GA - Man Swats Boy For Grabbing His Kitty

That's not correct. The owner says that the kid did grabbed hold of the carrier and tried to pull it off the chair. This cat just had surgery. I wouldn't be happy if somebody tried to do that to my pet.

The owner says that - but the vet tech's statement is different.

I believe if when LE arrived, the vet tech said that kid was completely out of control and grabbing post surgical animals in a hostile way, and backed up that this man brushed against the child in a way the child "probably didn't feel it", as the man contends, he would have been arrested.
 
I kind of sympathize a bit with the man. He's probably from the old school when people could hit each other's kids and not be committing a crime or an offense one could be sued over. He probably didn't think too hard about it and just reacted.

But I am frankly astounded that so many people think he was justified or that it is okay for a stranger to use physical force on someone else's child. Like many have said, you can't go around slapping adults whose behavior is bad. Why is it okay to hit a random child whose behavior is bad? Children have rights to be free from a stranger assaulting them in the same way adults do.

And someone posted that until 20 or 30 years ago, physical discipline was okay. It's only now that it is becoming bad to hit children. Well physically "disciplining" one's wife was okay for thousands of years as well. Children used to be deemed the personal property of their parents and the parents could do whatever they wanted to with them. Children used to work alongside their parents all day in mines or fields, instead of going to school and that was okay. Just because it is historical does not make it right.

This is not about "coddling" children. There would have been nothing wrong with the man telling the child, "Hey! Do not touch my cat's carrier again. Do you hear me?" And then physically blocking him from getting near or even removing his hands from the cage. But hitting the child? It's simply not right.

I had a similar situation. I went to the vet with my very scared cats and a bunch of kids were running around right outside the door, banging on it and banging on the windows. All the animals inside were scared. I had no clue who the parents were and no one seemed to be stopping them except at one point, a lady who seemed unrelated. I asked the people at the counter to do something. They did not. I then went outside and said firmly, "Do not bang on the windows or doors again. Do you ever get scared at the doctors? Well, this is the doctor's office for the dogs and cats and they are scared. When you make noise, it makes it scarier for them." They stopped for a long time but then after a while, one of them tested me and yelled through the mail slot. The workers did not seem to care and did nothing. I went outside again and said, "Hey. What did I tell you? Stop making noise."

It was at that point that a parent surfaced and began apologizing and yelling at them.

I never went back to that vet, though. I feel they have an obligation to try to make things quieter and to control their clients. (That was not the only noise that day).

In any event, I never once thought about striking one of those kids. That's simply not appropriate.

So, should this guy be sued? Nah, I don't think he was malicious and he probably acted on instinct. Misguided yes, but mom made huge mistakes that day too. The mother should have controlled her kid. When that didn't work she should have taken him outside. Since she didn't and a stranger lost his cool, she should have said, "I'm very sorry for my child's behavior but it is not okay to hit someone else's kid." But, since she wasn't the type to control her child to begin with, of course she is the type to sue a man her child was harassing instead of walking away.

Final thought, I hate hearing how kids "need" a swat or that a lack of corporal punishment is creating monsters. No, it's a lack of parenting that creates monsters. I handled 12 preschoolers when I was a preschool teacher without hitting one and had them under control. How could I do that and a parent can't handle one without having to resort to physical punishment? Hitting is not necessary to get a kid to behave.

Also, go ask all the men in prison today if they were hit. Invariably, 99.9% were spanked, "whupped" or whatever. Inconsistency, apathy, laziness, and a lack of a backbone is what creates spoiled monsters, and neglect and abuse and poverty (and more rarely, spoiling) is what creates criminals, not sparing the rod. JMO.

:goodpost: You said exactly what I was thinking, but a lot more eloquently!
 
Physical discipline of children by their parents and other adults has been standard practice for centuries. It's just in the past 20 or 30 years it's become inappropriate.

Reading some of these comments it would almost seem this man beat this child half to death, rather than what actually happened, a swat on the butt. Ever watched a sports game where players slap each other on the rear? From the story, it doesn't even seem like it was that 'brutal'.

MOO, this is why the prisons are overpopulated, and so many kids are in so much trouble all the time. Very few want to do the hard work (and it is hard work) of raising their children, and too many want to jump up and make excuses for bad behavior and over react to everything else.

A stranger has never had to swat one of my kids for anything, and if they were in the position this man was in, I would be apologizing to this man, not calling police and pressing charges on him. When my children were young, my house was always full of kids, and when these kids were under my care they were made to behave just like my own children were. Funny thing is it never stopped them from coming over (all the time...) and even now, when they are all grown up, I still have contact with most of them and great relationships with them.

As far as the man should have done this, that, or something else, I disagree. The man had a pet, and he was taking care of that pet and not letting it bother others. The mother should have removed the child from the waiting room and sat in the car with him, or rescheduled her appointment for another time when she could get a babysitter.

I wonder if it's true that a large percentage of the criminal population comes from homes where physical discipline was not practiced.


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And why does anyone has a right to grab somebody's pet?
Parents should control their children.

I agree 100% that people don't have a right to grab someone else's pet and that parents should prevent their children from misbehaving in this way. However, the situation does not then grant the right to lay hands on another person. Or does it?


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I wouldn't want a stranger swatting my kid on the hiney, but I wouldn't have let my kid be a bother to other people, either. I've been so bothered by other people's kid's bad behavior that I've WISHED I could swat a hiney or two, but I knew not to act on that impulse! (I've actually had one of my sons thank me for teaching him how to behave in public. We were waiting in the emergency room and this woman was chatting on her cell phone while her toddler ran, jumped, climbed and screamed all over the waiting area and up and down halls.)

If mom can't control a four year old, then that kid shouldn't be running loose in a public place, for his own safety and the safety of others.

Ideally, the employees should have intervened and asked the mom to either control the kid, or wait outside with him. But they didn't, and I guess the cat' "daddy" got so worried that he took matters into his own hands.

It is rather telling to me that the mom had to "insist" that the swatter be arrested.....that tells me that LE was going to just let this go, that they didn't see a huge problem with letting this guy go.
 
I kind of sympathize a bit with the man. He's probably from the old school when people could hit each other's kids and not be committing a crime or an offense one could be sued over. He probably didn't think too hard about it and just reacted.

But I am frankly astounded that so many people think he was justified or that it is okay for a stranger to use physical force on someone else's child. Like many have said, you can't go around slapping adults whose behavior is bad. Why is it okay to hit a random child whose behavior is bad? Children have rights to be free from a stranger assaulting them in the same way adults do.

And someone posted that until 20 or 30 years ago, physical discipline was okay. It's only now that it is becoming bad to hit children. Well physically "disciplining" one's wife was okay for thousands of years as well. Children used to be deemed the personal property of their parents and the parents could do whatever they wanted to with them. Children used to work alongside their parents all day in mines or fields, instead of going to school and that was okay. Just because it is historical does not make it right.

This is not about "coddling" children. There would have been nothing wrong with the man telling the child, "Hey! Do not touch my cat's carrier again. Do you hear me?" And then physically blocking him from getting near or even removing his hands from the cage. But hitting the child? It's simply not right.

I had a similar situation. I went to the vet with my very scared cats and a bunch of kids were running around right outside the door, banging on it and banging on the windows. All the animals inside were scared. I had no clue who the parents were and no one seemed to be stopping them except at one point, a lady who seemed unrelated. I asked the people at the counter to do something. They did not. I then went outside and said firmly, "Do not bang on the windows or doors again. Do you ever get scared at the doctors? Well, this is the doctor's office for the dogs and cats and they are scared. When you make noise, it makes it scarier for them." They stopped for a long time but then after a while, one of them tested me and yelled through the mail slot. The workers did not seem to care and did nothing. I went outside again and said, "Hey. What did I tell you? Stop making noise."

It was at that point that a parent surfaced and began apologizing and yelling at them.

I never went back to that vet, though. I feel they have an obligation to try to make things quieter and to control their clients. (That was not the only noise that day).

In any event, I never once thought about striking one of those kids. That's simply not appropriate.

So, should this guy be sued? Nah, I don't think he was malicious and he probably acted on instinct. Misguided yes, but mom made huge mistakes that day too. The mother should have controlled her kid. When that didn't work she should have taken him outside. Since she didn't and a stranger lost his cool, she should have said, "I'm very sorry for my child's behavior but it is not okay to hit someone else's kid." But, since she wasn't the type to control her child to begin with, of course she is the type to sue a man her child was harassing instead of walking away.

Final thought, I hate hearing how kids "need" a swat or that a lack of corporal punishment is creating monsters. No, it's a lack of parenting that creates monsters. I handled 12 preschoolers when I was a preschool teacher without hitting one and had them under control. How could I do that and a parent can't handle one without having to resort to physical punishment? Hitting is not necessary to get a kid to behave.

Also, go ask all the men in prison today if they were hit. Invariably, 99.9% were spanked, "whupped" or whatever. Inconsistency, apathy, laziness, and a lack of a backbone is what creates spoiled monsters, and neglect and abuse and poverty (and more rarely, spoiling) is what creates criminals, not sparing the rod. JMO.

My point about it being okay to physically punish children 20 to 30 years ago is that the entire population of this country did not just wake up one morning and decide spanking was bad, and it would no longer take place. Get what I'm saying?

However, I do believe too many people decided spanking, swatting, whatever, was bad, yet didn't bother to come up with an alternate method of discipline. Again, if you read the article, it clearly, clearly, clearly states the mother herself said she couldn't control her child. My point is that child was the mother's responsibility, not anyone else's in that vet's office. My opinion on this, and I stand by it, is if you don't want complete strangers disciplining your child in the way they see fit, then do it yourself, it's your kid.

BBM

IMO, this thread going off on this tangent is a lack of reading comprehension. The whole corporal punishment being discussed is over the man swatting the child. I have yet to read a post by the people defending this man stating lack of CORPORAL discipline is what is wrong with kids today.

Children are not born knowing how to behave, they have to be taught, and that's what their parents are supposed to be for.

I just don't understand the thought process that children are entitled to do whatever they want because they are children. A four year old is more than old enough to understand they shouldn't be messing with other people and their pets when they are told to stop, unless their parents have chosen not to teach them that, and it's pretty obvious to me this mother has no interest in teaching her child to behave. I also don't understand why people keep saying it wouldn't be okay if it was an adult so why is it okay since it was a child. I think it would be even more okay to swat at an adult who keeps trying to get at your cat in the waiting room of a vet's office after you have told them to stop.
 
I don't think it is quite right that this guy hit a kid, but I don't blame him. I think the kid deserved it - if only his mother had done it instead. I don't feel sorry for the kid OR the mother. I feel sorry for the guy, even if I don't think he should have done that.

I think its absurd to expect the guy to get up and do this and do that and put the cat behind the counter and etc etc just to avoid one disrespectful BRAT. I would not lay a hand on the kid, but you bet I'd be raising my voice, to him AND his mother.

I don't care if the kid couldn't do real harm to the cat when it is in a carrier. I don't think my pet deserved to be bothered and pestered after having a surgery. I wouldn't let somebody bother my child, I won't let someone bother my poor defenseless cat.
 
BBM

And this is where we disagree. If it's not okay for a stranger to touch the child, it is equally not okay for this child to be going after this man's pet, especially after he was told to stop. This man did not instigate this situation, the child, and by extension his mother, instigated it. You keep saying it would be different if it was an adult, but you are presenting it like you are just minding your own business and an adult swats you one, and that is not what happened here. It DOES matter if a child is being a brat. If this child had been an adult behaving this way, this man probably could have pressed harassment charges, and I doubt he would have gone to jail had he punched an adult for behaving this way.

I agree it isn't about spanking is good and not spanking is bad. It's about a woman, an adult, who is seemingly flapping her hands about helplessly, unable to control her four year old child. If she can't control him at four, what's she going to do when he's 14?

Too many parents want to be friends with their children, they don't want their kids to get mad at them, they don't want their kids to not like them, they don't want to put up with their kids crying or throwing a fit so they give in to these kids, they don't tell them 'no' and mean it, they don't teach them proper behavior, they don't teach them respect. I've seen several children grow up this way, they are selfish and entitled, now that they are adults they constantly get fired from their jobs (and it's never their fault), they can't keep relationships, they don't pay their bills...it's disgraceful. What this woman did with this child was to teach him he is entitled to get his way. Can't wait to see how he turns out...

Very well stated. :goodpost:
 
I don't think it is quite right that this guy hit a kid, but I don't blame him. I think the kid deserved it - if only his mother had done it instead. I don't feel sorry for the kid OR the mother. I feel sorry for the guy, even if I don't think he should have done that.

I think its absurd to expect the guy to get up and do this and do that and put the cat behind the counter and etc etc just to avoid one disrespectful BRAT. I would not lay a hand on the kid, but you bet I'd be raising my voice, to him AND his mother.

I don't care if the kid couldn't do real harm to the cat when it is in a carrier. I don't think my pet deserved to be bothered and pestered after having a surgery. I wouldn't let somebody bother my child, I won't let someone bother my poor defenseless cat.

I have the feeling that if the cat had scratched the kid the mother would still have been howling and putting the blame on the cat instead of being ashamed of herself for not being a "mother".
 
O.K. since Rusty the swatter (his nickname s Rusty) encouraged us all to communicate I figured I should see if he has a FB. Surely he does and I found it.





https://www.facebook.com/russ.baughcum


Note the cat Sasha has several photos that is until Rusty just got engaged and his feeeeants took over the page. She is a Rocket Scientist. Pretty girl.

Rusty himself may have not been feeling so well at the Vet as he was just in hospital and in mucho pain. Kidney stones and sepsis and such. Not in hospital the day of picking up his cat, and I am not excusing his behavior, but he was possibly p*ssed (no pun intended) his cat was ill as well and he may have been in pain himself. Again no excuse, but a reason?

He has to miss Burning Man this year and we all know how miffed we'd be if we had to pass on Burning Man. Rusty is also broke. He was not getting paid for time missed from work. Get a Vet bill? Again no excuse, but them bills are high.

LAST BUT NOT LEAST...........................on April 3 or 5th it was someone posted a photo and Rusty reposted it and I kid you not.......it's a photo of an attractive woman bent over and the caption? Something on the lines of "Spankings are for good girls too". If I was Rusty I'd nix that spanking photo.

Honestly you can not ever make stuff up like this in this here world. Meanwhile some kid got "swatted" by a man with a spanking pic on his FB. A mom is angry and poor Sasha well who knows how she is.

Yet another reason to keep up on your children because someone out there may have kidney stones and a sick cat, O.K.?
 
I guess I'm in the minority, but I feel any child who doesn't understand the words "no" and "stop" by the age of four deserves a swat on the fanny, and I don't care who administers it, especially when the mother is right there apparently doing nothing to get her child under control.

I have raised four children. There are times my kids misbehaved, and I took responsibility for it, because that was my job. It is not the general public's responsibility to put up with other people's children's bratty behavior.

Four year old child vs. four year old child's mother. How is the winner a four year old child, and how are people okay with that?


I'm with you! There is no reason a four year old child cannot be controlled, so if someone is unwilling to discipline their own child they shouldn't be surprised or offended if someone else does.

Would I want some stranger to discipline my child? NO. But I can also say there wouldn't be a need because I would have done it myself.

I can't tell you how many times I have wanted to discipline someone else's child. I get really sick of having my peace disturbed by some kid who's parents are oblivious. The general public should not have to put up with someone's out of control kid. When I was a kid if someone had swatted me for doing something wrong my mom probably would have swatted me again for being so disrespectful that they felt they had to to that. Of course times are different now, maybe we should start calling police when parents wont discipline/control their children and it disturbs our peace, ruins our dinners, movies, etc. (I'm only half kidding, something really does need to be done.)

Its a rare treat these days to get to see a child who is pleasant to be around.
 
On an aside I always recall times when kids were somewhere totally out of control. Then of course with that other parents would let their kids do the same thing so as not to have to parent. Then my daughter would look at me like "Are they kidding me? I know if I get up I'm in for it".

Filly is still reeling from Rusty the swatter not being able to attend Burning Man. He may be in court anyway.
 
Many of the posters in here seem to be annoyed specifically by the fact that the guy who swatted the kid on the butt was not his parent. But is that really a reason to arrest him? I've lost count of the threads on here where a child is battered to death, run under a scalding hot tap, kept in a cage, starved, etc by their own parents. And in many of those cases everybody turned a blind eye for ages as the abuse went on - even social services.

I can't help but think that the legality of a child being hit shouldn't depend on the relationship between the hitter and the child, but the nature of the action. A swat on the butt is not a matter for the police, but bruises and broken bones are even if they're inflicted by the child's parents.
 
Many of the posters in here seem to be annoyed specifically by the fact that the guy who swatted the kid on the butt was not his parent. But is that really a reason to arrest him? I've lost count of the threads on here where a child is battered to death, run under a scalding hot tap, kept in a cage, starved, etc by their own parents. And in many of those cases everybody turned a blind eye for ages as the abuse went on - even social services.

I can't help but think that the legality of a child being hit shouldn't depend on the relationship between the hitter and the child, but the nature of the action. A swat on the butt is not a matter for the police, but bruises and broken bones are even if they're inflicted by the child's parents.

While you have a point, think about it this way. I am an adult woman out in public. Is it acceptable for a stranger to swat me on the behind? Not brush against me or unintentionally bump into me, but intentionally touch me. No it is not. If we required actual harm before police action could be taken, then we should write off peeping toms right now. The point is that this is a stranger touching this child. People keep looking at the issue as one of discipline or spanking or kids run amock these days. To me, if it is unacceptable for one adult to touch another adult in this manner in public, then it sure as heck should be for kids as well.

Frankly, if a strange man swatted me on the butt, you can bet I'd have the cops out to arrest him ASAP, regardless of whether I was hurt or not. It is completely unacceptable to touch a stranger in that way.
 
I wonder if it's true that a large percentage of the criminal population comes from homes where physical discipline was not practiced.


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I wouldn't be surprised by that, especially with permissive parents. I know many bullies come from that background and are prone to crime.
 
I'm with you! There is no reason a four year old child cannot be controlled, so if someone is unwilling to discipline their own child they shouldn't be surprised or offended if someone else does.

Would I want some stranger to discipline my child? NO. But I can also say there wouldn't be a need because I would have done it myself.

I can't tell you how many times I have wanted to discipline someone else's child. I get really sick of having my peace disturbed by some kid who's parents are oblivious. The general public should not have to put up with someone's out of control kid. When I was a kid if someone had swatted me for doing something wrong my mom probably would have swatted me again for being so disrespectful that they felt they had to to that. Of course times are different now, maybe we should start calling police when parents wont discipline/control their children and it disturbs our peace, ruins our dinners, movies, etc. (I'm only half kidding, something really does need to be done.)

Its a rare treat these days to get to see a child who is pleasant to be around.

Sad fact is many parents are not parents. Too many parents want to be friends with their children. It just shows that having children does not make a person mature. Sad fact is they are even more immature than the child.
 
While you have a point, think about it this way. I am an adult woman out in public. Is it acceptable for a stranger to swat me on the behind? Not brush against me or unintentionally bump into me, but intentionally touch me. No it is not. If we required actual harm before police action could be taken, then we should write off peeping toms right now. The point is that this is a stranger touching this child. People keep looking at the issue as one of discipline or spanking or kids run amock these days. To me, if it is unacceptable for one adult to touch another adult in this manner in public, then it sure as heck should be for kids as well.

Frankly, if a strange man swatted me on the butt, you can bet I'd have the cops out to arrest him ASAP, regardless of whether I was hurt or not. It is completely unacceptable to touch a stranger in that way.

I can see what you mean, but this isn't quite the same as a peeping tom/pervy butt toucher. This child wasn't minding his own business when the man reached out and touched him on the behind - that would be a matter for the police! The child was making a nuisance of himself and had been repeatedly told to stop. The mother did nothing. So when the guy got irritated and swatted the child on the butt too lightly to hurt him, I don't think that should be a matter for the police.
 
I can see what you mean, but this isn't quite the same as a peeping tom/pervy butt toucher. This child wasn't minding his own business when the man reached out and touched him on the behind - that would be a matter for the police! The child was making a nuisance of himself and had been repeatedly told to stop. The mother did nothing. So when the guy got irritated and swatted the child on the butt too lightly to hurt him, I don't think that should be a matter for the police.

It doesn't have to be a pervy touch. Say I'm at a bar and I make a smart aleck comment to someone and they swat my behind. Again, they still have no legal right to touch me. This is the law as it is written.
 
I'm not sure it should be when it comes to children running riot in a public place. If their parents don't control them then a swat on the back of the legs from a stranger should be legal.

(I'm feeling grumpy today).
 
HA, the guy wouldn't have had to swat me, if my mom told me once to leave the man's cat alone & I didn't.......OMG, I would have gotten more than a swat from my mom! Yep right there in the vet's office in front of everybody, full blown spanking, that's how my mom rolled! The whole incident would have never taken place because my mom taught me better than that, I would have never dreamed of touching something that belonged to someone else without permission. Hey it worked for my mom & I lived through it so I don't see the problem. Kids have to have a reason not to misbehave & mine was fear of mom lol! Don't get me wrong, my mom was & is a great mom, she simply did not put up with me misbehaving. Heck, she's going to be 77 in July & she can still shut me up with a look!

I have zero tolerance for out of control kids, if you can't control them then leave them home! Would I have smacked the kid on the butt, no.....would I have wanted to YES! I certainly would have told the kid to leave my cat alone & if he didn't listen, then I would have told the mother & if it continued, I would have approached the staff at the vet, but I certainly would not have moved or moved my cat out of the kids reach, it would have been a stand off until that kid got the message!

It will be interesting to see how this pans out, if they get a judge like Judge Judy me thinks the kids mom is in for a tongue lashing!
 

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