NH NH - Maura Murray, 21, Haverhill, 9 Feb 2004 - # 8

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My theory is her father was angrier about the first car accident than he lets on in the interview. This probably aggravated Maura's already fragile emotional state (perhaps depression).

She was not in a good frame of mind, decided to take time off and drive to where she is comfortable (Vermont or the White Mountains). She emails her professor that she had a death in the family and needs to be gone a week, which was untrue.

She drives North, buys some alcohol, and drinks while she drives. It turns night. She is driving along a dark New Hampshire road and is impaired. She hits a very sharp left turn and reacts too slowly, wrecking the car in a snowbank.

This is her second car wreck in days. Now she is shattered. Plus, she is intoxicated. She has no idea what to do. She can't call the authorities because she would be arrested for a DUI. She can't call her father because he is too far away. Moreover, there is no cell service. She stands outside the car trying to make sense of her situation.

The bus driver stops, asks her if she needs help. She declines (because she doesn't want him to see she's been drinking),and says she called AAA and they are on their way. The bus driver suspects this is a lie because there is no cell service.

What happens next is more of a mystery. I suspect she panicked, thinking when the driver got home he would call the police. She didn't want the cops to find her inebriated by her disabled vehicle, so she takes off on foot, even though she has nowhere to go.

She treks into the woods to hide, her head not straight because of her emotional troubles and her intoxication. Only problem is it is a very cold night in New Hampshire and the woods are thick. She either got lost or simply remained in one spot too long and died of exposure. I know that search teams have combed the woods, but we are talking about a huge area of thick woods. In cases past, it's not uncommon for searchers repeatedly to miss a body 10 yards away under such conditions. Afterwards, her remains likely were eaten by animals, further hampering any attempt at location.

Likely, we'll never know for sure what happened to that poor girl. Maybe one day a hiker in the woods will come across some evidence that will put everything in a better perspective.

WRT the phone call...
By that time she would have been exposed to the elements for an entire night, and it's likely she was suffering from hypothermia. She had spent hours wandering deep enough into an area that finally had cell service. When she makes the desperate call, all she gets is his voice mail. In her condition, it's doubtful she could even speak at that point. If that was her message (which unfortunately cannot be proven), I think she died shortly thereafter.

Possible. Although, I don't think she was intoxicated enough to have been driving drunk, but perhaps, she wasn't sure, because she knew she was drinking. I do think she wasn't looking forward in telling her dad that she was in NH and her car was wrecked, especially after wrecking his car a few nights prior. There is no doubt, she was in a dilemma. I do think she walked away from the accident, but how far she ran off is a mystery. I have 3 theories: she succumbed to the elements, accepted a ride from a bad person or she was hit by a vehicle which threw her into the woods. My last theory is probably less likely, but possible. A fast moving vehicle or a truck may have thought they hit an animal or they just plain drove on to avoid responsibility.
 
Wow! I think possibly LE wanted them. As you well know, Topix is very loose, so something is up if the whole forum was pulled. Are you talking about WTF Bill on Topix as the trouble maker? He stuck out to me, because he tends to bash whenever he gets a chance to post. I was reading there a day or so ago, because of the other Topix poster (Beagle), who was allegedly responsible for the disturbing youtube videos. One thing I noticed, Beagle stopped posting after the video was noticed by the Renner followers and the media. WTF Bill was still posting. JMO

I think LE could obtain the entire MM Topix thread without taking all 12,000 posts down and if there were a few objectionable threads request that they be individually deleted. Perhaps it was taken down so that LE couldn't put two and two together about a few posters (not "Beagle") who might have been the same person and who purported to be EMS/formerLE/paralegal? Those same poster(s) (correct McSpy) also wrote that they had been told secondhand about how and where Patric Mc and Louise Chaput's bodies were found by fellow searchers. One certain and distinct typo was made by those posters and I think "mr112dirtbag" (who some believe to be "Beagle") might have noticed that as well as. The YouTube poster "mr112dirtbag" also went on to infer that some of the above Topix posters had the same IP address.

For days posters on Topix Franconia discussed how FM "probably" killed his daughter as some sort of family honor killing and burned her remains in an incinerator at his place of employment in Bridgeport, CT. That sort of nonsense was tolerated and endorsed by forum "moderators". If, however, posters tried to discuss where a perpetrator might have been watching for MM at, say, a Woodsville gas station when she passed by, that conversation got nipped in the bid by the moderator and the "EMS/LE/paralegal" posse.

The same poster who claimed he was told about where bodies were found also stated he could bring down the entire Topix thread if he wanted to at any given time. Now that "mr112dirtbag" is pointing the finger at that poster and his possible aliases the old thread has evaporated.
 
After looking at the new crop of videos uploaded (sperm swimming for an egg -- "1 in 4", a couple more black eye cartoon figures, "bodies of water") and the links and pasted in articles (e.g., for "1 in 4" there's a link to "going to the chapel"), I'm pretty sure that mr112dirtbag is a copy-cat and that 112dirtbag is a different person. The two sets are just so different, both in style and in the poster's MO (112dirtbag removed very quickly, mr112dirtbag seems to be accelerating his posts, for example). In the second set, it's strongly implied that the poster has some information that MM was heading up to meet someone, perhaps was promiscuous, had been in some sort of altercation... whereas in the first, the poster implies some involvement.
 
After looking at the new crop of videos uploaded (sperm swimming for an egg -- "1 in 4", a couple more black eye cartoon figures, "bodies of water") and the links and pasted in articles (e.g., for "1 in 4" there's a link to "going to the chapel"), I'm pretty sure that mr112dirtbag is a copy-cat and that 112dirtbag is a different person. The two sets are just so different, both in style and in the poster's MO (112dirtbag removed very quickly, mr112dirtbag seems to be accelerating his posts, for example). In the second set, it's strongly implied that the poster has some information that MM was heading up to meet someone, perhaps was promiscuous, had been in some sort of altercation... whereas in the first, the poster implies some involvement.

"Beagle" was always coming up with bizarre theories about the disappearance, including the abduction for the purposes of harvesting body parts including reproductive organs. I would have agreed with you about the copy cat theory except there are new videos up and the person looks the same as the one in the "anniversary" video. To me, the YouTube channel is just a continuation of his "creative" posts on Topix.

IMO, the only interesting he's said on YouTube is that he feels that LE and PIs in both the MM and PMc are letting old personal vendettas stand in the way of finding the truth and that some of those people are taking their personal fight to the pages of Topix Franconia.
 
Again I think we have to go back to what little evidence we have. The search dogs tracked her scent down the road, not into the woods. The school bus driver initially reported she was shaken up yet didn't seem intoxicated. If she was running and working up a bit of a sweat, presumably the SAR dogs would have been able to keep tracking her scent. It was around zero that night (unseasonably warm) yet with a fair amount of crusty snow around. I just think what little clues exist point to her being picked up by a car. Since nobody has come forward, I am inclined to believe it ended in foul play.

Also, they did search my air a few days later (no sure exactly when) but IIRC it had not snowed since she went missing, so should have seen tracks in snow or disturbance in snow from the air.

Really wish James in his book research would have checked into if her emergency car kit had a flashlight, and if it did, was missing since that would tell me she might have taken it to run at night - that's so important as it would greatly increase where she might have wound up.

Also, if James could have found out if she ever liked to run on roads versus mostly/only on a track, and if she ran at night on roads.
(I believe she did run marathons, but those are during the day and I imagine over decent or cleaned roads.)

Also, no one has ever tried to reenact running from where her car crashed on a similar night.

Also, would be interesting if James got her model Saturn and trying reenacting her route with the car running on 3-cylinders.... what kind of smoke would it make, gas mileage, get stopped by LE, etc., etc.... Better yet, have a young woman make the drive and listen in to CB radio traffic - would truckers call attention to a young lady driving a crippled car?
 
Also, they did search my air a few days later (no sure exactly when) but IIRC it had not snowed since she went missing, so should have seen tracks in snow or disturbance in snow from the air.

Really wish James in his book research would have checked into if her emergency car kit had a flashlight, and if it did, was missing since that would tell me she might have taken it to run at night - that's so important as it would greatly increase where she might have wound up.

Also, if James could have found out if she ever liked to run on roads versus mostly/only on a track, and if she ran at night on roads.
(I believe she did run marathons, but those are during the day and I imagine over decent or cleaned roads.)

Also, no one has ever tried to reenact running from where her car crashed on a similar night.

Also, would be interesting if James got her model Saturn and trying reenacting her route with the car running on 3-cylinders.... what kind of smoke would it make, gas mileage, get stopped by LE, etc., etc.... Better yet, have a young woman make the drive and listen in to CB radio traffic - would truckers call attention to a young lady driving a crippled car?

BBM

IIRC, one of Maura's sisters walked the same road at night to get a feel of what it was like for Maura. I don't know how far she walked, but IIRC, she did mention how dark and scary a run down that road would have been for Maura.
I'll see if I can find a link on this.
 
oldsteve, this site has many of the old news articles in one place. The article which mentions Maura's sister's walk down the dark road was from this article:

MAURA IS MISSING PART III: The Search*
Special Reports - Maura Murray is Missing*
Written by Maribeth Conway*
Wed, Jul 04, 2007 01:00*


"I wanted to see it as Maura had seen it -- after dark. I got out of the truck and walked up and down the road, looking at different angles and perspectives. There was a constant thought in my mind as I did this -- if I was Maura what would I have been thinking," Julie said in a recent email.*

"It was very cold, dark and quiet; I felt stunned. I will never forget that eerie feeling," she wrote.*


http://s10.invisionfree.com/usedtobedoe/ar/t13207.htm
 
Also, they did search my air a few days later (no sure exactly when) but IIRC it had not snowed since she went missing, so should have seen tracks in snow or disturbance in snow from the air.

Really wish James in his book research would have checked into if her emergency car kit had a flashlight, and if it did, was missing since that would tell me she might have taken it to run at night - that's so important as it would greatly increase where she might have wound up.

Also, if James could have found out if she ever liked to run on roads versus mostly/only on a track, and if she ran at night on roads.
(I believe she did run marathons, but those are during the day and I imagine over decent or cleaned roads.)

Also, no one has ever tried to reenact running from where her car crashed on a similar night.

Also, would be interesting if James got her model Saturn and trying reenacting her route with the car running on 3-cylinders.... what kind of smoke would it make, gas mileage, get stopped by LE, etc., etc.... Better yet, have a young woman make the drive and listen in to CB radio traffic - would truckers call attention to a young lady driving a crippled car?

BBM

Not all cars running on 3-cylinders have smokey exhaust. It depends on the underlying cause of the bad cylinder. If it was completely dead, then it was probably not smokey. If it had oil fouling up the spark plugs as a cause (no spark for firing up) then it would be smokey. All in all, smoke in the exhaust depends on the cause. If she had very smokey exhaust, maybe people would have noticed her when she stopped at the ATM, liquor store and gas station. I tend to look when I see it, because I hate air pollution.
 
Do you know why he was questioned by the PI and LE in the first place? He must have got their attention in some way.

Here's a link to what he wrote regarding being questioned by a PI (post #3):

http://www.topix.com/forum/city/bismarck-nd/T80T2I276VIP6AIU0

He was interviewed by the PI working for the Murray family in May, 2011 (I always thought it was much earlier). I can only assume that he was questioned because of his bizarre posts about the "kidnapped for body parts theory" that he started on Amherst, MA Topix in 2009.

http://www.topix.com/forum/city/amherst-ma/TDI8GHE3636JOUPSP
 
Thanks McSpy. If anyone wants to get a clear picture of the Maura Murray story, the best place to start would be the Maribeth Conway articles:

http://www.whitmanhansonexpress.com//extras/special-reports.html

She had access to family and witnesses, something that Mr. Renner, for the most part, has been denied thus far. Her reporting also garnered her a New England award for journalism.
 
I have another thought about the Saturn. I have a feeling it had a smokey exhaust and that is why the rag was in the tailpipe. Perhaps, Maura stuck it up there with a stick to block the volume of smoke and fortunately for her, there was enough space around the rag for some of the exhaust to escape. Otherwise, the force of the exhaust would have blown the rag out, or the car would have stalled from the blockage. She could have been embarrassed about the smoke and didn't like the attention of people and their mumbling, "why doesn't she get that thing fixed?!" Not to mention, the attention of the police.
 
Back to running on 3 cylinders - would think if it wasn't firing, then then unexploded (in the cylinder) gas/air mix would wind up causing lots of backfiring in the red hot exhaust pipes.

Also, remembering back to my CB radio days, truck drivers liked to yack about just about everything and anything they saw - especially if a young woman is involved... if she was thus talked about - no telling who might overheard.

Thanks Unscripted and McSpy for links to article about MM's sister checking out the place at night.

Still no info about a flashlight, or what it would be to really try an make a run on it on a similar Feb. night with and/or without a flashlight...

Wonder how many cars would have passed by... would not be easy to duck them, especially if running and looking out for those coming up from behind you - makes running all the more difficult while trying to avoid any road hazards.

ETA: In the picture at http://www.whitmanhansonexpress.com//extras/special-reports.html - it's like she's answering my question about running! Look at that, running on that surface! Got to have strong ankles... wow!

How far was the highway from her accident. Why run towards the woods, go back to the highway and catch a ride there...
 
Again I think we have to go back to what little evidence we have. The search dogs tracked her scent down the road, not into the woods. The school bus driver initially reported she was shaken up yet didn't seem intoxicated. If she was running and working up a bit of a sweat, presumably the SAR dogs would have been able to keep tracking her scent. It was around zero that night (unseasonably warm) yet with a fair amount of crusty snow around. I just think what little clues exist point to her being picked up by a car. Since nobody has come forward, I am inclined to believe it ended in foul play.
The bus driver who briefly spoke with her could not possibly identify this woman's toxicology. This is combined with the fact that MM would be attempting to appear sober. (Also, I'm not saying she was completely wasted.) I believe police found evidence at the scene that led to the conclusion that alcohol had been consumed.

We don't know if she was running down the road. IIRC, that witness was from 5 miles away only about 30 minutes after the bus driver's encounter. We cannot be certain that who the witness saw that night was MM.

I haven't completely ruled out foul play, but the combination of circumstances for that to occur on a sparse New Hampshire road at the same time an unpredictable accident took place would be much more than a tragic coincidence.
 
Back to running on 3 cylinders - would think if it wasn't firing, then then unexploded (in the cylinder) gas/air mix would wind up causing lots of backfiring in the red hot exhaust pipes.

Also, remembering back to my CB radio days, truck drivers liked to yack about just about everything and anything they saw - especially if a young woman is involved... if she was thus talked about - no telling who might overheard.

Thanks Unscripted and McSpy for links to article about MM's sister checking out the place at night.

Still no info about a flashlight, or what it would be to really try an make a run on it on a similar Feb. night with and/or without a flashlight...

Wonder how many cars would have passed by... would not be easy to duck them, especially if running and looking out for those coming up from behind you - makes running all the more difficult while trying to avoid any road hazards.

ETA: In the picture at http://www.whitmanhansonexpress.com//extras/special-reports.html - it's like she's answering my question about running! Look at that, running on that surface! Got to have strong ankles... wow!

How far was the highway from her accident. Why run towards the woods, go back to the highway and catch a ride there...


BBM

Maybe she thought that would be the direction the police would be coming from.
 
Here's a link to what he wrote regarding being questioned by a PI (post #3):

http://www.topix.com/forum/city/bismarck-nd/T80T2I276VIP6AIU0

He was interviewed by the PI working for the Murray family in May, 2011 (I always thought it was much earlier). I can only assume that he was questioned because of his bizarre posts about the "kidnapped for body parts theory" that he started on Amherst, MA Topix in 2009.

http://www.topix.com/forum/city/amherst-ma/TDI8GHE3636JOUPSP

It looks like the PI was being thorough. Beagle's theories were so over the top that he got people's attention. Interestingly, he seemed to be quite articulate too. The fact that he lived in the Amherst area may have raised eyebrows as well. Most people had theories that tried to fit the known facts, his theories were from outer space. I can see why the PI checked him out.
 
The bus driver who briefly spoke with her could not possibly identify this woman's toxicology. This is combined with the fact that MM would be attempting to appear sober. (Also, I'm not saying she was completely wasted.) I believe police found evidence at the scene that led to the conclusion that alcohol had been consumed.

We don't know if she was running down the road. IIRC, that witness was from 5 miles away only about 30 minutes after the bus driver's encounter. We cannot be certain that who the witness saw that night was MM.

I haven't completely ruled out foul play, but the combination of circumstances for that to occur on a sparse New Hampshire road at the same time an unpredictable accident took place would be much more than a tragic coincidence.

Even if she wasn't officially over the alcohol limit, she could have got in trouble for the open container. A soda bottle with wine in it was found close to her car on the ground. I think near the driver's side door. There was also wine splattered in the interior of the car.
 
The bus driver who briefly spoke with her could not possibly identify this woman's toxicology. This is combined with the fact that MM would be attempting to appear sober. (Also, I'm not saying she was completely wasted.) I believe police found evidence at the scene that led to the conclusion that alcohol had been consumed.

We don't know if she was running down the road. IIRC, that witness was from 5 miles away only about 30 minutes after the bus driver's encounter. We cannot be certain that who the witness saw that night was MM.

I haven't completely ruled out foul play, but the combination of circumstances for that to occur on a sparse New Hampshire road at the same time an unpredictable accident took place would be much more than a tragic coincidence.



BBM

Supposedly, LE told the Judge (FM's lawsuit against LE for Maura's case files) that they had 75% of the evidence needed to convict someone. Also, according to Renner's blog, there were Grand Jury subpoenas at one time in this case. To me, this info suggests foul play. However, LE could be wrong on the suspect, or even going in the wrong direction in the cause of her disappearance. Hard to know what is going on or exactly where they are at in this investigation.
 
The one thing that stays with me is this account by a weel-known local resident, RO, who saw and subsequently reported to police the sighting of the suspicious red truck half an hour before Maura vanished.

Here is what she wrote on another forum 5 years ago:

"I wish I could give an exact description of the truck but I can not. I was walking that night about 7 p.m to the local store (SSS). As I was walking up the hill (Route 112), a truck passed me and slowed down. When it got to the middle of the hill it stopped in the road. I immediately looked at the plate and noticed it was from Massachusetts. There is only 1 street light there and I could not tell how many people were in the vehicle. As I got closer to the truck it took off up the hill. When I rounded the corner to the store, I could see the truck in the driveway of the store. As I walked into the parking lot, which is well lit, the truck took off toward the crash site, (of course at that time I did not know there was a crash).

"As for the red truck, it slowed, then stopped and waited for me to get closer, then took off up the hill. He did not leave the store parking lot in any sort of hurry.

"When I entered the store I asked if she (WM) saw the people in that truck and she said no, no one had come in. I told her about them stopping in the hill. Then we just forgot about it. I stood in the store a while and was there when the police and ambulance went by. I never saw that truck again. The only way I can describe it is that it looked like someone who delivered wood. That was my first thought about it........red, MA plates and delivered wood. Either having a wood body or even just slats in the body. It was not a king cab or extra cab. Just a regular truck. That is all I can tell you.

"I was in the Swiftwater store for 1/2 hour - 45 minutes. It was about 20-30 minutes after I was there that the police went by. I am not at all Maura's size and in fact I was bundled up that night. I believe I caught the truck off guard as I was walking well off the road and as they passed I walked back on, which is why I believe they stopped completely. They could not see me without any street lights and maybe went to the store and waited for me to get up there to get a better look??? I don't know. That is just how it seemed to me.

"The truck didn't scare me. My thought is that they/he/she thought I was someone else. That is what I was thinking that night. When I saw them sitting at the store, I again thought, they really think I am someone else. And as I got closer and I could see the driver moving around - I was thinking, there, I am not the person you are looking for, and he drove off. I wish to God I could remember what I was wearing that night, but I can't.

"Someone asked about the truck and whether it was 4 wheel drive. I believe it was. I have been looking at trucks and have determined that it was definitely a four wheel drive or at least it was a 3/4 ton pick up, because it sat up high. The other thing I remember is that the window in the back was hard to see in....it wasn't very large.....which tells me it was an older truck maybe???"
 
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