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scandi - In my wildest dreams I wouldn't think of this as an accident!!!! This child was asphyxiated probably by holding her face down in dirt (not sure where), then her clothes were taken off and put beneath her in a shallow dirt grave where people are known to fish by the river bank. She was put in a fetal position where a bag of cement was poured over her and mixed with water until hardened. ACCIDENT? I don't think so!! mho My very first thoughts were that someone was being set up, a gotcha..an fu... (framed). If this is the work of a pedophile, his profile is different from most. Most children, once dead, are nothing but objects to a pedophile and thrown anywhere convenient. This horrendous sequence of events is the extreme of what this person had to do in order to feel a sense of power and control over this child or someone else. Yikes!
 
eyes4crime said:
scandi - In my wildest dreams I wouldn't think of this as an accident!!!! This child was asphyxiated probably by holding her face down in dirt (not sure where), then her clothes were taken off and put beneath her in a shallow dirt grave where people are known to fish by the river bank. She was put in a fetal position where a bag of cement was poured over her and mixed with water until hardened. ACCIDENT? I don't think so!! mho My very first thoughts were that someone was being set up, a gotcha..an fu... (framed). If this is the work of a pedophile, his profile is different from most. Most children, once dead, are nothing but objects to a pedophile and thrown anywhere convenient. This horrendous sequence of events is the extreme of what this person had to do in order to feel a sense of power and control over this child or someone else. Yikes!
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I do agree with you and threw the accident idea out to expand our horizons. Maybe in trying to hide her he accidently smothered her and then realized she wasn't dead so had to finish her off.

I don't know what to think there are so many possibilities. It does boggle my mind tho that she was evidently naked somewhere else as there were carpet fibres on her body as well as under her nails. I also think by pushing her face into the dirt he wanted to make sure she was dead. Cement dust in her lunfs will tell the answer to that.

I hope they are close to making an arrest. They know so much. What is it they don't know yet to put this sick person behind bars. The townspeople must be totally on edge knowing this guy is still walking their streets!
 
I think that whomever buried her did so because he/she needed Nevaeh dead in order to protect his/her identity for an assault but he/she was too chicken ****e to kill her any other way, so he/she buied her alive instead. Not having physically beat her/shot her/etc to death may make the pep feel less guilty somehow.
 
Just wanted to comment on some of the fine points you made in your post and offer an additional thought to consider as well.

scandi said:
. . .We have pretty well concentrated on SO involvement here. The family had SO's in and around them which gave us the thought. Her being found naked also adds to that. Children are so often sexually abused by family and friends.. . .
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Very true. In fact I have been sort of half expecting to learn of such an involvement in this case simply because it happens so often that family or other care givers are involved in a childs abuse/death.

scandi said:
. . .IMO, it happened around someone who was very angry with her to kill her in such a viscous way. That would have to be a crazy person. . . .
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It does sound like the result of a rage of some kind at first glance but I just don't yet know for sure due to a previous case as I will explain in a moment.

scandi said:
. . .Or else she was taken to be killed by some serial type killer - maybe his first kill. It was just such a bizarre death with the possibility of several unique MO's.
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Also very possible.

***********
Now one additional thought or two:
1. I remember a case (I think it was in FLA) of a girl that was molested and killed by an SO but he was a druggie and was under the influence of the drugs when he acted and he also buried his young victim and if I remember correctly she also was alive when buried. (Good thing that perp is out of circulation.)

That case makes me remember that there can be many influences on why a perp does the things he/she does.

2. The disposal place of the body seems to tell a bit though. The perp was comfortable enough with that spot to take the time to dispose of the child there.

I think it is possible the perp/s have been in jail before and have heard a little of how to make a body disposal look a bit like a serial killer dump.

I am thinking the perp/s spend or have spent quite a bit of time within an area about 20 mins drive time from the childs home and thus felt safe enough to take a child and then dispose of her within that area.
 
Why?????
That's all i can think of.....that's all that keeps going through my mind....:(
Why the HELL does some sick twisted piece of crap have to snatch an innocent sweet little princess and do such unspeakable things to her????
Why???
(I just now...while i'm on the couch on pain meds trying to recover from a bad UTI/kidney infection.....caught up on Nevaeh's story.....and i'm blown away and so incredibly sad and also so incredibly thankful that i'm sitting here in my living room w/ all 3 of my precious kids all safe and sound)
 
If she wasn't sexually assaulted, I would have to go back and look at JB.

She did mention she came home to change clothes, but we have no confirmation of that happening to my knowledge. Maybe a fight happened at that time and JB became enraged enough to take her "to the store" where she disposed of her. Since GF #2 of George's goes fishing with him, JB probably has been to that spot many times, IMO.
 
the more i think about this the more i get the feeling that the person while might have known nevaeh had no feelings whatsoever for her. usually when the person kills someone they at least "care" about they do it in a manner that would be quick for the person dying. this person didn't care what was easiest for nevaeh but instead what was easiest for them. it seems they held her there long enough for either her to pass out or to at least give up and then just covered her. their job was done. she was buried.
 
I read somewhere that there was no sexual assault. I don't know where but it stuck in my mind because we are all so focused on the SO's swarming around the Buchanans.

We have no idea if the soil in her mouth, throat and lungs matches that at the river. All we know is that the ME found dirt where there shouldn't be dirt.
 
Or maybe the perp thought he/she had drowned her, thought she was dead, buried her and she regained consciousness while buried. :(
 
DotsEyes said:
I read somewhere that there was no sexual assault. I don't know where but it stuck in my mind because we are all so focused on the SO's swarming around the Buchanans.

We have no idea if the soil in her mouth, throat and lungs matches that at the river. All we know is that the ME found dirt where there shouldn't be dirt.
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Hi DotsEyes ~

The only thing I've read is that there was lack of "physical trauma". I took that to mean no sexual assault. I have no clue what they justify as "physical trauma" but if a sexual molestation or signs thereof does not qualify as physical trauma ... then I give up.
 
kiki the parrot said:
I'm reminded that clothing removed but lack of SA could also indicate an attempt at staging a sexually-motivated crime to cover up something else. Sorry no 'good' options here, only thinking aloud.

:parrot:
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SeriouslySearching said:
If she wasn't sexually assaulted, I would have to go back and look at JB.

She did mention she came home to change clothes, but we have no confirmation of that happening to my knowledge. Maybe a fight happened at that time and JB became enraged enough to take her "to the store" where she disposed of her. Since GF #2 of George's goes fishing with him, JB probably has been to that spot many times, IMO.
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Haddie McFaddies Mom said:
Hi DotsEyes ~

The only thing I've read is that there was lack of "physical trauma". I took that to mean no sexual assault. I have no clue what they justify as "physical trauma" but if a sexual molestation or signs thereof does not qualify as physical trauma ... then I give up.
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I don't think it has yet been released whether there were, or were not, signs of a sexual assault. In my earlier post (above) I'd of course anticipated the possibility of no SA, in which case the investigation could naturally focus more on the possibility of JB's involvement. However the fact AR states there is a "lack of physical trauma" does not on the face seem to support a typical parental rage sort of killing in which a child is battered--since I took this statement as excluding any signs of outward injury, but not excluding sexual assault. By the same token, a forcable drowning had also occurred (as it would leave no obvious trauma) but seemed unlikely given the dirt aspirated.

:parrot:
 
Haddie McFaddies Mom said:
Hi DotsEyes ~

The only thing I've read is that there was lack of "physical trauma". I took that to mean no sexual assault. I have no clue what they justify as "physical trauma" but if a sexual molestation or signs thereof does not qualify as physical trauma ... then I give up.
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Physical Trauma in an autopsy or medical report does not normally refer specifically to sexual assault. (in some cases part of sexual assault may involve physical trauma, but they are not directly linked.)

Physical Trauma normally refers to clear and obvious injuries. Broken bones. Bleeding. Signs of having been stabbed, or gunshot wounds. Glaring and obvious signs of injury to the victim or to body tissues. "Trauma" always refers to strong external force or forces having been applied to a human body.

Obvious physical trauma will not be typically present in other types of circumstances. Suffocation, drowning, overdose or poison, etc. The types of injury or death that either comes from an internal mechanism (ie poison, overdose etc) or where the forces applied to the body are softer, and not prone to cause direct tissue damage. (suffocation etc)
 
I have to agree that rape would be considered a physical trauma because there would be physical damage. She's a baby.

So, if not an SO abduction for sexual gratification, then what do we have? A nude, dead child with no physical injuries, buried under cement, on top of her clothes with a beer can tossed in, dirt in her throat and lungs and carpet fibers under her nails.

I can come up with a scenario that explains everything we know at this point, but how silly would that be when we know so little.
 
W/out becoming graphic I can come up w a scenario in which there is sexual abuse short of rape which won't leave the same outward signs of trauma. However, most here are not trying to speculate but willing to await official word from LE.

:parrot:
 
I am having alot of construction going on at my house and haven't had time to read alot lately, but I can't remember if there was any evidence of rape on this child or if it had been ruled out. I remember reading that she was found nude, however, if since there was concrete poured over her body, I'm wondering if that would have hindered LE's investigation of possible rape? Just wondering....
 
STEADFAST said:
Buried alive makes the time to commit this crime pretty short, shorter than we had guessed. Remember how the timeline (or, that is, the time reports by various people) kept creeping forward just a bit at a time?
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that poor baby she died via my very worst fear .. how horrible i am having trouble after reading this thread because this is a real fear of mine .. now to see that a baby a precious baby died that way god i cant comprehend this :(
 
debbie0604 said:
I am having alot of construction going on at my house and haven't had time to read alot lately, but I can't remember if there was any evidence of rape on this child or if it had been ruled out. I remember reading that she was found nude, however, if since there was concrete poured over her body, I'm wondering if that would have hindered LE's investigation of possible rape? Just wondering....
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debbie0604 - Concrete can be very basic (high ph) causing it to be caustic to the skin and eyes. Scroll to the bottom of this link and it will tell you of the warnings. I asked this same question myself...wondering about cement hardening and filling the body cavities. Seems to me, the PH of the cement may be the real problem regarding DNA...just my opinion and don't know much for sure. Hope this helps!

http://www.cement.org/basics/concretebasics_working.asp
 
christine2448 said:
I used to have under my hat (christine2448) WS has changed the way I walk in this world (until posters complained I wasn't identifying myself as a moderator, so I went back)...but it has. It's HORRIFYING to know what is ALL AROUND US, EVERYDAY, ALL DAY...I hadn't a clue until I joined WS. Thank God, I now see the light and am able to protect me, mine, and others we can make aware. It's a VERY scary world we live in. :(
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Amen!
 
zadari said:
that poor baby she died via my very worst fear .. how horrible i am having trouble after reading this thread because this is a real fear of mine .. now to see that a baby a precious baby died that way god i cant comprehend this :(
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you're exactly right. We always hope in cases like these, that death came fast without much suffering, but unfortunately this was not the case. And what makes it even more horrific is the possibility it was someone she knew who did it and the poor little one had to be wondering why
 
docwho3 said:
Just wanted to comment on some of the fine points you made in your post and offer an additional thought to consider as well.

Very true. In fact I have been sort of half expecting to learn of such an involvement in this case simply because it happens so often that family or other care givers are involved in a childs abuse/death.

It does sound like the result of a rage of some kind at first glance but I just don't yet know for sure due to a previous case as I will explain in a moment.

Also very possible.

***********
Now one additional thought or two:
1. I remember a case (I think it was in FLA) of a girl that was molested and killed by an SO but he was a druggie and was under the influence of the drugs when he acted and he also buried his young victim and if I remember correctly she also was alive when buried. (Good thing that perp is out of circulation.)

That case makes me remember that there can be many influences on why a perp does the things he/she does.

2. The disposal place of the body seems to tell a bit though. The perp was comfortable enough with that spot to take the time to dispose of the child there.

I think it is possible the perp/s have been in jail before and have heard a little of how to make a body disposal look a bit like a serial killer dump.

I am thinking the perp/s spend or have spent quite a bit of time within an area about 20 mins drive time from the childs home and thus felt safe enough to take a child and then dispose of her within that area.
Click to expand...

That was Jessica Lunsford, the 9 year old from Homassasa, Fl. Her murderer stated that she was buried alive, but experts weren't sure if she was alive when buried or minutes before (she was in a plastic bag that she tried to get out of, her fingers managed to poke through the bag despite being tied together.)

reading this absolutely broke my heart. The terror she must have felt in those last few minutes.
 
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