Theories On What Happened to Caylee Part #4

reeseeva said:

respectfully snipped

As crazy as this may sound to some people, (including myself) I see young people today, as not viewing death the way previous generations do. Witnessing KC's Facebook & MySpace, paints a fatalistic portrait of her views on life & death. I do not condone, in any way shape or manner, her actions on how she disposed of her daughter, I'm just trying to step outside & look at why or how this may have happened!

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This is true, our culture has become way to desensitized to death/dying and the reality of it all.

reeseeva said:

This is also when she literally "drops out of sight" from her usual group of friends (too many reminders of Caylee) & fills her world with new people & distractions. She does not feel guilt, she is thinking the child is hers to do with, what she deems necessary, for her own survival.

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*respectfully snipped
i also think that a great part of casey 'dropping out of sight' and filling her world w/ new people. was through necessity. all her old friends would have noticed immediately the very conspicuous absence of caylee, but the new ones didn't know how casey chose to raise her daughter and would be far more likely to buy the nanny nonsense.

JWG said:

I am trying to triangulate a bit on when KC returned home on the 16th and fit it into the possibility that Caylee died in the car.

GA says he last saw Caylee around 12:50 PM when she and KC left for "work". Cell pings indicate they stayed in the vicinity. Desktop and laptop computer activity cease during this period of time, supporting the notion KC is not at the Anthony home.

Very light computer activity occurs between 1 and 2 PM on the laptop. Then very heavy computer activity occurs between 2 and 3 PM on the desktop. The activity seems to be indicative of KC being on the two computers and not GA. This further implies KC returned to the home just before 2 PM and had enough time to do a small amount of work on the laptop after returning, and later hitting the desktop. GA was not around, so he likely had left for work.

When did GA start work? I have heard 2 PM, and I have heard 3 PM. Travel time for GA was about 20 minutes, so unless he was doing errands before work, he would not be leaving until about half an hour before work. I think the computer evidence supports GA leaving the home before 2 PM, probably because his job started then on that day.

KC calls Amy at 1:45 and speaks with her until 2:21. Sometime between 1:45 and 2 PM, KC is back at her parents. Where is Caylee?

Now we can flesh this out with some speculation:

• Caylee falls asleep soon after leaving the A's because it is nap time. KC occupies herself with Tony texting somewhere near the A's, maybe Lee's...maybe the elementary school.

• KC calls Amy at 1:45, then while on the phone, heads back to the A's.

• KC and a sleeping Caylee arrive at the A's just before 2. KC grabs a few items from the car but is otherwise deep into her conversation with Amy. She sees a sleeping Caylee and notes to herself that she needs to come back out immediately and get Caylee and take her to bed.

• While inside Amy says something that prompts KC to flip open the laptop. Next she starts up the desktop. She and Amy talk and surf real time until 2:20 PM.

• KC is sucked into the computer by now and uses it heavily until JG calls a half hour later at 2:53 PM.

• KC and JG converse intently until KC gets a very rare call from GA at 3:04 PM. KC takes the call. Sometime during the conversation GA says "Caylee", and a little light bulb goes off in KC's head. "Caylee ..."

• KC gets off the phone with her dad as she rushes out to the car...

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Great attention to detail, JWG. I always enjoy reading your theories! With this theory, there are two things I wonder: how would this account for the high levels of chloroform in the trunk? Also, how would this fit in with Jesse's account of hearing Caylee in the background?

Pink Panther said:

It's all possible but it seems strange that if she was using this home as a hide-out, that no one would have noticed??? None of the neighbors would have seen her come and go???

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None of the neighbors saw her coming and going from the Anthony house either in all the time since she had been fired from Universal, with the exception of the day she backed her car into the Anthony garage.

Indigo said:

Great attention to detail, JWG. I always enjoy reading your theories! With this theory, there are two things I wonder: how would this account for the high levels of chloroform in the trunk? Also, how would this fit in with Jesse's account of hearing Caylee in the background?

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Someone mentioned on Part 3 of the thread, near the end, that KC could have been viewing the father's day video of Caylee or some other video of Caylee on the computer while speaking with Jesse. Certainly plausible, but we don't have enough information from the computer forensics to determine if this occurred. I believe media players do save a history, so the information might be there.

Another possibility is that Jesse was mistaken, as he was in recounting the conversation he had with KC on the 24th. It was not unusual for him to hear Caylee in the background, but it did not always happen. Given it had been some time since he had seen Caylee, I believe there is room for poor recall here on his part.

As for the chloroform, it is still possible that a combination of cleaners (specifically dry-cleaning solution) and / or pesticides or fumigants (to kill flies and maggots) could have left behind the chloroform signature. Chemical analysis of the items seized from the parental home should determine whether or not this is a possibility. Given the seizure took place 5 months after the fact, there is room for doubt, meaning there could be an argument made that the cleaners/pesticides were used up prior to December and the containers long since discarded.

sweetwater said:

And the convoluted connection to Universal is interesting, too.

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Would somebody be kind enough to let me know what this convoluted connection is? Or at least point me in the direction so I can find it? TIA.

Casey kept a container of homemade chloroform in her trunk. A place where she knew her parents couldn't ust "stumble" on it. Safekeeping.

After the big fight with CA, Casey was infuriated. Her vacation plans were ruined, and maybe CA even gave her a powerful ultimatum (i.e., get a real job, or I'm taking Caylee and you get the hell out!). She left with Caylee. Maybe Caylee started throwing a fit, or was just getting on her nerves more than usual (remember, she was already tense from the fight with CA). So she knocks Caylee out with chloroform, and puts her in the trunk. Not wanting her to wake up, she soaks a rag in chloroform and leaves it in the trunk, hoping it will keep her "under". Tape over her mouth to prevent her from screaming if she woke up before Casey got back.
The heavy amounts of Chloroform cause Caylee to vomit while unconcious. The tape over her mouth causes her to aspirate the vomit. She essentially "drowns" in it. (I'd venture to guess the mystery stain in the trunk was vomit, that possibly came out of her nose *excuse my bluntness*).

Casey makes the discovery. Not sure what her emotional reaction would have been, but she starts trying to come up with a plan.
Next day, drives to her parents house when she knows they're both gone. Pulls the car into the garage. Transfers Caylee's body from the trunk to the backyard to "bag it". Uses trash bags from the home. Starts thinking about burrying her in the backyard. Borrows shovel from neighbors. Then....second guesses her plan. Too easy. Too obvious. Now what? Put's Caylee's body back in the trunk, bagged. As she's getting back in, she sees random items of Caylee's in the backseat. Gathers them all up, sticks them in the bag also. Sortof the out of sight, out of mind idea.

Leaves her parents home, not knowing where to go. She turns off Hopespring and onto Suburban...it's quiet out. Not much traffic. She looks to her right and sees the woods where she and friends used to hide and hang out. It's filled with water. She pulls over. Maybe she idles there for a couple minutes...not sure what to do. Then she makes a split second decision....get rid of this body. No time like the present. She gets out and opens the trunk, then when the coast is clear, she carrys the bag down the small hill and puts it in the water. Maybe even rips a small hole in it so water will flow in, making it sink. After the bag is out of sight sufficently, she climbs back into the car....and leaves.



Thats my theory. It's not elaborate, but to me, it makes sense given what we know about Casey and how she thinks (in the moment, her own form of logic in play at all times).
As for the discovery of the body, I honestly think Casey told Lee where she could be found, and he, in turn, told the PI's. Probably told them, "look, this is win win. I can't be arrested for this, and if I suddenly show up and know where the body is, it will look like I helped. If you find her, it looks more innocent, and theres a reward, too" (I believe the reward was still on the table in early November).
Perhaps Casey told Lee in a letter, in code. Remember the account from neighbors that kids used to bury their dead pets in the woods? Well,Casey and Lee being so close in age, probably shared some friends. Knew all the kids in the neighborhood. Maybe at some point in their young lives, a friends cherished dog Spot (just for the sake of argument) died, and the group burried him in the woods. Maybe in a letter, Casey says...."You know who I was thinking about today? Spot. I sure would love to see him again." If they hadnt talked about the dog since childhood, it might have instantly raised a flag for the brother.

There is something about Casey’s actions afterwards that have been bugging me. If this was a planned killing, wouldn’t it be likely that Casey would have had a plan on what she was going to do once she killed Caylee? To me, her actions afterwards tend to lean toward this being an accident. Here’s why:

If she had planned to kill Caylee, I would think that she would have had a better plan afterwards, like leaving the state (perhaps saying that she got a new job, etc), or calling 911 a couple of days later to report her missing like some other psycho moms have done. I think she would have thought of something better than the nanny story.

She had to know that she would eventually be caught or have to answer to everyone as to where Caylee was. I can’t imagine that she thought that this would go on forever and that she would be able to keep Caylee away from everyone. I know this is probably not the way it happened, but I’m just trying to think of all the different scenarios…

What if…

During the day Casey and Caylee were in the pool (would explain why the ladder was up) and after being in the pool for awhile, Caylee takes a nap (perhaps out of site from where Casey is on the computer). At that time Casey goes online and starts chatting with friends. While on the computer, Caylee wakes up and wanders outside since that was where she last saw her mom. After awhile, Casey checks in on Caylee and sees that she’s not there so she starts looking around the house. After searching the house, she starts to panic and without thinking calls her parents because she can’t find Caylee. No one answers. She continues to look and finds her dead in the pool. Instead of doing the right thing and calling 911, she sees that Caylee is dead and quickly comes to the realization that she is at fault and that her Mom will blame her. So instead of facing the truth (which we know is easy for her) she realizes that she has to come up with something. She is no longer panicking or upset as in her mind she has removed herself from the situation and goes into her manipulating mode.

She gets a bag and lays a wet Caylee on top of it in the trunk (could explain the trace amount of chloroform in the trunk) . She then goes back into the house and grabs all her stuff and takes off. She becomes cold to the facts and ignores what has happened until the smell. At some point she takes Caylee out of the trunk and tries to bury her in the backyard and eventually moves her. She gets rid of the car and places it by a dumpster thinking that she can tell people the smell is from the garbage. Knowing that she will probably get caught, she comes up with the nanny story and decides to do everything she wants while she still can.


If you think about it, her old friends have said that she acted differently by partying, etc. Could it be that Casey decides to live it up as she knew it was only a matter of time that she’d be caught? Also, when she stole the checks from Amy, she had to know that she would get caught since she signed her name of the checks. How was she planning to explain that? She knew if she got caught for stealing the checks she would no longer be friends with all of them. I don’t think she cared that Amy was going to know, or about anything for that matter. I think that’s why she partied like crazy, dated, bought things and got a tattoo. I think she knew she was going to have to own up to everything sooner or later so in the meantime she was going to have fun. It would also explain her comment to Lee about how this (calling the cops) should have been done long ago. If you think about it, it doesnt sound like she was at all nervous or shocked that the police were being called. I think she expected this all along (to get arrested) but used the Nanny story to create reasonable doubt (not that it did).

Sick… yes.

Possible? I don’t know.
:waitasec:

reeseeva said:

This scenerio, has played out in my mind many times...
With all information from your work & JamesBondJames, there is only 30 mins. between the call from George to her call to Tony @3:35pm. This is why the premeditation doesn't work for me. We know that there was an argument on the 15th, which is substantiated in the Docs., Supplemental Report, Pg 2499, by Mark F to LE. The basis of that argument stemmed from Cindy's visit on Father's Day, & her conversation with her mother about the checks, & her mother's admonition to throw KC out. I think this was building & festering with Cindy on the ride home & she finally unleashes all of this on Casey, coupled with her being an irresponsible & unfit mother to Caylee & believe it was a huge blowout. Considering this with her all-night activity with TL (very little sleep) & combined with feelings of worthlessness, it explains, why, if an accident did occur, she could not face the fact that her mother was right. If this had been injected into KC's mind over & over again & then it actually happened, here is the Self-Fullfilling Prophecy manifested into reality! I think we can all relate to some incident in life where we've seen this occur, & it is Shocking! Maybe, if this unfortunate set of circumstances had happened without the assault from the previous night's altercation, her course of action after the fact, may have been different.

The cover-up now begins. Caylee is beyond anyone's help at this point & only thru some momentary neglect on KC's part did this occur. She exonerates herself. This is also when she literally "drops out of sight" from her usual group of friends (too many reminders of Caylee) & fills her world with new people & distractions. She does not feel guilt, she is thinking the child is hers to do with, what she deems necessary, for her own survival.

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*snipped*
...to add...there's more to pile onto how 6/15-16 was the intersection of several factors. Without going into detail and restarting the debate (pretty please) that raged early in the case 'bout why Cindy, Casey, George, & Lee initially used the date of 6/9 vs. 6/15. The week of 6/9 was a transition week for Casey. She went from Ricardo to Tony that week and it was a rocky transition. IMHO, Tony was doubting Casey..or at least pushing her buttons...that week and she was trying to convince him he was "the one". Ricardo was trying to keep Casey 'round (see texts w/ Amy), but, Casey was determined to start anew w/ a different class of guy (also her texts w/ Amy). Casey and Caylee were out of Ricardo's as of 6/10, but, not @ G&C's until 6/13 and/or 14...which made 6/9 stick in Cindy, et.al.'s memory as the date things changed re: seeing Caylee every night. IIRC, Casey had told G&C a story 'bout bein' somewhere week of 6/9 which is why Caylee bein' out (@ Ricardo's) that night was 'ok'...but, when she had to leave Ricardo's due to the break w/ him and take-up w/ Tony...she had to come up w/ something for Caylee since she had a good alibi going w/ G&C...she couldn't abort it now...she'd worked so hard to put it in place! Perhaps Casey was having some few-hour-long hook-ups w/ Tony 6/10-6/13...so the 'new' form of Caylee-care started ~6/10. It may not have been working so well, hence, the walk w/ Kristina C. 6/12 at a time that was certainly at/near Caylee's bedtime may have been to test the waters 'bout keepin' Caylee overnight.

What went wrong 6/16 may have simply been some change in the method Casey was using 6/10-6/13+/-. Perhaps 6/10-6/13 Caylee was close enough (e.g. the Pontiac in Sutton Place Apt. parking lot) that Casey would run out to check on her saying she was gonna call Cindy (recall Tony said she'd step outside), take out the trash (Fusian receipt from May in trashbag in trunk) and this allowed shorter durations and more frequent monitoring. Casey had to take Caylee to a location near G&C's (Lee's? Brackenwood?) for the majority of the time these nights owing to the pings there. Stats analysis of pings this period support that they were from different nearby location to G&C's. If the 6/16 Blockbuster plans w/o G&C-care just meant a few more hours...maybe Casey thought she'd perfected the sedation process and just upped the dosage a bit. Change in Dosage? Change in Rx? Combination of both?

As I've posted before...I try to keep an open mind and I've envisioned everything from a well-planned murder of Cindy gone awry...to...total accident. I just haven't seen enough evidence to conclude w/ great certainty one OVER the other. There are great points to make both sides.

Changing the Rx (dosage and/or type and/or method of admin.) 6/16 seems to kinda go down the middle for me...kinda hybrid...and I think I'll park it here 'till I see something more concrete to sway one way or t'other.

ETA: There are indications Ricardo may have intro'd Casey to chloroform. LE's searches of his computer should be telling. Casey may've even sourced the chloroform by taking some from Ricardo's stash. Amy stating that Caylee could sleep through anything, and the Amy waking up in diff. pants may all be signs chloroform (and/or other Rx handy) was already in-use and Casey simply continued what might've originally started in order to give Casey & Ricardo some uninterrupted intimate privacy...only this time, Tony was the prize, and Caylee was not as easily monitored.

Who_What_When said:

There is something about Casey’s actions afterwards that have been bugging me. If this was a planned killing, wouldn’t it be likely that Casey would have had a plan on what she was going to do once she killed Caylee? To me, her actions afterwards tend to lean toward this being an accident. Here’s why:

If she had planned to kill Caylee, I would think that she would have had a plan to leave the state (perhaps saying that she got a new job, etc), or she would have called 911 a couple of days later to report her missing like some other psycho moms have done. She would have had a better plan that the nanny story.

She had to know that she would eventually be caught or have to answer to everyone as to where Caylee was. I can’t imagine that she thought that this would go on forever and that she would be able to keep Caylee away from everyone. I know this is probably not the way it happened, but I’m just trying to think of all the different scenarios…

What if…

During the day Casey and Caylee were in the pool (would explain why the ladder was up) and after being in the pool for awhile, Caylee takes a nap (perhaps out of site from where Casey is on the computer). At that time Casey goes online and starts chatting with friends. While on the computer, Caylee wakes up and wanders outside since that was where she last saw her mom. After awhile, Casey checks in on Caylee and sees that she’s not there so she starts looking around the house. After searching the house, she starts to panic and without thinking calls her parents because she can’t find Caylee. No one answers. She continues to look and finds her dead in the pool. Instead of doing the right thing and calling 911, she sees that Caylee is dead and quickly comes to the realization that she is at fault and that her Mom will blame her. So instead of facing the truth (which we know is easy for her) she realizes that she has to come up with something. She is no longer panicking or upset as in her mind she has removed herself from the situation and goes into her manipulating mode.

She gets a bag and lays a wet Caylee on top of it in the trunk (could explain the trace amount of chloroform in the trunk) . She then goes back into the house and grabs all her stuff and takes off. She becomes cold to the facts and ignores what has happened until the smell. At some point she takes Caylee out of the trunk and tries to bury her in the backyard and eventually moves her. She gets rid of the car and places by a dumpster thinking that people will think the smell is from the garbage. Knowing that she will probably get caught, she comes up with the nanny story and decides to do everything she wants while she still can.


If you think about it, her old friends have said that she acted differently by partying, etc. Could it be that Casey decides to live it up as she knew it was only a matter of time that she’d be caught? Also, when she stole the checks from Amy, she had to know that she would get caught since she signed her name of the checks. How was she planning to explain that? She knew if she got caught for stealing the checks she would no longer be friends with all of them. I don’t think she cared that Amy was going to know, or about anything for that matter. I think that’s why she partied like crazy, dated, bought things and got a tattoo. I think she knew she was going to have to own up to everything sooner or later so in the meantime she was going to have fun. It would also explain her comment to Lee about how this (calling the cops) should have been done long ago. If you think about it, it doesnt sound like she was at all nervous or shocked that the people were being called. I think she expected this all along.

Sick… yes.

Possible? I don’t know.
:waitasec:

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I have had very similar thoughts myself, and have said many times that I think her behaviour afterwards could well have been just a sort of manic final fling because she knew the jig would be up at some point. I agree with you that it appears she had NO plan for explaining a 'disappeared' Caylee, at least not until her mother found her and started demanding answers. If she already had the 'kidnapping' plot worked out, then as you say, why didn't she 'raise the alarm' within a few days of Caylee's death, as soon as she had disposed of the body. She also obviously had no plan for the disposal either, as it appears she drove around with a dead Caylee in the car for at least a few days.

Who_What_When said:

There is something about Casey’s actions afterwards that have been bugging me. If this was a planned killing, wouldn’t it be likely that Casey would have had a plan on what she was going to do once she killed Caylee? To me, her actions afterwards tend to lean toward this being an accident. Here’s why:

If she had planned to kill Caylee, I would think that she would have had a better plan afterwards, like leaving the state (perhaps saying that she got a new job, etc), or calling 911 a couple of days later to report her missing like some other psycho moms have done. I think she would have thought of something better than the nanny story.

She had to know that she would eventually be caught or have to answer to everyone as to where Caylee was. I can’t imagine that she thought that this would go on forever and that she would be able to keep Caylee away from everyone. I know this is probably not the way it happened, but I’m just trying to think of all the different scenarios…

What if…

During the day Casey and Caylee were in the pool (would explain why the ladder was up) and after being in the pool for awhile, Caylee takes a nap (perhaps out of site from where Casey is on the computer). At that time Casey goes online and starts chatting with friends. While on the computer, Caylee wakes up and wanders outside since that was where she last saw her mom. After awhile, Casey checks in on Caylee and sees that she’s not there so she starts looking around the house. After searching the house, she starts to panic and without thinking calls her parents because she can’t find Caylee. No one answers. She continues to look and finds her dead in the pool. Instead of doing the right thing and calling 911, she sees that Caylee is dead and quickly comes to the realization that she is at fault and that her Mom will blame her. So instead of facing the truth (which we know is easy for her) she realizes that she has to come up with something. She is no longer panicking or upset as in her mind she has removed herself from the situation and goes into her manipulating mode.

She gets a bag and lays a wet Caylee on top of it in the trunk (could explain the trace amount of chloroform in the trunk) . She then goes back into the house and grabs all her stuff and takes off. She becomes cold to the facts and ignores what has happened until the smell. At some point she takes Caylee out of the trunk and tries to bury her in the backyard and eventually moves her. She gets rid of the car and places it by a dumpster thinking that she can tell people the smell is from the garbage. Knowing that she will probably get caught, she comes up with the nanny story and decides to do everything she wants while she still can.


If you think about it, her old friends have said that she acted differently by partying, etc. Could it be that Casey decides to live it up as she knew it was only a matter of time that she’d be caught? Also, when she stole the checks from Amy, she had to know that she would get caught since she signed her name of the checks. How was she planning to explain that? She knew if she got caught for stealing the checks she would no longer be friends with all of them. I don’t think she cared that Amy was going to know, or about anything for that matter. I think that’s why she partied like crazy, dated, bought things and got a tattoo. I think she knew she was going to have to own up to everything sooner or later so in the meantime she was going to have fun. It would also explain her comment to Lee about how this (calling the cops) should have been done long ago. If you think about it, it doesnt sound like she was at all nervous or shocked that the police were being called. I think she expected this all along (to get arrested) but used the Nanny story to create reasonable doubt (not that it did).

Sick… yes.

Possible? I don’t know.
:waitasec:

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Devon said:

I have had very similar thoughts myself, and have said many times that I think her behaviour afterwards could well have been just a sort of manic final fling because she knew the jig would be up at some point. I agree with you that it appears she had NO plan for explaining a 'disappeared' Caylee, at least not until her mother found her and started demanding answers. If she already had the 'kidnapping' plot worked out, then as you say, why didn't she 'raise the alarm' within a few days of Caylee's death, as soon as she had disposed of the body. She also obviously had no plan for the disposal either, as it appears she drove around with a dead Caylee in the car for at least a few days.

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I agree. Also, I don't mean this in a sympathetic way at all, but I think she went into some kind of denial where she just decided to "ignore" what she did as if to pretend it never happened. I believe she started believing her own lies and that is why she hasn't shown any emotion.

When you think about her stealing the checks from Amy, it just doesn't make sense. Why wouldn't she try to hide it somehow? She signed her name to the checks so it wasn't like Amy wasn't going to find out. I don't think she cared because she knew it would soon be over. JMO

Who_What_When said:

I agree. Also, I don't mean this in a sympathetic way at all, but I think she went into some kind of denial where she just decided to "ignore" what she did as if to pretend it never happened. I believe she started believing her own lies and that is why she hasn't shown any emotion.

When you think about her stealing the checks from Amy, it just doesn't make sense. Why wouldn't she try to hide it somehow? She signed her name to the checks so it wasn't like Amy wasn't going to find out. I don't think she cared because she knew it would soon be over. JMO

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Good stuff.

Cindy has complained that no reporting has been done on how Casey was bonkers hysterical on the 31st(help) night and was on the floor in a bad way. Well, I understand that with the police on the way, she could have been upset, but the reason no reporting is no one has seen anything like that. Possible the jailers see stuff they can't tell - both ways imho.

JWG said:

Someone mentioned on Part 3 of the thread, near the end, that KC could have been viewing the father's day video of Caylee or some other video of Caylee on the computer while speaking with Jesse. Certainly plausible, but we don't have enough information from the computer forensics to determine if this occurred. I believe media players do save a history, so the information might be there.

Another possibility is that Jesse was mistaken, as he was in recounting the conversation he had with KC on the 24th. It was not unusual for him to hear Caylee in the background, but it did not always happen. Given it had been some time since he had seen Caylee, I believe there is room for poor recall here on his part.

As for the chloroform, it is still possible that a combination of cleaners (specifically dry-cleaning solution) and / or pesticides or fumigants (to kill flies and maggots) could have left behind the chloroform signature. Chemical analysis of the items seized from the parental home should determine whether or not this is a possibility. Given the seizure took place 5 months after the fact, there is room for doubt, meaning there could be an argument made that the cleaners/pesticides were used up prior to December and the containers long since discarded.

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Yes, that was me wondering about the Father's Day video.(Did we lose that thread in the fire?) It's possible that the Coolpix camera had video/audio output also. I believe a cable would make instant playback possible in that case. I also agree that Jesse could be mistaken.

It will be interesting to see what comes up during trial in regard to the chloroform. I would think that the dry cleaning solution and the fumigants or the pool chemicals would give off additional VOCs that could help to set them apart in some way.

If an alternate explanation for the chloroform is offered, I wonder how it will be played out. What are your thoughts on this, JWG?

Devon said:

I have had very similar thoughts myself, and have said many times that I think her behaviour afterwards could well have been just a sort of manic final fling because she knew the jig would be up at some point. I agree with you that it appears she had NO plan for explaining a 'disappeared' Caylee, at least not until her mother found her and started demanding answers. If she already had the 'kidnapping' plot worked out, then as you say, why didn't she 'raise the alarm' within a few days of Caylee's death, as soon as she had disposed of the body. She also obviously had no plan for the disposal either, as it appears she drove around with a dead Caylee in the car for at least a few days.

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If this was a deliberate act, one would think it would have been easy to stage something, even half-a##ed, so as to not point the finger at her. She pretty much just let it play out, not knowing what to do.

I believe that had the argument not happened the night before, she may have made different choices. If Cindy accused her of multiple transgressions in the care of Caylee, & IF there was an unsupervised moment of neglect which contributed to her death, the very next day; that with which she had just been accused, Actually happens!!.....Her mother's prophecy has now come true. She is in shock.. calling 911 won't help, Caylee is dead... ."how can this be happening to ME".....

Would like to hear opposing views on this!

reeseeva said:

If this was a deliberate act, one would think it would have been easy to stage something, even half-a##ed, so as to not point the finger at her. She pretty much just let it play out, not knowing what to do.

I believe that had the argument not happened the night before, she may have made different choices. If Cindy accused her of multiple transgressions in the care of Caylee, & IF there was an unsupervised moment of neglect which contributed to her death, the very next day; that with which she had just been accused, Actually happens!!.....Her mother's prophecy has now come true. She is in shock.. calling 911 won't help, Caylee is dead... ."how can this be happening to ME".....

Would like to hear opposing views on this!

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I agree. If she had planned this she would have come up with something, anything in advance. I personally think she would have left town. All her actions afterwards were random. She just chose to ignore the whole thing. If she planned it, she would have been planting seeds all along and would have talked about Caylee a lot more than she did the days after. Her friends mentioned that she eventually ignored their questions Caylee's whereabouts. It's almost as if she was refusing to think about it, which to me doesn't add up if it was planned.

Also, if it was planned, why not do it before everyone went to PR? This way she could go on the trip and use the excuse that the nanny was watching Caylee while she was away. Then upon coming back she could have freaked out in front of her friends since they would have believed the Nanny was watching and then took Caylee. It would have been more believable as a week would have passed while she was away.

reeseeva said:

If this was a deliberate act, one would think it would have been easy to stage something, even half-a##ed, so as to not point the finger at her. She pretty much just let it play out, not knowing what to do.

I believe that had the argument not happened the night before, she may have made different choices. If Cindy accused her of multiple transgressions in the care of Caylee, & IF there was an unsupervised moment of neglect which contributed to her death, the very next day; that with which she had just been accused, Actually happens!!.....Her mother's prophecy has now come true. She is in shock.. calling 911 won't help, Caylee is dead... ."how can this be happening to ME".....

Would like to hear opposing views on this!

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Well there's no opposition from me at this time, because the alternative theories, e.g. Caylee murdered so that she could live happily ever after with AL, or murdered to spite CA, or just because she was an unwanted responsibility etc. just don't seem to 'feel' right to me. That's not because I can't accept that mothers kill their own children (I can and do) but because it just doesn't quite add up in this case IMO!

I see no concrete evidence of forethought, and what appears to be re-active, rather than pro-active afterthought. If it wasn't an accident due to negligence then IMO the next 'best-fit' scenario is a spur of the moment killing, no planning, no intent - just something that happened and KC lost control!

Devon said:

Well there's no opposition from me at this time, because the alternative theories, e.g. Caylee murdered so that she could live happily ever after with AL, or murdered to spite CA, or just because she was an unwanted responsibility etc. just don't seem to 'feel' right to me. That's not because I can't accept that mothers kill their own children (I can and do) but because it just doesn't quite add up in this case IMO!

I see no concrete evidence of forethought, and what appears to be re-active, rather than pro-active afterthought. If it wasn't an accident due to negligence then IMO the next 'best-fit' scenario is a spur of the moment killing, no planning, no intent - just something that happened and KC lost control!

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I know a lot has been said about her killing Caylee because she didn't want her, but I don't know if I truly believe that. By looking at the emails and text messages and what her friends have said, it doesn't appear to me that she hated or didn't want Caylee. I think she probably did feel trapped, but I think a lot of mothers feel that way at times. As for her saying "little snot nose", I honestly don't think that is as big as a deal as it's being made out to be. Although I've never said anything like that about my child (I'm way too proud of being a Mom! LOL), I've known a lot of mother's who have said a lot worse about their kids. Her history and her actions afterward just don't seem like it was planned. JMO.

PS: Please note that I am in NO WAY defending or condoning what Casey did. :furious:

Devon said:

Well there's no opposition from me at this time, because the alternative theories, e.g. Caylee murdered so that she could live happily ever after with AL, or murdered to spite CA, or just because she was an unwanted responsibility etc. just don't seem to 'feel' right to me. That's not because I can't accept that mothers kill their own children (I can and do) but because it just doesn't quite add up in this case IMO!

I see no concrete evidence of forethought, and what appears to be re-active, rather than pro-active afterthought. If it wasn't an accident due to negligence then IMO the next 'best-fit' scenario is a spur of the moment killing, no planning, no intent - just something that happened and KC lost control!

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Casey could have had several motives. Fear that Caylee would eventually expose her double life could have been a very powerful one. This could be compared to Mark Hacking, who killed his wife simply because she found out about his lies.

2goldfish said:

The facts that I know as of this date over and over point to a deliberate death no matter how much I still naively wish it to have been an accident.

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and this is still what LE is saying, right? i've been curious, how could they know that it was intentional without knowing HOW caylee died?

stellasmommyphd said:

and this is still what LE is saying, right? i've been curious, how could they know that it was intentional without knowing HOW caylee died?

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This is interesting as I wonder what they have? From what I've seen I don't see it as intentional but they must have something. I guess we have to wait for the trial! Until then I still lean more toward it being an accident due to negligence, just because of her actions after the fact. Like another poster said, her actions seem re-activenot proactive.