GUILTY GA - Lauren Giddings, 27, Macon, 26 June 2011 # 5

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bessie said:
I did see them, Knox. They dusted extensively, which you would expect in the victim's apartment. Not so much in a neighboring apartment.

3Doglady, I was taken aback myself when I saw it is a full sized refrigerator. Like you, I was picturing something smaller.
Click to expand...

Why? That size is small, much shorter than the man carrying it and virtually the same price (new) as a 2-3 ft tall fridge. Very inexpensive when purchased used.

The dusting of the fridge...............um, does LE have SMcD fingerprints? When can they ask for them? ANd if they do have them, apparently they weren't on the fridge?

Was blood found in the fridge? What would they be testing for if not? Traces since none is visible?

Also, does anyone know if the power was on or off in that apt the week it was vacant, before tenant returned for things? How far did he/she travel before returning? I would think that McD would be too chicken to do all that. He doesnt' seem cold and heatless, but nervous/distraught/ maybe? (in interview)

I am still curious as to why the police didnt' smell anything in the garbage on WEdnesday........unless with the beginning of the investigation, they had to get rid of it quick, out of the apt. Could the body have been frozen in fridge and that be the reason the body looked as if she hadn't been dead long? Why there was no smell on WEdnesday when possibly placed there? The reason for the power on or off question.

2 things, a....if anything took place in vacant unit, whomever did this, had to either know when or if current tenant would be returning...................or b.......whomever did this just thought it was vacant and no one would be returning (eh, didnt' convince myself on that one), either way, the perp ran the risk of getting caught, tenant could have returned early.

Also, borrowed luminol? What does that imply? I was thinking they would need plenty to check every inch of the place, sounds like they didnt' find any blood evidence and just kept trying? Anyone?
 
Sandstorm said:
The only point I find unlikely is his verbal disclosure of his feelings to Lauren...IMO, he would not have been forthright in a verbal approach to Lauren. I do not think he had that confidence to disclose his inner feelings towards her. I feel that she knew he had a 'thing' for her, so she was nice to him and maybe even felt a bit sorry for him. I read a comment on Macon.com that a relative had posted which said, "one of the people, that Lauren told her close friends, that made her feel uncomfortable was you guessed it.". No name mentioned but the inference being McD. IMO.
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ref: Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased GA - Lauren Giddings, 27, Macon, 27 June 2011 - #4


Sandstorm said:
Also, his lack of social skills forced him to internalize his feelings for Lauren and those feelings developed into, as you said, " an unhealthy ideal ". I have a very bad feeling about what all he was thinking about Lauren... moving into the scale of creepiness which is another reason I do not think he could have talked to Lauren about his feelings.
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ref: Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased GA - Lauren Giddings, 27, Macon, 27 June 2011 - #4


Sandstorm said:
What is worse is, if this crime was premeditated. What if he took this further in his thinking and decided that she could not leave him forever....that he could not bear to let her go... I consider this a possibility which makes this crime worse than it already is. IMO
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My feelings have always been that this was not premeditated,
with her death being accidental or, more likely, intentional due to him just "loosing it".
Even if it was not premeditated, this "attachment" to her is probably the reason for the last-minute torso disposal.
Premeditation is certainly possible... and definitely more disturbing.
 
It is sad to see all of the fingerprint dust , very eloquent how you describe it . I guess they have to dust everything but it looks like they really dusted up the kitchen more so than her bedroom closets. Even if they match Mcd's fingerprints to it , we know he was in there based on his interview. Perhaps we will find out something today after Burns meets with Winters. I think Burns is going to show all his cards, but it will not be a full house .
 
PsychoMom said:
I am reading a lot of assumptions regarding how SM thought, but I do not see any history of his behaviors being erratic. Strange clothing? Yes. Political debates? Yes. But, violence? No. Obsessions? No. I have to wonder why we aren't hearing about a long history of strange violent outbursts if this is the type person he is. To me, that is very telling. It makes all these other equations difficult to swallow.

Has anyone found any history about previous behaviors by SM? Not the email, which was during the election year, and I heard a lot people get really stupid during that time. That was more of a political debate and rant than anything remotely similar to violence. I am looking to hear he did things like obsessed over the girl in math class in high school and the principal got involved. Or he was butchering the neighborhood kittens as a kid. Or that he has previous stalking charges for an ex-girlfriend. And maybe some verification that he was straight and not gay. I have not heard anything at all. If those things were there, I would expect someone, even from his high school days and not a lawyer type, would be blasting away at him.
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The theories we are discussing are only that: theories.
We are basing the theories on the the possibility that McD is the perpetrator.
If he is the perpetrator, then he killed Lauren and dismembered her.
If he could commit that crime, then there is no doubt that he is a violent person.
Therefore, documentation of any past violence is not required.
Again, we are only posting theories.
 
PsychoMom said:
I am reading a lot of assumptions regarding how SM thought, but I do not see any history of his behaviors being erratic. Strange clothing? Yes. Political debates? Yes. But, violence? No. Obsessions? No. I have to wonder why we aren't hearing about a long history of strange violent outbursts if this is the type person he is. To me, that is very telling. It makes all these other equations difficult to swallow.

Has anyone found any history about previous behaviors by SM? Not the email, which was during the election year, and I heard a lot people get really stupid during that time. That was more of a political debate and rant than anything remotely similar to violence. I am looking to hear he did things like obsessed over the girl in math class in high school and the principal got involved. Or he was butchering the neighborhood kittens as a kid. Or that he has previous stalking charges for an ex-girlfriend. And maybe some verification that he was straight and not gay. I have not heard anything at all. If those things were there, I would expect someone, even from his high school days and not a lawyer type, would be blasting away at him.
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i agree. and im not saying mcdaniel isnt guilty. if he did do it, that doesnt mean he was infatuated with her and i say this because i believe if lauren did feel uncomfortable around him she would have told her family. i mean she lived the for years and she was very close to her family. someone would have know if he made her uncomfortable. i know i could be wrong and he could have been infatuated with her and was really good at hiding it...(i think everyone wants to think that about him because she was so beautiful and sweet, i guess you could say she was perfect)... im just putting it out there.
 
SmoothOperator said:
Jumping off super sleuths post about a theory about a possible way that Stephen had been able to subdue Lauren.. Just as Knox mentioned one does wonder how this very physically fit woman that stands at 6' was over powered by McD.. I feel under the circumstance of just hand to hand combat between the two of them that Lauren couldve most likely beat the snot out of him.. That's why I feel like not only did McD rely on the element of surprise but also combined that with a moment of weakness, caught completely off guard leaving Lauren at a disadvantage.. I too feel as tho McD's obsession escalated at a rapid pace from the time she returned to Mcaon after her sister's wedding(she returned to Macon June 14.. And was dead 11 days later).. I think in those last 11 days he had grown increasingly desperate as he knew that she was moving to an entire different city on the 31st.. I think he entered her apt when she was out Saturday afternoon/evening and was hidden, lying in wait when Lauren entered her apt after having picked up Zaxby's from the drive thru at 6:30pm.. I would not be surprised if infact that wasn't the first time he had entered her home while she was gone and hid and watched her at some other time.. But the night in question I believe he knew he was not there just to watch her.. I think he was watching and waiting for that perfect opportunity to arise where he could ensure that he had the uppermost hand.. Possibly was going to even wait til she was asleep to make his move.. But I think another opportunity that may have presented itself was Lauren taking a shower.. IMO he knew that he had to kill her quick.. IMO his motives were not for Lauren to be alive(and I will leave it at that).. I believe that he used the element of complete surprise.. Ambush.. With her in a vulnerable, completely unprepared state.. I believe he either used blunt force trauma or survivalist type hunting knife to quickly kill her while in the shower.. As I said I believe his intention was to kill her quickly.. Not just debilitate.. I feel like no matter the Injury if she were only debilitated that she would have fought like hell, screamed like hell, beat on walls, tile like hell!!! And quite possibly have even gained an upper hand on SM.. I think he knew he couldnt risk any of those things so he knew it must be a quick kill.. To which I believe he most likely did some prepping to the area after he initially killed her in the shower that he most likely used something similar to the thick plastic that comes in large rolls for indoor painting.. I believe after covering the entire bathroom and even leading into the hall that then he did dismember her.. I believe her body as a whole never left her apt.. I believe that only due to the prepping done beforehand of the area is the only way that a clean up was possible.. But of course as most know there very likely is going to be trace evidence left behind regardless of the prepping and 3-4days he had to thoroughly clean.. And hopefully that is part of the 200 pieces of evidence tht we know were sent to FBI for testing..
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This still goes to the idea of premeditation and planning, which I guess I just have a hard time with.
For one, he was very intelligent. I personally think if he'd planned this, he would have gotten away with it.
Remember his attention to detail... he would have had a very thorough plan,
and would have known how he was going to dispose of her.
... and possibly where (off site) he was going to store what he wanted to keep.
I think the fact that he had to plan and execute all of this after the fact
accounts for his oversight of all the various details which has made this
a murder investigation, as opposed to a missing person.
 
PsychoMom said:
I am reading a lot of assumptions regarding how SM thought, but I do not see any history of his behaviors being erratic. Strange clothing? Yes. Political debates? Yes. But, violence? No. Obsessions? No. I have to wonder why we aren't hearing about a long history of strange violent outbursts if this is the type person he is. To me, that is very telling. It makes all these other equations difficult to swallow.

Has anyone found any history about previous behaviors by SM? Not the email, which was during the election year, and I heard a lot people get really stupid during that time. That was more of a political debate and rant than anything remotely similar to violence. I am looking to hear he did things like obsessed over the girl in math class in high school and the principal got involved. Or he was butchering the neighborhood kittens as a kid. Or that he has previous stalking charges for an ex-girlfriend. And maybe some verification that he was straight and not gay. I have not heard anything at all. If those things were there, I would expect someone, even from his high school days and not a lawyer type, would be blasting away at him.
Click to expand...
I think a lot of factor play into this... his family and upbringing, his intelligence,
some possible social disorder and the fact that he internalizes these things.
I'm sure there were signs, but they would have been subtle, as he would have
been careful not to let people know just how disturbed he was inside to maintain his image.
It's a case of something that has slowly been building within in over a long period of time
and it's finally revealed itself.
 
Sandstorm said:
The theories we are discussing are only that: theories.
We are basing the theories on the the possibility that McD is the perpetrator.
If he is the perpetrator, then he killed Lauren and dismembered her.
If he could commit that crime, then there is no doubt that he is a violent person.
Therefore, documentation of any past violence is not required.
Again, we are only posting theories.
Click to expand...
I second this by saying I'm still not 100% convinced myself.
I would be thrilled if Burns shocked us all and revealed another killer.
I feel for McD, I really do.
 
Jessicaleanne1992 said:
i agree. and im not saying mcdaniel isnt guilty. if he did do it, that doesnt mean he was infatuated with her and i say this because i believe if lauren did feel uncomfortable around him she would have told her family. i mean she lived the for years and she was very close to her family. someone would have know if he made her uncomfortable. i know i could be wrong and he could have been infatuated with her and was really good at hiding it...(i think everyone wants to think that about him because she was so beautiful and sweet, i guess you could say she was perfect)... im just putting it out there.
Click to expand...

I think she did, but they don't want to come out and talk about that right now.
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased GA - Lauren Giddings, 27, Macon, 27 June 2011 - #4

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased GA - Lauren Giddings, 27, Macon, 27 June 2011 - #4
 
SmoothOperator said:
Am I reading this correctly? That it says Whitmire was a neighbor of Giddings and McD at Barristers Hall?? I wonder what unit or proximity was to Lauren and mcDs apts?
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He lived/lives (don't know if he's moved out or not) on the very back side of Barrister's Hall. His front door faced the alley behind the complex that is parallel to Georgia Avenue.
 
Sandstorm said:
The theories we are discussing are only that: theories.
We are basing the theories on the the possibility that McD is the perpetrator.
If he is the perpetrator, then he killed Lauren and dismembered her.
If he could commit that crime, then there is no doubt that he is a violent person.
Therefore, documentation of any past violence is not required.
Again, we are only posting theories.
Click to expand...

Here is my last post regarding this: and thank you Sandstorm for this gracious post:)
*I had a stalker in high school, I was 17 he was 23, I was a lot like Giddings, always thought and saw the good in everyone, and I was fearless.
*This guy was part of the cleaning company that my parents used at my
house, I, like Giddings hardly interacted with him, hi and bye and how are you.
*This person did not have a violent history and was close with his family and his mom was in denial later (sound familiar).
*He was writing me anonymous letters and mailing them to my house. Eventually, they became sicker. I never told my family. Never. I thought, I've got this. My mom, thank god, finally opened one letter and freaked out. His writings had become perverse, and he finally disclosed who he was. You see, IMO, very similar to McD, the imaginary relationship in their head grows till they have to have you. He actually wanted me to write him back.
*When I never wrote him back and thank God for my parents setting up
meetings with me of lawyers and LE who knocked some sense in me. I still, like Giddings, thought this guy is not going to hurt me. Boy did I get a talking to and the sense knocked into me through a lawyer and LE.
*So his passion grew like McD and my stalker showed up at my high school, was arrested with the same hunting knife that McD has been shown to wear and my bra (from my room he cleaned) wrapped in tissue, and he thought we had a relationship!!! He told my principal I was going to have his baby!!!
*I, fortunately, was able to receive a restraining order and he was sentenced to a mental institution. I could have ended up like Giddings.
*When they went to his house, they found a pair of my underwear (gross) and a stack of letters he had never sent that were beginning to sound gruesome.

So please let us go on with our theories. They usually come from a sound and reasonable place. ;)
 
NotALawyer said:
My bolding: This is something I have been wondering about. If bond was denied initially because there were two separate charges, then why would it be awarded now? There are still two separate charges, correct? What would have changed between the initial hearing and now?
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The ORIGINAL bond had been set in magistrate court which was the appropriate place at the time (when there was only the one charge) HOWEVER: when the second burglery charge was added - that second charge mandated that the bond hearing could not be heard by a magistrate judge, but rather had to be heard in superior court- resulting in the orginal bond hearing being revoked. At the time, Buford did file for a bond hearing before the superior court, but then dropped that request in favor of filing a motion to have the matter deceided regarding the "conflict of interest" with the DA's office. Now that the ruling has been issued on that matter, the bond hearing is back on the calendar.
 
justiceforlauren said:
Here is my last post regarding this: and thank you Sandstorm for this gracious post:)
*I had a stalker in high school, I was 17 he was 23, I was a lot like Giddings, always thought and saw the good in everyone, and I was fearless.
*This guy was part of the cleaning company that my parents used at my
house, I, like Giddings hardly interacted with him, hi and bye and how are you.
*This person did not have a violent history and was close with his family and his mom was in denial later (sound familiar).
*He was writing me anonymous letters and mailing them to my house. Eventually, they became sicker. I never told my family. Never. I thought, I've got this. My mom, thank god, finally opened one letter and freaked out. His writings had become perverse, and he finally disclosed who he was. You see, IMO, very similar to McD, the imaginary relationship in their head grows till they have to have you. He actually wanted me to write him back.
*When I never wrote him back and thank God for my parents setting up
meetings with me of lawyers and LE who knocked some sense in me. I still, like Giddings, thought this guy is not going to hurt me. Boy did I get a talking to and the sense knocked into me through a lawyer and LE.
*So his passion grew like McD and my stalker showed up at my high school, was arrested with the same hunting knife that McD has been shown to wear and my bra (from my room he cleaned) wrapped in tissue, and he thought we had a relationship!!! He told my principal I was going to have his baby!!!
*I, fortunately, was able to receive a restraining order and he was sentenced to a mental institution. I could have ended up like Giddings.
*When they went to his house, they found a pair of my underwear (gross) and a stack of letters he had never sent that were beginning to sound gruesome.

So please let us go on with our theories. They usually come from a sound and reasonable place. ;)
Click to expand...
But McD never did any of the things your stalker did , I don't see a parallel. At first when I heard some "personal items" were taken from some apartments, I immediately thought maybe McD stole some of Lauren's underwear , or shoes . Now we know (or think) all he stole were condoms, and they were from other's apartments. If this guy did it, and did it there, there would have to be so much blood, so much forensics, so much hair fiber, stuff on his computer, that we should already have an arrest by now.I said this a few weeks ago and feel stronger about it now as every day goes by. JMO though
 
respectfully snipped
tomkat said:
Why? That size is small, much shorter than the man carrying it and virtually the same price (new) as a 2-3 ft tall fridge. Very inexpensive when purchased used.
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I can't tell judge the refrigerator's height because it's angled downward. I can see it's width and depth, though, and it appears larger than an average apartment fridge.

tomkat said:
The dusting of the fridge...............um, does LE have SMcD fingerprints? When can they ask for them? ANd if they do have them, apparently they weren't on the fridge?
Click to expand...
He was arrested and has been incarcerated for a month on the burglary charges.

tomkat said:
Was blood found in the fridge? What would they be testing for if not? Traces since none is visible?
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We don't know if blood and/or fingerprints were found on the refrigerator.
 
AgentFrankLundy said:
But McD never did any of the things your stalker did , I don't see a parallel. At first when I heard some "personal items" were taken from some apartments, I immediately thought maybe McD stole some of Lauren's underwear , or shoes . Now we know (or think) all he stole were condoms, and they were from other's apartments. If this guy did it, and did it there, there would have to be so much blood, so much forensics, so much hair fiber, stuff on his computer, that we should already have an arrest by now.I said this a few weeks ago and feel stronger about it now as every day goes by. JMO though
Click to expand...

I wasn't trying to parallel everything. If I knew how to bold, I would lol.

Main points:
No violent history
We had no relationship
I did not disclose things to my family about him
He thought we were in a relationship
And his passion grew out of control
(theories IMO above relating to McD)

We do not know there is no evidence. As Kaityln States many times and in this article as well, http://www.macon.com/2011/08/02/1651895/police-da-set-meeting-on-giddings.html#ixzz1TqhD30Eo, LE are tight lipped for a reason.
 
A lot of people are speculating that SMD was obsessed with Lauren. Maybe even that he had a "relationship" built up in his mind. What are these speculations based on? Is there something I missed that would indicate this (other than his interview answers that he noticed things about Lauren like where she normally parked)? Sure, he seems like odd guy and Lauren was a pretty girl. I'm just wondering if that's all these speculations are based on. SMD just seems like a loner to me who probably didn't care too much about girls (or having a relationship at all). I know it's all speculation at this point, but I'm curious why a lot of posters think he could have been obsessed with Lauren.
 
PsychoMom said:
Here it is:
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I am sure the legal teams are all STALLING but they can't hold him if he's not been named a suspect can they? I mean without stalling, manipulating the situation. Surely Buford doesnt' want to let SM out either if he's not sure yet if he's guilty or not. Who wants to be responsible for someone else's murder if he is guilty..THey may be all just stalling adn waiting for more evidence, Buford needs one piece of evidence to prove his client is innocent to feel good about letting him out,(?), though if there is nothing tying SM to the murder, what can they do? I wondered too if there was any blood evidence discovered or if they are just looking for dna since the body was discovered outside of apt 3. I feel like they coudln't tie any blood to SM or fingerprints to SM or he'd already be named a Suspect. RIght? Of course they still have to wait for forensics if they did find blood, but what about fingerprints?
 
tomkat said:
I am sure the legal teams are all STALLING but they can't hold him if he's not been named a suspect can they? I mean without stalling, manipulating the situation. Surely Buford doesnt' want to let SM out either if he's not sure yet if he's guilty or not. Who wants to be responsible for someone else's murder if he is guilty..THey may be all just stalling adn waiting for more evidence, Buford needs one piece of evidence to prove his client is innocent to feel good about letting him out,(?), though if there is nothing tying SM to the murder, what can they do? I wondered too if there was any blood evidence discovered or if they are just looking for dna since the body was discovered outside of apt 3. I feel like they coudln't tie any blood to SM or fingerprints to SM or he'd already be named a Suspect. RIght? Of course they still have to wait for forensics if they did find blood, but what about fingerprints?
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I think it would be pretty unlikely that Buford is part of a conspiracy to keep his own client in jail. That would be unethical and adverse to his client's best interest, which I sincerely doubt he would be doing. His only rationale for delaying the bond hearing as long as he has would be because he finds it to be strategically in the best interest of his client.
 
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