Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 - #11

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I don't think anyone knows if the children had a sleepover on the Thursday night, can't seem to find any info on it. As for DV victim, I personally think a lot of victims don't tell everything to their family or friends and try to cover it up

Yes, minni, you are correct in regard to DV victims hiding the truth of their situation from family and friends. Having worked with many DV victims in the past, I have witnessed differing levels of fear, shame or denial that can prevent a victim from disclosing the DV to others.

Your post made me think about the "unspecified observations" that police made when ABC was reported missing, on the morning they attended ABC's/GBC's house. Some posters on here have raised some thought-provoking ideas relating to what the "unspecified observations" may have been (e.g. vehicle bonnet still being warm). If DV was a concern, very obvious signs would be things like holes in the walls, broken crockery, a bruised and bleeding victim etc. However, more subtle signs would include things like rearranged furniture (noted by indents in the carpet), a clean patch of carpet (from a possibly soiled rug being removed), or hooks on the wall, minus hanging pictures (possible knocked off in a dispute, or used as a weapon/material for defence). MOO.

EDIT: I just wanted to clarify that the above paragraph is concerning physical DV. If ABC was the victim of psychological DV, it would be very difficult to determine this, unless she disclosed it to a close friend or family member.
 
Interesting show on CI channel watching now. Happy for eighteen years, too good to be true early on. Wife having an affair......

I pressed record earlier and just started watching it right now...husband a strange one, thats for certain...creepy
 
Two things that have always puzzled me.
1. There is no way a female would go for a walk at 10pm even in Brookfield.
2. If she was going for a "walk" at 10pm why was she not wearing warmer clothes? It was cold at night even then.
She has left the house but not for a "walk".

April 30, 2012

It was previously reported Mr Baden-Clay last saw his wife leave their rural Brookfield home, in Brisbane's west, to go for a walk late on April 19.

But police confirmed today Mr Baden-Clay has maintained he last saw his wife watching television at their home about 10pm that Thursday night


He has told police he woke the next morning to find her missing and raised the alarm about 7.30am

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...rs-11th-day-20120430-1xtka.html#ixzz1vYjDHSSY
 
I pressed record earlier and just started watching it right now...husband a strange one, thats for certain...creepy

they are saying they decided to eventually arrest him on circumstantial evidence, I wonder the outcome will be?
 
With regards to the ACA report last night - to be honest you really couldnt get more "national" exposure than that. So why has TM been exposed on national tv? Could we be looking at another mistress with anger issues and this is just a ploy to anger her more the fact that TM has the limelight and not her? The marks on GBC his chest face and arms these IMO are made by a female defending herself or attacking him? Are we dealing with a crazed woman who was forced to terminate a pregnancy? If there is another woman than this will surely tip her over the edge to see TM as "the other woman" in GBC life ......

OR - the other reason for national is for "character" witnesses to come forward regarding TM as she used to live in NSW so perhaps this was the only way to reach her "home town" mmmmm

Well thats two theories of mine for today - make of it as you will "sleuths" :)
 
well said, I also fully believe this to be premediatated. I was of the belief initially that it was perhaps a garden variety husband & wife argument gone horribly wrong but the more I think about it and look at it I don't think as much.
Besides I think ABC with her fitness and ballet and dancing and energy would have easily fought this pussy off quite nicely, i really do! or at least enough to get away from him.
Therefore I don't think she stood a chance nor saw it coming...
and to that end, there were probably a few motives at play here.

Does it normally take this long for toxology reports? Perhaps it was premeditated and the police are holding back these results for a reason?
 
Wakeskate, based on what you are saying, would the entry point be Wirrabara Road then? Do you know if there are many houses on that road?

That would be my guess. You can see a track leading up from the end of that road. That gate appears to be locked, but street view looks like you could drive around it.
There appears to be a few houses on the road, but they aren't much further from Mt Crosby road than Wirrabara road, so someone creeping up there with headlights dimmed could easily be missed. IMO.
Police also had Bunya Street (entrance?) taped off. Again I have never been up there but it's also another point of entry.

Personally I thought they were all peoples properties up there (didn't realise it was a state forest), so if it were me I wouldn't even consider stopping there, which points to someone who knew the area and had been there.
I do know if you continue way out the end of Mt Crosby Road and turn right heading up to Lake Manchester you can get into some really remote areas without having to go through any populated areas. I would guess that would be the destination of someone who didn't know the area as well. (but then I know that area as I have been out to Lake Manchester before)
 
What amazed me was that there must have been at least 6 police cars arrive at the GBC house the morning she went missing.
This could have been discussed previously, so forgive me, but had there been a reason for them to pounce so heavily? Had Allison gone to police about something in the days leading up to her murder?

With all the action that was taken that day....I really do think that there was something suspicious about GBC or something Suspicious at the house.

I must admit though.....I did find it very strange that I heard about this on the news in NSW......Which generally does not happen if something suspicious is not suspected...If it were a simple missing person only the state media pick it up at first but NSW heard about it virtually the same time as QLD??
 
Does it normally take this long for toxology reports? Perhaps it was premeditated and the police are holding back these results for a reason?

it can take months, we waited 3-4 months for a family member's results recently because it turned out to be a rare strain disease.
still, I think the police have them by now. this wasnt a rare strain disease was it!!
just havent made it public yet...
 
Interesting show on CI channel watching now. Happy for eighteen years, too good to be true early on. Wife having an affair......

Maxymoo, I wonder whether the professor took care of his daughter in the time he was their number one suspect before he was arrested, did you happen to hear that part?

and, again with the computer searches revealing what the suspect was up to 'how to murder someone and not get caught' indeed!
 
With regards to the ACA report last night - to be honest you really couldnt get more "national" exposure than that. So why has TM been exposed on national tv? Could we be looking at another mistress with anger issues and this is just a ploy to anger her more the fact that TM has the limelight and not her? The marks on GBC his chest face and arms these IMO are made by a female defending herself or attacking him? Are we dealing with a crazed woman who was forced to terminate a pregnancy? If there is another woman than this will surely tip her over the edge to see TM as "the other woman" in GBC life ......

Most of what you have said is what my thoughts have been with little tid bits in the media to lure the person responsible out ..watched A current affair and they mentioned the TM affair and money /business problems ..what will the next release be...
 
Could someone tell me what time the children actually went for their sleepover - and who took them. Was it ABC or GBC? --- Maybe if it was GBC or if the person came and picked them up from their home - it may have been GBC who took them down to the car for them to go away for the night and they did not see ABC at the time.... What I am getting at is if one of the children had a row with their mother and she was pushed and fell and died instantly. This could be the plausable reason of his 'looking guilty' all the time. He could be covering it up with some of the family - to protect his daughter. Just another idea thrown out and is bound to get shot down in flames... but it is feasible - he is covering for someone close to him.

IMO - I do not think she was a domestic violence victim either - I simply cannot see her parents and friends sitting back and allowing it to happen myself... for goodness sake what sort of parents and friends are they if they do - the Dickies do not come across to me as if they would turn a cheek whilst knowing their daughter is being mistreated in this way. the marriage was not a good one and may have been on the rocks - and he certainly had affairs - but that does not make him a killer.

ABC had a hair appointment that night so im guessing the kids were already at "the sleepover", you wouldn't normally take kids for a sleepover after the late Thursday night hairdressing appointment....

IMO that sort of puts cold water on the kid doing it...
 
it can take months, we waited 3-4 months for a family member's results recently because it turned out to be a rare strain disease.
still, I think the police have them by now. this wasnt a rare strain disease was it!!
just havent made it public yet...


Yep, I also think that the police have most of the post-mortem/toxicology details. Not releasing this information to the public could possibly be part of their strategy in placing added pressure on ABC's killer/s?

I'm not well-versed on stuff relating to criminal investigations, convictions, court cases etc., but I was under the assumption that, if the police did have information relating to the cause of death, they would not release this to the public or, especially, to POIs/suspects, as this would provide the POIs/suspects with an opportunity to form an argument against why/how they were not involved in the victim's death. I might have to read up on this now, because I really have no idea.

MOO.
 
ABC had a hair appointment that night so im guessing the kids were already at "the sleepover", you wouldn't normally take kids for a sleepover after the late Thursday night hairdressing appointment....

IMO that sort of puts cold water on the kid doing it...

Thanks Greg - was it a night time app. at the hairdresser or an arvie one? I thought it was an arvie one?
 
OK although I agree the GBC guilty theory seems the most obvious outcome, I have some alternate ideas about some of the assumptions people are making:

Firstly as far as I gather the daughters were at home on the night - I think the sleepover at Senior BCs on Thurs night is a furphy stemming from a misunderstanding / misinterpretation of ABCs friends comments which I take to refer to a planned sleepover on the Friday night (if that makes sense!?).

So (for an alternate theory) on the night, daughters at home in bed. Mum and Dad working hard to patch things up, but break into an argument about something (previous affair, finances, maybe even feuding in-laws?). GBC storms off to his (possibly separate) bed leaving ABC fuming on the couch watching the Footy Show.

ABC then contacts a 3rd party and gets in the car late to meet them - possibly to confront a GBC lover, maybe she had a lover herself, maybe there is some other connection eg bad finance dealings.

This 3rd party commits accidental or intentional murder for unkown reason and covers it up, later in the night sneaking ABCs car back into the carport.

This explains Police frantic search initially for a missing person, and their interest in car movements through the wee hours.

GBC wakes up feeling remorseful about the argument, can't find ABC, rings and texts the obvious friends/family and for some reason starts to think the worst, maybe even having good reason to suspect a 3rd party and/or foul play. He's got the girls, so he can't leave the house and so he calls the police

The Police search begins and we know the rest. To possibly explain other events:

Lacking other leads, Police have focused on eliminating GBC by forensic checks on home, car, computer - they need to do this given he is the obvious/easy one for the tabloids and angry mobs to focus on and unless he is completely eliminated he could provide a potentially convenient way for the real murderer to shed reasonable doubt at a future trial.

GBC not joining the search / manning the command post - Police would not allow him to search for above reason, polluting the crime scene. And he wanted to be with his daughters and keep them away from the command post in case of a grisly find.

His unusual behaviour and lawyering up - I read nothing into this, who knows what was going through his mind or what is a normal reaction in this situation (guilty or not)! As a real estate agent though he would have had regular dealings with lawyers and is reasonable he would turn to them for advice early on. But a smart lawyer would soon realise this could blow out of proportion and recommend an expert criminal barrister be brought in when ABCs body turned up, given the husband is generally the first and most obvious suspect in these cases (as evidence by the overwhelming voice of opinion on this site).

The car crash - was he being persued by a tabloid journo or photographer and tried to evade them? Again given all the speculation about guilt it is no surprise the police later impounded the car to test. These actions are as much about methodically ruling out all theories, as proving guilt.

Who is the 3rd party, the suspect in this theory? At this stage I have no real ideas on this but comments by Police may indicate GBC has a good idea but the Police are having trouble putting evidence together? Or maybe GBC is not saying as he's worried about future reprisals eg daughters meeting foul play?

The triad/bikie thing seems far fetched but not impossible!
 
Just a passing thought... what if the kids were meant to be home that night {no sleepover planned}... and while they are still there something happens to Allison {they didn't need to have seen it from a different room} ... so he hurriedly organizes a sleepover so they are not at home because he has things to deal with? As I said... just a thought. Albeit a dumb one. haha
 
If any of you wants to learn more about sociopaths, we had the most awesome radio show about them! My jaw was on the ground the whole time! Our guest is the author of this website: http://www.lovefraud.com/

Here's a link to the radio show. Don't laugh when you hear me talking, I was still nervous about being on the radio back then. :lol:

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/websleuths/2011/09/12/websleuths-radio

Loving the accent tee hee
 
Re the kids sleepover...

This was the first we heard....

Mrs Baden-Clay's best friend, Kerry-Anne Walker, has helped the Dickies in their ordeal and was at the search site every day. She was one of the last to have contact with Mrs Baden-Clay, texting her on the night she disappeared about her plans for the following day.

"That Friday was a busy day for her. She had a full-day conference in town and the kids were having a sleepover that night, so she would have got all her stuff ready," Mrs Walker said.

"I had texted her that day, the Thursday, and she texted me back that night saying she'd drop around on her way home from this conference .

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/grief-for-lost-daughter/story-e6freoof-1226346302840


Then there was another report, May 12, 2012, in which it stated the kids had a sleepover at a friend's home on that Thursday night.

From memory it was included in this report most of which wasn't available online (although it may mention it in the video included in this report...I've not checked it yet)

"Read the full interview and the latest developments in the Baden-Clay case in today’s print edition of The Sunday Mail

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...says-best-friend/story-e6freoof-1226353690726
 
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