning the viability of testing. Thank you for clarifying further. I am looking forward to learning all I can, and again thank you very much.

Lion

Its my pleasure to answer any question you may have. I love it when people take an interest in science. I really enjoy sharing my knowledge with others as the more educated we become the more help we can give. ;)
 
Its my pleasure to answer any question you may have. I love it when people take an interest in science. I really enjoy sharing my knowledge with others as the more educated we become the more help we can give. ;)

I soooo understand, Chloekins. I was pre-vet and was accepted to vet school, but circumstances sparked me to turn in a different direction. But, I love all things medical science, and college genetics was fun to me(and many other courses!). I am so happy you are here to enlighten and educate us:). I am such a learn monger:laugh: .

Lion
 
Its my pleasure to answer any question you may have. I love it when people take an interest in science. I really enjoy sharing my knowledge with others as the more educated we become the more help we can give. ;)

It is wonderful to have someone with so much knowledge about DNA here. I am sure that you will be a great asset here. Welcome again.
 
I soooo understand, Chloekins. I was pre-vet and was accepted to vet school, but circumstances sparked me to turn in a different direction. But, I love all things medical science, and college genetics was fun to me(and many other courses!). I am so happy you are here to enlighten and educate us:). I am such a learn monger:laugh: .

Lion

Ohh thats lovely! I wanted to be a vet when I was a child but just couldnt bear the thought of hurt animals. I have always been interested in science even back in primary school. I got the histology bug whilst in college and then pathology just grabbed me by the backside during med school (haha!) and I am currently in my fellowship for cytopathology. The body, either in human or animal form is a mysterious and beautiful thing even when it isnt running properly.
 
Ohh thats lovely! I wanted to be a vet when I was a child but just couldnt bear the thought of hurt animals. I have always been interested in science even back in primary school. I got the histology bug whilst in college and then pathology just grabbed me by the backside during med school (haha!) and I am currently in my fellowship for cytopathology. The body, either in human or animal form is a mysterious and beautiful thing even when it isnt running properly.

Bravo, Chloekins! And, may you have the most rewarding of experiences during and after your fellowship. I share your interests, and I look forward to working with you in searching for Princess Blue's name in life.

Are you from England, Great Britain, or Australia? I see that you used the word, "whilst". Just curious;) .

Lion
 
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