TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #4

glorias said:

First, we have no idea if LE has spoken with the kids.Maybe someone else will remember -- did someone local confirm that LE had not spoken with them? I have a vague memory of it but didn't find anything on a search. So anyway, there's nothing to indicate Matt compelled kids to lie for him.

Now, as far as the timeline, we know when Gail was at the house: according to Matt, Gail "dropped the children off with no one home at about noon." (Of course, that's the same interview where he said he had no idea how long Gail was at the lake house, and we now know that's not true: He knew she left when police were at the house for the 911 call, and he knew she came back at noon the next day. But let's side-step his inconsistencies and accept that she came back there at noon on April 30.)

Susie says Gail left about 12:15.

Matt says when he arrived, Gail was gone. But we don't know when Matt arrived, do we?

I'm going through all this again because that time frame is the one I'm very interested in. We don't know when Matt arrived that day as far as I know, we don't know what he did afterward, nothing. Just Gail was last seen about 12:15, then on May 2nd she was reported missing.

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I've been following this case pretty closely and don't recall any mention of LE either speaking or not speaking to the kids. If it has been mentioned by locals, I wish someone could find it!

I keep thinking of the Perry March case, where he pretty much brainwashed his kids to believe that their mom just walked away from them. NOT that this is happening here, but anyway...

That time frame you mention is very crucial to this whole mystery.

believe09 said:

I have to say, I dont think the time allows for MP to have carried out an evil deed against his wife in this fashion. But again, the kids would be the key to the timeline.

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And of course, it is the time frame "according to MP" who has been inconsistent in some of his statements. The kids really do hold the key.

believe09 said:

I have to say, I dont think the time allows for MP to have carried out an evil deed against his wife in this fashion. But again, the kids would be the key to the timeline.

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Which is why I think that if she is a victim of foul play, then he didn't do it himself. If he is ultimately responsible for her disappearence and theoretical murder, my opinion is that he likely would've hired someone to take care of her, protecting himself from having to hide his whereabouts from the children or forcing them to cover up his actions.

glorias said:

Well, Matt said that they had made plans to meet at the house around noon on the 30th, so I think it's very plausible that she came back because Matt had asked her to. My speculation is that he didn't want Gail and the kids to leave in the first place.

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I may not remember correctly after all that has been posted about this, but it seems to me that Matt stated "he had proposed to met Gail" when she returned to SM on the 30th. I don't recall seeing if she agreed or declined.


@smooth operator you seem to have put a lot of thought on Matt.

Columbo said:

And of course, it is the time frame "according to MP" who has been inconsistent in some of his statements. The kids really do hold the key.

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His “inconstancy” it seems to me is based on incomplete information and subsequent forum speculations. LE has not made a statement saying that MP has been inconsistent or have I missed something?

I’m sorry to opining that MP didn’t give any thought to his wife’s arrival in Ala as he was too busy going gaga over the GF.

I’m really surprised at WS letting some of this theory involving and implicating of MP before he is named as POI carry on. At this time it would seem he and the children are victims as well. What if the kids corroborated his assessment of her mental health would they be turned on too?

Post after post has testified to the vigilance of SMPD concerning vehicle traffic. If they are to be believed I have to assume that SMPD have a pretty good idea as to the comings and goings of the parties involved.

The neighbor also seemed to be keeping an eye out for GP.

Frankly it sounds to me MP was too busy talking on the phone and carrying on with the possibly two women he was seeing to be bothered to hatch a complicated plan to get rid of GP.

Those poor kids he is the only parent they have with them now and it would do good for them by tempering the atmosphere until there is a statement from LE, IMO.

Has anyone ever disputed his claim that she had left the home and children in his care and out of touch with him “decompressing”?

In my experience that is very unusual behavior for the SAHMs I know but it does point to her being confident in his ability to take care of home and hearth and if he has done it before I guess he was a fake "hero" then too?

ALL IMO

"Since you are aware SM police patrol the streets in the city limits 2 x day, does anyone know if Hamilton County Sheriff's office did the same in Walden to the Sequatchie County Line knowing Gail was missing until they were brought on officially just last week? HCSO is contracted for patrolling all of Walden's Ridge (town) and unincorporated Signal Mountain in Hamilton County (out near Mount Carmel Baptist). This may have the largest unpopulated area of dense forests, Roberts Mill Road, and way out behind subdivisions (e.g., Grandview) that have not been developed yet."

Yes, they also patrol at least once per day, Walden 2X per day....but that (in Walden) may have been from when they had their own PD....but all at least once per day.
It seems really unlikely the local PD's weren't actively looking for signs of Gail and her Jeep as they did their rounds, since athough she wasn't officially missing for 48 hours, at least 2 people had been talking to them about it before then. As many have pointed out, the PD's don't have a huge crime-rate to manage.

Jade said:

His “inconstancy” it seems to me is based on incomplete information and subsequent forum speculations. LE has not made a statement saying that MP has been inconsistent or have I missed something?

I’m sorry to opining that MP didn’t give any thought to his wife’s arrival in Ala as he was too busy going gaga over the GF.

I’m really surprised at WS letting some of this theory involving and implicating of MP before he is named as POI carry on. At this time it would seem he and the children are victims as well. What if the kids corroborated his assessment of her mental health would they be turned on too?

Post after post has testified to the vigilance of SMPD concerning vehicle traffic. If they are to be believed I have to assume that SMPD have a pretty good idea as to the comings and goings of the parties involved.

The neighbor also seemed to be keeping an eye out for GP.

Frankly it sounds to me MP was too busy talking on the phone and carrying on with the possibly two women he was seeing to be bothered to hatch a complicated plan to get rid of GP.

Those poor kids he is the only parent they have with them now and it would do good for them by tempering the atmosphere until there is a statement from LE, IMO.

Has anyone ever disputed his claim that she had left the home and children in his care and out of touch with him “decompressing”?

In my experience that is very unusual behavior for the SAHMs I know but it does point to her being confident in his ability to take care of home and hearth and if he has done it before I guess he was a fake "hero" then too?

ALL IMO

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Isn't his statement regarding GP's psychiatric issues an inconsistancy to what LE has found?

Do you have a link with the information of the two women who he may have been seeing? I've only seen one woman referenced prior. TIA

There has been some talk of him seeing at least one woman more openly since GP disappeared. It's more likely the children would hear about this within their local atomosphere than anything posted on WS. Also in overhearing conversatons he may be having with same since it's reported he did this on a regular basis. Kids are very observant. imo

I'm sure the children are very confused and troubled...so his babbliing with his gf(s), not taking part in any search efforts, and not volunteering to take a poly seem to go against the grain of him having the children's best interests at heart.

IF someone else was given the job of disappearing GP then he wouldn't have to skip a beat in time with his social affairs.

IMO

fedfan4life said:

Well, if we assume that Matt murdered Gail himself, then how would that be possible within the span of 10 minutes? Unless, of course, he did not return home by 12:10pm. Do you think it's possible that he could compel his children to lie?

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Did anyone see MP return to the house who could
back up the time he gave? Maybe Susie Button?

carolinagirl56 said:

Did anyone see MP return to the house who could
back up the time he gave? Maybe Susie Button?

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In my understanding, we don't have that as the time he gave. We have it as the time a poster gave in a comment on an article, who stated that is what SB had said.

Every time I drive by the road going down to the house, I see a SMP car turning in. I don't know if they are going to patrol the house, but I don't remember seeing so many police cars turning in that way before.

Jade said:

His “inconstancy” it seems to me is based on incomplete information and subsequent forum speculations. LE has not made a statement saying that MP has been inconsistent or have I missed something?

I’m sorry to opining that MP didn’t give any thought to his wife’s arrival in Ala as he was too busy going gaga over the GF.

I’m really surprised at WS letting some of this theory involving and implicating of MP before he is named as POI carry on. At this time it would seem he and the children are victims as well. What if the kids corroborated his assessment of her mental health would they be turned on too?

Post after post has testified to the vigilance of SMPD concerning vehicle traffic. If they are to be believed I have to assume that SMPD have a pretty good idea as to the comings and goings of the parties involved.

The neighbor also seemed to be keeping an eye out for GP.

Frankly it sounds to me MP was too busy talking on the phone and carrying on with the possibly two women he was seeing to be bothered to hatch a complicated plan to get rid of GP.

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BBM

First, yes, very early on in the case, Matt said that his wife had psychiatric issues, and in the very same news articles it would say LE had said there was no evidence of it. If you read through these threads you'll see other examples, like when Matt told media he didn't know how long Gail had been at the lake house. Obviously he did know, because he told the media she came back about noon, and we now know he knew when she left because her leaving was due to the 911 domestic call she made. That's in the police reports and has been reported by the media.

Second, the stuff you're saying about phone calls and 2 girlfriends is pure rumor. The phone calls comments are made on other sites and are completely unsubstantiated, and I don't think we have even discussed them here on WB. Two girlfriends is something I haven't even heard before.

Edited to add that I would hope no one would ever put 9 and 12 year old kids in the position of having to corroborate their mother's mental illnesses.

sophieness said:

In my understanding, we don't have that as the time he gave. We have it as the time a poster gave in a comment on an article, who stated that is what SB had said.

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Ok, thanks. It would take about 25 minutes to get from his mother's house to their house.

hollyblue said:

Isn't his statement regarding GP's psychiatric issues an inconsistancy to what LE has found?

Do you have a link with the information of the two women who he may have been seeing? I've only seen one woman referenced prior. TIA

There has been some talk of him seeing at least one woman more openly since GP disappeared. It's more likely the children would hear about this within their local atomosphere than anything posted on WS. Also in overhearing conversatons he may be having with same since it's reported he did this on a regular basis. Kids are very observant. imo

I'm sure the children are very confused and troubled...so his babbliing with his gf(s), not taking part in any search efforts, and not volunteering to take a poly seem to go against the grain of him having the children's best interests at heart.

IF someone else was given the job of disappearing GP then he wouldn't have to skip a beat in time with his social affairs.

IMO

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Not necessarily. Statements from her friends say she was in a state over something.

Here is a quote to pick over:

http://www.wrcbtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=14627648

In a sworn statement he claims his wife has suffered "bouts of depression", is on several prescription medications, and is "delusional".
Gail's family denies those claims.

"Absolutely not," said Diane Nichols, when asked if her sister has a history of mental illness, "she is a very intelligent person, healthy, has two kids at home, she loves those kids, this is unusual."

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I see the reporter asking a leading question by asking does she have a mental illness. That isn’t what MP said, imo.

>>>Edit>> found link to MP saying:it was his opinion she was unstable and having severe issues after losing her job but I didn’t see where he said she was being treated or had an admission to a hospital or anything like that that would have had left evidence for LE.

I’m no expert but are bouts of depression considered mental illness? It could have been short term situational depression.

Isn’t the medication she may be on important as some of those warn of increased suicide risk and other side effects that are concerning including delusional thoughts?

I, in her position, would be thinking any phone call or trip to the store a cover for indiscretion. Call it delusional if you may but that is what I would be thinking.

But myself I would have kicked him out the first indication I got of another woman. And I sure wouldn’t want him going to the lake house with us much less riding in the car. If he had a snit and got out and took off walking I would leave him in the dust and have the locks changed.

I agree the alleged girlfriend is probably no surprise to the kids. Surely the parents have had a candid talk with the kids with the onset of divorce and separation talk. The theories of MFH and his positioning himself as a fake hero and other MP killed her postings are what I am concerned about.

My repeating of the gossip of I said possibly two girlfriends is mild compared to talk of MFH and actual participation in murder by MP!

The other possible GF was in a news comment which said there was one in Ala also.

I missed that about a poly didn’t know that SMPD had asked for one.

The Bobo’s didn’t participate in searches are they suspects in your mind? Many of the family of the missing do not take part in searches. It just seems like flimsy evidence against him considering he didn’t seem to care about her much anyway.

He obviously has his best interest at heart or he would have gotten a divorce before he had his alleged affair.I was hoping posters would have the kids best interest at heart by not accusing him of murdering their mother before LE makes him a POI.

It concerns me to think that GP may have felt that the circumstances and the fall out would mean in some way she isn’t all those wonderful if she was having issues dealing with it.

You may be surprised how widely read and influential WS is – check the sats who knows who all the visitors are.

ALL IMO

glorias said:

BBM

First, yes, very early on in the case, Matt said that his wife had psychiatric issues, and in the very same news articles it would say LE had said there was no evidence of it. If you read through these threads you'll see other examples, like when Matt told media he didn't know how long Gail had been at the lake house. Obviously he did know, because he told the media she came back about noon, and we now know he knew when she left because her leaving was due to the 911 domestic call she made. That's in the police reports and has been reported by the media.

Second, the stuff you're saying about phone calls and 2 girlfriends is pure rumor. The phone calls comments are made on other sites and are completely unsubstantiated, and I don't think we have even discussed them here on WB. Two girlfriends is something I haven't even heard before.

Edited to add that I would hope no one would ever put 9 and 12 year old kids in the position of having to corroborate their mother's mental illnesses.

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I hear what you are saying but I still have a notion a lot of this is red herring.

Maybe it is wishful thinking. I would like to believe their remaining parent did not hurt the other.

It would concern me greatly if a statement has not been taken from the children.
With their Mother missing I am sure there have been many hard questions asked of them that no one ever wants to be in the position of asking.
If SMPD, as the investigative agency, did not ask questions about state of mind before and up to the time of her leaving the house I would be shocked and would consider them derelict in their duties.

I don’t know I think MP was saying it was his opinion she was unstable and having severe issues after losing her job.

I don’t feel like there is enough verifiable information to have a firm theory as to MP’s involvement in foul play.

All imo

Snipped.

Jade said:

Isn’t the medication she may be on important as some of those warn of increased suicide risk and other side effects that are concerning including delusional thoughts?

I, in her position, would be thinking any phone call or trip to the store a cover for indiscretion. Call it delusional if you may but that is what I would be thinking.

But myself I would have kicked him out the first indication I got of another woman. And I sure wouldn’t want him going to the lake house with us much less riding in the car. If he had a snit and got out and took off walking I would leave him in the dust and have the locks changed.

I agree the alleged girlfriend is probably no surprise to the kids. Surely the parents have had a candid talk with the kids with the onset of divorce and separation talk. The theories of MFH and his positioning himself as a fake hero and other MP killed her postings are what I am concerned about.

My repeating of the gossip of I said possibly two girlfriends is mild compared to talk of MFH and actual participation in murder by MP!

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It's my understanding that someone has seen the documents that list the specific medications; however, it's against HIPAA to release that info because Gail is, as far as we know, still alive. I don't honestly know how it works if she's found to have passed or if time goes on and she's declared legally dead. Right now, though, it's not in her best interest (or WS's!) to reveal the meds. They may be important but they are seriously off limits, and we have to accept that.

I don't know what/who MFH is.

As for the two girlfriends and phone calls stuff, I just wanted to point out that those are indeed rumors. Rumor is not the same as speculation, and I'm not here to judge which rumor/speculation is "okay" to post and which isn't.

We have no idea if Gail has been murdered, let alone by Matt. I think we all understand this. That said, many here, including myself, think she met with foul play. Some of us have dismissed accident, suicide, or doom at the hands of a hypothetical unknown assailant for specific reasons based on the information we have available.

I wonder if the PI is getting anywhere with his investigation? So far all we know is that he went to Alabama with a letter demanding AD to give back some items Gail might have given her.

fbx said:

"Since you are aware SM police patrol the streets in the city limits 2 x day, does anyone know if Hamilton County Sheriff's office did the same in Walden to the Sequatchie County Line knowing Gail was missing until they were brought on officially just last week? HCSO is contracted for patrolling all of Walden's Ridge (town) and unincorporated Signal Mountain in Hamilton County (out near Mount Carmel Baptist). This may have the largest unpopulated area of dense forests, Roberts Mill Road, and way out behind subdivisions (e.g., Grandview) that have not been developed yet."

Yes, they also patrol at least once per day, Walden 2X per day....but that (in Walden) may have been from when they had their own PD....but all at least once per day.
It seems really unlikely the local PD's weren't actively looking for signs of Gail and her Jeep as they did their rounds, since athough she wasn't officially missing for 48 hours, at least 2 people had been talking to them about it before then. As many have pointed out, the PD's don't have a huge crime-rate to manage.

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I wrote what you replied to, and I live outside of the SM city limits and know HCSO may not even patrol every day of the week (although they may lead some to think that). They use to only patrol two days a week when I inquired awhile ago, and that may have increased, but not by much. They choose 'random' days to patrol to not show a pattern, seriously that is what I was told personally 'off the record'. Police visibility is little or none, especially off the main road (Taft Highway).

My question was meant to imply if there was a missing person's report on May 2nd in Signal Mountain, did anyone know if HCSO put more patrol on the mountain even though they were not a part of the 'official' investigation. I have not seen an increase in visibility even though now they are a part of the investigation.

With that said, it could have been days before anyone patrolled the streets and days without LE at all outside of the city limits.

Regarding Meds-well I would think it would depend 1.) On whether or not she was acutally prescribed something and if she is actually taking it and 2.) When she MAY have started the meds. Most side effects take place pretty quickly, certainly within the first 6 weeks.

Much like the Horman threads, there is no named POI in this case, but if you are a believer in the foul play theory it is natural to cast your eyes on the adult who was closest to Gail. That would be Matt.

For me, the longer the time has passed the more concern I have with the possibility of foul play. My only yardstick for this is the knowledge of similar cases and the family/friends statements that she is a devoted mother. Oh, and LE's firm statement that they have nothing to support MP's affidavit that she was/is unstable and had psychiatric issues.

This statement paints a picture of a woman who could have wandered away. I think it is a deliberate portrayal, but not because I think MP did away with his wife. I think it represents a typical albeit nasty statement you would see in divorce that might be ramping up...possibly based upon the cards each held.

For example, let's say MP was cheating with one or more women and was (possibly) abusing Gail. She had a lot of money in her name apparently-MP claimed that the accounts she restricted his access to are marital property...but not that they are joint. That would certainly carry some weight if we consider it in the context of a divorce.

Now, let's say that Gail was unstable and was prone to wandering away and leaving her children unattended. Well that would carry some weight as well.

Except in this case, LE is saying they have no evidence that she was unstable. And we know there were multiple domestic calls to the residence-in fact the day before she disappeared she fled with her children to another state.

IMO, MP is moving forward with his part of the divorce filing now because he will get what he is asking for simply because Gail is not there to contest it. JMVHO.

Columbo said:

I wonder if the PI is getting anywhere with his investigation? So far all we know is that he went to Alabama with a letter demanding AD to give back some items Gail might have given her.

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Does AD have to give MP anything if GP gave it to her? Maybe, I can understand the recording/security device if in fact it was a marital asset, but documents and such? If he saw the news report where it was shown on TV (even though blurred), he would know, but would documents, notes, and lists GP may have made be legally MP's?

glorias said:

Snipped.



It's my understanding that someone has seen the documents that list the specific medications; however, it's against HIPAA to release that info because Gail is, as far as we know, still alive. I don't honestly know how it works if she's found to have passed or if time goes on and she's declared legally dead. Right now, though, it's not in her best interest (or WS's!) to reveal the meds. They may be important but they are seriously off limits, and we have to accept that.

I don't know what/who MFH is.

As for the two girlfriends and phone calls stuff, I just wanted to point out that those are indeed rumors. Rumor is not the same as speculation, and I'm not here to judge which rumor/speculation is "okay" to post and which isn't.

We have no idea if Gail has been murdered, let alone by Matt. I think we all understand this. That said, many here, including myself, think she met with foul play. Some of us have dismissed accident, suicide, or doom at the hands of a hypothetical unknown assailant for specific reasons based on the information we have available.

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But her friends said she was gathering evidence of the affair. That was in the news.

MFH= murder for hire

I’ve followed missing cases for years on WS and no one judges anyone for taking meds. Such heart breaking cases where family members have thrown it all out there. Like having a baby you get to the point everyone is looking down there and you just don’t care anymore you just want it over with the best outcome.

WSer’s take this seriously and with consideration of someone maybe needing meds and not having them then they will expand the search and flyer sending to, for example, homeless shelters. They will take into consideration the lack of or access to in order to think about how she may be found.

In town civilians searching need to know where to look and why they are looking there.

Oh, I don’t know what to think.

My best wishes to the family and friends who love her so much. She had such sad eyes in the pictures it’s good to know she is feisty and fun loving.

ALL IMO