09-17-2011 Topaz Mountain Search Yields Charred Wood and Decomp

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Oriah said:
BBM:
BeanE- exactly. And in all honesty, I can't see there being any other explanation for the HRD dog hits on the charred wood, unless they are false positives. In addition to that- if after the wood (or whatever it turns out to be) was removed from the dig site- and they were alerting only to what was recovered and not the dig site itself (as has been reported).. then what the heck is going on here?
If there is HR decomp present in enough quantity for an accurate alert on charred wood taken from soil- then it is likely that there is decomp in the surrounding substrate. So the dogs should have continued to alert on the dig site as well as the soil and wood particles removed from the site.
Maybe this is what they were doing when bringing dogs back to the site repeatedly to see if they alerted on the dig before continuing the dig- and why they ceased to continue to excavate after the HRD dogs stopped alerting... not sure.

But I do hope that once it was evident there was a burn of some sort going on, they brought in a dog or two trained in accelerants.
Does anyone know if this is the case?
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If so, I don't believe it was ever reported.
 
If they are still searching this area that tells me that they indeed knew JP vehicle stopped at that area and only that area, well maybe besides a gas station.

This is probably the location he camped at and where Susan was, JP probably this past August went out there camped, dug up Susan, and disposed of her elsewhere in the area because JP didn't stop any place else. That is what I'm think LE is thinking.
 
It is confusing Oriah. It was repeatedly said yesterday, the dogs are not alerting on the material which was removed and placed in piles, only in the hole?
 
Knox said:
It is confusing Oriah. It was repeatedly said yesterday, the dogs are not alerting on the material which was removed and placed in piles, only in the hole?
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Ok- now I am thoroughly confused!
 
I also find it strange that LE made no comments when it was reported that JP went camping in Aug. Not one word however I'm wondering if JP camped out there and planted something of susan's he had in that hole to throw off LE. Suppose she is close to those mines and LE were close, so he had something of Susan's hidden, and went to get it, drove out there, and buried that in that hole.
 
Lera213 said:
If they are still searching this area that tells me that they indeed knew JP vehicle stopped at that area and only that area, well maybe besides a gas station.

This is probably the location he camped at and where Susan was, JP probably this past August went out there camped, dug up Susan, and disposed of her elsewhere in the area because JP didn't stop any place else. That is what I'm think LE is thinking.
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How would they know he only stopped here? :waitasec:
 
Lera213 said:
I also find it strange that LE made no comments when it was reported that JP went camping in Aug. Not one word however I'm wondering if JP camped out there and planted something of susan's he had in that hole to throw off LE. Suppose she is close to those mines and LE were close, so he had something of Susan's hidden, and went to get it, drove out there, and buried that in that hole.
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If he hid evidence of Susan's with the hopes it would be found, then his story he has been asserting for 2 years that she ran off with the other guy is bogus. Not likely, IMO.
 
Oriah said:
Ok- now I am thoroughly confused!
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"These charred pieces had something to do with decomposition," said West Valley Police Lt. Bill Merritt.

That means at some point, the charred pieces very likely came in contact with either blood or decomposing flesh or clothing that contained some of that material, he said.

As for how human decomposition got on the charred pieces, Merritt said, "There are so many different scenarios of what it could be."

It was unlikely the apparent wood gave the cadaver dogs a "false positive," Merritt stated. The cadaver dogs are trained to detect human decomposition as opposed to flakes of dead skin. He also noted it was interesting that the charred pieces were found buried about 2 ½ feet in the ground.



Pat Reavy, Deseret News
West Valley police Saturday completed their digging at what they originally suspected was a disturbed gravesite and removed about 100 small pieces of what appeared to be charred wood.

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/...rred-wood-during-search-for-Susan-Powell.html
 
Chili Fries said:
keeping in mind how small the thing seems to be...the one picture almost looks like the remains of the sole of a shoe with the twine being the stitching that's left.
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Now that I look again, is it possible the fibrous stuff we see is simply miniscule roots that have attached themselves to the objects?
 
Satellite, GPS, gas receipts, eye witness, informant, and or surveillance.

Yes JP asserts Susan ran off but he also knows LE will not charge him without a body. So, instead of climbing down or excavating a mine that he collapsed maybe or it is a steep climb down and he isn't going down there, then perhaps he has one item he forgot to get rid of but maybe had it somewhere with decomp on it. He went camping in August, had a campfire, burned the time.

I mean I'm trying here to figure out the madness.
 
Knox said:
"These charred pieces had something to do with decomposition," said West Valley Police Lt. Bill Merritt.

That means at some point, the charred pieces very likely came in contact with either blood or decomposing flesh or clothing that contained some of that material, he said.

As for how human decomposition got on the charred pieces, Merritt said, "There are so many different scenarios of what it could be."

It was unlikely the apparent wood gave the cadaver dogs a "false positive," Merritt stated. The cadaver dogs are trained to detect human decomposition as opposed to flakes of dead skin. He also noted it was interesting that the charred pieces were found buried about 2 ½ feet in the ground.



Pat Reavy, Deseret News
West Valley police Saturday completed their digging at what they originally suspected was a disturbed gravesite and removed about 100 small pieces of what appeared to be charred wood.

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/...rred-wood-during-search-for-Susan-Powell.html
Click to expand...

If that charred wood had any value, I doubt she would be holding it out in her bare hand like that. MOO.
 
This is a charred ankle bone of a hippo. I'm only posting this to give a visual of what a charred bone would look like. Granted this is much larger than a human but it is something we can try to compare. I notice you can see some pores in the bone. Anyone try to really blow up that screen shot to see if any pores are on it?



burnt-bone.jpg
 
Knox said:
It is confusing Oriah. It was repeatedly said yesterday, the dogs are not alerting on the material which was removed and placed in piles, only in the hole?
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From what I saw, that was when they talked about dirt.

When they talked about the wood, they said that once they removed the wood, the dogs stopped alerting in the hole, and started hitting on the wood.

ETA:

dogs hit on wood after taken out of hole, and stopped hitting on hole:


Once the pieces were removed from the hole near Topaz Mountain that investigators had been digging since Wednesday, cadaver dogs trained to detect human decomposition stopped indicating there was something still in the hole and reacted to the collected pile of pieces.

http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=17284572


dogs did not hit on dirt taken out of the hole:

Cadaver dogs have not given any indication dirt already removed from the site

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/52600721-75/police-site-wood-merritt.html.csp
 
Dr. Know? said:
Fire would make your hands red too getting to close to it and all. I wonder what took the search 10 to 15 miles away? And where is that exactly? What did Abbott say that he knew other than he felt strongly to tell the LE. Suspicious activity.

If this was a Josh site they have cleared, I wonder if they found fragments of clothes, blanket? I can see him dumping her then going back in the rental car to finish the job up. Burn something that had DNA on it. Creep.

There is still a chance that there were other items that we don't know about nor the LE until tested. Hope we hear the final word on that.
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I know that I've missed a few posts so sorry if it has been discussed and maybe someone can point me in the right direction to the discussion but has it been stated what the "suspicious activities" entailed?
 
Lera213 said:
Satellite, GPS, gas receipts, eye witness, informant, and or surveillance.

Yes JP asserts Susan ran off but he also knows LE will not charge him without a body. So, instead of climbing down or excavating a mine that he collapsed maybe or it is a steep climb down and he isn't going down there, then perhaps he has one item he forgot to get rid of but maybe had it somewhere with decomp on it. He went camping in August, had a campfire, burned the time.

I mean I'm trying here to figure out the madness.
Click to expand...

I agree, it is maddening. But I've been to Puyallup, there are thousands of places JP could get rid of evidence there. Why travel all the way to Utah?

I think the August camping trip was more likely the P's thumbing their nose at LE. They were pizzed that their home was searched and SP's "embarrassing" private journals, among other things, were taken.

If Susan was moved, I think it happened long ago, MOO.
 
lonetraveler said:
I know that I've missed a few posts so sorry if it has been discussed and maybe someone can point me in the right direction to the discussion but has it been stated what the "suspicious activities" entailed?
Click to expand...

Abbott wisely declined to share the details with media.
 
Oriah - dogs hit on wood after taken out of hole, and stopped hitting on hole:


Once the pieces were removed from the hole near Topaz Mountain that investigators had been digging since Wednesday, cadaver dogs trained to detect human decomposition stopped indicating there was something still in the hole and reacted to the collected pile of pieces.

http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=17284572
 
DLT88 said:
Yeah, I guess it's hard to have a supply of human remains on hand to train dogs. This is all so exasperating. But I have to think they came to this area for a reason and should NOT give up. Keep checking the mines.

But, though, why would someone bury charred wood that deep underground?
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Oh I'm sure that there is an adequate number of cadavers available for research studies or training purposes. A lot of people donate their bodies to science. There are also unclaimed John Does and Jane Does available.
 
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