CANADA Canada - Audrey Gleave, 73, Ancaster ON, 30 Dec 2010 #2

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Missizzy said:
Are you referring to PK? He does have reddish hair but this guy is said to have very short dark hair. The sketch makes the suspect appear to be dark skinned, IMO.

Frightening, indeed.
Click to expand...

I also posted this on MS thread (suspect in her murder!)
http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Crime/2011/07/21/18450416.html

TORONTO - The hunt is on for a 35-year-old drifter believed to have killed a Toronto teen and dumped her body at the side of a gravel road near Uxbridge, Ont.

"On a dating and meeting website, Hi5, Ghanad claims to be from Hamilton, Ont."

"he describes himself as being from Mashhad, Iran".......
 
Hi everyone:

I just got finished reading all of your thoughts here. So, how about this:
a student AG taught who was 'hot for teacher', quite disturbed as a teen, received a failing grade from this pretty/sexy teacher, etc. and he returned years later to seek revenge?

Perhaps they linked up years later online, met a few times for coffee and he eventually arrived at AG's house.

Thoughts?

Oh, and as such an animal lover, I cannot see/understand AG confining her dogs ever except in a case to protect them OR someone arrived and said "Sorry, but I'm deathly afraid of dogs".

Thoughts again?
 
Apologies for posting two in a row, but I was struck by something posted by Missizzy - about the cemetery and the 'dark arts'.

Often, certain times of the year bring out the worst in people. AG's killing took place in the Christmas/New Year time of the year. Now, I'm wondering about a killer having been prowling around that cemetery for years - perhaps AG's dogs were used to this person's scent - and on that horrible night something went very wrong. IE. the killer knew when AG let the dogs out for their final night time run and (somehow) he/she got into AG's house/garage.

I'm also thinking it could be a female because in the high school years, one is discovering their sexual identity. Perhaps (back to the 'hot for teacher' scenario) the killer is a female student. I think a female teacher would be more inclined to strike up a friendship with a former female student rather than a male student.

What a conundrum......
 
I've always suspected that the killer could be a woman or women. This is only my opinion but I feel that Ms. Gleave's sexuality was somewhat ambiguous. That is very common for someone who, to my mind, fits the picture of being somewhere on the spectrum. She also coached a girls' basketball team and we certainly know that she wouldn't be the first teacher/coach to have a student have a crush on them or for there to have been some inappropriate contact--possibly totally unknown to other students. I don't know what the age of consent was at the time in Ontario nor if there are prohibitions against any sexual contact between students and staff. In some US states, no student under the age of 20 can give consent to an educator.

And concerning the "dark arts". Yes, most certainly it could be a woman, as well as a group. And remember, this was not just the Christmas holidays. It was a very unique week full of atmospheric events which highly reported. When I searched for events held around that time, there were many. Several cemeteries in the Hamilton area have been noted as meet-up locations for "night-time explorations"...including the Ancaster Pet Cemetery. I think that the cemetery adjacent to Ms. Gleave's home would be no exception.

One thing that doesn't fit for me, though, is the safety of the dogs. It's a well proven fact that shepherds are very often the brunt of horrid satanic or occult acts. I have no idea why such a noble breed suffers this. However, the Gleave dogs remained unharmed. If there was a single person, they might not have been a match for the dogs. However, if there was a group bent committing evil acts, I would think they would have harmed the dogs.
 
dotr--I'm not sure what that site is but it seems to have been translated. I think it merely pops up due to the term, "anxiety" in the original article's title. Just a thought.

But I hadn't heard about a neighbor being in the house "tens of years" ago. That's interesting. Once again, it is made clear that Ms. Gleave was not a person who was easy to get close to. That seems so odd when looked at side by side with the comments of students from years ago.

"Mama" Gleave and Audrey Gleave seem like two different people. Could a woman really have changed so much?

We've talked about how she did not allow people into her home. How about her fancy car? After all, cars are personal space too. There are remembrances from at least one male student that she used to drive him home. How about more recently? Did she give people a lift? There's something in that car that interests LE.
 
The original article:

http://www.thespec.com/news/local/article/543143--anxiety-returns-as-murderer-still-on-the-loose

Anxiety returns as murderer still on the loose
June 6, 2011

"....“She was always very pleasant and congenial, (but) she wouldn’t invite you into her home,” he said. The one time he was allowed inside was decades ago when he was helping her with a plumbing or electrical problem inside her house..."



The "anxiety" article linked above, which I think is more of a "pop-up" article:

http://theanxietynaturalremedies.in...rderer-still-on-the-loose-hamilton-spectator/

Anxiety returns as murderer still on the loose – Hamilton
no date

"....“She was at all times pretty enjoyable and congenial, (however) she wouldn’t invite you in her home,” he said. The one time he was permitted inside was tens of years ago when he was assisting her with a plumbing or perhaps electrical trouble inside her home...."
 
An eventful week and most probably of interest to a person educated in science and physics. Unfortunately, it was probably of great interest to those wishing to conjure up occult forces in cemeteries.

From Wiki:

"...The previous total lunar eclipse occurred on December 21, 2010, at 08:17 UTC...."


and


http://www.seektress.com/ma122810.htm

Geomagnetic storm: December 28, 2010


and


The Winter Solstice: December 20-21, 2010


From:

http://libertytothecaptives.net/ritual_calendar.html


Dec. 22 ~ WINTER SOLSTICE (Sabbat Festival)
(Sexual Ritual)
Oral, anal, and vaginal; human and/or animal sacrifice


Dec. 24 ~ DEMON REVELS (High Grand Climax)
(Orgy and Blood Rituals)


http://www.labyrinthofpeople.com/lop1/SRAcalendar.html

Dec. 22 Satanic Feast Day Orgies Oral, Anal, Vaginal

Dec. 24 Satanic Demon Revels Da Meur High Grand Climax

Sexual association with demons called up, and animal and/or human sacrifice
 
Just going back over a few things. I found this comment by Ms. Gleave's former husband strange, given what we've read:

http://www.thespec.com/news/crime/article/307949--police-investigating-ancaster-area-homicide

"She was protective of her private life because she lived alone, AG said. “She was obviously very, very intelligent. Probably her biggest passion was cooking. She’d try anything,” AG added...."

more at link


I happen to be the mother of three professional chefs/bakers. One thing I've learned about them is that they like to cook their own food. They enjoy collecting recipes but they are all quite picky about eating what others prepare.

We've read again and again that LV brought soup and that PK brought a special cake....one made from a recipe which came from AG. Why wouldn't Ms. Gleave be cooking her own food? Most people are intimidated about bringing a food gift to a person known to be passionate about cooking.
 
I can't remember if I've posed this question before. Do any locals on board know of any artistic cemetery photography which has been done in the past? There's a person noted to live very close to Ms. Gleave which specializes in this type of photography and seems to really enjoy the older cemeteries. I've often wondered if Ms. Gleave encountered this person and any others who might have been tagging along.
 
Quoted from Missizzy:

One thing that doesn't fit for me, though, is the safety of the dogs. It's a well proven fact that shepherds are very often the brunt of horrid satanic or occult acts. I have no idea why such a noble breed suffers this. However, the Gleave dogs remained unharmed. If there was a single person, they might not have been a match for the dogs. However, if there was a group bent committing evil acts, I would think they would have harmed the dogs.


Perhaps there are two factors at work here regarding the dogs:
- it was a single killer (as Missizzy said)
- or, the attacker (if female who had a high school crush on AG) was 'respectful' enough of AG's love of dogs.:furious: (This idea makes the crime almost worse!)
 
Missizzy said:
Just going back over a few things. I found this comment by Ms. Gleave's former husband strange, given what we've read:

http://www.thespec.com/news/crime/article/307949--police-investigating-ancaster-area-homicide

"She was protective of her private life because she lived alone, AG said. “She was obviously very, very intelligent. Probably her biggest passion was cooking. She’d try anything,” AG added...."

more at link


I happen to be the mother of three professional chefs/bakers. One thing I've learned about them is that they like to cook their own food. They enjoy collecting recipes but they are all quite picky about eating what others prepare.

We've read again and again that LV brought soup and that PK brought a special cake....one made from a recipe which came from AG. Why wouldn't Ms. Gleave be cooking her own food? Most people are intimidated about bringing a food gift to a person known to be passionate about cooking.
Click to expand...

Yes, now that you mention the 'loved cooking' it also strikes me as odd. Hmmmmmmmmmmm..........:waitasec:
 
Quoted from Missizzy:

We've talked about how she did not allow people into her home. How about her fancy car? After all, cars are personal space too. There are remembrances from at least one male student that she used to drive him home. How about more recently? Did she give people a lift? There's something in that car that interests LE.


I understand what you mean - the car + LE still have me wondering.:confused:

ETA: Indeed, there is something in that car which LE have their eyes on. I doubt it's blood - but DNA, forced entry, soil from shoes, or perhaps the killer left a taunting note to LE. The possibilities are endless.
 
No_Stone_Unturned said:
Quoted from Missizzy:

One thing that doesn't fit for me, though, is the safety of the dogs. It's a well proven fact that shepherds are very often the brunt of horrid satanic or occult acts. I have no idea why such a noble breed suffers this. However, the Gleave dogs remained unharmed. If there was a single person, they might not have been a match for the dogs. However, if there was a group bent committing evil acts, I would think they would have harmed the dogs.


Perhaps there are two factors at work here regarding the dogs:
- it was a single killer (as Missizzy said)
- or, the attacker (if female who had a high school crush on AG) was 'respectful' enough of AG's love of dogs.:furious: (This idea makes the crime almost worse!)
Click to expand...

If the perp did not have a gun to use as a weapon, a knife would have been too risky to use to attack the dogs without getting bitten. If they did bite, I am sure a big chunk of the perp's DNA would remain with the dogs, whether they were killed or not.
 
dotr said:
If the perp did not have a gun to use as a weapon, a knife would have been too risky to use to attack the dogs without getting bitten. If they did bite, I am sure a big chunk of the perp's DNA would remain with the dogs, whether they were killed or not.
Click to expand...

Perhaps the perp KNEW that AG had a nice set of kitchen knives!?!? I have a niggling feeling that the perp entered AG's house with only a SMALL weapon. Then, once in the house, the perp got something belonging to AG (knives, gardening equipment) OR the perp left the weapon(s) in the garage, near the car. And he/she retrieved them once AG was subdued.:twocents:
 
dotr said:
If the perp did not have a gun to use as a weapon, a knife would have been too risky to use to attack the dogs without getting bitten. If they did bite, I am sure a big chunk of the perp's DNA would remain with the dogs, whether they were killed or not.
Click to expand...

Now this goes back to WHY the dogs were left unharmed. Perhaps the killer was someone familiar to the dogs - this person went over to pet them, say 'hello', etc. in order to make AG feel at ease letting this person into her home.:furious:And then this scenario would bring us back to AG having an affair with someone as suggested in another post.:twocents:

ETA: Have any of you wondered WHY AG wouldn't let friends/visitors into her home? From what I've read (could be wrong) AG always sat with people OUTDOORS on a bench.
 
Missizzy said:
Just going back over a few things. I found this comment by Ms. Gleave's former husband strange, given what we've read:

http://www.thespec.com/news/crime/article/307949--police-investigating-ancaster-area-homicide

"She was protective of her private life because she lived alone, AG said. “She was obviously very, very intelligent. Probably her biggest passion was cooking. She’d try anything,” AG added...."

more at link


I happen to be the mother of three professional chefs/bakers. One thing I've learned about them is that they like to cook their own food. They enjoy collecting recipes but they are all quite picky about eating what others prepare.

We've read again and again that LV brought soup and that PK brought a special cake....one made from a recipe which came from AG. Why wouldn't Ms. Gleave be cooking her own food? Most people are intimidated about bringing a food gift to a person known to be passionate about cooking.
Click to expand...

IIRC, the handyman's new wife AK was a pastry chef (or studying to become one??). The original plan was to bring the cake prior to AG becoming ill. Maybe the cake was made from AG's recipe to have AG's critique on it.

From her mom's obituary, I get the impression that LV is unmarried. When AG was at LV's on Boxing Day, I wonder if there were other family and friends there as well, possibly other singles ... others who met AG and became aware of where she lived and that she was not feeling well.

There is that one photo of LV and AG both dressed in red, looking healthy and happy. I guess we don't know if that picture was taken during the 2010 holiday season, but presumably someone else was taking the picture.

ETA: Photo is probably irrelevant ... apparently it was taken "a few Christmases ago":

http://www.torontosun.com/news/canada/2011/01/03/16748161.html
 
I need to clarify something. I used the initials AG to denote Ms. Gleave's former husband. He happens to have the same initials. We have to use initials for him as he's considered "uninvolved". We are free to use the full name, Audrey Gleave, on this thread as she is the victim of a crime, however. Just don't want anyone confused.

I do remember PK's wife being a pastry chef--I believe at a local coffee shop. I wonder if it was also where Ms. Gleave met her friends. That was in one of the early videos or articles. I still don't know why she would prepare something that Ms. Gleave enjoyed and presumably knew how to make, rather than to make another treat.

One think I've yet to see addressed is whether PK was allowed access to the dogs. He worked on the property doing repairs and planting flowerbeds (by his description). I don't recall him mentioning the issue of the dogs. Does anyone? In looking at the photos of the house, I've often wondered just what all he did. There didn't seem to be extensive landscaping and yet he spoke of working hard all day while Ms. Gleave scientifically described the plants.

Did he do repairs inside the home? If so, were the dogs allowed free roam? How did he enter the home when he found Ms. Gleave dead? IIRC, reports said that he entered the home....rather than the garage. I've never quite understood how LE discounted him as a possible POI within the first 24 hours or so. They obviously also discounted LV as she was allowed free access to the home and Ms. Gleave's possessions.
 
Missizzy said:
I do remember PK's wife being a pastry chef--I believe at a local coffee shop. I wonder if it was also where Ms. Gleave met her friends. That was in one of the early videos or articles. I still don't know why she would prepare something that Ms. Gleave enjoyed and presumably knew how to make, rather than to make another treat.

One think I've yet to see addressed is whether PK was allowed access to the dogs. He worked on the property doing repairs and planting flowerbeds (by his description). I don't recall him mentioning the issue of the dogs. Does anyone? In looking at the photos of the house, I've often wondered just what all he did. There didn't seem to be extensive landscaping and yet he spoke of working hard all day while Ms. Gleave scientifically described the plants.

Did he do repairs inside the home? If so, were the dogs allowed free roam? How did he enter the home when he found Ms. Gleave dead? IIRC, reports said that he entered the home....rather than the garage. I've never quite understood how LE discounted him as a possible POI within the first 24 hours or so. They obviously also discounted LV as she was allowed free access to the home and Ms. Gleave's possessions.
Click to expand...
<rsbm>

I believe AG's coffee klatch was at Williams Fresh Restaurant (Cafe?) and seem to recall that AK worked at Starbucks.

I have also wondered how and why PK entered the house when he would not have known whether the dogs were confined or not. I would be interested in knowing what entrance he used, and if the garage door was open or closed. If it was closed and you were knocking on another door and there was no answer, one would normally assume that AG was unavailable or indisposed, or possibly out with friends. WHY would he enter the home when AG didn't answer the door? If the garage door was open and her car was there, but there was some visible sign of struggle in the garage, he should still have been concerned about the dogs attacking him (unless they were okay with his presence). Did he have a cell phone whereby he contacted police? If so, most people would call 911 and wait for police to arrive. He would have no way of knowing if a perp was still in the home.

I don't think we know that he actually entered the house. If AG was found in the garage, then the sign of struggle would have been the horrific scene that LE made reference to. So, maybe PK didn't go in the house at all and the garage door was in fact open and the crime scene in full view.
 
I also have been wondering how PK entered the house! The only thing that comes to mind is that the killer fled quickly, leaving the doors and garage door open. His/her fleeing in a rush would account for the neighbour's dogs barking at 2.30am if they heard someone running/rushing through their property.

Obviously, the killer didn't leave the house quietly and go to the main roadway to escape.

Thoughts??:eek:

ETA from sillybilly: I don't think we know that he actually entered the house. If AG was found in the garage, then the sign of struggle would have been the horrific scene that LE made reference to. So, maybe PK didn't go in the house at all and the garage door was in fact open and the crime scene in full view.

You know, about the garage door being left open makes this crime even worse, I think. It would be like the perp saying - 'See what AG deserved'. Just ungodly.......
 
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