Trial Thread 4/12/2012

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Where is the proof that the seat was removed in March? :waitasec:

Because Derstine said so?

If he wasn't "dating" TLM, why is her DNA mixed with his sperm on his front passenger car seat? Why did he have pictures of her in a motel room wearing his t-shirt on his SD card? Why is there video of them attending a movie?

MOO


no Kamille not because Dirk said so...because I believe there is a written statement from this witness from that time frame (which he reminded him of and the witness agreed)..... I have stated my thoughts and the way I read the statements today and now I will move on so this will be my last post on that seat)... respectfully yours......:moo: I also would like to add that I want the person or persons responsible for TS death to be dealt with according to the law but I also don't want someone convicted on the words of a known and proven liar....how sad would that be....as I have previously stated, there is no doubt in my mind that MR played some role in this but to what extent has yet to be proven...the fact that he was there should be enough to put him away for a number of years but lets make sure that the label on him is the correct one....accessory yes...murderer (no as per TLM)...sexual interference with TS...not proven and can't be....no evidence as per the pro's...that is why I am keeping an open mind on those other charges... his lifestyle is no concern of mine nor how many women he dated at one time etc....:moo:
 
does not the above stated by the witness that MR removed the seat March 29th....please someone correct me if I am reading this incorrectly....thus the reason I said there was no back seat at the time of the murder....:banghead::banghead::banghead:
I will have to go back in the threads to find the tweets but I believe Griswold is testifying to witnessing two separate incidents with the car seat. The first in March where the seat was removed with the inference being to install speakers thereafter the seat was put back in the car and the second incidence April 15 when the seat was put on the curb for trash collection. The latter was viewed by two different neigbours who both also testified that there was a large piece of furniture on top of the car seat on April 15th. They therefore could not see if the seat had chunks missing. JMO

At least this was my understanding. Hopefully someone will jump in if I'm wrong. I'll go looking for those tweets.
 
so the seat was removed the end of March and then thrown out with the general pickup in the area mid April...scratch another from TLM statement about cutting out parts of a back seat and thus the reason TS had to sit on the floor...wonder when we will find out the "car wash" was a figment of her imagination...I still believe he was there at the scene but his role is what I am having difficulty in trying to figure out... I also don't think he was "dating" TLM..more likely using her to obtain drugs... as they say..."hell has no fury"...:moo:

JMO......I don't think the defense has ever intimated the MR wasn't in the car.

Their theory is that TLM lied about why VS was there, and she had her own plot brewing. The plot didn't work out and the police had become involved by then. TLM decided to murder VS to hide her involvement.

MR panicked when he returned to the car, didn't call LE, and tried to hide the evidence of the crime.

TLM claimed MR told her.......to help clean up because she was involved in it as much as he was. When TLM first made that statement........she accused MR of killing VS. Now that we know it was TLM who killed VS, it is more likely that TLM said that to MR.......IMO

IMO.......The Crown counted heavily on the testimony of TLM, but her changes in testimony and the background uncovered by the defense.........devastated her credibility.
 
I think it was a tweeting error, desrstine suggested that he took the back seat out in march to add speakers, the witness did not say he did, i'll try or someone try to find the info of his testimony exactly

I think so too, and feeling like an idiot after searching the internet for what other body fluids sperm is found in. :doh:
 
I found this: If you're asking if we can get a DNA profile from semen that contains no sperm, then the answer is no. Sperm is the only component of semen that contains DNA. I guess it is possible that someone might shed a few skin cells into the semen, but it would be pretty unlikely.
Here: Sperm fraction? - Straight Dope Message Board


I'm not finding much else, but I'm still looking.

Salem

What about guys that have been fixed? The old expression shooting blanks comes to mind lol. The car had a previous owner - is it possible he too used it as a love shack? I can't check right now, but if somebody wants to look into that.

Keeping in mind that the expert noted that it is possible for DNA to e deposited in layers.

The thought of the inside of that car makes me ill. Yech!
 
so the seat was removed the end of March and then thrown out with the general pickup in the area mid April...scratch another from TLM statement about cutting out parts of a back seat and thus the reason TS had to sit on the floor...wonder when we will find out the "car wash" was a figment of her imagination...I still believe he was there at the scene but his role is what I am having difficulty in trying to figure out... I also don't think he was "dating" TLM..more likely using her to obtain drugs... as they say..."hell has no fury"...:moo:

Actually this is taken out of context. He is saying when he saw the seat on March 29th there were no chunks out of it. NOT when it was seen in the trash pile.

HTH,

Salem
 
Good lord, more girlfriends? Didn't he just move back to Woodstock at the beginning of the year? Is this number 6 or 7 within a 4 month period? :waitasec:

MOO

I want to say eight and nine according to my list. :floorlaugh:
 
I think it was a tweeting error, desrstine suggested that he took the back seat out in march to add speakers, the witness did not say he did, i'll try or someone try to find the info of his testimony exactly

LFP tweet is different from AM980 tweet posted by matou.:twocents:
 
I believe it has been said by various witnesses this far there were blankets in the back seat, I wonder if these blankets were ever found, or have ever been tested for DNA. MTR could have had a blanket laid out over the back seat during the rape and therefore not leaving much DNA evidence on the actual seat. Just a thought, nothing to back that up.

In the evidence picture of the back seat of MTR's car, there was some sort of brightly coloured material that appeared to be a blanket with a Navaho print. It looked so similar to me, as the bedspread that TLM was laying on in that picture of her in the motel, that I tried to compare them, but the patterns did not seem to match up and the blanket/material? in the back seat of MTR's car appeared to be bolder colours. This material was in the evidence photo and when I saw it, I wondered too, if it had been tested for DNA evidence. MOO
 
I want to say eight and nine according to my list. :floorlaugh:

On the subject of dating, it appears that MR had no problem attracting the ladies ... Just couldn't seem to keep them interested for long. Not surprising that he was seeing several ... With POF and his being new in the area there was a fresh supply of fishettes who would like to meet him. I would think the problem is more one of their realizing that he has no steady job, no assets, a crappy car and gets attached too quickly. Gals in their twenties are lookin for a gy with more going for him, so they bail.

I think that within that age group, the idea of exclusivity while first dating has Gone With the Wind.
JMO
 
Thank goodness jurors will have verbatim transcripts for their deliberations. IMO
 
One by one by one.......pieces of evidence that people believed would be presented to prove the Crown case..........have been dropping away.

I wish the Crown had a stronger case, because it may force MR to testify in his own behalf. If the defense believe the Crown case hasn't reached the threshold of proving guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.......we won't be hearing from MR on the stand.

JMO.........
 
What about guys that have been fixed? The old expression shooting blanks comes to mind lol. The car had a previous owner - is it possible he too used it as a love shack? I can't check right now, but if somebody wants to look into that.

Keeping in mind that the expert noted that it is possible for DNA to e deposited in layers.

The thought of the inside of that car makes me ill. Yech!

BBM

Has that been established? I must have missed it because I was curious about that.

MOO
 
On the subject of dating, it appears that MR had no problem attracting the ladies ... Just couldn't seem to keep them interested for long. Not surprising that he was seeing several ... With POF and his being new in the area there was a fresh supply of fishettes who would like to meet him. I would think the problem is more one of their realizing that he has no steady job, no assets, a crappy car and gets attached too quickly. Gals in their twenties are lookin for a gy with more going for him, so they bail.

I think that within that age group, the idea of exclusivity while first dating has Gone With the Wind.
JMO

The ladies don't seem to go for the guys that still live with Mommie!!! I know from the past with my own kids, if a guy was living in the basement or even in the main part of the house, it was bye bye, especially when the ladies were working and independent and paying their own way and had their own apartments. Just MOO
 
Did the defence not suggest his client helped to clean up the murder scene for TLM, why would it be so hard to believe he cleaned up his car too? Not understanding..oh...because he was accused of rape in the car.....JMO
 
@AM980_Court
Griswold says he noticed Rafferty remove the seat and put it in his shed March 29th, 09. He is read his synopsis, now remembers.
@AM980_Court
Derstine asks if chunks were cut out of the seat. Griswold says no. Just one cut. No more questions.


Griswold had forgotten his complete original testimony from 2009 and he is given a copy of his original statement to police to refresh his memory. Once he reviews it, he remembers there were two separate incidences he viewed with Rafferty's car seat: one in March, one in April. The tweet above (posted by matou in this thread) refers to the March incident Griswold witnessed with MTR's car seat. And yes, it was Derestine himself who inserted the suggestion that MTR removed the seat in March to install speakers. I'm guessing MTR gave his lawyer this info.

I believe defence is once again trying to reduce the witnesses credibility and confuse the jury and he's doing a good job of confusing everyone. JMO
 
Its' too bad that seat wasn't found

WHAT?!! I cannot believe the seat wasn't found in the landfill. I would think if the company who hauled away MR's car seat was a special pick up of large items, they would know the destiny/area of where that seat ended up. Is it possible MR got nervous with it sitting on the curb too long he transported it himself to an unknown location? That won't surprise me at all. It would go to show why LE were not able to locate it in the landfill. :moo:
 
BBM

Has that been established? I must have missed it because I was curious about that.

MOO

Now that I don't know for sure ... The car is "older" ... I would think that he bought it used for next to nothing with the intention of fixing it up himself. I wonder if it will come up at trial about previous owners?

Jmo
 
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